What a disappointment!!

I think you should call, email, whatever it takes . You shouldn't be out any money for this at all!

And I think I'd email verbatim just what you've written here and sent it to them as well.

I'm sorry you had to go through that. It's very frustrating. Contact Etsy.

I had an issue with a hat before Christmas that I returned for poor quality work. It looked nothing like her example photo. She stuck with 'handmade things will vary'. Yes, but I would have never looked twice at the hat she sent and I certainly wouldn't have paid what she was charging. Just own up. She did refund my money, but while I was trying to figure out how to word feedback so I was being fair, she cancelled the order and I was unable to do so! That made me mad because I realized what she was doing so I contacted Etsy and, while they were very polite, basically said that's just their policy and if a sale is cancelled you can no longer leave feedback. They were going to put a ''note/watch' on that seller to keep an eye for the future. The seller wasn't being even made aware of this. After this incident I realized I don't think I've seen any negative reviews on there.

Wow! Your experiences are eye-openers to me. I've purchased very little from Etsy, but I will definitely watch for the slightest negative or noncommital reviews from now on. So far, my experiences have all been positive.

Thank you for your review of Etsy. As far as I'm concerned, large selling platforms need to make sure that the review process is honest and valid, if it is not, I'd think twice about dealing with them.

So sorry this happened Lukki! I have bought a good bit on Etsy with good results! I've only had one "problem" and that was the time in which an item came, but found out the seller's mother had a medical problem. Certainly understandable. I'm very careful who/what I buy, and often have conversations with sellers before making a purchase. I've even had some custom work done through Etsy (shower curtain, pillows,etc.) and have been well pleased. It sounds like you did your homework, I'm sorry the seller acted the way they did. And cancelling a sale, just so feedback can't be entered, is just wrong!

Ugh, I went to the site and those bags are gorgeous. I would email etsy to let them know how she worked the system to avoid a bad review. It won't help you but if enough people complain it might change something.

I would email etsy to let them know how she worked the system to avoid a bad review. It won't help you but if enough people complain it might change something.

Unfortunately, ebay has already clearly demonstrated that this way of operating works exceptionally well, so I would not hold my breath. People have known about ebay for years, but their revenue just keeps climbing.

Lukki, I'm sorry this has happened to you.

Have you tried @EtsyHelp on Twitter? A couple of years ago I was having issues with Sears over a mattress delivery. Emails and phone calls were not working. I took to their Twitter customer service account and I had a "please IM us" within minutes. My issue got rectified very promptly.

Wow, that stinks.

Looking at her site, she doesn't mention where the items are made, so you assume she is buying them wholesale from China. That's why she has no experience with how to fix them - she's just turning over product.

It looks like she sells the items on amazonUK:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?me=A2OT8YNDPWCZBD

If you can find the same bag there, you could probably write a review as long as you don't mention anything about Etsy. Just focus on the problem you encountered with the bag.

You could write a review of the company and its policies on resellerratings.com

And I notice she has a Facebook page, but I suspect that businesses can control what appears on their page.

Terrible story but still not understanding why you can't leave feedback after 2 week period. Is it b/c the return nulls transaction so there is no transaction to rate? If yes, wow, what trickery!!!

Cancelling the transaction and refunding you are tied together. Etsy charges sellers 3.5% of the sale, as well as a listing fee and transaction fee for the payment if you pay through Etsy checkout- the cancellation has to happen for Etsy to refund thise fees it doesn't mean its a conspiracy to prevent you from leaving feedback. Its a function of the way Etsy works and is not the sellers choice or in the seller's control. Calling it trickery is hilarious. If you have a complaint about that it is with Etsy, not the seller.

Nonetheless, I sent the seller a link and invited her to be part of the conversation if she chooses to.

I've had 1692 perfect sales on Etsy and 500+ purchases with only one incident, as a buyer, which I worked out with the seller. I'm very pro- Etsy based on my experiences.

here are the sellers return policies, which were last updated June 26, 2016:

Refunds and Exchanges

I am confident that you will be happy with your purchase but if not, I am happy to offer a refund or an exchange. Please note that I can only accept returns/exchanges on unused items.

You must return your purse within 14 days of the date of receiving it. If you would like to return your purse, please contact me to request return instructions.

Please note that shipping the original and return postage costs are not refundable.

What a bummer, I am sorry this happened to you!

I would def take your complaint to Etsy. These business models do not work with dishonest reviews.

This reminds me of an experience I had with Air BnB, handled well I thought.

Someone agreed to rent a house to us, but they needed to reconfigure the listing because they had the main house and its carriage house listed for rent separately. They were renting both to us at the same time. They agreed to do so at a certain price and said "give me a day to create a combo listing for you to reserve it".

When the listing did not appear, I followed up with her. She essentially told me after reading my reviews of other properties, she wasn't sure if she wanted to rent to me. My reviews were very positive, 4 and 5 stars for the places we had stayed, but they were also detailed and frank. And the reviews I had received for my behavior as as guest were exemplary. Clearly she had something to hide and did not want me writing about her place.

I was shocked. I contacted Air BnB, and they were great. Apologized profusely, thanked me for helping the community with my reviews, and said they do not tolerate this. She was kicked out of their program. She had several FL properties, and I check from time to time .... they are all gone, still.

So Veda, if I'm understanding correctly, the ONLY way to refund someone's money is to cancel the purchase? Or is that the mechanism to choose if the vendor does not want to lose the % $ paid to Etsy for processing the sale and return?

Veda certainly you can understand the issue. If it's not trickery it certainly favors the seller and is not "hilarious" to the disappointed buyer. The buyer appears to have two choices. Keep a defective item and leave a review to warn other buyers. Or they can send the item back, get a refund and not be able to leave a review. Both choices leave the buyer in a bad position.

D_gw, i find the accusation hilarious, if you don't thats fine. Its not a conspiracy against buyers but if anyone is unhappy about it they should take it up with Etsy- the seller has no part of that policy so accusing them does no good. Is leaving a review really more important to them than returning an item and getting their funds back? I doubt it. I rhink most people take their money and move on.

HB, it is the proper procedure to follow. In addition to getting the fees back it removes the sale from the sellers sales record so it does not appear as positive income- we do receive 1099s (or equivalent in other countries,) from Etsy payments and Paypal showing our income that has been reported to the IRS (or equivalent,) by the payment processor and are taxed accordingly.

i honestly dont know if you can refund any other way, I've never needed to issue a refund other than cancelling on a return for a buyer who bought a dress that was too small for them. Because I sell vintage there was not another dress to do an exchange.

I think eBay works similarly. After a dispute with a seller who refused to respond was resolved through resolution, the purchase was removed from my list of feedback. I was unable to leave feedback for her refusal to respond, as well as her lying in the description, to warn other buyers. And, I have to say, to vedabeeps, I am dismayed at you using information gleaned from this forum, to put the OP in such an embarrassing position as to email the seller. Many use this forum to vent/complain to get others' opinions. You might have asked the OP first.

Thank you for clarifying. Maybe if enough people complain, they can upgrade their system to include comments from returns (like Amazon does).

Seems like people s/b able return/get refund AND review reason 4 return. Granted, Some people are downright malicious in their negative f/b but sensible people buying online can usually read thru that.

Deeinohio, do you think it was right to out the seller publically not only by company but personal name as well on a public forum? Did she ask the seller first? She sidnt say she had "a transaction," she maliciously named the company and woman.

The buyer chose to engage in an international transaction with a 14 day return policy and has complained about having to pay return postage even though that was clearly stated in the sellers policies. Its really unfortunate that the transaction didn't go well and the item had defects- thats so disappointing as a buyer. The buyer also doesnt feel they got appropriate customer service which is a let down, too. I value good customer service and a poor experience will definatly stop me from doing business with someone again. BUT the conspiracy theory that the seller is intentionally blocking the buyer from leaving a review is wrong and unfair.

Did you know that on Etsy sellers cant leave feesback for buyers AT ALL any longer? How's that for unfair?

I stand by my comment. If luckki couldn't leave legitimate feedback on etsy, she has a right to warn others. I don't remember ever reading negative feedback on etsy, so I don't give their system much credence anyway. I never purchase without first emailing an etsy seller. Their responsiveness factors into my decision to purchase.On eBay, I ONLY read negative feedback. if refusal to address a problem is part of that feedback, I move on.

Buyers can (and do) leave negative feedback on Etsy. I'm also a big feedback reader.

Veda, I don't think the OP is in any way being malicious in naming the company and the woman. I don't think it was appropriate for you to contact the seller regarding this.

I wonder if they could add a "return rate" to the metrics.

Mtn, I think that would be difficult to do since each shop is an independant business with different policies and procedures. Some stores are very return friendly for any reason and a return doesn't necessarily indicate that a wrong has occured. They would be unfairly punished by a high return rating.

lukkllrish, are you still owed money for the return shipping of a defective item?

I think (just my opinion) if someone is doing business in public, that it is ok for them to receive comments on their business. That Etsy does not have a mechanism for this is a weakness in their own system, which in this case is forcing someone to 'go outside' the Etsy system. It is similar to people complaining on instagram (or is it tweet, I'm not familiar with these) and receiving much more prompt responses to their concerns (usually large companies). I do feel that ordering something that was wanted, and having to return it, is a transaction that is different from a true "cancelled" sale which to me, is more like changing your mind, perhaps before even receiving the order (thus having no commentary)....but receiving something that is damaged and getting what one considers poor response/service -- that is definitely something I would want to know as a future customer, and would appreciate reading about in the feedback.

Veda, I understand the complexities, but I would still want to know if a seller had higher return rates than average.

Maybe Etsy should require a standard return policy.

IDK, but I agree with the original poster that she got a bad deal

I was refunded and three days later the seller cancelled the transaction. FWIW, this is what Etsy had to say to me in an email...

Transactions are eligible for cancellation if an order has been returned to the seller and fully refunded. You may view the canceled transaction by signing in to your account and going to You > Purchases and reviews and clicking on the "Canceled" tab toward the top of the page.

When a transaction is canceled, the ability to leave a review is removed. We’re unable to reinstate the ability for you to leave a review for this transaction.

That being said, please know that I have made a private note of your experience on ________ account for this transaction. I do want to be clear that this note will not appear publicly on the site. Please feel free to reach back out and let me know if you would like any specific details included in this note.

If you have any additional questions or concerns, please let us know. We're happy to help.

I then asked if I would have written the review would she have still been able to cancel. I also questioned if she would get notice of the note.

Thanks for getting back to me about this. I can certainly understand your concerns regarding the hat you received.

First, please know that if a review is left before a transaction is cancelled, the review will remain, however, the ability to leave a new review is removed once a cancellation has been completed.

That being said, please know that the note added to _______________ account would be private and would assist us with investigating their practices further. I want you to know that members who continually demonstrate an inability to fulfill business obligations in a professional, honest manner are permanently removed from our marketplace.

I know this won't change the fact that you had a poor experience with this purchase, but as part of our on-going effort to make Etsy a more safe and trustworthy place for all of our members, this may help prevent this type of situation from happening to another buyer.

I appreciate the information you have provided regarding this transaction. If I can assist you with anything further, please don't hesitate to reach back out.

Lukki - The seller handled that terribly. You shouldn't be out that money and you should be able to leave feedback. Seller definitely has a lot of control.

"Maybe Etsy should require a standard return policy"

i dont know if they can, that may be overstepping their "just a venue" status. Each shop is an individual business. It would definately hurt their business to try to standardize other peoples businesses.

and on that note, I have a bunch of stuff to go list in my own etsy shop. My work day needs to start. :)

I had a bad experience on Etsy once - ordered porcelain, handpainted egg cups from a seller in Australia. One arrived broken and she refused to accept any responsibility. She finally agreed to send a replacement but only if I paid for the shipping...a 2nd time.

I'll stick to eBay in the future. I also ALWAYS pay using PayPal and my AmEx card. AmEx is very consumer oriented, rather than always defending the seller.

The seller should have done better here, no doubt, but the review policy is ETSY's, not the seller's, so you really have two different complaints. Buying through Amazon UK would apparently have allowed free returns for a defective item, though you'd still be out shipping on the receiving end. Now you and the seller are both unhappy and the only ones making any money are the shipping services used.

The one thing I am certain of is that I wouldn't spend $80 to return an item I really liked (especially where that would be a large percentage of the purchase price of any of the items I saw on Amazon UK) if I could probably remedy the problem on my own. I would have asked the seller more directly and clearly about a repair (or return shipping since the item was defective), researched leather adhesives on my own, taken the bag to a shoe repair and asked about them repairing it, or looked into disputing the transaction on the credit card (would never deal internationally without that protection). It doesn't sound like you were right up against the 14 days (3 days and asked again sounds like you were well into the first week, but that may not be accurate), but even if I was, I would figure out how to fix it rather than spend $80 to have nothing. That hurts.

Thank you all for your feedback, I'm still reading through all the replies, but wanted to address Veda real quick.

I did not "out" the seller and she obviously didn't care about my position, so why on earth would I think twice about considering hers? Besides, she doesn't make her name or shop a secret, they are both public on several sites. Also, read her policies, there's no clarification that if the item is defective, it would be my problem, if there was, I wouldn't have bought anything from her. If the item(s) weren't defective and I had just changed my mind or didn't like it, I would accept responsibility and understand that I would bear the burden of the costs to return it, but that wasn't the case. Also, I didn't post to be vindictive. I posted to basically educate other forum members about the policies now used on Etsy, if you don't agree that's your perogative, but I do not regret posting.

Chickadee, I paid 20.00 to have the item shipped to me. And yes, I paid 80.00 out of pocket to return it because I did not want a purse with the lining already coming off.

Also, the reason I didn't pursue asking her more directly is because I had seen where another buyer had the same problem and was also ignored when she inquired. If she didn't know what I should use, then she could have just stated that instead of ignoring the inquiry completely.

Lastly, all the feed back and explanations about the process is very very appreciated. There are two sides to every story and I'm sure there are reasons some things took place they way they did because of policies I'm not aware of. I posted my post as a consumer and it is an honest dialog of my experience from my perspective. (Sigh) I still love her bags, so I'm off to check out Amazon, you rock Graywings!

ETA: Veda, The reason I still feel and hold the seller responsible is because she cancelled the transaction the minute she saw that the item had been returned. She also didn't respond to the last email I sent her WHICH was not in anyway irrate and I will be happy to post that here as well. Sellers should be held to a professional standard and have accountability. You can say what you want, but IMO, selling an item that's defective with the expectation that the seller keep it as is or bear the expense to return it is just not reasonable.

I'm coming back to update this, as I've heard from the Seller. I don't know if it was in her original plan or Veda's heads up but the Seller has reached out to me about reimbursement of the 80.00 postage in fees. I know she generates a lot of sales from the states so I felt it was only fair to post that she took the extra step to make it right for me and that it's very much appreciated.

That's great news, Lukki!

Yeah...I'm really pleased!

I almost didn't open this thread because it seemed we'd reached the end of the story, but I'm glad to hear the seller has reached out and made this right for you. Hope the adhesive problem gets tracked down and resolved.

Glad she made it right!

Etsy wants to be more like Amazon. Things are changing.

I just had the worst experience with an unprofessional seller on Etsy and have spent over 2 weeks trying to resolve it, without results. I have used Etsy for years for clients and have never had a problem until now. This time, I found Etsy to be very pro-seller, anti-customer (buyer) and I plan to write a letter to the CEO explaining my frustration. There was a very lengthy dispute documented which Etsy closed at their discretion for a non-sensical reason, and I am now without remedy to a mis-represented and shipping damaged item. To make matters worse, the seller found me on Houzz and opened an account just to defame me in an overly dramatic, libelous and immature manner making false claims and trying to put a stain on my reputation. I am working to remedy it with Houzz as a review on my professional Houzz profile is not the place to review an Etsy transaction. Why was this even allowed?

I’m sorry you’re going through this. Etsy seems fine as long as no issues arise. I’ve used it a lot. US and out of the country orders. I recently had an order go wrong. Fwiw, anyone who doesn’t know, when you get into returns or exchange you risk the seller cancelling the order then you can’t leave feedback. I’ve complained to Etsy about this and received an oh well type response. You also cannot post photos in a review unless it’s five stars. Crap I say. I hope you can get things cleared up there and here!

I'm so sorry to hear that. Coincidentally I've had her etsy shop up in my tabs waiting for me to order as I also found a purse there I loved. I'm so glad I hadn't yet gone ahead with the purchase. I would definitely contact Etsy and make your valid points. How frustrating! I've had good experiences with Etsy, but this certainly adds a note of caution to purchasing.

FWIW, This is an old thread. Lukki has a good outcome. I was responding to Vicki’s recent post above.

Hi Vicki,

I’m so sorry to see what you’re going through. I did have a good out come with this seller and I actually buy and recommend her products often.

Prior to this situation however, I had a problem with a woman who was going to make some custom valances for me out of my own fabric. The fabric was expensive, 20 something a yard, she botched the entire job up and then cancelled the order on me (so I couldn’t even leave a review). She sent me some of my fabric back, but in the end between fabric & shipping costs, I was out about 100.00 or more when it was all said and done. I have to agree that Etsy is unquestionably pro seller, buyers with a problem don’t have a chance. In a perfect world, they would have someone who can act as an unbiased liason between a seller and buyer to help negotiate a fair compromise. The other thing I learned from this last experience though is that the majority of sellers have put a lot of time and effort into their shops. They really do care about finding a happy medium and doing the right thing.

My suggestion would be to fight fire with fire and start a thread linking to as many of the applicable former Gardenweb rooms as possible. Share your story, be transparent, name the shop and lay it all out there. Etsy may be pro seller, but my experience has been that the Gardenweb forum is not. I would also head over to her facebook page and post there as well.

ETA: The resolve from this situation actually came about after another Etsy seller saw this post and sent a message to the seller I was having the issue with. It ended up being the best thing to happen. Obviously, there was a glitch somewhere but looking back, I can say now that I think it was an honest misunderstanding.