Sol: I didn't know you had a mean streak in you, LOL!!!!!!!
Lou

shaun, you need to buy a better grade of plate. Get Chinets, they are tough and won't tear. The last guy who wrassled me for my dinner plate went to the emergency dept. with a dislocated thumb. He's lucky I didn't snap his ulna with my karate chop.

My philosophy is that you can be better fed with good manners and a karate chop than with good manners alone.

Jimw

Karate chop? Is that anything like a pork chop? (Just to keep this food related)...

Sol, whether someone can take food off my plate depends on whether or not I like it. I learned that when I was a kid, and I was required to try Jello. Again. I'd have paid someone to taste it off my plate!

Annie

Who the heck is Jimw? Tell him to stop signing my posts.

Jim

Yeah! Who the hell is JimW???? I think we have an imposter among us~~

Jim:
Is JimW your cousin.

You could use the spoon, to remind someone of bad manners.
- - - - - - - - -

What are the noises everyone is talking about.
Would that be someone making a " Boom ". LOL!!!

Why couldn't everyone , point to the perpetrator and say,
WhoooooooOOOOOOOOOO !!!! LOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

OR SALUTE !!!!! CENTO ANNO !!!

I couldn't help myself. LOL!
- - - - - - - - - - - -

If I had to worry about all the rules while dining out,
I would have " Acidita ", before I was done.

LIGHTEN UP and say MANGIARE, DI TUTTO, QUI SI MAGIA BENE,
SALUTE !!!

I don't know what this means. Tell me when you find out.

Lou

Here is an interesting one:

Talked to a French Friend, She said in France, to eat Ortolan Bunting birds, you are supposed to cover you head with a towel, otherwise it would be bad table manners.

dcarch

Yes....the legend is that one draped their head when eating the tiny and endangered ortolan to hide from God....others say to protect the eater's identity because it is illegal to kill the birds.
Linda C

If I could send my grandson to any of you to correct his manners, I would. No matter how hard we try to teach him good manners, he refuses to learn. Have you ever seen a 10 year old who has the manners of a pig. He does. He makes me sick to see him eat like that, he does it be a jerk. He is heading down the smae path his father went down. His father was put in the brig while overseas while he was in the Navy. Something to do with the daughter of a high ranking officer and my son in law was the accused.

Just sigh and look sad, then look away. Finish your dinner quietly, as if there was great sadness in the house. He may escalate to get attention. Ignore it. It's hard when they get to this age, but it can be done. Then take heart. My brother had a stated philosophy against manners at that age. My mother is continuously amazed that he's really a very polite person nowadays.

If he is doing it deliberately, I would feed him earlier, and then invite him to sit with the adults when they eat. That way, you can enjoy his company without the bad manners. I would let him know that he is welcome at the grown up table when he can use big kid manners. I have a hunch that it might not be your decision.

Good luck.

Jo

p111og:
Why doesn't my p111og look the same as yours ???
Are they " One's " in the middle, or something else.

Anyway, back at the dinner table.
My Grandmother had a Stated Philosophy also,
the wooden spoon.

Or if you used bad manners, you didn't eat !!!

Worked well, and I loved her for it.

Lou

I can't believe how many responses this thread has generated! FWIW, I'm sure I could eat out with all of you and totally enjoy the experience.

But here's my "today" story. In the 27+ yrs DH and I have been married, he has never figured out which B&B plate and wine glass is his at a formally set table. (He can't set a table either, but I've always blamed that on his left-handed-ness - the knives and forks are always on the wrong sides.) Anyway, he came home from a business conference yesterday, and he proclaimed that he has FINALLY figured it out!

At the final banquet, he's seated at a round table with 6 other equally clueless engineers, all waiting for the first guy to grab a bun or glass to set off a chain reaction where they can each claim the proper vessel, without instigating a food fight. The eighth guy at the table confidently chooses the appropriate glass and plate, which amazes the rest such that someone asks him how he knows which is the right one.

Here is how this guy explained to the rest of these over-educated left-brainers:

Hold both hands in front of you, and place thumbs to middle finger, with the index finger of each hand pointed up. Your left fingers form a "b" which stands for "bread" and the right fingers form a "d" for "drink".

DH says he will never be confused by this concept ever again.

As the father of two 18 yo boys and all their friends who seem to eat here more than at their own homes I must say that sometimes the "noise" is hard to ignore.

Like when the wallpaper is peeling off the walls, the front door is slammed open and Mrs.M is making a staggering run for fresh air. Looking around it seems as if you are looking through a chemical fog.

This type of "noise" seems to emanate from the fast food/frozen microwave dinner type of boy. Of which mine are not. Thankfully.

I never eat from another person's plate unless invited to.

Lou, they're "L"'s (lowercase). Three of 'em. But I've seen all kinds of versions, and they're all fine. When I first signed on, I would have chosen a different handle if I'd known I was going to be at GW for the long haul. At the time it was just a question about a stove... Call me JC if that's easier.

The wooden spoon sounds similar to one of my ballet teachers' way of correcting alignment. Yikes! I just thought that if Daylily's grandson didn't get anything but sad disappointment, he'd probably go through an extinction burst, but would eventually lay off the gross out from boredom with a disinterested audience. Jo's method sounds more direct and probably easier to make work.

Cooksnews, I think that's brilliant!! Takes an engineer!

cooksnews,

You know how to tell a story!

Jim

Daylilydazed, I always took away my child's favorite thing to get her to shape up. Whether it's the TV, Nentendo or the car. Worked every time.

Ten year old boys are well, ten year old boys! Think Bart Simpson!

Give him time and positive reinforcement as well as appropriate instruction. He can't be expected to know what he doesn't know. I have two children, one boy and one girl, and I loved this age in both kids. Temperamentally they were a delight.

I've linked a good About.com article. It does a good job of describing a ten-year-old's development.

I think it's too early to sentence him to the brig for bad table manners. ;)

Sorry Ladies:
Guess I'm what you would call " the old school "
I would have been married 55 years when my wife passed.

We let the kids know right from the " get go ", what they were doing wrong.
And if it wasn't corrected they would get the " get go ".

I've raised many kids, including, sisters, nephews and nieces.
They all look up to me now.

It is a great reward for me,to know they appreciated the way I taught them.

Everything has changed now. You can't be too harsh with the children.

Glad I'm from the old school !!! Don't have anymore kids to raise.

I'll let my DD and GD raise my GGD.
They will probably spoil the hell out of her.
Maybe I'll just go fishing.

When she is old enough , I'll take her fishing !!! LOL
Lou

Good Lord, Cooksnews...I really don't want to admit how long it took me, sitting in front of my computer, to set my fingers according to your directions...dain bramaged, after a long, lazy weekend...but when I finally got it right, I thought, what a great mnemonic device!

Daylily, my heart goes out to you. It's easy for others to make suggestions, but the fact remains that your grandson is not your son, so you don't have the authority to do with him as he perhaps should be done by. I have a nephew I'd like to teach a few things...but he isn't MY kid, so I have to choose whether to put up with his bad manners for the sake of family peace or instigate a big to do.

If MY KID ate like a pig just to be a jerk, he'd find his dinner plate nailed to the floor where he could eat like a dog if he preferred to behave like one. But, NOT my kid? Unless he's throwing food at me, it isn't my business other than to wonder what the heck his parents are thinking and hope it is a stage the poor kid will grow out of before his bad manners are a bigger impediment to his life than simply being an annoyance to his relatives.

If he's eating in my house....it's my business.....
Hang in there daylily....you may be the one stable influence in his life.

It drives me crazy when people lean over the table to take a drink from their straw instead of picking up their glass, or leans way down to wipe their mouth with a napkin instead of bringing the napkin up to their mouths...

We go out with another couple who, to borrow from Jeff Foxworthy, "are good people, they just don't get out much" and they do things like slather butter all over their bread/rolls, eat directly off the appetizer plate, and lick the knife (him)...I would never dream of saying anything but sometimes I cringe...like the time we went to one of our favorite local upscale Italian restaurants and the husband asked our waitress "What kinda noodles ya got?"

I've seen British etiquette books that specifically say that peas should be squashed onto the back of the fork, best with some other sticky vegetable, like potatoes. And never scooped!

Again, why, I wonder! Some rules just seem so arbitrary and silly. Yes, I'm guessing they must have SOME origin that made sense at the time. But like I said earlier, if they don't make sense to me, I tend not to care.

I will also say that I pretty much never serve (or eat) peas as a separate dish. There is something that is just not that appetizing about a pile of green peas sitting on the plate. Although I do love Lars' idea of putting them in a nest! How cute is that!!

I usually combine peas into a casserole dish. I did this when my kids were little, the idea being that they'd eat all their veggies mixed in with the other food, and not be put off by the pile of green. Don't know if that's what did it but they do like their green veggies!

I'm pretty cretin-like all the way around so I'm definitely not the one to tell others how to do things. I do wonder though about the comments regarding people helping themselves to what's on someone else's plate uninvited. I figure couples often do that with each other or kids to their parents - but again, that's invited, as in, understood between them that it's ok. Other than that, I'd be gobsmacked if someone did that to me unless I'd specifically said to do it!

"I think my chicken is not quite cooked yet"

" Are you sure? I think it's cooked. We always eat it that way."

What would you do?

dcarch

" I do wonder though about the comments regarding people helping themselves to what's on someone else's plate uninvited."

I think it was a bit of hyperbole just for fun. As a participant, I hope that's what it was. :-)

Jim

You are correct Jim. My comment was hyperbolic in nature [G]

"Sol, I hate it when they do that, especially when they do it with their salad fork when they're supposed to be using their dinner fork."

Jim, within my circle of friends, a meat fork is often the weapon of choice...

Sol

dcarch, I'd probably make a joke about how I'd grown up eating charcoal-chicken and couldn't get used to it any other way, and ask if it would be rude of me to slip mine into the pan/toaster oven until it was cremated to my liking?

Then I'd rave about some other dish or three and ask for the recipe for whatever sauce/spice mix the chicken had been (not) cooked in to make it clear that it wasn't the chef's lack of skill but my own peculiarity that had come to the fore.

Or, alternatively...I'd just cut it up and push it 'round the plate, eat the sides, and go out for pizza on the way home.

Like Rachelellen, I'd probably squish it around my plate, but unless it was still clucking, I'd probably shut up and eat it. Hopefully with the appropriate fork, but I'm not making any rash promises here about that.

I've often said that I'd eat peanut butter and jelly sandwiches on paper towels if I love the company I'm with. Since I seldom eat with people I don't care about, I'd never do anything to offend the cook.

Heck, I've even been known to eat pizza (which I hate and detest), with olives (which I doubly hate and detest), and never say a word, because people I'm with like it and I like them.

Occasionally I have professed to be on a diet when presented with something I just can't eat, but that happens seldom.

jonsgirl, remind me and I won't butter an entire slice of bread while we're out to lunch. (grin)

Annie

May, the problem with your peas is your peas! If you blanch them they'll be bright green and very pretty. Some frozen peas aren't blanched. If you're using frozen, treat yourself to some Petits Pois. Petits Pois are lovely, tiny, bright green, and more sugar than starch. They're the only frozen vegetables I have a lot of affection for, probably because we never get them fresh, and they're delightful! I can eat them frozen, from the bag like candy, or just slightly warmed in a dish by themselves, or as a side dish for a proper dinner. That is why I would never, ever squish them into potatoes, which seems just as bad a way to keep them on the fork as honey is to keep them on the knife. If you blanch fresh English peas, they'll be pretty too.

I think the reason for the English squishing is that they'd developed this rigorous must do way to eat, but it doesn't work for peas. They're not allowed to scoop, and they can't be chasing the peas around the plate trying to stab them individually with their forks, so squishing is their only option. Which is why practicality should outweigh custom! Like one man I know who will ask for a teaspoon if he's served rice. He thinks eating rice with a fork is ridiculous. It is! Of course, learning to do it is a milestone in grown up manners, but I appreciate where he's coming from.

Since we're still talking manners, I'll mention that I was just seated at a wedding with at least 2 major cultures and three sets of table manners going and no bolts of lightening rained down from the sky. It was a black tie opt. event, so people were on their best behavior. Still, one gentleman put his bread on his dinner plate--something I would never have noticed if it weren't for this thread! Another didn't eat the dinner at all but was perfectly polite to the staff and didn't make a fuss. The only fault I would call would be to the band, who were very good, musically, but too intensely loud. They drove many people away, betimes.

lol Annie, I promise to discreetly avert my eyes...I'm kidding! Wouldn't bother me a bit! :)

The last group meeting Jon had was in Ohio and he is hosting one here in WI this month, am not sure when we'll get to MI again but I haven't forgot our lunch! :)

Hi everyone:
I just remembered a Quote of Ben Franklin.

" Be who you are and say what you feel,
because those that matter - don't mind and
those that mind it don't matter."

Of course this doesn't hold true for everything,
or an over kill.
Lou

Lou, I think Dr. Suess said that.

Eileen, I agree, it was Dr. Seuss...

Ben Franklin did say, however:

"Remember not only to say the right thing in the right place, but far more difficult still, to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment. "

And that's much harder, but much wiser, I think, as I remind myself to bite my tongue regularly.

Annie

What was that line from "Steel Magnolias"? "If you can't say something nice, come sit by me."

Grins!

I think Alice Roosevelt Longworth said it first.

Yes. She did.

I'm also fond of Dorothy Parker.

You are probably right . I had it jotted down with some quotes of Ben Franklin.

Some others I had listed:

" Let a childs first lesson be obedience and
the second be as thou wilt."

" Any fool can criticise and complain -
and most fools do "

" He who will not stand with someone who is right,
will some day stand alone. "

Made some myself but can't remember them.
Guess they weren't important,or I'm having a memory thing.

LOU

If both of us thought alike, one of us would not be necessary. Anonymous/Unknown Author

"I'll mention that I was just seated at a wedding with at least 2 major cultures and three sets of table manners going and no bolts of lightening rained down from the sky."

AH HA HA HA HA HA! Love it!

" but far more difficult still, to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment. "

I love that part of your quote, Annie; silence can be golden. On these forums and in real life too. Specially since there's no edit button in either , lol....

Mitch, I can't tell you how many times I've typed something and then just didn't hit the submit button, LOL

Annie

Never drink and type... ;)

I hear you!

There is a current thread active on this forum that I have responded to 3 times but never submitted. Mind you the typing out of what I wanted to say is rather cathartic.

Annie me too girl. So many times! hahah!

Better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to [type] speak and remove all doubt

Friends don't let friends post drunk.

LOL Eileen, I've definitely woken up thinking, "PLEASE tell me I didn't post to that thread last night!"

LOL !!!! been there.......

gump! swallow!

Sometimes the most clever thing to say is nothing at all~