Honestly I think the 'shorter' version is going to look stupid. You need the length and the angle to make it look like the beams have a real job. That said, I think you can get away with 4 of the long version - 1 on each of the ends and 2 flanking the center window column. No, they won't be evenly spaced but I think it could work. Hopefully someone here (PPF?) can do a mock up for you.

I agree - use the 4 supports, length as shown, and spaced out logically with the window groupings.

Just make sure they are beefy enough and perhaps add some steel terminations or something to make them more important.

Agree with Janni and DLM

Yes! Thanks for the mock up ! Def helps to see it. I don’t think the longer ones are going to work , but maybe the shorter ones would if they were substantial enough. Thanks so much for the photo!!

Honestly, I think sized as they are still makes sense since there will be enough of an angle.

(my rendered line is thinner than the proposed bracket and still looks substantial enough...not that I'd go thinner, but gives you an idea that you'll be ok size-wise)

ha - after seeing the mock ups - the shorter brackets work!

***Please have a structural engineer analyze that long deep cantilever and wind uplift.

There are casual “rules of thumb” used for cantilevers and roof overhangs but not applicable for this case IMHO.

Shorter brackets, spaced closer to the wall.

I like the shorter brackets as illustrated by Glo European. Big bonus with shorter brackets is unobstructed views which makes this dilemma an improvement to the original design IMO. One thing, I think the shorter brackets would look better made with black steel to match the windows. The steel brackets and wood beams would look awesome. Not crazy about the rusted metal chimney. Stone would look soooo much better.

@ myrica4 : we haven’t received the landscape drawings yet. I do no the retaining wall won’t be as high or conrete but rather a shorter stacked boulder wall and no turf. Just pea gravel drive and then some boulders, grasses and trees. They did say they were going to backfill under the deck some so the Deck wouldn’t be so high off the ground.

The chimney was originally conceptualized as rusted sheet metal. They are taking now stone veneer. We are not going with the stained cedar but instead hardie Plank painted medium to dark gray. I think the chimney might look good in the anodized sheet metal slabs but I’m not sure if the price surcharge. Looking forward to seeing what options we have. Colors would be more like this. Don’t mind the chimney color.

Yes to myrica4 's suggestion of equally spacing the beams since they are no longer based off window placement! Also, will those beams continue inside the home? Love that design detail!

Contemporary Exterior · More Info

For the exterior chimney, have you considered stopping the masonry at a height equal

to the interior firebox, and using a round double wall metal pre-fab chimney up to the required height?

It's a modern look in keeping with your exposed braces for your roof beams.

And that is why we need the mock-up! I like the shorter beams but I'm still not sure about the equal spacing - in the mock up they aren't equidistant from each other unless it's a visual fooler. The center two are closer together, no?

@ glo European yes the beams do continue inside :)

I like the alternative designs suggested but would need to see a section drawing to be able to offer advice. Is there similar bracing on the other side? What does the structural designer have to say about it?

@ RES luckily the beams are only a design element and not structural.

Explore the use of heavy cables with turnbuckles from the end of the roof beams to the narrow strip of wall above door level. It will make the roof look lighter. They do not necessarily have to be parallel.

If the beams were structural, the as built would look A LOT like the original.

One of modern designs tenets is truth in materials so I would explore no beams or brackets. They look fake and add to maintenance. What direction do those windows face? A southern orientation would benefit from another shorter overhang/louvers, closer to the tops of upper windows. Same for the lower windows but looks too late for that. Substantial handrail or trellis on deck could also help the seemingly out of proportion forms.

(reposted from above)

I don’t know the history of your project but please have the structural engineer analyze that long deep cantilever and wind uplift.

There are casual “rules of thumb” used for cantilevers spans and roof overhangs but not applicable here and not a substitute for engineering review.

Sorry to alarm you, there is no way to tell from the original rendering if those brackets were originally intended to be structural to help hold that deep cantilever down from uplift and break up the long cantilever span.

If they have no purpose are they just there for show? Is that your idea of good architecture ... giant fake brackets?

The cantilevered rafters appear to be I-Joists with no lateral bracing of the bottom chords so they are going to deflect and that will load the brackets and the brackets will load the wall horizontally. If there is nothing inside to resist this load, the wall may eventually bow.

Any change should be reviewed by the structural engineer of record. If the original design was not done by an engineer, you should have that corrected immediately.

This is not a design for an amateur.

Good catch RES, I did not notice those are I-joists. It is my understanding they can cantilever a maximum of 2'-0" properly installed.

The 2ft limit is for cantilevered wall offsets. For longer spans the bottom chords are braced perpendicular to the span with straps, blocking or a ceiling material, Or the sides of the I-Joists can be covered with sheathing. In any case, the I-Joists should be treated for weather protection. They won't last long without some kind of protection.

I know an architect did the original drawing but Im not sure if a structural engineer stamped them. I will bring this up to the builder. I suppose the best way to go about it is to have the structure as built inspected by a structural engineer. I’d hate have issues and try to sue after the fact :(

There are states that allow such a structure to be designed by a builder or an architect but not many. Where I live an engineer must design any structure that isn't included in the tables and diagrams of the building code. That includes LVL beams and I-Joists.

Looking more closely at the rendering, the roof joists appear to be enclosed and beams added below to which the brackets are attached. To understand the design we would need to see a building section and the engineer's drawings.

Engineers are not allowed to stamp the work of others unless they work under their supervision. Find the engineer's design drawings; they should be on file at the building department for anyone to see.