Woke up this morning, November 12, after a night of below freezing at 30 F, or -1 C. Roses still look the same, but the tiny rootings without a layer of "buffering clay" on top took some hit: 10% wilt. The tomatoes in far front are 100% wilted by frost.

The tomatoes in back (southern sun) are 50% frost-wilted, with the tomatoes nearest to the house stay the same, see pic. below after a night of frost, Nov. 12. This tomato bed has leaves mixed in with clay through the past 4 years.

Every fall I collect leaves from my 6 deciduous trees and dumped on this tomato bed. It has heavy clay to buffer against acidic rain and low temp. Plus the fluffy leaves enable roots to do deeper than 1 foot.

The fruits are not affected by frost on Nov. 12. I keep them for Thanksgiving. My neighbors' tomatoes turned brown in heavy rain Sept, and they trashed their plants in Sept when the temp was warm above 70 F or 21 C. When tomatoe plants turn brown, that's from poor-drainage clay & heavy rain, rather than frost.

As I mixed 1/2 leaves with 1/2 clay for drainage, I notice tomatoes stay green past freezing frost. One year my sister (zone 6, New York) visited me in mid-November and was surprised that I still have fresh tomato in November. That's from the excellent drainage of raised-bed, and plenty of leaves mixed into clay every fall.

Above Dee-lish, bought as tiny own-root mid-May ... now become 5' x 3' and doesn't mind freezing temp. last night. Leaves are still healthy today November 12. Last fall I dug down past 2.5 feet, threw out the icky-light clay, then mixed native black clay with 1 giant bag of leaves. The leaves decomposed after 6 months of winter to provide fluffy soil for best root-growth in summer.

When rose get that tall fast, it means there's excellent drainage and loamy soil past 2 feet deep, plus there's horse manure (pH 8) on top to buffer acidic heavy rain in Sept & Oct, thus leaves are not affected by blackspots.

Above Evelyn laughed at the frost, Evelyn as own-root blooms until snow hit. My two Comte-de-Chambord as OWN-ROOTS are still blooming as of Nov. 12, but the 3rd Comte (grafted on Multiflora) stopped blooming since September. Comte is hardy to zone 4, it's the Multiflora rootstock which makes it stingy.

Below is a bush-shot of Pink Peace after it dipped down to below freezing, November 12, it's a grafted-on-Dr.Huey so there's blackspots. My own-root Pink Peace was much healthier but it could not survive zone 5a winter:

Alyssum is my favorite annual flower .. blooms in early May and lasts until snow hit. Same with yellow Calendula .. both attract beneficial insects.

Above thornless rose Bohemian Rhapsody is very hardy, and blooms well on this November 12. Bought it as tiny own-root end of June.

Above Japanese Maple does well in frost on Nov 12, it's in partial shade & always moist so it retains its leaves while all the trees lost their leaves.

I also have 2 other Japanese Maples: one in full-sun & dry spot still has half-the leaves, but the other in a wet & poor-drainage clay lost all its leaves.

Good-drainage is the key for keeping leaves past frost, and putting leaves in the planting hole helps with drainage in heavy clay. I witnessed impatient flowers in poor-drainage clay lost all leaves in September, while the impatients in good-drainage clay kept its leaves 1 month longer.

Above is Carding Mill, it lost all leaves below a wet spot, so I moved it into this hole, which was dug past 2 feet deep, then mixed 1/2 leaves with 1/2 black clay last fall. Still healthy, with new buds on November 12, despite below freezing temp. last night.

I believe in Lavenderlace's testimony that her Own-root roses in sandy soil & topped with alkaline horse manure are clean without blackspots. Horse manure does wonder, if the soil below drains well.

Every single bloom above has good-drainage, thus bloom past frost. The best bloomers like Dee-lish (with 10+ buds now) has 1/2 black clay mixed with 1/2 composted leaves. Same with Strike-it-Rich, a continuous bloomer.

There's a saying "spend more money in the planting hole than the plant itself."

Fifteen years ago my neighbor hired people to plant a $250 tree. I watched as the guys removed bad clay and rocks from the hole ... to my horror, they put all the rocks & bad clay back !! I knew that $$$ tree won't survive. Three years later, it died.

Straw wrote: "As I mixed 1/2 leaves with 1/2 clay for drainage, I notice tomatoes stay green past freezing frost."

That's a good tip Straw. Noted.

Alyssum and Calendula as beneficial plants. Good. Both of them are easily available here and thrive very well. Straw: How about planting lot of Freezias along roses. They fill the whole yard with perfume.... but are they good as companion for roses.

Above is Geranium Red not affected by frost on Nov. 12. It was a tiny rooting in May and didn't grow much in partial shade. Then in cold November, I put it next to the house & full-sun, and it doubled-in height & stems got thicker, plus 3 buds formed.

There's the logic in rooting in FULL-SUN, with misting. Bluegirl in hot Texas does it, same with other folks in warm climate. The sun really helps certain roses to root-faster, such as hybrid-tea. But the water-hogs Austin roses like Pat Austin & Golden Celebration root better in partial shade. So before rooting any roses, I always check to see if that rose likes full-sun or partial shade !!

That's also true of rose grafted on Dr. Huey: 1st year is great, then afterwards it becomes stingy & prone to blackspots.

Just saw Khalid's tip on growing freesia (fragrant). Thank you !! I looked up and saw "Freesias do well in zones 8 to 10, and may be grown outdoors only in warm climates." How I wish to be in a warmer zone !! Will let my sisters know about freesia, since they are in warmer zones.

Jude

Thank you, Aileen, for your late-November roses. Koko Loco is so unique, Earth Angel is lovely. I'm very impressed with Mme Anisette's healthy foliage. Your Pretty Jessica has very healthy foliage, and I like that dark-pink color.

My Jude's rooting has blackspot when I put into my clay. Jude is so sensitive to wetness .. In May, one Jude-rooting died during heavy rain. The second Jude struggled in Miracle-Gro Moisture control soil (too wet), so I had to fix the pot with 1/2 sand, and Jude improved.

After 2 nights of below freezing temp, 80% of my tomatoes wilted, but Evelyn blooms get better. Evelyn is one special Austin that can take extreme temp, it bloomed when the temp. was near 100 F in hot summer, and blooms right through frost. Pic. taken November 13:

I use those tall zip-loc plastic bags that hold bed-sheets & blankets. I'll put a flat-piece of cardboard down, then pour soil, stick cuttings in, and zip-up the bag to hold moisture. I tried that before with coarse sand, and that was too wet and rotted the cuttings. This time I'll use a drier-soil medium that holds less moisture.

The above is my strategy to root indoor through the winter via the "baggie method" by Cheryl Netter in Colorado, zone 5a.

Khalid: What methods that you used for "hard-wood" cuttings? Cuttings taken in late fall is hard-wood. Thanks for any info. I notice that hard-wood cuttings dislike moisture, and need to be kept away from heavy rain.

Will also find a "heating-pad" to put under the basket, then plug in. Roots root better when soil is warm, and my house is too cold in the winter, at 57 F, or 13 C downstairs where I keep the cuttings.

http://forums.gardenweb.com/discussions/3566166/rooting-rose-cuttings-methods-and-techniques

Another method below: re-use those band-size containers (with wide-openings at bottom), fill the white basket with some water, so roots can pull up the moisture from below. Also cut off a pop-bottom and invert it over the band, to retain moisture in dry-winter. It's in partial sun. I also mist the cutting next to it (without the cover). I pulled up that cutting and there's root after only 2 weeks, so the sun helps with faster root-growth & same with misting. The sun in zone 5a is very weak in winter.

Here's an excerpt on Cheryl Netter's baggie-method for her zone 5a, Colorado. THANK YOU, Cheryl for sharing your method with the public:

http://www.cnetter.net/rose_tour/rose_cut.html

" To score the cutting, you can use a knife, pin (or even a sharp fingernail) and scratch just through the surface to the pith underneath.

The cutting needs the leaves to produce roots, but those under the soil will just rot.

Fill a gallon zip lock baggie 1/4 to 1/3 full with moist (not wet) STERILE loose potting mix. I use 1/2 Peter's potting soil and 1/2 perlite or vermiculite.

If you use a powder such as Rootone, dip the end of cutting into rooting compound and then knock the excess off until just a thin coating is on the cutting. Poke a hole into the soil in the baggie where the cutting will go. Carefully insert the cutting a couple of inches into the hole.

Once all the cuttings are inserted, gently squeeze the soil in the baggie by placing your hands on each side and pushing in until the holes are closed up and the soil is making good contact with the cuttings. Use 1/4 to 1/2 cup of water. Gently pour a tiny amount of this water right at the point where the cutting sticks into the soil. This helps the soil stick to the cutting and removes air pockets

Inflate the baggie by blowing into it and zip it shut.

Put in bright, indirect light - if it gets direct sun it will cook. If any leaves drop from the stem, you can remove them and reinflate the baggie.

Once you are convinced that the cutting has enough roots, unzip the baggie about an inch. Unzip a little more every day for about a week. Some will show roots by the end of ten days, others will take more than 6 weeks. If the cutting is still green there is hope. Don't use diseased cuttings. If the soil is too dry, the cuttings will shrivel, if it is too moist they will rot and turn black." Cheryl Netter.

http://www.cnetter.net/rose_tour/rose_cut.html

Straw: Here is what I do in zone 9b Islamabad.

Actually I don't do anything spectacular. Just making sure that I select healthy hardwood cuttings that are cut cleanly at 45* with a very sharp knife. I lightly peel off a bit of skin 2 to 3 inches from the base and then insert the cutting min 4" in the soil. I do not use any rooting hormones. I do not trim the branches / shoots too much. Watering has to be controlled. In winters, watering more could rot the cuttings whereas there are less chances of dehydration. Watering less is better. I plant my cuttings in a bed next to a wall in my lawn.... in open.

But this is what I do in a very different climate where the temp in winters does not go down below -2*C, that too for few days only and it does not snow. I have no idea how it will workout in your climate that is entirely different and very cold. You are going to keep your cuttings inside..... I would suggest just enough watering till the time they sprout. Thick hardwood cuttings have enough moisture of their own to sprout. When leaves sprout, you may increase watering but not too much.

best regards

Thank you, Khalid, for those tips on rooting hardwood ... You are right about the thicker the cutting, the more vigorous the rooting !! Saw your pics. of thick cuttings & lots of leaves and I'm impressed.

I also do what you advised "I lightly peel off a bit of skin 2 to 3 inches from the base and then insert the cutting min 4" in the soil."

It's hard to find a less-moisture potting soil. I used 1/2 perlite and 1/2 potting soil, and cuttings still rotted in open air, thanks to the heavy rain. Then I used the same stuff in a baggie (no rain), and that still rot !! Regarding Cheryl Netter's using Peter's Potting soil for her baggie-method:

Scott bought Peter's, and that excellent stuff is no longer available. Since Peat moss is acidic at pH 4, some brands add dolomitic lime to supply calcium and magnesium.

Instead Peter's potting soil added bark ash (alkaline), which supplies calcium, potassium, magnesium, and all trace elements. Also granite sand has phosphorus & potassium (good for roots).

Metro Mix also has bark ash, and is used in greenhouse veggies seedlings.

Peter's Professional Potting Soil Grace- Sierra
Canadian sphagnum peat moss, vermiculite, granite sand, bark ash, nitrogen, phosphorus, potassium, calcium and other minerals, wetting agent 5.8-6.8

The below link detailed the ingredients in popular brands of potting soil. Soil guide - all about potting soil

Below is the ideal set-up for rooting roses indoor: A pack of see-through plastic red-cups, and a one-liter soda bottle, see below. I just have to cut the bottom of the bottle with a box-cutter-knife, that works as a "green house dome". I also drill holes at the bottom of those red-cups, and put them in a basket for indoor rooting.

Some folks put a glass-jar over a cutting OUTSIDE, so the wind doesn't blow it away. Can't do a glass-jar in my summer with frequent rain. Next summer I'll test that in a shady place where rain is blocked out completely.

The above are my "mini-greenhouse" using those zippered-plastic pouches that bedsheets are sold in. Learning from my disasters with "baggie-method" for the past 2 years, I no longer wet 1/2 potting soil & 1/2 perlite .. it's impossible to squeeze out excess water.

What I do this time is to use 2/3 coarse sand mixed with 1/3 potting soil in fast-draing pots which many holes drilled .. that sat in the rain for months which the acidic rain water washed out the lime in sand, making it less alkaline. Plus the soil is damp, rather than soaking wet.

Cuttings need a slightly acidic medium to root. One site recommended 1/3 peat moss and 2/3 sand. Peatmoss is acidic at pH 4, which balances the alkaline sand (pH 7.4) and alkaline-tap-water. Thank God the patent on Evelyn expired this Sept, 2016.

My experience, plus many others: cuttings take root faster in more sun, plus misting. I don't like perlite since it floats around when watered, I prefer sand since it makes a "tighter contact" with cuttings, inside baggie.

I would rather err on the side of "too dry" for the baggie method, than "too wet". It's easy to fix "too dry", simply filled a bottle with 1/2 hydrogen peroxide & 1/2 water and mist the inside. Hydrogen peroxide kills mold and oxygenates the baggie.

The roses which have healthy leaves, I do baggie method. The roses which are prone to blackspots, can't use baggie-method .. open air & full sun & misting is best.

For Kelly: Warning on Vermiculite ... It holds water too well. One University Extension site warned against that for rooting. Few years ago, a friend e-mailed me to share that her rootings rotted through winter thanks to vermiculite. Momscottagegarden who used to post here also shared about her cuttings rotted in vermiculite. That's 3 sources against Vermiculite.

I use perlite, which holds much less moisture than vermiculite. I used 1/2 perlite and 1/2 potting soil for rooting, and that was STILL TOO WET even in outside & open air. My best success now is inside the house, with an invert-pop-bottle on top as a mini-greenhouse, over a band-container (with mostly open bottom) so water can drain fast.

The soil I use is 1/3 sand, 1/3 perlite, and 1/3 potting soil .. on the dry side, since it's under a enclosed dome. One rooting site recommended 1/3 peat-moss and 2/3 sand ... but pH of peat-moss is 4, that's too acidic for certain roses.

After more than a week zero mold growing under the inverted-pop-bottle, and the cutting is still green. The pH of that medium is neutral, since I let acidic rain water washed the alkalinity off from the sand.

The below link explains the difference between perlite and vermiculite. Perlite is best to root cuttings, versus vermiculite holds more nutrients, thus best when ROOTS ALREADY DEVELOPED, such as band or gallon-size own-roots.

Perlite holds more air, thus best for cuttings, which needs oxygen to develop roots. Vermiculite holds more water, thus best for developed roots which need more water & nutrients.

"Perlite and vermiculite are both good at retaining water, but vermiculite acts more like a sponge, holding much more water than perlite and offering less aeration for the plant roots. Perlite retains water because of its large surface area with nooks and crannies available for water storage. Because perlite is porous it allows excess water to drain more readily than vermiculite and improves soil aeration.

However, the amount of water vermiculite holds is not ideal for plants such as cacti or rhododendrons, which need a well-drained soil. The moisture retained by vermiculite would lead to root rots or plant death."

http://homeguides.sfgate.com/vermiculite-vs-perlite-49660.html

I finalized my spring 2017 rose order from Roses Unlimited, no more changes !! This is what I sent to Pat Henry today, Nov. 17, all are own-root roses, to be delivered end of April 2017. I don't get Twilight zone since it's not hardy, and die-back is severe in zone 5:

My order of 7 own-roots for 2017: Golden Fairy Tale, Lagerfeld, Barbra Streisand, Sonia Rykiel, Firefigher, Versigny, Bolero.

What are your finalized rose-orders for next spring? Thanks.

I have three Amazing Grace arriving today. Also some favorite Twice in a Blue Moon, Lemon Spice, and Singin' the Blues and a few others because they have done so well no-spray.

Tiffany arrived last week.

Thinking about ordering Grande Dame, Buxom Beauty, Plum Perfect, Love Potion, and Evelyn so comments very much welcomed. My cucumber beetle scare has dampened my enthusiasm a bit though!

Straw, Lagerfeld has been beautiful here! It started out really slow, especially compared to neighbors Ebb Tide, so I wasn't too impressed at first.

But now it has big gorgeous blooms of lavender with a lovely scent, though it's still very mild. Long lasting in the vase too.

Clean foliage, even during that humid time that caused Heirloom so many troubles.

By the way, as soon a the air dried out, Heirloom started growing new leaves again and acting as if nothing ever happened! I moved them yesterday to full sun so we'll see what it thinks about that next year at 105!

Lavenderlace: I checked your Amazing Grace in HMF .. such a large bloom at 5" and thornless !! Every pic. of Amazing Grace looks better than Fred. Mistral. Amazing Grace has more petals, I would grow that too if my climate is warm.

Beetles are a real-pain .. The $6 Jap. Beetle trap I bought was really effective in catching dozens of beetles .. if set FAR AWAY from roses. I wonder if they sell such trap for cucumber beetles with different aroma?

Definitely Ebb Tide likes your loamy soil, Ebb Tide is fantastic bloomer for Khalid's loamy soil and Sam's loamy soil. But others with clay reported just the opposite.

Just checked pictures of Ebb Tide's leaves: such small leaves don't like dense clay. William Morris has really tiny leaves and it did really bad in dense & wet peaty soil. I moved into my heavy clay and it got worse. Lady of Shallot is another tiny-leaves that doesn't like my fertile clay, but folks reported L of S. thrive in bad soil !!

Jubilee Celebration is another small-leaves that hates clay. It's only 1' x 1' as own-root for Brittie in gumbo clay, Texas, which means it will be 0.5' x 0.5' in my cold zone. So glad that I took Jubillee off my buy-list.

Such small-leaves roses will do great in sandy soil, but won't like heavy clay.

Sam in loamy/sandy soil grows R. Hugonis, such tiny & lacy leaves ... I already had bad experience with that type of tiny & lacy leaves (moss-annual-flower) which died instantly in my heavy clay. About moss-rose-flower: "The succulent leaves of the portulaca are another clue to the wonderful drought tolerance of this low growing annual flower." No wonder that moss-annual-flower died in my wet clay.

Here's a comment in HMF about rose Hugonis thrives in bad soil, but hates neutral pH clay: "Really wonderful in a wildish environment. A second plant placed in full sun and dense clay of neutral ph has never done anything."

http://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.php?l=2.16807.5&tab=32

Below is an Internet pics. showing the tiny leaves of R. Hugonis. My Blue-Mist rose has tiny leaves like that .. did great in loamy potting soil, but very lousy in heavy clay.

I took some pictures today, since it will drop to 20 F, or -6 C tonight Sat 11/19, and Sunday night. These are the roses which have zero blackspots as of Nov. 19, only few pale leaves due to dry & strong wind at 40 mph. Loamy soil and alkaline horse manure are the key to their health. Below is Dee-lish bought end of June at 1/2 price own-root:

Dee-lish blooms get more petals in cold weather, but Calendula wilted:

Below November 17 Louise Este, healthy foliage in clay made loamy with sand. Next to it is Marie Pavie with many buds (this is Marie's 4th flush).

Below is Nov. 17 William Shakespeare, healthy thanks to my fixing the clay last year with a bag of sand, right next to my air-unit:

Evelyn has nice blooms, but I have to fix the soil tomorrow .. it dropped most of its leaves since I didn't dig down to 2.5 feet many years ago. Cloudert Soupert (light pink) is 100% healthy since I spent 1 hour digging deep for drainage.

Other healthy roses on Nov. 19 in zone 5a, after below freezing night. Poseidon below with 5 buds, but can't open. Upper stems are almost thornless:

Below is Tchaikosky (French Romantica) with 10+ buds but can't open, not enough sun and too cold, no blackspots, just some pale leaves at bottom:

Picture of bouquet on Nov. 17 with Radio Times (center) and Comte de Chambord (dark pink). Pale orange is Crown Princess Magareta (didn't get horse manure) since I fixed its hard clay with gypsum. One bloom of Comte de Chambord (damask) and white Mary Magdalene (frankincense) is enough to perfume the entire room:

Great pics! I love the calendula you grow. Do you know what variety that one is? I have too many on my list, no idea where everything will go. Help me narrow it down?

De lish

Rose de rescht

St Elbertha

Cressida

Perdita

CL America

Alfred Columb

Vics caprice

Variagata de bolongia

Jaques cartier

Madame Isaac Pierre

Liv Tyler

Sonia Rykiel

Rogue royal

Augusta renoir

Aloha

General cavaignac

Gloire de dijon

Baroness de roschild

Gloire de ducher

Paul ricault

Sweet victoria

Etna

Leopold Ritter

LA petite prince

1812 rose

Out of rosenheim

Traviata

Leonardo de Vinci

Yolande de Aragon

Paul Bocuse

Yves piaget

Versingy

Peter mayle

Rose al perfum de ihay

And maybe the reeve

Kelly: Re-post your list for your zone 4 with my comments ... the highlights ones I would buy. I can collect my yellow Calendula seeds & send to you in May.

The reeve: Yes, it's hardy & disease-resistant

De lish: Will notify you in May

Rose de rescht: Yes, it's hardy & Khalid loves it.

St Elbertha: spelling?

Cressida: yes, a zone 4 person grows it

Perdita: yes, hardy & blooms lots for folks

CL America: saw at local zone 5a store, it's a once-bloomer

Alfred Columb: spelling?

Vick's Caprice: is hardy & thornless & easy to root. I would buy this !!

Variagata de bolongia: spelling?

Jaques cartier: No, I gave it away, ugly huge bush, tiny & boring blooms

Madame Isaac Pierre: I have it, this roots easily, I accidentally killed its baby.

Liv Tyler: No, thorny water-hog and died in my zone 5a winter, weird scent.

Sonia Rykiel: yes, survived many my zone 5a winter until rain/freeze in Dec. '15.

Rogue royal: No, not winter hardy, and wimpy as own-root.

Augusta Renoir: No, serious balling, not hardy.

Aloha: yes, vigorous climber

General cavaignac: Not hardy, need zone 6b.

Gloire de Dijon: No, Tea Noisette is NOT hardy.

Baroness de rothschild: yes, it's grown in zone 4 public rose park in Canada

Gloire de ducher: No, hardy to zone 6b, re-bloom isn't great.

Paul ricault: hardy to zone 4b, yes !! Centifolia is super-healthy.

Sweet Victoria: Bred in Canada, yes, hardy.

Etna: a moss rose, not hardy unless you are in zone 6b.

Leopold Ritter: yes, hardy to zone 2b, multiflora needs loamy & acidic soil.

LA petite prince: Delbard bluish rose? Delbard and blue: both are not hardy.

1812 rose: No, a zone 8b person reported die-back in winter.

Out of Rosenheim: no scent, plus 32" x 16" isn't big enough to survive cold zone.

Traviata - very healthy at alkaline zone 5a rose park, height of 47" is vigorous.

Leonardo de Vinci - No, only hard to zone 6b vs. Bolero hardy to zone 5b.

Yolande de Aragon - yes, zone 5 and 4 folks love this.

Paul Bocuse - hardy to zone 5b with height of 5' is plenty vigorous.

Yves piaget - no, very wimpy, unless grafted.

Versingy - survived 2 of my zone 5a winter, need loamy soil & winter-protection. Died on Nipptress (Cynthia) and died in my 3rd winter.

Peter mayle - Died on a few zone 5b folks, survived for another zone 5b since it's close to his house & heavy winter-protection.

Rose al perfum de ihay - spelling?

Kelly is in zone 4, I'm in zone 5a. I notice that my favorite winter-hardy roses in my garden or nearby parks: Khalid also like them for his extreme-hot summer: Mirandy, Pat Austin, Golden Celebration, Crown Princess Magareta, The Dark Lady, Julia Child, Rose de Rescht, etc.

Vigorous & deep root is the key to extreme temp. survival, be it hot or cold. I usually go by the height of a rose. If a rose is listed very tall in HMF, the chance of winter-survival is good, like Stephen's Big Purple which survives 5 zone 5a winters.

Except for French Romantica (Liv tyler, Frederic Mistral, Peter Mayle) .. these have roots that spread horizontally, rather than deep-down, thus tend to dry out or be killed by below freezing. Mirandy is very-winter-hardy ... my kid doesn't like its nasty thorns, so I killed that own-root, and its root was deep, more than 1 foot. It was very drought-tolerant & disease-resistant.

I like thornless roses. Got poked plenty by tall & thorny roses .... but the small & compact roses don't poke me that much.

For Khalid: I pray every day for your success in quitting smoking. Found some news about the risk of heart attack UP with smoking. http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/314441.php

"Researchers from the South Yorkshire cardiothoracic center in the United Kingdom examined 1,727 adults who were undergoing treatment for a type of heart attack known as STEMI.

STEMI stands for ST-segment elevation myocardial infarction,

The highest risk was found among smokers under 50 years of age, who were almost 8.5 times more likely to have a STEMI heart attack than nonsmokers and ex-smokers combined.

The risk was inversely associated with age, meaning that it decreased as the age increased. For instance, among adults aged 50-65, the risk fell to five times higher, while in smokers over the age of 65 the risk was only three times higher. The smoking prevalence rate among STEMI patients under the age of 50 was 75 percent.

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/314441.php

Thanks Straw! Yes, I miss-spelled a couple; Im spelling challenged.

St Ethelburga

Variegata di Bologna

Alfred Colomb

Rose a Parfum de IHay

https://www.antiqueroseemporium.com/roses/1224/rose-a-parfum-de-lhay

Kelly: Info. for the above:

St Ethelburga - hardy to zone 6b, size 4' x 3' from England. I don't see Nipptress (Cynthia zone 5b) with 700+ roses growing this, so it's iffy.

Variegata di Bologna - hardy in zone 3b, occasional repeat, 6' to 10' tall.

Alfred Colomb - bred in France, almost thornless, hardy in zone 6b, but height is decent at 4' to 5'. I see zone 4b, zone 5b gardens growing it.

Rose a Parfum de IHay - hardy to zone 2b, a Rugosa means it needs sandy/loamy soil, plus acidic rain. Great scent.

Do you think that this flower is Julia Child or maybe Doris Day? I gave it away since it was supposed to be Ebb Tide but I'm still curious. It bloomed in 102 degrees in the soil that was extra sandy for Ebb but dug it up soon after.

Mystery rose:

Lavenderlace: First impression is "Julia Child", I had seen that many times at nearby rose-park. Julia Child has longer leaves, and Doris Day has rounder leaves. I didn't buy Julia Child when it was only $10 per gallon as own-root, I don't like its scent, and don't like how the bloom fade to white.

I killed Arthur Bell (yellow) due to less petals in hot sun. But I miss Honey Bouquet (winter killed that one). It's a deep yellow which never fade, yummy honey scent, and bloomed when it's near 100 degree, plus it's compact & cute verus a gigantic & angular Julia Child.

Julia Child was my first impression too and we called her Julia for a while. But then changed it to Doris when the flowers didn't fade but maybe it's something else? They did wilt very quickly though but it was very hot.

Thanks for looking at her! She now lives in a pot and they are hoping that she'll stay small.

Lavenderlace: Your "Doris" day looks almost thornless. Yellow Molineux is also known as low-thorn, and fades less than Julia Child. Pat Henry of Roses Unlimited is very nice. She put up with my changes in order for spring 2017. Her husband died Oct 24, 2015 .. I'm sad for her.

Here's what I wrote to Roses Unlimited regarding my order:

" Found that The Dark Lady and Golden Fairy Tale both have Rugosa heritage, both are very thorny. My alkaline heavy clay isn't suitable for Rugosa (prefers sandy/loamy).

Would it be possible to change that to low-thorn Nahema and Lagerfeld? I also add Barbara Streisand to make up for my sin of changing my order !!

Final list is 7 roses for April 2017 delivery: Nahema, Lagerfeld, Barbra Streisand, Sonia Rykiel, Firefighter, Versigny, and Bolero."

So happy that Pat Henry approved my changes. I won't make any more changes !! I got poked plenty so I'm happy with low-thorn Nahema, Firefighter, Lagerfeld. Sonia Rykiel has much less thorn than Austin roses. My buy-list consists mostly of roses that died through my zone 5a winter, the only new ones are Barbra Streisand and Lagerfeld.

That sounds like a fun order! Lagerfeld's scent is mild but it's good here and getting stronger by the day. And the blooms are so big and pretty!

What a wonderful order! I'm going to get Nahema, too and also Bolero from your list. We'll have to compare; my Bolero will be from ARE. I really want SR, but since my orders will be so large this year, I may wait to next. However, I'm so impatient and rose take so long to reach their stride, that's why I'm trying to stick mainly to climbers this year.

Since this is a buy-list thread, I'll include the link to "why own-roots are better than grafted". Multiflora rootstock would be the WORST for alkaline soil, I posted pics. of how multiflora-rootstock SHRANK in my alkaline clay, to be smaller than a snapdragon-flower root. Lifespan of multiflora-rootstock is less than 5 years in alkaline soil, and it CANNOT SPROUT own-roots like Dr.Huey rootstock.

http://forums.gardenweb.com/discussions/2133077/why-own-root-roses-are-healthier-than-grafted?n=28

Canceling order of roses on multiflora. Chamblees has some new ones that look nice. They have gruss Aachen

Sweet drift

Loretta Lynn van Lear

Belindas dream

Gaye Hammond rose

Seminole fire

Wild ginger

Miranda lambert

Sunny sky

Soul sister

Anyone have any thought on these?

No thought or experience on any of them, but WG has been on my radar for it's beautiful colour, as well as Mirand Lambert. I ordered Gruss an Aache from ARE when they had free shipping so I'm excited to Spring.

WG is listed as zone 4 so I am hopeful! The other 2 are listed as zone 5 but I think there are reports of people growing gruss in zone 4 if I remember correctly. (Helpmefind has been down the last couple days and I don't know what to do with mysrlf, lol.) Classes start again Monday, so I have been using my time wisely; looking up new roses!! Although, I think I'm out of space...

Kelly: Anything listed as zone 5 would be safe for your zone 4 if there's at least 1 foot of winter-protection (leaves, straw, dirt). Frost-penetration for zone 4 is more than a foot deep (I spent time researching on the depth of frost-damage).

Belinda Dream dies to the crown for a friend in my zone 5a. Neither Cantigny rose garden (1,200 roses) nor Chicago Botanical Garden (5,000 roses) grow that one. My neighbor grows Drift roses, they get bigger every year and very winter-hardy.

Also how much rain or snow you get determine winter-survival better than zone. When I ordered my $$$ peony, it stated that if you have consistent snow, you can UP one zone of hardiness. Stephen Big Purple is not hardy for Cynthia, zone 5b, but VERY HARDY for my zone 5a, thanks to my wet clay.

Other factors that help with winter-survival: digging deep for drainage, and break up clay with gypsum, pine-bark-mulch, chunky organic matter that prevents soil from frozen. See link below:

http://forums.gardenweb.com/discussions/4329440/keep-roses-alive-through-winter-and-differences-in-roots-rootstocks?n=18