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Best options for non-tiled shower?

shead
4 years ago

We have have had two medium-to-large tiled showers in the past (and currently) and DH is adamant about wanting to explore other options for our upcoming master bedroom and ensuite addition because of the grout and cleaning issues. Ideally, we'd like to have a 48" x 60" shower but I'd like something that looks nicer than the typical cheap acrylic shower kits that are found at big box stores. A solid one piece pan in that size is very hard to find and the ones I'm seeing are the tile ready kind :/


I did find this on Houzz but I don't see any pans that go with it nor do I know how well it will hold up:


https://www.houzz.com/products/transolid-expressions-48-x-60-x-72-glue-to-wall-tub-shower-wall-kit-bianca-prvw-vr~131940512


Thanks!


Comments (42)

  • User
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Cast iron or custom Corian pan. Corian walls. None of the choices that will last and look good for years are going to be budget choices like the cheap acrylic ones. You’ll spend 5x over to get quality. But it’ll last much longer than 7-10 years too.

    shead thanked User
  • bry911
    4 years ago

    Honestly, your best option for walls is large format tiles with small grout lines. It accomplishes much the same thing as giant slabs of material and at a fraction of the cost. For flooring you can do the same but I like lots of grout or teak on shower floor.

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  • functionthenlook
    4 years ago

    I'm sure you can find nice looking acrylic surrounds. Yea, I would skip the big box stores. They are so easy to clean and last a long time if you buy quality. Our last house had one piece acrylic units and when we moved 24 years later they looked as good as the day they were put in. I was glad when we moved into our present house it didn't have tile. I hate scrubbing grout. Try looking at a kitchen and bath store.

  • just_janni
    4 years ago

    You should be able to do a custom pan with a liner and sloped sides. and then pick a nontraditional covering - for example, we'll be doing either an epoxy that matches the bathroom floor (with added silica grit) or a quartz aggregate - both will be seamless and grout-less.


    We'll couple this with some sort of solid surface wall covering - Corian, large formate tile, back painted glass, etc.


    Husband is a grout hater, too.


  • shead
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    @User,


    I am not necessarily looking for a budget item, just something that’s simple and easier to clean than tile even if it costs the same as tile.

  • ILoveRed
    4 years ago

    In our last house in the master bath we had a custom shower pan made out of solid surface and used tile on the walls. The pan was a near perfect match color wise to the tile and it looked really good. The pan was ridiculously expensive and we could have tiled it for much less but dh would not at that time. They came in and templated the space and it was a perfect fit. The product was called Alantra. It was a breeze to clean.

    https://www.carstinbrands.com/solid-surfaces/alantra



  • User
    4 years ago

    A solid surface shower will be MORE than tile.

  • shead
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    "A solid surface shower will be MORE than tile."


    And I'm okay with that if it means it's easier to clean and pretty foolproof in installation.

  • Nancy in Mich
    4 years ago

    Grifforms out of Oregon will make you a solid surface (Corian) shower pan to your specifications for a price. I used a Transolid solid surface shower pan with trench drain (63 x 38) and walls for my roll-in shower. I am not familiar with their Expressions line. Bath1 describes it as " Made from impact and scratch-resistant, hygienic, durable, and non-porous compression molded material " I had the solid surface walls and they are nice. If I was putting the effort and spending the money for solid walls, I would get a Solid Surface product, be it Transolid, Corian, Swanstone, or whatever. You can go to the top of this page and do a search on "Solid Surface" in "bathrooms" to find threads that will explain what a solid surface is and why it is preferred.


    You can see all the Transolid products at Bath1.com and you can actually talk to the folks at Transolid by phone if you have questions.

  • User
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    You should avoid anything that tries to make plastic look like marble.

    Take a look at Kohler's Choreograph shower wall systems. Its like the box store stuff but its a complete system with better materials and fabrication. But find a Kohler supplier or showroom and look at the stuff.

  • User
    4 years ago

    Choreograph is just fancy printed or basic solid color Fiberglass Reinforced Plastic. It’s available from commercial suppliers of public restrooms at a fraction of the price than Kohler wants for it. With a lot more material choices and better availability. Kohler had a 6 month wait list at one point this summer. And it’s not even pretty stuff. It’s the same stuff that your local Exxon uses.


    The weak point in any of this is the pan. Large custom pans are very expensive. A tile pro can create a custom mud pack pan that can have an alternate material covering to tile. Epoxy for instance. But it’s durability, detailing and and interface with the drain system, is going to limit choices like that to those who don’t mind repeating the process every 7-15 years.


    Which is a lot of people these days, as renovations have become fashion statements rather than responses to the end of the material life cycle. That’s why tile has been so popular. It’s a lifetime choice. It has the lowest life cycle cost of any material choice. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnn.com/travel/amp/ancient-mosaic-jesus-galilee-intl-scli/index.html

  • User
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    I was assuming the OP wanted an off the shelf soution. For a custom shower enclosure I recommend hiring a design professional . I've never known a client to have a problem with marble tile.

  • Seabornman
    4 years ago

    I have friends with solid surface shower walls. It still looks good after 20 years. I used large format tile in our last redo. Still has grout joints and still get dirty.

  • shead
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    @User, no, not necessarily an off the shelf solution but something that is durable, easy to clean, and minus the inherent issues that tile has. I'm not even necessarily talking about a CHEAP solution either. I'd gladly pay more for a product that is less maintenance and DURABLE. It sounds like solid surface might be the best route. Resale isn't a factor as we are building on our farm in a rural area. As my friend recently put it, "In my 20's and 30's, I cared about aesthetics more than anything regarding my house. Now that I'm in my 40's, I care about that less and efficiency and easy to clean more."

  • User
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    The inescapable fact is that no matter the material that you choose, the same dirt will be there. It’s either hidden, or it’s not. Solid surface gets the soap scum just like the tile does. White cabinets get the dirt just like the wood ones do.

    Just because it’s less visible doesn’t mean that it’s “clean”. Would you rather have visible dirt prompting you to clean, or would you rather have it keep accumulating until it does become obvious?

    A well done tile installation isn’t that difficult to clean. It just isn’t.

  • functionthenlook
    4 years ago

    Mack, no offense but I will have to disagree. Yes, dirt is dirt. But solid surface is much easier to clean. Been there, done it.

  • shead
    Original Author
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    "Solid surface gets the soap scum just like the tile does."

    Um maybe, but solid surface or other smooth surfaces don't have to be resealed every 6 months to a year.

    Solid/smooth surfaces are usually easier to install and aren't prone to lipping as tile can be. There's nothing worse than discovering lipped tile on your shower floor AFTER the tile installer is long gone that you hit your toe against almost every time you get in the shower. BTDT twice now.

    Smooth surfaces don't have indentations (i.e., grout lines) that are more prone to catch and trap that soap scum making it build up more quickly and need cleaning more frequently. It washes down the drain much more easily.

    Smooth surfaces areas are MUCH easier to clean. Period. I can clean my kids' one piece shower/tub unit in 1/20th the time that it takes to properly clean my tiled shower.

  • PRO
    Cabot & Rowe
    4 years ago

    If you elect to do a solid surface for the walls such as corian or forza stone or any slab material the the shower MUST be waterproofed. Caulking at the seams is NOT waterproofing. The shower must be waterproofed before any surface material is applied.

  • User
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Tile can be fairly maintenance free if the correct construction methodology and right professional are chosen. Modern grouts don’t require sealing. 1960’s tile bathrooms never sealed their grout, and the surviving ones, like my hall bath, still look great. Both are low maintenance for different construction methodology reasons. If cared for properly, and fad “modern” cleaners are avoided.

    For low budgets, yes, inexpensive printed acrylic panels will always be a better choice than a low budget tile job. It’s “easier” for that level of contractor to install. Bad tile work from hacks isn’t a good reason to avoid tile though. There’s a certain cost threshold for finding quality and longevity together. Which is why solid surface materials cost more than most quality tile jobs. Its the same with the super large format tiles where a single tile covers the whole back of the shower. It costs as much as stone slabs. It takes skilled labor, which is scarce. That’s not a reason to avoid it either. It’s the reason you screen your contractor harder.

    For any budget, finding the most skilled contractor for the job is more important than finding the “perfect” material that a low skills guy then messes up. That goes for tile, Corian, or stone.

  • bbstx
    4 years ago

    DD totally hated the tile in her shower. She’s a bit of a clean freak. She could never get the grout clean enough to suit her. Finally, she ripped out the tile and had “cultured marble” panels installed that mimic tile. Both the walls and the shower pan were custom made to her sizes. It was so much easier to clean and she was so much happier.


    She chose a color that blended with the tile around the tub area. From a reasonable distance, you can’t tell the difference.


    My shower is also “cultured marble” but in a white subway tile pattern. I did it for ease of cleaning. It was more expensive than tile. But my goal was not a cheap shower. My goal was a shower that would be easy to clean. I got that!

  • tendrac
    4 years ago

    We are currently in the process of building and plan to install a solid surface surround and pan in our master shower, which will be 5' x 6'. Like your DH, I cannot do another tile-and-grout shower. My OCD tendencies and sensitivities (i.e., the feeling of grout lines on my feet and reactions to chemical bathroom cleaners) made me truly hate the experience of our last one.


    So far, the list that we have put together for solid surface sources are: Avonite, WilsonArt, Corian, and Staron. Additional options include Meganite, Mystera and Hanex.


    Since we are still in the research phase for this part of our project, I cannot offer any personal experience about which is the best option. What I have learned from my research is that the cost of materials will be more than that of grouted tile but the cost for install should be less due to the ease of installation. For our space, we expect there to be little-to-no savings between the two options. We are okay with this since, the simplicity of maintenance is worth more than any up-charge between the two.


    As an aside: we also looked into Tadelakt as an alternative to tile-and-grout. This was my preferred choice but, unfortunately, we could not coordinate our build with the schedule of the only installer in our area.

    shead thanked tendrac
  • Seabornman
    4 years ago

    It depends where you live, too. I visited a friend in Florida, whose 1950's bathroom looked like the day it was built - the tile work still had crisp white joints. It wouldn't look like that here - high humidity, little use of AC, hard water, a real mold and mildew hotspot.

  • Nancy in Mich
    4 years ago

    I have hard water. I have a solid surface shower that has been in service since July 2018. I use liquid shower soap. I have NEVER cleaned the walls of my shower with any solution, nor done anything to them except squeegee most times we shower. I have no soap scum, no build up of minerals and no stains. I have sprayed the shower floor with cleanser and scrubbed with a scrub brush on a mop stick to get into the lines that are indented into the floor of my shower that makes it look like tile and gives it traction when pink slimy mildew has formed and it comes right off. Spraying it with Force of Nature water (an electrolysed water made at home with a small appliance) will kill this stuff if I do that regularly, too.


    My Transolid shower has either overlapping flange joints (horizontal joints) or molding to cover the vertical joints and caulk. I have one visible line of caulk, at the bottom where the walls meet the pan. That is a flanged joint and waterproof with the caulk as a filler, not the sole waterproofing method.


    There is no need for waterproofing behind a properly installed solid surface shower and there would be no ability to tie in the waterproofing behind the walls to the shower pan.


    Res 3D Sketches, you say, " I've never known a client to have a problem with marble tile. "

    You must be new to the Gardenweb Home forums if you have never known of a homeowner to complain of marble in a shower. Simply do a search for "marble shower" in the bathroom forum at the top of this page and spend the next few days reading.

  • shead
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    "Modern grouts don’t require sealing."


    I have been told this and have paid for the expensive grout additives in both tile jobs and on both occasions (with the tile "pro" and with the tile "pro" aka "really a hack"), I was told that the grout really should be resealed after a year despite other claims.


    Again, though, my goal is to eliminate as much (if not all) grout as possible despite whatever cost that would entail. Life's too short.....

  • shead
    Original Author
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    "whose 1950's bathroom looked like the day it was built - the tile work still had crisp white joints."

    Was the house originally built with a shower? Our 1970's harvest gold hall bathroom has the gold tile on the walls and around the tub (only partially) but the original owners didn't use it for a shower. It still has white crisp joints as well, but I highly doubt there is any waterproofing behind the tile which is why I have shower rods and liners on all four sides of it now after installing a handheld shower for the kids to use. It'll all soon be torn out and redone with a one piece acrylic tub/shower that I've had numerous times in the past and had nary a problem with cleaning, etc.

  • bry911
    4 years ago

    Just my opinion on a couple of things...YMMV


    I had a rental property with old 70's 4x4 ceramic tile over drywall. The tenants were a family of four who used a handheld shower for nearly 10 years and it never once leaked. At first, I checked it religiously until I eventually understood it was just not going to leak. Although, there are many benefits to waterproofing tub and shower walls, vertical surfaces are still vertical surfaces and act just like vertical surfaces, so when installing new stuff water proofing is important, but I wouldn't invent problems where none currently exist.


    So our walls are are 48"x48" tiles with like 1/16" grout lines, it takes me seconds to clean it, and I really mean seconds and not minutes. It takes me longer to walk to the shower than it does to clean all of the grout lines. We originally had them on the floor also but changed because it was just too slick. If you are using bar soap then it is going to form soap scum on solid surface just as fast as grouted surfaces, you can certainly make the case that it is easier to clean off, but also requires more regular cleaning. I consider myself to be fairly coordinated and I lost my footing several times with few grout lines. Now I prefer things like pebble flooring and lots of grout.

    As for cleaning, I hate to admit this but I got a 50' extension hose for the pressure washer and I just spray it clean in a minute or two. There is something completely satisfying and mesmerizing about a pressure washer, I don't understand it really, but I don't mind cleaning the shower floor whether or not it needs it.


  • shead
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    "but I wouldn't invent problems where none currently exist."


    Oh, I agree. In case my OP wasn't clear or got muddled throughout, the bathroom I wish to have solid surface in is a totally different bathroom from the 1970's one I mentioned. But since the whole house is basically being gutted, the 1970's bathroom is going bye-bye as well and being totally reconfigured.


    I just lol'd at the image of a 50' pressure washer hose in a bathroom....brilliant!

  • shead
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    I just thought I'd update everyone on the pricing I was quoted for a custom Corian pan and shower walls for a 42"x60" shower......w/shipping $6800, which doesn't include installation. Ouch.


    And while I'd have been willing to pay somewhat more, I'm not sure I can fork over that much more...eek. A preformed pan and large format tiles are looking more appealing, especially if I use bry911's pressure washer suggestion.

  • User
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Thats about middle of the road costs for a actually qualified tile setter to do the job. Without glass. You kept insisting that price wouldn’t matter to you.... A shower the size you’re talking about is darn lucky to end up under 10K with glass. My guess on the reason the Corian came in at such a low price is that they are not actually using Corian. They are likely using a different solid surface, since the patent is off of Corian and there are lots of generic equivalent products out there.

    https://www.ceramictilefoundation.org/find-certified-tile-installers

  • shead
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Our last tiled shower was around $4k all in for a similar sized shower. $5k-5500 all in might be worth it but not $8k+ after labor and glass. Geographic location is the biggest factor and we are rural.

  • User
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    4K isn’t a properly done shower. That’s close to just material costs. I deal with pros nationwide. There are international gathering spots for exchanges of information. Including pricing. There’s the line that below that, you’re not dealing with a qualified professional. 5K in the absolute cheapest cheap area of the country is that line. With no niche or extras. And no glass. Average is 7-9K. In an expensive area, more like 9-12K. Add in natural stone, or extra features, and up that 2-4K.

  • shead
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    live_wire_oak, I will respectfully disagree with your armchair assessment that it was not properly done. The entire thing was waterproofed with Schluter and included a niche and corner bench. I watched the entire process and read numerous info regarding the Schluter installation to make sure it was done correctly.

  • Nancy in Mich
    3 years ago

    Very Nice!


  • functionthenlook
    3 years ago

    Lovely. I think it looks just as nice as a tile shower. When I see tile showers, I see work keeping it clean.

  • tendrac
    3 years ago

    @shead it looks nice! I am looking at the Transolid product. Initially, I was thinking about a faux tile or stone color for the master shower but, then, I realized that the extra expense is not worth it to me since my main focus is to have a grout-less shower at the lowest cost possible, material-wise. So, I am planning on going white. I've, also, decided to change all of my bathtub alcoves from tiled to solid surface. I am just over cleaning grout.


    Anyway, how tall are your panels? How long did the install take? Also, did you get quotes from additional solid surface companies?

  • shead
    Original Author
    3 years ago

    @tendrac, there is only one dealer in my area that does any type of solid surface for showers. Luckily, it's only 45 mins from me so we went with them. We didn't get any other quotes. Our builder has had other clients use it before and really liked the material and quality of the Onyx Collection. The materials alone (shower plus corner bench and alcove) ran about $3600 and it was $1500 to install. That said, I was shocked when I got the final install price. Our builder had one of his subs install it and I was onsite for most of it. It took about four hours for two guys. They did REALLY well on our job :insert eye roll:. There are YouTube videos on how to install it but we didn't have the time or the tenacity at that point to attempt it nor did we want the liability if it went totally wrong ;) Our panels are 7 ft tall.

  • Sarah Anthony
    2 years ago

    @tendrac What did you end up going with?

  • tendrac
    2 years ago

    @Sarah Anthony We are still in the process of building but have planned to use the Transolid Expressions panels in the master bath and three of our secondary bathrooms. Due to stock issues (and other setbacks), we only recently received the panels for our secondary bathrooms. Hopefully, those will be installed by this week or the next. Since we still have some additional finish and plumbing work to complete in the master bath, we will probably not have those installed until the end of January or beginning of February.

  • Sarah Anthony
    2 years ago

    @tendrac Thanks the response! I’d love to see some pics and follow your journey as things get installed!

  • shead
    Original Author
    2 years ago

    @tendrac, my hairdresser is also having issues getting her Onyx Collection shower installed due to supply chain issues. What a crazy, crazy time we're living in :(

  • tendrac
    2 years ago

    @Sarah Anthony I will keep you updated on the install. Still hoping that they will begin this week but electricians are hogging all of the space right now. So, hopefully, next week will have at least one installed.


    @shead Indeed, it is! We have run into a few issues, here and there, but it hasn't been as bad for us as it seems to be for those who started their projects after the onslaught of covid. I am happy that we purchased most of our big-ticket items in advance. It hasn't been ideal having those items just sitting around, waiting for installation, but we saved financially and emotionally by purchasing early on in our build.