@virgil: I want to make sure I understand your last comment. That's a generic image you included, yes? Not intended to be specific to our site?

@mrspete: I'm intrigued by the master closet/bathroom switch, but I'm having a hard time puzzling my bathroom pieces together in that space. Any ideas on how that could work? 6-8' vanity, generous shower (4x6 1/2ish) and a w.c.

@cpartist: I'm trying to think why a deep front porch wouldn't shade from the sun... what am I missing?

@lily'smom: I can't thank you enough for the thoughtful feedback and advice. I wondered about this comment: "I would want more than a sliding glass door for the [master] bedroom". Did you mean in terms of windows? We will definitely have them, but just haven't ironed out the elevation yet. The bed will be on the south wall.

Those were our thoughts regarding the pantry also: A functional space, not just for storage.

Lots of other stuff in there for me to chew on as well, thanks! :)

B Mac, while your are mapping out your house using pencil and paper or computer, think about alternatives to your current plan. So much easier to change now than once the walls go up.

Many children enjoy the togetherness of sharing rooms, nooks and crannies, and study spaces. However, different types of children need different things. For a child who thrives on quiet time to energize and think, a very small bedroom shared with an exuberant sibling can be a misery and ruin the kind of joy you sound like you are trying to create. You might want to look up The Not So Big House and give some thought to "away spaces", especially since you aren't done having your family. You might have a few introverts. :-)

My sister home schooled her kids and she built a big school room. As the kids grew she quickly realized that there is noisy learning and quiet learning and she needed to create spaces to accommodate both. She has a very musical family and, while they had a music room, she ended up having to use her dining room (and sometimes a bedroom) for long stretches of serious practice. She often said she wished the dining room were 3' bigger in both length and width (it was a little bigger than the one on your plan).

You haven't said if this is a "forever home". If you think grown kids might come back to visit with spouses, create a home now that can be adapted to bigger beds, etc. A good plan can help you achieve that without creating a Supersized house.

Give some thought to the suggestions from the architects on the forum who have offered advice. How light enters and moves through a house and how people are able to move through space are key components to making a house a pleasure to live in.

As Lily'smom said, please don't feel you have to respond to my comments. Just enjoy thinking about all the aspects of beautiful architecture while you have this wonderful opportunity. Such an exciting time for you and your family!

@larecoltante: Thank you! I'm actually a huge fan of Not So Big principles and the room labeled as a "study" is actually designed to be an away room. We also built the kid nook upstairs for that purpose, as well as a reading nook in the play room, a desk in the guest room, etc. because we definitely have two introverts already: my husband and my oldest.

I want to make sure we're both talking about the same dimensions on the eating area, because there was confusion on that with a previous comment: Currently it's 15' x 9'. Your sister has one somewhat bigger and wishes it was 18'x12'+ ? Our builder keeps wanting to size it as more of a breakfast "nook" so we were thinking 15' x 9' was generous! (It accommodates our table with all the leaves in it with 3' of passing area on both ends.)

We love the music room in the plan with doors that close for acoustical separation. Piano playing is nearly constant around here. I'm wondering about your sister's situation again: did music overflow the room just because there were multiple people practicing at a time?

I'm starting my 11th year as a homeschooler. While I have a modestly sized family, many of my homeschooling friends are blessed with much larger families, including several with 8 or more children. So I offer this advice based on my own experience, and that of dear friends with whom I've traveled our homeschool journey.

First off, since you're starting from scratch, and are designing generous spaces, create a dedicated homeschool room. You will have projects, reports, and class work that is not always convenient to clear away in time for meals.

Your kids may need quiet study space, especially as they enter the high school years. Bigger bedrooms would be nice.

Kids don't need seperate sinks, but another bathroom, or at least a powder room, will make it easier to respect the growing privacy needs of modest children as they enter puberty.

I know how sweet it is to have kids sharing rooms, but our sons and daughters need separate spaces as they mature. And just because we homeschool doesn't mean we need to promote a constant standard of deprivation for our kids. Homeschooling through high school is a marathon, not a sprint. Give yourself the grace to revamp your ideal circumstances to reflect the needs of your growing family. If nothing else, build a basement that will provide much-needed flexibility over the years.

@BB: Thanks so much for your thoughtful remarks. It's interesting how we all come into raising kids with our own preconceptions. I shared a bathroom with three older brothers and modeled our bathroom on the plan after my childhood bathroom, because I thought it was a great way to share that space! But many comments have been calling me out on that so I'm starting to reconsider...

It's a very solid point about the unfinished basement!

Read very carefully what Virgil posted about the site.

And to be honest, and I'm saying this hoping it will be constructive, from reading your replies it appears that your mind is largely made up. Every once and a while here we get a "I want input" (or "Where did we go wrong") thread when in reality they're validation threads. There's always a reason why a suggestion can't be accommodated. We had one here a while back and out of 60 suggestions I think we ended up changing the swing of the powder room door!

All successful projects have one common element that element is trust. Trust in your designer, trust in your builder and trust in yourself that you have an open mind.

In lieu of a retype I'll do a copy and paste I wrote a while back about trust:

"That's great Cheri! Let me just add a few additional thoughts in hopefully making your experience the best possible.

A good architect, when given the chance, will provide a design that can give a client everything they want, but often in ways completely unexpected. But for that to happen it takes a critical element necessary on the part of the client in every successful project and that element is trust.

Often during our initial meeting, the client will reveal their ability or inability to trust others. If I feel the element of trust is not there they will likely be referred to a permit drafter. A creative person should explore other approaches with you in the spirit of "That's great but have you thought of this.......". But for that to be carried forward successfully it takes a trusting client to not only allow the architect to expand on alternative ideas but to objectively look at other approaches in a collaborative effort with the architect. And that's an intangible that all successful projects are born out of.

And as an aside, that's why the charrette process works so well in that ideas can be explained, heard, modified, explored, remodified and evaluated all in their rough form and all in real time. I can't tell you how many times a client sitting across the table from me has said "Wow! We never thought of that. We like the kitchen idea but how 'bout if we move the entry here and the...." As I hand them the pen. In some of those design sessions the client commands the pen almost as much as I do!

Just be ready to expect any preconceived ideas to be questioned. They may in fact turn out to be perfectly valid but at least they've been evaluated against alternates as any good architect should do.

Finally, regarding preconceived ideas, I've quoted on this board before these two quotes by two creative people.....

Henry Ford observed "If I had asked people what they wanted they would have told me "A faster horse".

And Steve Jobs mused “A lot of times, people don't know what they want until you show it to them. Everyone wanted an iPhone when they first appeared, but no one could have described what they wanted before seeing one".

So put trust in your architect to carry you through the process in the spirit of Mr. Ford and Mr. Jobs and you'll have a home that is the very best.

And speaking of the best, here's wishing you the best of luck with your project. Exciting times!"

Again, this is meant to be positive constructive advice and I hope you take it that way.

You've said that the dining area is large enough for your dining table with 3 feet on each end. Is that with the chairs pulled out from the table or just the table. How much space to you need to move comfortably around the back side and the ends of the table when your family is sitting at the table?

I would suggest making bedroom 1 and the full bath on the main level ADA compliant. If someone ends up in a wheelchair for a short time or if you have a handicapped house guest, it would be a wonderful thing to have.

As others have posted, there is no need for you to respond specifically to my post .

Hi B Mac, my sister's dining room was about 10 x 14. There wasn't a lot of room to walk past when people were seated at the table. They are a large family, however. Your design, if I'm reading it right, is more open than hers, but the family members sitting on the window side will always struggle to get in and out. I guess it partly depends on what you want. Many people who post on the kitchen forum expect to eat in shifts. Others want everyone to eat at the same time.

My sister's kids ended up playing many more instruments than the piano: trumpet, trombone, sax, flute, piccolo (I know I'm missing at least one) and all played the piano. We used to tease her that she should have just contracted with the local high school to provide the marching band. They could not all practice in one room.

HTH!

B Mac wrote, "...@virgil: I want to make sure I understand your last comment. That's a generic image you included, yes? Not intended to be specific to our site?..."

No, B Mac, it's very specific to your site. It is your site--do you not recognize it? And how you may think about it and designing a house for it?

Your design will be considerably improved (and changed) if you think simultaneously about site analysis/interior functions/exterior orientation and massing.

This conversation has buried itself in a focus on the level of sinks and doors and lost sight of the major aspects of architectural design which help to make a successful design for a home.

There's a need here to lift one's vision and refocus on the significant influences of designing a home before narrowing one's vision to the details in a given room.

I'm generally not a commenter although I read this forum obsessively! Couldn't resist a comment today though, since I have three young kids with hopes for one or two more. We also live in the country on 5 acres and are planning to start building this fall.

My first response is actually that I like a lot of things about your plan! Love the kitchen relationship with the back entry going out to the back yard, but also opening to the mud room, the powder room, the pantry. As other mentioned the pantry could be narrower, but otherwise can totally picture this working so well!

Your stairway location to the second floor is also something I love. Starting up from the living area, then facing a big window as you go up, and opening into a big central hall.

In my limited understanding of your site, I also like the way you have your house oriented and the driveway location. I'm just imagining a tree lined drive, as people drive up, they see glimpses of the house, building expectancy. Then they turn into the loop and see the actual 'front' of the house, and it feels welcoming and cozy, as it's away from the main road. Feels more like a destination if you will. Call me crazy, but my favorite things on any plans are the unexpected and possibly not quite most practical!

A couple of things I will mention though, if you keep the stairs to the basement where they are, I would want a door for sure. Currently my basement steps are right in line where everyone comes in and I hate it! It's not a very good first view to be greeted with, and it does seem to suck your eyes downwards. If it were me, I'd move the stairway over to the side along the study. The door to the study could be moved forward and it would be even more private if it's to be used as an away space.

One more thing, with your kids bath upstairs. I'd put a pedestal sink in with the toilet and shower. Then I'd change the sink behind the door to a big storage cupboard. Reasoning for this is that the person using the toilet can wash their hands before opening the door, and basically have a sink right there for anything they might need. At the same time another person can be combing their hair, or brushing their teeth at the sink outside. This outer sink area also would not need a door, although that's personal preference.

@cpartist: I'm trying to think why a deep front porch wouldn't shade from the sun... what am I missing?

Your porch is facing West? The sun in the late afternoon is much lower and hotter. You need to read up on passive solar heating/cooling.

You've gotten so much great feedback that it would be hard to expand on what you've already received. I am curious, though, if this is intended to be a forever home for you? Apologies if I missed that.

However, I made that comment about the porch and realize like ARG and Virgil have said that you are so focused in on details that you're missing the larger picture.

I understand you've spent lots of time and energy creating this plan and making it YOUR plan. However that doesn't always translate to a good plan. We sometimes get so involved in our own plans we really can't see the forest for the trees. Right now you still need to design the forest and not the trees.

I agree with the architects here that there probably is a much better way to design your house and the approach that takes into consideration the land, the interior and the exterior. A person of design talent would be able to help you with that so both of you could come up with something wonderful.

There is a reason to engage the services of a professional. It's to get the most out of the house for now and for the future use of your house. It's to make the most of your land and your views and to create the most welcoming entry. It's to get everything right sized for your needs and do it in your budget.

You have your skills, talents and education. Unless that education and skill is in architectural design, it is probably best to leave the design to someone who has that talent and education.

After all you wouldn't bring your sick child to your accountant or ask your Doctor to fix the electric in your house.

How exciting to be designing your house for your family! As a mom of six (four of whom were homeschooled), I believe I do understand your way of thinking. :)

Here's a couple of my suggestions:

1)Take the current downstairs bathroom space and turn that into your pantry. I would enlarge it just a bit to the "left." I would put 18" shelves on one side, and approximately 6" shelves on the other. I have this arrangement, and I put everything that we use frequently on the 6" side. Everything is easy to see and it was easier for the kids to keep the shelves neat. Ideally, you would move things things just a bit so you could enter the pantry through the mudroom or the kitchen.

2) Now, take the pantry space and turn that into a bathroom with a shower (with a handheld nozzle ) that you can enter from the guest room "and" the mudroom. Expecting muddy children to clean up in that tiny powder room will only create more mess. You'll have mud on the walls. I know. Been there, done that!

3) I would put hooks on the "right" wall in the mudroom for coats, and a long table or built-in desk against the left wall for computers, studying, and messy projects.You could also put shelves and/or cabinets above the desk for storage. We were also kitchen table homeschoolers after vacating our dedicated schoolroom that was too far from the kitchen; however, I would have dearly loved a dedicated space close by where I could keep an eye on the kids while they were on the computer, making messy crafts, etc. (Maybe you won't need the desk in the kitchen, now?)

4) Upstairs - Regarding that area of unfinished storage: would it be possible to swap that with the first bedroom to the right? You would gain a larger bedroom. I would take the back half of that storage closet to make a closet in the new bedroom. You could also use the front half as a powder room. In the upstairs hall bath, one child could be bathing, one or two could be using the vanities, and you would still have a private toilet available. :) Or you could use that entire area for another bathroom upstairs (one for boys, one for girls?).

5) I would put the laundry on the opposite wall for easier ventilation to the outside. And it will be quieter in your master bedroom.

6) Back to the downstairs - I really like that you have several, different spaces for people to escape into their own private thoughts and activities. Unfortunately, you don't have one very large living area. Somehow, I would want to make your great room larger, even if I had to consolidate two of the other rooms. Now that my family has grown by 3 sons-in-law, 5 grandchildren, and still growing, I could really use one larger living area! A larger great room would have certainly been nice when we had lots of family and friends over, as well.

Best wishes on your build!

This is such an interesting thread. It seems to me so similar to many of the other threads involving home schooling. It appears to have an overwhelming focus and concern on interior rooms and their grouping, and a lack of focus on site analysis and exterior massing/design. In fact, there seems to be a lack of awareness of the essential inter-connection between site analysis and planning, interior organization and exteriors.

I don't think there's been a single comment about what the exterior of the house looks like. It is apparently unimportant.

As for site planning considerations influencing the design of the house, it appears that the house was designed on a clean sheet of paper and then twisted here and there to sit on the site in an manner which flies in the face of any sort of site analysis. The necessity of a lengthy and expensive driveway, taking money away from the house itself, is only one example.

Being focused and concerned with home schooling is a tremendously important challenge. It's one which deserves the most thoughtful and serious attention. but it's also possible to do that and to also pay attention to all of the other issues which go into making a house a successful long-term home. If one is aware of and understands the other issues.

I wish that there was more that could be said and done to show the OP what s/he is missing. Very best wishes for the successful completion of your important first home.

I don't think there's been a single comment about what the exterior of the house looks like. It is apparently unimportant.

Well I said in my first post:

Where are your elevations. Homes are not designed by creating a plan and then adding an elevation. They are designed by creating the interior and exterior and how it will be sited on the land at one time.

and:

Frankly, seeing how you've oriented the house and the other things I feel you need the help of someone with design talent.

and:

I agree with the architects here that there probably is a much better way to design your house and the approach that takes into consideration the land, the interior and the exterior. A person of design talent would be able to help you with that so both of you could come up with something wonderful.

The problem is Virgil, the OP I feel really doesn't want to hear it. I think she's already invested so much time and energy in this plan that she's wedded to it. In her mind, "it's good enough."

My dining room is 12'9" by 13" long. When I host holiday meals, there are 4 adults and two teenage children. It is WAY too small and cramped. I cannot get around one of the chairs to even serve properly. For your size family, you dining area needs to be BIG!

Do you intend to homeschool through high school? Your needs will be VERY different than they are now, with the children gathered around the kitchen table while you cook.

Is this your "forever" house? If not, you must balance your homeschooling/large family needs with those of a future buyer.

As for that huge garage on the front of your house...surely with this much land, you can face it either to the side or to the back on the road entry side. Then continue the driveway around to your front (the back of the property), and have a nice circular drive with plenty of parking for guests.

You truly need a design professional to help you with this house. Just the siting alone requires professional expertise. WAY too expensive to get it wrong.

Sorry, cpartist, in my comments above, I meant no comments about the house exterior from the OP...I'm still struggling with words and grammar!

LOL. ^^ Agree with you there.

I am by no means an expert but can you fit in a dedicated homeschool room where it can be closed and off at the end of the day? I have always like my home office to be separate. And then later a library or something? All my opinion! Congrats on your land and homeschooling your kids! That was something I could have never done!

@virgil:

I really appreciate your post but the image you worked up didn't match our site, which is why I was confused. Our site has access from the north east, not south east. I know you all help many people so I guessed it was more of a suggestion of the kind of site study I should undertake myself, rather than one you had already done for me! (Thanks!)

@all: I don't frequent forums online and one reason is the possibility for misunderstanding is so high. I feel that is the case here. For sure, my husband and I have pored over plans and books (including several of the ones suggested) for months... and we've measured lots of spaces that felt right to us, so we aren't coming into this discussion with a blank slate. If I was working with an architect directly who I trusted, I'd have a much more open mind to large scale changes but nobody here has suggested any large scale changes (and I didn't expect them to! That's what architects get paid for.) All they've suggested is to look at the site/sun/etc. (and we have to the best of our abilities) and modify some of the inside spaces (and we're carefully considering every suggestion). On the topic of trust, we don't have any reason to trust carte blanche any one particular commentor on this site... but again, we're listening and appreciative.

Bottom line: We would love to work with an architect like Architectrunnerguy but couldn't find anyone locally who worked the way he does (not charging tens of thousands of dollars + wanting input on every aspect of construction and design). Maybe we didn't know what to look for? So we did our best to consider all the special things about our site and needs that stock floor plans don't address, and we took a leap of faith. Posting here on the forum required another leap of faith and I feel like it's paid off, though it's not easy reading how often my statements (and my motives) are misinterpreted.

Designing a Home thread.

I really appreciate your post but the image you worked up didn't match our site, which is why I was confused. Our site has access from the north east, not south east. I know you all help many people so I guessed it was more of a suggestion of the kind of site study I should undertake myself, rather than one you had already done for me! (Thanks!)

Actually his is showing it from the northeast. North is usually shown at the top which is what he did. Where are you seeing he made the access from the southeast?

You said, "I'd have a much more open mind to large scale changes but nobody here has suggested any large scale changes. (and I didn't expect them to! That's what architects get paid for.)"

So on the one hand you're saying you'd be open to changes IF we showed you how to make major changes, but on the other hand you're saying you didn't expect us to because as you rightly state, that's an architect's job.

What I read into your comment is that you've already made up your mind and are happy with your plan. That you weren't looking for major feedback but only some minor changes, like move a door here, add a window there type of comments. And that's okay since you're happy with your plan.

Bottom line: We would love to work with an architect like Architectrunnerguy but couldn't find anyone locally who worked the way he does (not charging tens of thousands of dollars + wanting input on every aspect of construction and design). Maybe we didn't know what to look for? So we did our best to consider all the special things about our site and needs that stock floor plans don't address, and we took a leap of faith.

Your statements aren't being misrepresented but you yourself said you're not willing to take the leap of faith. If you truly wanted to find an architect who works like ARG, it would definitely take work to find one. It would take research and probably not calling the large offices but finding a 1 or 2 person firm. ARG, JDS and Mark all work by themselves.

But it can be done. Arialvetica came here a year or so ago with a plan that we all felt could be better. She then found an architect who had never heard of a charrette and had never tried it but was open to the idea of doing one. And she got a design she would have never come up with herself and the architects liked the process so much they have decided they're going to do it again. And it didn't cost her much and saved her more than she paid the architect.

But the difference is Arialvetica put her trust in someone else. She realized she's not an architect or designer and worked with a professional.

Posting here on the forum required another leap of faith and I feel like it's paid off

Yes if you feel your plan has been validated then it's paid off. I do wish you only the best.

@cpartist: The image was labeled North with an arrow pointing to the left, which is why I was confused.

I'm having a hard time with your tone, or at least my interpretation of it, to be honest. I really appreciate the feedback and suggestions of so many participants in this thread (and I've typed my thanks until my fingers are numb!) and you've given me invaluable links to content elsewhere on the forum. I'm getting quite an education! But I feel like you're trying to bully me off the forum for some reason. I'm still very much interested in constructive feedback but I'm not seeing any in your recent responses.

@buildinginTN and others who asked about whether this was a forever house: That's quite a question! I don't know. We love the spot and we hope to be here at least 10-15 years. I am not sure I see us living here for 50 years. That's probably the best answer I have at this point.

Many people mentioned using the unfinished storage space upstairs in other ways: extra or larger bedrooms, an additional bathroom, etc. I love many of the ideas, but I'm afraid our budget won't accommodate additional sqft. We really don't have a great estimate $/sqft yet but didn't want to just "go bigger" unless our needs truly merited it. I'm filing the suggestions away, however, in case I'm pleasantly surprised by the cost estimate we receive!

@cpartist: The image was labeled North with an arrow pointing to the left, which is why I was confused.

Mea Culpa. No excuse, but that will teach me to look at things on small devices. I see where north is labeled, so please accept my apologies.

I'm having a hard time with your tone, or at least my interpretation of it, to be honest. I really appreciate the feedback and suggestions of so many participants in this thread (and I've typed my thanks until my fingers are numb!) and you've given me invaluable links to content elsewhere on the forum. I'm getting quite an education! But I feel like you're trying to bully me off the forum for some reason. I'm still very much interested in constructive feedback but I'm not seeing any in your recent responses.

I am absolutely not trying to bully you. If you're mostly happy with what you have, then that's terrific. (Reread what I wrote.) I gave you info on how to possibly find an architect and pointed you to someone who had done so recently and is now building their dream home.

And I reiterated what those more experienced than myself continually try and get across here on the forum. The idea that houses shouldn't be created one floor at a time by moving around boxes, then adding a covering for the exterior and after that's all done, try and see how it will fit on the land. It's hoping they realize as Virgil said above:

"It appears to have an overwhelming focus and concern on interior rooms and their grouping, and a lack of focus on site analysis and exterior massing/design. In fact, there seems to be a lack of awareness of the essential inter-connection between site analysis and planning, interior organization and exteriors."

In the end the only people you need to please are yourself and your family. Since you seem to be mostly happy with what you've created, I wish you nothing but the best in your build. :)

Hey, there, Miss B!

I, also, am a homeschooling "mom of
many" (5, and open to more), and I'd like to address a thing or two with
your "2nd FLOOR OPEN QUESTIONS."

- Should we do 8ft ceilings upstairs and save money? Our kids sleep
in bunk beds, which is our main reason to consider going with 9'. I
would think at a certain age they could be in a bottom bunk though?

If
it were me, I absolutely would not do 8' ceilings in a bunked room.
:-) We currently live with 8', and I would kill for an extra foot. Not
only would it make it easier to make the beds (and I'm a shorty!), it
may be far more comfortable for even slightly claustrophobic kiddos (or
overly tall ones) to climb into bed and might enhance their quality of
sleep.

- How can we make that small kid nook at the top of the stairs magical?

If
you aren't looking to change its footprint at all, what about adding
some cutouts in the wall that it shares with the stairwell? I don't
know what house style you like, so it's hard to be more specific, but
the cutouts could be virtually any size, with or without glass depending
on the hole(s). Built-in niches (on any/all walls, at various
heights/depths for kids of all sizes) for small treasures, current
favorite books, art displays, scavenger hunts, hide and seek, etc.

Dang, now I gotta keep some of these ideas for myself, lol. :-)

Oh, and one more thing... Maybe consider adding a second toilet in the kids' bath, if budget won't allow another complete bathroom? I don't know about y'all, but we frequently share sinks if necessary, but more than one person on the potty is definitely a no-go, lol. Might have to steal space from the master, and/or swap the bath with the corner bedroom. Assuming the idea is of any interest to ya.

The OP wrote, in her opening project description, "GENERAL NOTES:

- Our best views are to the East (top of the plan) and South..."

I took her meaning to be the site plan. Only later did it become clear she was referring to her floor plan.

It changes nothing about the site analysis and implications for architectural design, except where the sun rises and sets.

It's probably much too late to suggest the OP look at an "L-shaped" house design to explore those options, rather than her current design.

Many
people mentioned using the unfinished storage space upstairs in other
ways: extra or larger bedrooms, an additional bathroom, etc. I love
many of the ideas, but I'm afraid our budget won't accommodate
additional sqft. We really don't have a great estimate $/sqft yet but
didn't want to just "go bigger" unless our needs truly merited it. I'm
filing the suggestions away, however, in case I'm pleasantly surprised
by the cost estimate we receive!

But you're building it. The money you're "saving" by not finishing it is very small compared to that cost. If these things are the difference between building and not building, you're going to come up short.

B Mac - Just wanted to say that many suggestions are made on the basis of the suggestion simply being another idea to consider. Very often when people ask for comments or suggestions, they then admit that they hadn't considered some ideas that the members offered. They just hadn't thought of them. Oftentimes, we can look at something for so long that we don't see the obvious! Or just other ways of doing something.

Anyway, after considering all the options that were offered to you, you have to decide what works for your family. Just remember that most suggestions really are offered in the spirit of "Well, here's another idea for you to consider, and here's why I think this might be better."

Best wishes on your build!

Wow! Nick has really provided a great alternative which not only fits the site well, but also provides spaces which may work very well at various levels. This assumes the family can all negotiate stairs well. The levels will provide acoustic separation as well as "mess" separation as the children grow older and want their own space. Well done, Nick!

Nick just gave you the other idea you were looking for. Now of course it probably needs tweaking but the idea here is there is definitely more than one way to create what you need. I'm sure if this isn't just right for you, there are other excellent ways to create a wonderful plan

Nick excellent job.

"Thank you" doesn't even begin to cover it! What an amazing community you've fostered here.

We have much to mull over, chew on and re-think. We're going to do just that! You all have opened our eyes to many things we weren't able to see before, and I'm confident our home will be better for it.

People of such design talent, volunteering their skills to help others like this, are unbelievable. Mr. Nick, you really created a work of art right there. I was so stinkin' excited to see that house, and it's not even mine!!! Beautiful. :-)

I am by no means an expert, but I wanted to make a comment about site placement. Our last house was lovely, an elaborate home hidden back off the highway in the woods. But the driveway led straight to the garage, constructed at the east end (narrow end) of the ranch style house.

Visitors were faced with a choice - do I follow the sidewalk on the right or on the left, both of which led to a door. Invariably they choose the logical one, the one that they assumed would lead to a front door facing the highway. Wrong! That was the kitchen door. The front of the house faced AWAY from the highway, towards the woods.

Dumb layout. I hated it. No amount of landscaping could fix it. The entry way was very very nice with marble tile and an expensive chandelier but nobody ever saw it. And there was no way for anyone to actually see the house, other than walking out in the front or back yard.

Take plenty of time with your site layout. The house will probably stand for 80 years - do it right.

I'm late to the party here but want to comment on thinking about your kids' needs now vs. the future. When we did a big addition and complete renovation of our kitchen and 4 baths, many of our friends were surprised that we raised all the counters, even in the kids' bathrooms. (They were 9 and 11 at the time.) My son grew at least an inch during the construction phase, and now at 17 he's 6'6"+. Trust me he likes/needs those high counters! (My daughter is over 6' and likes them too.) And by the time we finally switched out DS's twin sized bed for a bigger one, he looked like Will Ferrell in Elf. Even if your family won't get that tall, your kids might want to get out of bunk beds by the time they're in middle school or high school. So when you look at spaces like your nook or kids' rooms, I'd recommend thinking of someone your size or your spouse's size (whoever is bigger) and think about whether you would be comfortable. Also consider where they will be when they want to have friends over, and if they can have some private fun time with friends. It's really good to be the house where kids want to go. I like knowing where they are and meeting their friends, and it's nice to have them close but give them some privacy. (They use our finished basement primarily for that.)

As for a future dog (which I highly recommend :) ) I appreciate having room in our mudroom for his food in a cabinet (it takes up lots of room), his food bowls and leashes, some towels for wet days, a sink for muddy paw days, and a door right to the outside. Looks like you have that through the patio door; just wanted to make sure you're thinking about that too.

Might you want a man door at the back of the garage? (Will you need to bring yard tools, toys, etc. out to that side of the garage? Would be nice to exit without walking around.)

My DS in a twin bed:

lol @ chicagoans! Not sure I could convince my 6'+ teen boy to wear the footsie pajamas! ;-)

I agree that Nick's "approach" is perfect.

I also have a friend with a weird driveway /parking area, and I'm always a little uncomfortable "approaching" her house because no matter where I park it feels like I'm blocking someone else or parking in a "family spot". With a little attention to detail, you can plan your driveway so that a guest clearly knows where to park and which door to enter -- and I think this is a topic that doesn't receive enough love around here!

Chispa, one of our family traditions is new pajamas every Christmas Eve ... and last year my girls received black cat footed sleepers (they are 19 and 22). To say that they loved those sleepers would be a gross understatement.

@chispa @mrspete: LOL on the footsies! Over the summer my kids volunteer at a camp for special needs kids (Camp Courageous in Iowa.) Prior to DS's second week there he came home from Target with onesie pj's that looked like a kangaroo, complete with a pouch and a little joey stuffed animal. The campers loved seeing someone like him (I think they kind of admire the HS volunteers) wearing an outfit like that and acting goofy. I think it makes them feel safe to act silly and not try to be 'cool'. And I love that my DS is good with being silly sometimes. :)

I will chime in on the importance of a clear approach to the front door. My friend built their house on a steeply sloped hill. They have a long driveway that leads uphill to a side facing garage that sits back from the front plane of the house. Unless you pull your car all the way up to the garage, you will be parked on a steep slope. It's hard to walk up this steep slope to the house.

From the parking area in front of the garage, you walk up steps to a raised deck on the side of the house. At the top of the steps you are right in front of the patio door leading directly into the kitchen. The deck jogs around the corner to the front of the house. The front door is recessed on the front of the house so you can't see it. No one ever knows where to go. She absolutely hates it! When she has company coming she closes the blinds on the kitchen patio door hoping people will go to the front entry even though no one knows where it is. She usually ends up with people wandering around the driveway looking for a front door. So now she just waits outside for people or lets them in through the kitchen. She was trying to save a few bucks and didn't build the necessary walkway and stairs needed for a front entry. Totally not worth it.

Also, Nick, wow! what a great solution :-)

So how did it turn out? We are building as well and I hated all the plans out there some more then others. They were either lacking, or had qualities that I have in our current home. If you are still trying to figure out the master set up I can sure send you what we chose for our set up. Then bathroom is smaller but doesn't lack in function, also we have our master in that same corner and we have a narrow window above where our bed will be way up high and went with narrow windows on each side of our bed. I also recommend that you go to a lot of open houses that have walls in the foyer when you walk in, look at different designs and layouts, see what you like and don't like. On paper vs visualizing in your head is so much more inadequate then actually looking at a home with super small bedrooms, or obscure walls. Your plan may work for you in your head but if you can actually walk into a home that the foyer is blocked with wall 5' in front of the entrance you may rethink where you put your stairs. I saw a few different options where you could sneak in the stairs with a little bit of tweaking to your floor plans. Also, we took a floor plan apart and it is part of 2 different plans plus my own tweaking. We went to our local small town home building lumber yard and they have ppl there that draw this stuff up for a living, I asked how much my plans were and they didn't charge me as our contract buys his inventory there. and find yourself a craftman contractor, one that is great at what he does, small time not a big company builder that turns out tons of houses in a yr. Ours does one per yr, he delivers quality, integrity and he doesn't bat an eye when you want to change things a bit on the interior. He built my in laws massive addition and I watched the man work, he was awesome! Find someone who will work with you look at your finished plans and tell you that wont work or maybe another way to look at it. Build your house the way you want to but first, go look at some open houses that are similar or have some of the same things you have in your plans. Best of luck! I feel your pain of finding the right plan, late nights, research, consumed by what you need and want. When your house plans feels right and you have come to where you are confident with them you will know it is right.

BMac and I were all hoping this thread would go away but to answer Sheri's query......there was some innocent and very well intentioned positive cross posting going on while BMac was talking to me privately about her project. We were looking at what she already had and I came up with this overall "Big Idea" or "Parti" in architect speak....core concept is getting maximum views to the outside from the kitchen and relating the back yard to the house, minimizing the impact of the garage etc.

We did a remote design session (I live in Annapolis, they're in Oregon) using this drawing as a basis for discussion. Came back later and had another remote session using this more defined drawing below... Got a porch looking to the back with good views of both the front AND rear from the kitchen. Having lived on a large parcel myself it IS nice to see the front from the kitchen. When a vehicle is heard one can look out and see if it's the FedEX guy, or Daddy coming home or some unknown vehicle and I was shooting for that here as well as to get views out the back to where kids might be playing (they have 4 or 5 IIRC).

It still wasn't there yet and I was planning on another session to get it to a level like this (another project but an example of a finished design):

I was leaving on a three week vacation however. While I was gone they showed it to the builder and in my absence he made suggestions and drew up the construction docs so here's what he drew and is being built incorporating his suggestions:

Another FINE example of the remote work ARG does. ARG designed our house and drawings are being tweaked as I type. We hope to go to contract by mid month. It's been a process and narrowing down our builder of choice and we are almost there. ARG has been GREAT and I'll be very happy to see the final set of drawings that ARG gives his seal of approval on. Local drafting company is doing the actual CAD from ARG's conceptuals along with a nice long voice conference. House looks great!

PI, I am looking forward to seeing your house.

Thanks CP and I yours. At least FINALLY seeing some real drawings as it were is a great thing. We are actually very very close now with a few tweaks and voila. Project is out for bids and we should be to contract before Christmas.