Thank you very much, Ingrid. Now I feel a bit embarrassed for even asking but I have very limited experiences with roses and the ARE clearly spoiled me with their lush growth. The photo of Munstead Wood is not be the best one because there is much more whitening on the leaves than what can be seen here. In any event, I repotted them into 3-gallon pots and will follow your advice.

Incidentally, I've just now heard back from the nursery owner, whom I also asked about Munstead Wood, that it's likely spray residue. They spray roses regularly in their greenhouse. Very nice that some nurseries are vigilant in addressing their customer's concerns, even on Sundays!

I'm guessing you've never seen an adult plant of 'Mme. Hardy'!! Without annual manicuring and shaping, it grows tall, lanky and all its foliage is on the top quarter. That's how it grows.

There is nothing wrong with the roses in your photos. The first one probably has some spray residue on the leaves.

Paul, I think we posted simultaneously. The owner just contacted me that they spray their roses. How nice of her to reply back on Sundays! I can't edit my post & I had to put it as a comment.

You are absolutely right! I've never seen most roses that I am ordering. Old garden roses are not common in my area, alas. I learn it all by looking at their photos in books and on this wonderful forum. :-)

If this is how Mme Hardy grows then I definitely have to find a different spot for her than what I originally thought. Good to know it. Thank you!

MH can make a nice, bushy climber against a wall or fence! Congratulations on your new roses! Lovely choices.

Many thanks, Carol.

Yep. 'Mme. Hardy' will make canes up to 8 feet tall, that rocket straight up and gradually arch over under the weight of bloom. In subsequent years, those tall canes will branch into laterals but only modestly and the laterals are never more than 6-12 inches long. This makes for a plant that is sparse of foliage as the older canes accumulate, and it tends to flop and get messy unless you 1) train it on something or 2) reduce the height of the new canes to 3-4 feet maximum, which encorages more lateral branching and leads to a more full, rounded shrub.

But make no mistake - unless you are willing to manicure the plant (as in #2) twice a year, you will end up with a sparse, lanky plant that produces all its bloom on the top few inches of the plant. It is not an inherently attractive shrub; it needs work.

That isn't at all how it grows here. It is a very short, stiff plant.

@Mad: its all about climate, I guess. In zone 8 its lanky and bad-mannered and often exceeds 8 feet.

. . . and since we are talking to someone near Buffalo, I believe.

Mad Gallica, can MH be trained as a climber in your zone (over time)? I could swear that MH was the rose I saw growing as a wall shrub/climber in a comparable climate, but the rose was not labeled. Carol

Yes, Mad_Gallica, I am in Western NY. Either way she grows, it sounds like it's not the kind of rose shrub to put on main display as I initially planned. I got carried away by the beauty of her bloom, but rather oblivious of the shrub shape. I'll probably grow her in pot for a year until I see her growth habit in my garden before planting in the ground next spring.

After reading these comments, I browsed through photos on helpmefind.com and it seems that she can be trained as a climber in some cold climates, as their member in zone 5b posted a couple of photos:

http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=21.154320

http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=21.172634

Carol, it was much more likely to be Mme. Plantier. That one will get big, though I managed to kill mine by putting it in too much shade :(

Sometimes it looks to me as if there are two zones in my backyard plus who-knows-what-zone for my front yard :-) I can grow some plants there that my next-door neighbor cannot and vice versa. If I plant Mme Hardy in one area, I'm sure she would behave as mad_gallica describes. But there are some other more shielded areas that fit the new USDA official zone as 6a... either way, I am super excited about both roses and that they are fine. Thank you all!

Ha! Ha! Yes, Madame Plantier certainly becomes a substantial resident in the garden. I'm currently looking for a permanent placement for mine in my tiny city lot. The mature specimens I've seen are more like, pardon me MP, bulky fountains. I hope I can make her climb for me. Vertical is about the only direction that's left in my yard. I'm so sorry to hear about the demise of yours, Mad Gallica!

The rose I saw was not MP, but I imagine she and MH are often confused. I am also not certain it was MH, but the bloom, foliage and canes sure looked like her. Quite thorny. The plant had obviously been growing on the wall for years. I wonder if I have a photo somewhere. It would be in my disorganized stack of old film photos, darn it.

It sounds like a climbing MH in Buffalo might not be possible. Vesfl, please do post photos after you place your roses and as they grow. I'd love to see them mature. I'm learning as everyone shares their experiences.

Mad Gallica, do you have a photo of your MH plant? If you have a chance to post it, I'd love to see its form. As Paul mentioned, in this area of the country, I've never seen MH as a smaller shrub. I grow Botzaris because I've found it to be more compact, easier to shoehorn into my back garden.

Carol

'Botzaris' is a much better shrub, in my experience; well-mannered, better, healthier foliage, larger, more sophisticated blooms. Its got it all.