Is Nitrogen depleted in Clay soil?. Cherry tree isn't looking good.
M56 V89
5 years ago
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ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
5 years agoRelated Discussions
What fruit trees will grow well in pure clay soil?
Comments (23)First of all a little background. I am a graduate of Cal poly Pomona, I am a licensed irrigator in California and Texas. I also own a tree farm in Texas . White Hall Trees. In texas we do not have gray clay we have black clay that is at least as bad as what we had as a kid in California( I grew up in Orange County) Now with that said. The problem that everyone seems to have is the same. You claim you cant get fruit trees to grow in clay. Being a Civil Engineer, Landscape contractor and LI for 30 years I have some basic recommendations. First Clay is an excellent way to hold water ! and fruit trees need water! But not so much as to be wet all the time. First raise the tree about 3" above existing grade. When planting dig the hole twice as big around as the pot and 3 inches shallower than the pot . When back filling around the pot use a 3/4 to 1/4 ratio of good composted material to the clay and Float the tree back in. Simply put add water to the soil to get out air. Then ad 3" of good hardwood mulch around the tree. The biggest problem that you have is water so call Ewing Irrigation or John Deere landscapes and get some Rainbird .26 Drip tubing on 12" centers and drip the trees! If you circle the tree with lets say 6 drip emitters and water for 10 minutes you water .26 gal of water. Lets say the tree needs 3 Gal of water per week in one hour you will water 1.56 gal of water. So water 2 hours per week ! You may need to water Tuesday and Friday for 1 hour each day and check the tree hole with a moisture probe you can buy at one of the local Home depots for about $ 10.00 The biggest deal is don't guess ! Test and check ! Make sure. If you need more than 3 gal of water per week they have drip tube in .26, .4,.6, and .9 Netafim, Rainbird, Hunter, and Landscape products all make drip tube ! Do the calculations and if you are unsure call an irrigation professional they can help. The guys at Ewing can also help if you ask and by the way if you bring donuts to them they even get nicer !!!!!!!!!!!! Try It !...See Moresoil test results - sodic, clay, ph 8
Comments (21)P exists in soils primarily as phosphates, which themselves act as bases and can increase alkalinity. That's one of the things your are trying to overcome. At high levels P can reduce the availability of a number of metal ion nutrients, such as zinc and copper. Your levels are high, which shouldn't be a problem. You just don't want to be adding and pushing them to very high levels. When I said "drain" I meant percolate. The question is can excess sodium be leached from the soil with good quality water? That requires that if the soil were soaked or saturated it would drain down, leaching sodium as it does. The water question is critical to your long-term success at that site. There is no home test for amounts of Na or Ca. But if you know a well driller with good local knowledge he may be able to tell you what kind of water exists in your area, and how deep the natural water table lays. Those would be good first clues. One of the interesting things that some clays can do is to transport water and dissolved minerals upwards towards the surface from below by capillary action. It is most pronounced when the water table is closer to the surface. I see this very frequently in my neighborhood, where water will ooze up and out of cracks in our concrete streets. I have no idea if your clay soils are susceptible to that kind of action, but if they are then the potential for restoring the soil becomes somewhat questionable. A good well driller who knows your area may be able to clue you in....See MoreCant seem to raise nitrogen in soil
Comments (9)It is not possible to get an accurate N reading from a home soil test kit. Even many professional soil testing labs do not test for this nutrient. N is the most mobile of the three primary plant nutrients and is very difficult to assess. It will read differently based on time of year/time of day, whether the area is in sun or shade, how much moisture is in the soil, quantity and type of organic matter and a host of other various factors. At best, you will only get an approximate reading at that point in time. It is also the single nutrient that is most often naturally lacking or deficient in an unamended cultivated garden. Blood meal is a good source of fast acting organic N but sometimes it is too fast :-) In a warm, humid environment, blood meal will convert to ammonia rapidly and this can often burn fragile roots. You need to be very careful with your application rate - no more than a pound per 100sf. A slower, less soluble source would be better. Together with the organic matter of the compost, I'd guess the blood meal plus fish emulsion may have created too high a N level, at least temporarily. And I don't think this is aided by your watering practices (which would flush the excess soluble N) - 6 minutes is not a sufficient duration for any kind of proper soil depth penetration or to satisfy the needs of young, rapidly growing seedlings. It is far better to offer water at the root zone (not with sprinklers, where most evaporates before it hits the ground) for a longer duration and less frequently. You want to check and make sure the water penetrates down into the soil at least 6-8 inches. The bark, if applied very heavily, may also be impeding water penetration as well. I dislike bark for a veggie garden. Better to use a finer textured mulch - chopped grass trimmings, shredded leaves, compost, composted manures, etc., as these will help to retain soil moisture rather than repel it....See MoreTrees in bad soil - not draining good
Comments (24)ON the drainage again. Two years ago I planted two maple trees for a landscaper I was working with. These were larger trees, I could not pick-up the trees but could drag them. I dug two holes as far down as one can with a sand shovel, including digging down further by digging while on my knees. The holes were about three plus feet wide by the depth of a sand shovels handle. First tree I broke threw the yellow clay to what ever was below as the water drained out of the hole in minutes. The other, with the more expensive and beautiful tree I did not. I told my boss and he said put sand in the bottom of the hole, which was stupid because it was sand bags left over for blocking water from running off I got off of the contractor junk pile and I wanted it for landscaping at home. (beautiful sugar sand). Well as I expected the hole with the more expensive tree did not drain and the tree died. Had he done as I suggested and gotten a power post hole digger on skid steer he could have made a dry well four to five feet deep beyond what I dug out and filled that with sand or gravel or more likely, it would have broken through the clay to the original soil. The first tree lived and did very well. SO? If you plant more trees get smaller hand held post hole diggers with augers apprx. ten to twelve inches wide and dig the holes down as far as you can. Fill the bottom with pea gravel or coarse sand. This will give the water a place to go to. If you still have water problems after this-- punt....See MoreEmbothrium
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