Claudia, you described a mall in my area to a tee. There are plans to tear it down and build mixed use residential with affordable housing and retail. There is another mall more upscale in the area that seems to be thriving. I don't browse in the mall like I used to. I go to one or two particular small stores occassionally. I find these stores carry very limited stock especially in petite sizes. I do most of my shopping online. My teenage granddaughters prefer shopping at small stores in commercial urban centers rather than stores like Macy's and Nordstrom. They do shop online.

And then there's ours The Mall of America. It can take as long as an hour to find a parking spot. It's for sure very hit and miss with Malls. Brick and mortar shopping is for sure becoming a thing of days gone by.

20 years ago the three large anchor stores left our mall. Rents went sky high for the remaining small shops which began closing one by one. Our mall too became a ghost town for years. In recent years, Harbor Freight has rebuilt into a large portion of the former mall and part of the structure is now a Secretary of State office and there is a college classroom area. So it all looks good now.

I don't really remember when I last went to a mall, but these days I would tend to go to one fairly close to me. In L.A., I mostly go to what used to be Fox Hills Mall (now a Westfield mall), and I go there mainly because it has a Best Buy store, but it has always been difficult to park near that store. I used to go to Fox Hills to buy clothes and shoes before I retired, but now I don't need as many clothes as I used to. I would also occasionally shop at The Beverly Center or Westside Pavilion but have not been to either of those in quite a few years now. Both of those have (or had) upscale stores.

I have not noticed any similar malls in the Palm Springs area, but there is huge outlet mall at Cabazon, just west of Palm Springs. That mall is always full of what appear to be Chinese tourists, and so it is doing quite well.

I think Mall of America might be an exception to the general indoor mall thing. Right from the start it built itself as a travel destination for shopping and other entertainment. And it has that no sales tax thing to help attract the masses. At least it used to- I haven't been there in a couple decades. Most indoor malls were built for more local shoppers and include the taxes.

In our area, we have 2 outlet malls as well, both outdoor. One is more upscale and seems to do well...the other is struggling and losing stores. Of course I could never understand the point of outdoor malls if you live in our area with lots of bad-weather days.

30 years ago all the polls said the day of the indoor mall was gone. People wanted to drive up to the store they cared to shop--in and out quickly not stroll through a Mall. 40 years ago I moved our downtown JCPenny to the big Mall in Fargo--which is doing gang busters--so was SHOCKED by the poll. When I heard the powers that be were investing all the teacher's retirement funds into the Mall of America I pulled mine out--I was at home with my kids at the time. Turns out the polls were correct--but it is hit and miss. There are a few Malls doing just fine. As Annie said here in the north it's sort of a must. Fargo used to get a healthy Canadian population shopping. Not sure if it's still true.

I visit a local mall monthly because my hairdresser has a spot in a Sola complex, a unified group of small owner-operated salons. I enter thru an outer door, but her space is in front and looks out at the mall, and it is sad. I noticed that most of the busier stores all have exterior doors.

The mall in my area is doing OK, by the cars in the lot. It is within a huge shopping complex Most every store or restaurant you would want is in the complex. The last time I was in our mall was before the pandemic. We use to take the grands to the indoor play area in the winter. Now they are too big for it.

I'm not big on shopping to begin with and I find malls inconvenient. One of the downsides is you have to lug all your purchases with you from store to store or take them back to the car then return to finish your shopping. In the winter your left lugging your coat with you. At least with stores that have shopping carts you can throw your coat in the cart.

The nearest mall to me is twenty five miles away. I went there about fifteen years ago to buy some china. I haven't been since. During lockdown people started discovering their local specialist shops and they are having a bit of a rennaissance.. That, coupled with online shopping has hit the big malls.

Well those big stores were call ”Anchors.”

I think of all the good farmland many of these malls took over. The good loam stripped off and sold — much of it for lawns.

I don't go often, but I've been two or three times this summer. I live in a major metropolitan area and have relatively easy access. I basically go for access to teen/young adult shopping and shoes. It's amazing how fast some of these stores go in and out of business. Macy's is doing well in my area. Dillard's is a lot slower. I used to love JCPenney, but they ruined it. The Buckle and American Eagle were the best places for my crew. We have done some online shopping.

Some of the old malls have been turned into college campuses in various places I've lived. The area usually starts to run down before that happens. I'm not sure how that turned out for them.

I went to a mall about two years ago to return something I'd had shipped from Macy's. I'd thought I could look at other sizes and other options in the store. Hah! There was no inventory to peruse. I was told I could order items sent to that store and come choose from them that way...AS IF!

The demise of well stocked department stores decimated the supply of 'remainders' to provide stock for places like TJ's. Years ago I could buy quality clothing originally from Saks or Marshall Field's, marked down at remainder stores. Then the big stores started their own low-price shops. And after that...in lieu of quality remainders, major stores and discount stores began ordering cheap stock to sell at low prices. Today you can just dress cheaply from Walmart or Target or pay high prices at boutique-y shops. Combined with shrinking buying power for the shrinking middle class, it's no wonder more people walk around looking like they've dressed to mow the lawn.

It's so strange around me that the malls are dying but new shopping centers address going up, and bustling. I think I was in a Macy's last year to help my son buy a clothing gift his brother wanted, and a year before that because the go-to for 5 with the watch repair kiosk was still there. Now that mall is being redeveloped with residential, an open space for entertainment, and I think medical, as well as some retail.

I did always think they would be great retirement villages. Year round walking, cafe, medical, PT, and you wouldn't need so much parking so some could be converted to outdoor recreation and green space.

But, just as so many schools and such were built to accommodate my baby boom generation are now gone or repurposed, the same will happen with all the senior housing going up to accommodate us.

And you know, all us mall shoppers grew up and realized how much stuff we DON'T need.

Some malls are doing quite well, others not so much. The number is definitely shrinking...

https://www.marketplace.org/2022/06/27/rumors-of-the-death-of-the-american-mall-may-have-been-greatly-exaggerated/

The shopping center in my town, a beautiful outdoor affaire does incredibly well. Several of their retailers make up the list of the top sales tax receipts in our city.

Neiman's, Hermes, Tiffany, Vuitton , and good old Macy's bring in the sales tax. I was surprised to see Nordstrom did not make the list.

Ooops, Nordstrom did make the list.

I missed quite a few more stores from the shopping center. In light of the value of some of the other places on this list, like car dealerships, it's amazing to see things like small, super high end clothing stores raking in the dollars. Malls are not dead. They are just in the wrong places.

Most of the malls are gone in this area and the never ending stores of the same name are slowly starting to close. There was supposed to be a "shopping center" connected to the nearest Macy's after the rest of the mall was torn down. As in other areas higher end apartments are being built in much of the old parking lot along with a golf driving range that was built behind the newer apartments.

It will be interesting to see what happens in the near future. People are starting to miss the ability to have somewhere to walk when it is too hot, too cold, too wet, too snowy etc. While many do belong to gyms they are finding that a treadmill and the walking tracks lack any sort of mental stimulation. Some have mentioned walking in some of the shopping areas but have also mentioned the speeding and drivers not stopping for stop signs make it less enjoyable.

Those of you who have those ethnic shops of all kinds might want to look at the clothing. While some pieces are over-decorated with beads and other stuff some are also very comfortable at home clothing. What I have found is the pieces I have purchased are somewhat stiff until after being washed a couple of times.

From the same source, a look at how strip malls are more favored now, as people want to spend less time shopping...

https://www.marketplace.org/2022/08/01/macys-is-making-a-bigger-investment-in-strip-malls/

I feel the same way. I avoid having to go inside our local mall (which seems to be doing just fine) and the big box stores too - I hate wandering around those vast spaces looking for the single thing I came for. Our Macy's is very nice, but there are hardly any employees around when you need assistance, or want to check out - limited selection in-store as well. So much easier to order online and pick up in store - or have it shipped to home.

Macy's is a total mystery to me. It's horrible at our shopping center too. It's one thing to have no help finding things, and that the place is a pig pen, but if you do find something, actually buying it is all but impossible for want of staff.

PS And this has been the case wih Macy's since I moved here in 1996! Hardly a new problem.

The nation's supposedly first mall was here in Seattle. Most of it closed down a couple years ago to make way for a practice ice rink for our new hockey team. It made me sad. It wasn't the fanciest mall, but it had the basics and it was never too crowded.

We still have a couple of indoor malls downtown, and three large ones just outside of Seattle. All of them are still quite full and busy.

Honestly, I don't like indoor malls anymore, mainly because of slow walkers blocking me at every turn. I hate the stupid vendor carts hucking cheapo crap and annoying sales people in my face, and the smell of cheap food being pumped in the air. I think this is why so many malls are dying. I only go if there's something I really need.

There are 2 malls within easy driving distance from my home - one is 10 minutes the other is 20. Currently Cherry Hill Mall in South Jersey is doing very well - the main anchors are Nordstrom, Macys and Penny's (if you're being generous). It also has the usual mix of Pottery Barn, Williams Sonoma and other retailers. The restaurants are busy. I've been to Nordstrom's to buy clothing for my grand daughters. I'd do it online but I am hopeless at determining sizes.

It does have a large Apple store which I frequent.

The other Mall which is closer to me was a busy center when I moved to S. Jersey. For those familiar with Philly retail it had a Wanamaker's, Lord & Taylor, Sears and Gimbels (which evolved into a Litt Brother's and is now a Boscov's).

The mall is undergoing a huge transition. Cooper University Medical Center is taking over the old Sears for an urgent care, testing facility and offices. The Lord & Taylor has been sold, there are a number of vacant stores but the developer is building a hotel in the paring lot plus apartment buildings. The township has earmarked a percentage of the new apartments as 'restricted income' to satisfy N.J.'s low income housing allotments.

We used to have three thriving malls in our area. The one I loved when my kids were little had a Gap, Gimbels, Eddie Bauer, and John Wanamakers. I bought all our clothes there and visited a few times a month. I heard that mall is in real disrepair now. I haven't been there in 25 years. I really dislike malls and shop at free-standing stores like TJ Maxx, Homegoods, and Marshalls. I had to drive to Lancaster to go to the Apple store. That mall is still doing well. But the mall which is 1/2 mile from my house is still doing excellent although I don't know why. I haven't bought anything from there in years but this summer I've been there more times than in the past five years walking ten laps since it's way too hot for the Appalachian trail...nine days in a row with mid 90 temps. This mall was built 50 years ago when we moved to this area and never has it not performed with no vacancies. The demographics it appeals to, in my opinion, are men from 16-40. It's all running shoes, baseball caps, tee shirts with a sprinkling of Macy, Dicks, Penneys, and Bath and Body.

Edited to add American Eagle and Hollister

The nearest mall to my house is 85 minutes away (yes, I live in rural America). I was there about a year ago and it was very sad. I was appalled at Macy’s! Looked like they had pulled out of storage all their leftover apparel from 1980! And shoes were stacked (not in boxes) on steel racks 7’ tall.

I rarely go to an indoor mall now.

1. Storefronts are empty.

2. The stores that are open have little selection.

3. It’s easier to shop online.

4. And last but not least: as a rural American, I’m alarmed by news reports of crime and violence in malls/cities/large events. Not something I deal with on a regular basis.

The Macy's here is up to date, pristine and orderly - and usually pretty quiet. I used to work there in the late 80s, in a leased department. It was first a Maas Bros., then a Burdines. I think Federated Dept. Stores owned them all at one time or another. The mall has a Dillards and J.C.Penney as well. There used to be a huge Sears, but that is now Dick's Sporting Goods, and there are a number of other stores there in that footprint - PetsMart, and a supermarket among them, along with restaurants. It's pretty busy there - 3 other shopping centers are located close by.

There are lots of shopping neighborhoods in L.A. that have nothing to do with malls, and these include Abbot Kinney in Venice, Main Street Promenade in Santa Monica, Melrose in West Hollywood, Rodeo Drive in Beverly Hills, and Leimert Park in South L.A. Then there is Koreatown, Thaitown, Little Tokyo, Sawtelle (AKA Little Osaka), Westwood Village, Palisades Village in Pacific Palisades, Montana Ave in Santa Monica, etc. Weather is not a problem here, and so it is always pleasant to shop outdoors in the western part of the city.

It was sad when Bullocks Wilshire closed, however - Marlene Dietrich used to shop there.

Zalco, I grew up at Marshall Field, and Macy’s is a mess compared to Marshall Field. Once I went to the downtown Chicago ”flagship” store and it looked like a discount store. Now Macy’s at the mall looks as unkempt as my local Kohl’s but with somewhat better quality to be found. I don’t even want to go in, except when my son has something on his ”wish list” and I really like to see and touch what I’m buying, especially when it is a gift.

When Covid restrictions relieved enough that we could visit DMIL in Toronto, we did. We went to the nearby mall, and were amazed that it was bustling! We had to wait in line at the donut shop in the food court (I owed DBIL a donut for some sports bet, I don’t remember but you better believe he remembered!) and we were lucky to find a small table.

Bpath, Marshall Field's in Chicago ... sigh ...

I know … sigh …

I have never, ever liked malls or department stores. I don't like shopping environments and get panicky when I can't see the exit. I do all of my shopping on the internet, the occasional sample sale or at tiny boutiques. Nothing makes me want a piece of clothing less than seeing a rack with thirty pieces of the exact same thing.

Woodfield in Schaumburg, northwest of Chicago, IL, largest mall in my area, afraid it will never be like this again. Great video!

https://youtu.be/kmG5ai_d-GI

The very sad thing is these malls replaced lovely downtown stores run by locals. The town I grew up in was a wonderful place to shop with five &dime stores, women's and men's clothing stores, stationery stores, shoe stores, a news agency, Joe the Motorist Friend, hardware stores, and two theaters. Now the town is a shell of the lovely downtown it was decades ago before the malls took away their customers.

I am so surprised that some of you still have real stores to shop in! Shocked, I tell you!

I live on the east coast in the suburbs of Washington DC. There is no dearth of income here and you would think that there would be any number of retailers waiting to exchange your cash or credit for any number of material goodies. But, that is not the case.

The only department store that is anywhere near here ,about 15-20 miles NW of the DC line, is Kohls. That is the only one, unless you want to count the painfully pathetic Macys that is still hanging onto the edge of the dead mall. There is a Pennys that, like Macys, is clinging to a slowly decaying mall about 20 miles away.

There is no downtown area and there is no cute little shopping area.

There is an outdoor shopping center that was built in the last 10 years that is anchored with Target, Walmart, Home Depot, Kohls and Best Buy and a Michaels. This is a big parking lot and there is little effort to link these stores via a walkable sidewalk. It was designed with the idea that you would drive to the different stores, not walk around as you might do in a downtown. So, it does not invite that kind of lingering and there are no sidewalk restaurants or cafes or benches to sit.

Seriously, if I decided that today I would like to browse and shop and just mess around like I used to do, I have no idea where I would do that.

There is one of those "outlet" malls that was built some years ago. It is close and I was there sometime last Spring. Most of the storefronts were closed and about the only thing for sale there were shoes. Like the indoor mall, it was very quiet and almost deserted. It used to cater to those Chinese shopping tourists and you would see chartered buses pull up and disgorge a small horde of shoppers. I guess that all changed with covid.

I do strongly believe that we Americans have and still do buy way too many useless material items and that is a strong negative and, in a way, I dont regret the loss of places to spend your money on things that you probably best not. But, what these areas often also give us is a place to congregate, eat, browse and, yes, to shop. That I miss, that having somewhere to go and walk around and see people and be with others. The marketplace has, traditionally, been more than just a place to sell and buy.

There is a lovely little small town not too far that has a revived downtown. It is full of curated "vintage" clothing stores and a couple of other things but there is not much of anything other than that and a candy store, and more than enough antique stores. There is nothing much that I want to buy there, but it is a lovely little historic walk around town. Not being a tourist town, it lacks the kinds of shops that you find in those places. It is about a 30 minute drive up the highway.

I dont want to buy so much as I want to browse and be amongst others, to congregate. i actually miss the market place. There is no where to congregate and to just be with others, sit on a bench. or at an outside table or pick up something for dinner and maybe buy a new blouse.

Happy Birthday Mall of America!! 30 yrs old today!!

I forgot about our Castle Rock Shops. A huge shopping complex. Quote: The center is the largest open-air outlet center in the State of Colorado, where you’ll find over 100 name brand stores, including Coach, Polo Ralph Lauren, Tommy Hilfiger, American Eagle, Osh Kosh, RH....

I agree with the sentiments and experiences shared here. We do have one super mall ( King of Prussia) and that is definitely not deserted but it's definitely not the thriving place it was. I know when I needed to get a house gift and thought about some of the nicer stores (Neiman Marcus, Bloomingdales)... when I looked online, much of what I was interested in was only available online and not in the store.

We have another typical sorry mall very nearby and it is beyond desolate. It's been sold, and supposedly is going to be revamped into a high tech center - nothing retail.

I keep trying to think of how these massive structures with parking and all could be re-utilized. Annie, I 'd be curious to know about the one that is now housing because that seems like the logical use. There is still a housing shortage and so much over abundance of retail properties.

We had to go into the sorry mall the other day and DH remarked that he felt like he was at a funeral.

One of the largest malls in the KC area was razed about 7 years ago and Cerner corporation built a campus in that location. Cerner was bought by Oracle last year and now they are trying to sell some of Cerner's many buildings around the city.

The malls that went under in the greater Pittsburgh area was due to the area turning bad and it wasn't safe to shop their anymore. Other areas had too many malls. Some went high end while others reduced their size putting business on the perimeter or went open strip mall.

I think one reason our mall stayed successful is because it is the only large mall west of the city and also draws shoppers from the pan handle of WV and eastern Ohio.

I've never really been a consistent mall shopper. I haven't been to any in several years. Funny thing, though. About 6 or 7 years ago I had a very clear, real-it-seemed, and vivid dream that one of our local malls that I know well, had been turned into apartments with the lower central walkways/courts still there, now gathering areas for the residents. With a few shops, a pharmacy and some restaurants on the main levels, as well. Perhaps a dream of the future, who knows?!?

That was actually the vision of the man credited with inventing the American mall...

https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/the-gruen-effect/

LoneJack when did Independence Center close? It would have been much closer to you than 85 miles. I have not been there since Sears closed although if it had not been the closest store I would not have gone. People that tend to go there are somewhat crazy. I waited for someone to pull out of a parking space the previous time I was there and a woman went ballistic because I stole the only parking space available. Since she was still in her car I just walked away. She called mall security on me and apparently had enough pull they were driving around actively looking for me. One actually drove past me on his radio repeating my description except they were looking for a middle height woman that caused a problem. I was wearing a top that had a distinctive design. She had not even been in the lane until the suv started backing out.

maifleur03 - it was Bannister Mall that closed and was razed to build the Cerner campus.

Not sure where you got the 85 miles from, I never mentioned anything about it. Both Independence center and Bannister mall are/were about 25-30 miles from where I live.

Yes, Tyson's ll (Tysons Galleria) in Virginia outside Washington DC. I had to return a purchase to Johnny Was. Very few people in the mall and I felt terrible to be returning something without buying anything. The poor saleman tried so hard (in a very nice way) and asked that I come back because that was the only way the stores can stay in business. It was an off-time,off-day though. I hope the store as well as the mall are busier on average than the day I was there. There are several department stores in the two Tyson malls (Galleria and Tyson's Corner Center which we used to call Tyson's l-still do actually) including Neiman Marcus, Nordstrom, Macy's, Bloomingdale's. I like going into the stores even though I rarely do. Just not a big shopper either online or in person.

The stores are much quieter here but it seems the ones that have Walmart and London drugs in there or near there are bustling.

We lost zellers and Sears before covid which were mainstays when our children were younger. We lost eatons a few years before that.

DH and I had jobs at Sears and Eatons when younger. I suppose the children who are getting jobs now work for these big online businesses or at all the different service jobs but certainly not at department stores and malls where many of us worked.

Nowadays in order to keep my costs down I buy all my clothes at thrift store. Not for everyone but it's always been just fine for me with my taste.

Maifleur may have meant that she was approximately 85 miles away and that you were closer than her?

I haven't been to our big mall in almost 15 years and the smaller mall nearest to me in about 7 years but I think the big mall is still busy as is the smaller mall because of the anchor stores like the Dollarama and Shoppers Drug Mart. We used to have the best downtown until the 1970s. I have no reason to go to the mall, I prefer mostly to patronize local business, Costco or Amazon.

I miss our malls. One had an arcade and a movie theater, so one could waste the whole day there having fun. It was recently demolished. The other is still standing but the last time I was there was only to go to bath and body works and then to the soft pretzel place and great American cookie. I haven't been in probably a decade, as its just not a convenient trip for me anymore. The other night minion at my job sometimes goes there just to walk for exercise and says that its still pretty well occupied by stores, but not very busy at all and he wonders why it's still standing. He suspects its the food court, which has those places ONLY found in food courts, though I have noticed a lot of those places are joining forces and opening standalone stores. For example the are building a great American cookie/ marble slab creamery combo nearby.

Still, even though I miss those days of lurking at the mall all day, I acknowledge that I contributed to their demise. I prefer the variety and convenience of online shopping,and don't feel bad about it. I remember everyone of my friends growing up had the same clothes, because there was only the mall and Kmart to shop in, and they didn't have much variety. Now, I am looking forward to November so I can break out my Thanksgiving dresses, turkey leggings and pumpkin pie headband, and stuffing earrings. Can't find any of that at the mall! And Sears would probably never have a pink rice cooker in stock. So malls are fine for nostalgia but for practicality, its better that that real estate be converted into something more useful, IMO.

It seems to me indoor malls rose and fell along with the giant bulge in our population that was the Baby Boom...

I llive just outside Washigton, D.C., in Arlington, VA. We still have malls. The largest is Tysons Corner, which is about eight iles from me. If the weather is too wicked for me to walk ouutside, I walk at the mall. They have a few empty spaces, but still have Bloomingdales, Nordstroms, Macys, and Barnes and Norbles for the anchors. Lord and Taylors closed. We also have other malls: Pentagon City, Springfield, and Fair Oaks. Our area is semi urban, so that may be what is keeping the malls going. If I need something (which is rare) I can usually find it at Macys, and on sale. Bad for them but good for me. I would hate to be managing a department store right now.

Lynn, Coconut Point Mall in Estero Florida has that set up. Living space upstairs, with the retail downstairs.

Imagine telling someone you live above Tommy Bahama as a landmark to find address?