Yes actually frequently offered Rosa banksiae 'Lutea' might be just the thing. It's not a Rambler so I didn't think of it. If you are located in coastal California this has even been mass planted, to grow as a shrub along local freeways. It even has the same general physical appearance as certain acacias when in flower. The next point would be if this (or any other rose) would be in flower at the same time, earlier I assumed you thought this likely.

Thank you both! Sorry I should have mentioned the acacias are white, but no matter I love a yellow center anyway!

Emborithum, Paul's Himalayan Musk is definitely on my list, a little disconcerted to hear about the issues you've had with foliage! That's one thing I love about Bobbie James. Its foliage looks stunning from spring to leaf-fall.

Leontine Gervais is reeeeaal pretty!!

I'm in Tuscany just outside Florence and have a white banksia which I adore. I'd dismissed them as an option for the tree, but maybe I'll reconsider.... I think it's a good idea actually. They're really common around here, especially the Lutea, but it would be a new way of using it.....

Google has told me they're actually pseudoacacias.

Robinia pseudoacacia

Might you have Robinia pseudoacacia? That blooms primarily during May and June here. Although there are ~1,450 species the kinds of Acacia familiar in gardens that are showy in bloom such as A. baileyana and A. dealbata produce yellow flowers during winter and spring.

[You posted the previous while I was composing this. First thing to check would be if the locusts and the new rose would be in peak bloom at the same time]

I grow La Mortola, Felicite et Perpetue, The Garland, PHM and Banksia lutea. Any of these would do, I would think. PHM is reasonably clean in my climate apart from a bit of mildew which is not very noticeable on a high climbing rose unless you look at it from a very close distance. Of the above, La Mortola and the banksias will not need much help to initially climb up, the rest might need some initial coaching to start rambling rather than scramble low.

Madame Alfred Carriere is a tea noisette. In my garden (zone 9, Northern CA), which I believe is in a similar climate to yours (mild rainy winters, hot dry summers), it thrives. I have two which grow over 30 feet up trees. Blooms are white with a little pink shading in the bud, opening to all white. Completely healthy foliage here. I do NOTHING to them. The best part is IMO, that, unlike most ramblers, the banksias (which I love), etc. they bloom 11 months of the year here. Have since I planted them 15 years ago.

Here is a long distance pic of one of mine - this is the middle of it - it continues to go up another 10 feet into the trees on the left.

Jackie

In your zone, with a tree to climb in an out of the way place, I think I'd be tempted back to 'climbing Devoniensis'... it frightened me a bit with its vigorous and thorny growth, and I don't have any trees for it, but it had fine foliage, reddish new growth, and rather charming pale old world flowers... I wonder if you might like it?...

Wow! Jackie! What an inspiring photo!!

She's going on the list now! La Mortola interests me but the two nurseries I get roses from don't sell it, strangely.

As can be seen in previous photo 'Carriere' does not produce a large, Rambler like dense cloud of small flowers. There is of course all manner of other Large flowered roses in a range of colors that could be tried, if the comparatively spotty (and often much smaller) display these offer is instead thought agreeable.

We have had Paul's Himalayan Musk virtually naturalized and growing into Douglas Firs for over 12 years without any trouble other than a bit of black spot. We're on a wooded hillside in northwest Oregon in a forest clearing, so we have acidic soil and limited direct sun. When we first moved in 12 years ago, I temporarily plunked a couple of pots of PHM in between firs until I could plant them. I was distracted and indecisive, so the roots planted themselves among the tree roots in the deep shade and, with no help or encouragement from me, they were soon growing into the tall trees and blooming. (I had to cut the plastic pots away.) I've potted and given away numerous cuttings to friends in similar settings, so I'm responsible for many trees from Portland to Seattle dripping with roses.

Now that we've finally built our cabin, I need to add other ramblers and OGRs, but PHM will always be in the mix.

Love this topic, and, by the way, hello! It's been a while.

I must say that 'Paul's Himalayan Musk' doesn't do well for me. This may be due to location, though. I love enormous ramblers and large-flowered climbers. I do in fact have the double yellow Lady Banks growing through trees and looking great, The double white would do equally well: mine is a mountain on a pergola. I agree 'La Mortola' would be a good choice, but be aware that it's about the thorniest rose there is, though up in a tree that's probably not a problem. In fact, a tree is probably the very best place for all those thorns. 'Treasure Trove' has large, vaguely peachy blooms and will get up to thirty feet and very likely more; this has always been good. This year it has mildew, but then it's gotten two inches of water since December and it isn't happy about it. Another R. filipes seedling is 'Brenda Colvin', also a good healthy vigorous rose and a monster in the making. All the roses mentioned so far are once-blooming.

Intermezzo: I'm thinking your acacias are as Embothrium said, Robinia pseudoacacia, which grow all over the place up here and are called "robinia". The name I know in English is black locust. I hope your tall tree isn't a black locust? We had 'Treasure Trove' growing up one when the whole thing blew down in a storm. It was interesting.

I would be mightily tempted by some of the warm climate large-flowered roses. Jackie's suggestion of 'Mme. Alfred Carriere' is high on my list; then how about 'Jaune Desprez', 'Crepuscule', and the once-blooming, but splendid, 'Souv. de Mme. Leonie Viennot' (of commerce)? I would back all of these to get up to twenty feet, and very likely more. They are all fragrant and easy growers, and would look wonderful dripping down from a tree.

I have a number of Ayrshire ramblers, very confused as to name. They're all tough roses, fragrant, and big plants, and would do fine. Small white double blooms, once flowering. 'Felicite Perpetue' is one of this clan.

I like Barbier Wichuriana large-flowered ramblers for their grace and beauty. They're more or less once-flowering. White 'Alberic Barbier' is one of the standouts, then there's 'Leontine Gervais', soft peachy-pink, and one I've never grown, 'Alexandre Girault', pinkish red. Deep colors are rare in this group. There are others, all the ones I've seen I liked.

I was just noticing the great foliage on Alberic Barbier today. The entire Barbier Wichurianas have unbelievable foliage. The flowers were shockingly gorgeous too, and I think mine rebloomed last summer.

The problem for me with Paul's H. Musk (I, too, am in Tuscany,in the northern area of the province of Prato) is that it's bloom period is very brief. It's so beautiful and perfumes the whole garden, but it seems to only last a week or so. I think the problem is exasperated by the fact that it blooms late-ish in the season, when ,sad to say, it is often already extremely hot. Treasure Trove's flowers last longer, and, like Bobby James,has the virtue of producing those naturally long,upright, high-growing canes, so it goes into a tall tree by itself, without the gardener having to fuss (I remember having to put a ladder against the oak tree on which I grow P's H M and pulling the canes up into the boughs with cords). I, too, adore the Barbier ramblers, but again they don't have the automatic tree-climber habit of TT or BJ.

Wow, thanks so much everyone! Hi Melissa, yes it's been a long time!

Yes, what is called an "acacia" here is actually the robinia. I've taken a photo, it's particularly gloomy this morning, so it will make next year's eventual "after" photos seem all the more glorious! ;)

Some notes: 1) I'm aiming for once-blooming 2) This tree might die, but I'm not concerned. If it dies, then we'll see what happens, it will be fun. The woodpeckers love this tree. I love the woodpeckers so I refuse to have it cut down.

3) This tree is see from a fair distance from the house, so details are not so important, more so the general effect. I also want people walking their dogs, or strolling down this little road to be charmed by an unexpected cascade of blooms and delicate leaves.

4) Strong wafting scent is definitely a point in favour of any of these options.

5) I'll be placing my order soon and having it delivered to a flower show next week, so we have little time to decide.

6) Isn't this tremendously exciting!!!!

yes! Ramblers on trees always are, IMO,LOL!

I agree about the totally exciting. I am currently half dreaming and half planning to plant a lot of these same kinds of roses down in the woods and have them scramble around in the treetops. Two double yellow Lady Banks roses are already in place and doing fine, and last winter we planted two Ayrshires which look happy enough so far, and I have faith in the toughness of Ayrshires. Most of the rest I'll have to propagate, so it's a long project.

Alright, this is the list at the moment (so many tempting other options, repeat bloomers, and larger flowers, and colours, but I'm trying to be disciplined):

-PHM

-R. banksiae (yellow or white, yellow or white, so hard to decide!)

-Rambling Rector (for scent)

-Brenda Colvin

-La Mortola

-Apple Blossom

-R. russelliana (this one because the man at the nursery so strongly recommended it... does anyone grow it?)

Cathy, thanks for the link to your blog! Very informative\|!

I hope you find the rose you are looking for, and I understand the romance with this idea, but I'm sorry to mention this, and perhaps I shouldn't as it's sort of putting a damper on your enthusiasm, and I hate to do anything like that... but that tree would make me rather nervous of planting anything that might topple it over. If that was just a field down below, I wouldn't be so concerned, but with a road that is used by walkers, and presumably a car or two?.. knowing my luck it would come crashing down at an inopportune moment to say the least...

Just a word of caution that I know you don't need... but you did mention that the tree might die... is it showing signs of deterioration?... but I simply couldn't plant a monster rose up that tree, in that location, maybe something to the lowest limbs would be as far as I could stand it...

You may be a younger, more carefree person without these sorts of concerns, and I'm probably a lot older and more cautious... but I wonder what anyone else thinks about this?...

Russelliana is new to me, I can tell you for me it's a slow to start grower. Meaning it just don't grow as fast as some of the others, it takes time to build. Mines still in a pot and will be planted out this fall. Here's a picture of mine this spring.

Edited to say Marlorena the thought had crossed my mind..

Marlorena, you're probably right. Fortunately though I'm the carefree one, I DO have someone here who is maniacal about keeping things under control, so the tree would get the chop before it could fall over. If it's during a violent windstorm like the one that hit us a couple of years ago, trust me nobody is walking out in that weather. The road is not public so cars are not allowed on it.

Nevertheless, do you think a less vigorous rose would be better?? Any suggestions?

I'd be fine with something that only goes up the lower branches...

How nice to see a pic of Russelliana! I'd never heard of it before this week!

I see that tree is in a spot that seems difficult to reach, not to mention put a ladder up against it and its lowest branches seem to grow some height from the ground so I will repeat something that both bart and I said above. Many true ramblers like PHM will need some coaching to start climbing up rather than scramble on the ground because their canes stay thin and flexible for long. Roses like the banksias, La Mortola, Souv. de Mme Leonnie Viennot and others with some HT blood in them plus some ramblers like the ones bart mentioned will climb without any help because their canes grow stiff and upright.

I planted a lot of ramblers to climb on trees or other things last year, they're too young to tell the tales, but something for you to check. Here are my ramblers: Baltimore Belle, Thelma, Rene Andre, Rosa Moschata, Toby Triston, Veilchenblau, Gerbe Rose, Kiftsgate, Paul's Himalayan. I am in zone 6a, an ice hole, I don't think my ramblers will grow tall. I'd be happy if they'd grow up to 12-15'.

I love the Barbier ramblers too, unfortunately I just lost the one I had.

I'd love to live in a warmer zone and grow Teas and Noisettes..

I think the possibility of a weak tree blowing over, particularly if it has a massive rambler/climber growing on it, is something you want to think about. It happened to us. The problem with a lower growing rose is that it won't be able to get up into the sun. What kind of tree is this? as it only now occurs to me to ask. Some kinds are more suitable than others. Oaks are the max, but there aren't enough oaks. As I've hinted, we solved our lack of suitable mature trees by letting our roses go up into the canopy, to ramble from tree to tree. My hope, so far not disappointed, is that the weight of the roses will in this fashion be distributed among many trees which individually couldn't support them.

As far as I know, acacias are not very stable trees. There were lots of them in the woods on the road going up to the town where we used to live, many were draped in ivy. After a couple years of drought,we got rain again, and snow as well, and many of these trees uprooted,so I think that this is a valid concern. (I don't think, however, that they crash down suddenly on a person's head; actually, what is more dangerous in that sense on these steep wooded Italian roads is the danger of rocks crashing down!!! and plants' roots help to prevent that somewhat) But I can see a way around it: why not plant a more stable, fast-growing tree next to the acacia,at the same time that you plant the rose? Once the new tree has grown large enough,you can then get rid of the acacia,and the rose will be able to grow up the new tree. You could do a little group of cypresses,for example,putting the rose on the side where it'd be in the sun even once they got big...

Forgot to add: if you do decide to add some trees there, I'd start with BABIES ; little guys that can grow up in simbiosis with the (probably) rocky soil. Larger ones are difficult to establish,would require watering for a couple of years at least,and might never really be able to sink their roots deep down. With fast growers like cypresses the babies will very quickly catch up in size anyway.

Felicite et Perpetua

Ok, thanks so much everyone!

First of all, Melissa, Fabrizio thinks it's an "olmo", which I think is an Elm....

Fabrizio also says it won't fall over (with great assuredness) but I think he underestimates how big (and heavy) the rose will eventually get.

That being said.... bart, GREAT IDEA, especially love your suggestion of the cypress, and yes, a baby.... I mean it's a good idea to plant a second "insurance" tree in any case.

Cypresses with roses growing through them are absolutely the most gorgeous. I just wonder if their root systems will be able to handle the steepness of this slope. We also need deep-rooting trees to hold the slope together!

suncoastflowers, what a coincidence... I JUST FELL IN LOVE WITH THIS ROSE! Was at a flower show this morning and FELL in LOVE with it. I'd read about it, seen it, but I don't know,.... it just really captivated me. That and Paul Transon, which I'd never seen in real life. Ah, gorgeous. I wish someone with nothing in their garden would let me plant stuff for them... I'm running out of space!

Also saw a gorgeous Thisbe.... anyone have experice with this rose?

The "bit of black spot" mentioned above for the 'Paul's' is probably the same what appears to be downy mildew I always got on it here. As in brown blotched leaves dropping all summer.

Mowed hillside shown looks like a pretty tough spot for a rose to get going and do well.

I think 'Félicité Perpétue' might be just the ticket, but if you're still taking suggestions, 'Climbing Cecile Brunner' might be a rose to consider. Some clones are once-bloomers, others rebloom in the fall, and there are probably some that keep chugging along in between... Nice fragrance of the wafting sort.

Virginia

Embothrium, actually everything seems to really thrive in the soil of the slope. It's REALLY nice and humus-y. It's "mown" because my partner cannot stand things to be untidy. He's a little bit crazy. I prefer it full of wild things growing, but he can't stand it. I let him have his way here.... let's say a compromise (after all, he is letting me consider planting a rose to go up a tree).

I also have great faith in roses and have no doubt in three years there'd be something grand making its way up there, not a doubt in my mind.

bart, i just thought of something..... there are bay laurels (seedlings) growing nearby ( you can see in the photo). They're very young, but we could let one grow into a tree and that could actually be the "Plan B" tree.... Fabrizio says a cypress wouldn't manage :(

By the way, this is the first year we've started working on The Slope (Il Balzo). It's incredible when you look at the photo above, to think that it will be completely different in three years or so.... maybe even sooner. Those bay laurels are only a couple of years old and some of them are already huge!

Why wouldn't a cypress manage, pray tell? I don't mean to sound aggressive and rude,but italian cypress, though not, surprisingly, native to Tuscany, does very, very well here, with very little effort (close to zero effort, if you start with babies,plant them in October/November, and water them the first summer when there's the typical summer drought) Yeah, I'd encourage the laurels, too,absolutely...I'd aim for a nice little uber-Tuscan hillside, there...cypress and laurel and a juicy giant rambler (or,does one dare? even TWO???) scrambling about through the evergreens... could be breath-taking...But I 'm glad you're thinking "away" from the acacia; they are not reliable trees, I think. The one you have gave you the concept, the inspiration...now take the ball and run with it, lol!

I agree about the total toughness of Italian cypresses, the only tree that grows at all well on our harsh sun-baked hillside. Could shade do them in? Deer particularly love them, though. If you have deer, and plant Italian cypresses, you would have to protect the trees.

I loathe elms (yes, 'olmo' in Italian). They have invasive shallow roots and, in my experience, no ground-holding value whatever, while they keep anything else from growing. Against that I'll mention that a nurseryman told me that they put down a deep taproot, so perhaps I'm wrong about the lack of capacity to anchor the ground. I'm not wrong about the invasive roots. I call elms zombie trees, neither alive nor dead: they die readily, but then sucker anew and restart growth, usually someplace you didn't want them. I hope in time to eliminate every elm from our land.

P.S. I wholeheartedly agree with the importance of anchoring the ground! We devote a great deal of resources to this challenge.

A bushy, thick, upright branched selection of italian cypress is a challenge for the less efficient of ramblers due to its dense foliage. I believe only the most vigorous of once blooming ramblers can create a magnificent site on them. They are also relatively slow growers so if one plants a young one now one has to wait for quite a few years (decades?) before it can become the host of a large rambling rose. Covering a younger cypress with a rose may smother it and leave it stunned imo.

On the topic of cypresses, I think the trepidation stems from the fact that a couple of years ago (March 2015?) our area suffered terribly from a cyclone and thousands of cypresses and stone pines came crashing down all around us.

Even I'd sworn I'd NEVER ever plant a cypress after that (as you can tell, I'm now over it.....)

With cypress corpses lying around everywhere upended, you could really see how shallow the rootballs were.... just wide the width of the tree, and just as deep, no more....anchoring these gigantic trees. It was sobering....

Anyway, we'll see about cypresses, sometime in the future perhaps. But I do have etched in my mind the vision of great cypresses draped in white roses at Ninfa south of Rome.... probably the most beautiful sight I've ever beheld.

Back to my little slope. Melissa, I was just thinking of your photos and how LOVELY your garden (land) is, and I bet you started out just like us... something bare and grim... and slowly you start working at it, and after some years you find the earth has rewarded you and there is joyful life teeming all about.

A boring question now: Does Felicite e Perpetue shed its petals cleanly??? I saw a photo in a Peter Beales book where they look sort of brown and wretched...

I can't stand that.... my Lamarque does that and it drives me batty but at least I can get at it to deadhead.... the one in the slope will need to self-clean.

I don't know about 'Felicite Perpetue', but wanted to say, you have the right idea about gardening. We still have a long way to go on our land, and in fact, it's going to take another generation, probably not us. But if you keep thinking and digging and planting and maintaining, in time miracles will occur.

You'll have to wait until my FetP blooms, which will be any day now, to give you a report about if it sheds the petals cleanly or not. It is planted at the edge of my property so I don't pay particular attention to it but during its full flush.

Yes Nik, keep me posted!! :)

Little White Pet is a polyantha sport of Felicite et Perpetue. LWP hangs on to its flowers and they look like brown tissues all over the plant. Very healthy and vigorous (I think mine wants to revert to the climbing habit) but those old flowers do not look good. When the flowers are fresh though, the plant looks gorgeous, absolutely covered in white flowers.

I may be coming in too late here, but FWIW, re Banksia choices - in case it helps, the double white (Banksia banksiae I believe) is said to have the most powerful fragrance of the 4 basic ones - yellow and white, double and single. The fragrance is lovely, very like violets, but I don't remember it wafting particularly. Wafting is often dependent on having some humidity in the air to carry it. Another point worth considering is that they're generally evergreen, whether you consider that a point in their favour for your situation or otherwise. The foliage is particularly nice - healthy and delicate/almost ferny looking, and the growth thornless and very lush.

And, since you mentioned your vision of delicate foliage cascading down, I concur with Virginia in thinking of Climbing Cecile Brunner - delicate in both bloom and leaf, and very big and cascade-y!

Adelaide d'Orleans is similar to Felicite Perpetue, and my impression - though mainly from photographs - is that it has a particularly delicate, graceful habit and general appearance. (Many pictures of Mottisfont gardens in England show their highly maintained Ad'O draped archways, should you care to google them.) Once-blooming only.

Having said all that, looking at your photo, which by the way is quite lovely, I wonder about a creamy yellow wilder looking species or close to species rose, like Rosa cantabrigiensis perhaps - a distinctive, thorny, upright, arching shrub with tree-scrambling potential in a warm climate and ferny foliage that's said to be scented, like the Incense Rose.

Comtesse, that's an interesting thought about getting R. cantabrigiensis to climb in a warm climate. No mention of it climbing at HMF, which might be as good a reason as any to try it.

As for Climbing Cecile, there is a photo posted to tessiess' thread on odd roses that may be of interest: http://forums.gardenweb.com/discussions/4600153/odd-roses-and-their-garden-friends?n=28

Just scroll through- leisurely!- the many delightful photos until you see a rose eating a tree... you'll have arrived at your destination.

Virginia

Rosa cantabrigiensis is so lovely. Sigh. And that photo of Climbing Cecile Brunner...!!!

I think the slope should only have species roses? What do you think? I've started populating it with some. So far there is a r. canina, r. gymnocarpa & as of about 2 hours ago, a r. californica. Which, from the blooms on it at the moment, looks like it has a very long flowering period. Is this true? Also if what I've read is true, it can get huge. I'm hoping it gets huge. Anyway, those are on the "left hand side" of the slope. I want to add a Stanwell Perpetual near-ish the gymnocarpa because I think the colours look great together. So the left hand side is the pink-y, reddish, apricot side. The "right hand side", the one with the tree in question, facing the infamous robinia pseudoacacia, is more "wild" because it borders a little clump of "forest" so I was thinking of having a bit of a white, cream and yellow theme on that side.....

Félicité et Perpétue is still on my list nonetheless, despite its looking "done up and ready for a party" and the likely possibility of spent blooms hanging around too long.

As you can see, I did not make up my mind in time for the flower show, and will just have to drive to the nursery to pick it up eventually :) :) :)

La Mortola, R. Laevigata, and a bunch of the other big white ramblers are all still on the list too. Here's a shot of the robinia & elm from the back of the garage, different viewpoint.

F. has expressed a desire for COLOUR. Only to make decisions even more difficult...

Bold colour (but not out of place in a woody setting, imo) = Cl. Cramoisi Superieur (Agrippina in Italy).

I came back from Rome yesterday, full of memories of roses and ruins around Lazio. Climbing Cécile Brunner was the rose that impressed me most both in Giardino di Ninfa and Roseto di Valleranello because of the beauty of the flowers. I should be lucky to be able to grow the bush form but if I could I would go for the climbing version. It was at least 30 ft tall in both places. Agrippina was also beautiful.

A photo of my young Climbing Cecile; she has some darling buds, and nice, wafting fragrance:

Cheers,

Virginia

I've been so busy lately (and with a new phone that doesn't like the houzz app - or maybe the houzz app is just objectively bad) I haven't been able to keep up with the forum! I did want to just UPDATE on this topic.... that of the tall tree climber I was asking about earlier this year.

Well, the tree is VERY SICK, near death and it's probably going to have to be cut down by the time fall comes around.

So..... that puts a crimp in my rambling plans somewhat and explains why you haven't seen ecstatic posts of a new baby rose in the slope struggling through its first year and on its way to greatness in the air......

:(

TBC much later.

Nice to hear from you again, Anna-Lyssa. I had been wondering where you had gotten to.

About your plans, well, patience. How's your weather?

Melissa! Hi!

Yes, pazienza!

About the weather.... I've just about summed it up on the "Hot" thread.... :(

And the cistern went dry again last night. And everything is a a standstill.