Stepparent custody and visitation

16 years ago

Stepparent's Right to Request Custody or Visitation:

References to statutes and pertinent state specific cases involving the rights stepparents have to request the court for child custody or visitation rights.

(1) Alabama: No statute. Shoemaker v. Shoemaker, 563 So. 2d 1032 (Ala. Civ. App. 1990) (there is no right, by statute or common law, for visitation with stepchild).

(2) Alaska: Alaska Stat. 25.24.150(a) (Michie 1995) (provides standing for custody rights to third parties on divorce, separation, or death of parent). Carter v. Broderick, 644 P.2d 850 (Alaska 1982) (court may grant visitation to stepparent who stands in loco parentis to child).

(3) Arizona: No statute. Olvera v. Superior Court, 168 Ariz. 556, 815 P.2d 925 (Ct. App. 1991) (trial court lacks jurisdiction to grant custody to stepparent); Bryan v. Bryan, 132 Ariz. 353, 645 P.2d 1267 (Ct. App. 1982) (stepparent who stands in loco parentismay be awarded visitation rights; note, however, that in Finck v. O'Toole, 179 Ariz. 404, 880 P.2d 624 (1994), the Supreme Court of Arizona impliedly disapproved of Bryan's holding that the superior court has authority to award visitation to a stepparent).

(4) Arkansas: No statute. Stair v. Phillips, 315 Ark. 429, 867 S.W.2d 453 (1993) (stepparent has no right to custody of stepchild after divorce); Stamps v. Rawlins, 297 Ark. 220, 761 S.W.2d 933 (1988) (interpreting Ark. Code Ann. 9-13-101, which provides that court can award custody of "child of marriage," court held that it could award custody of stepchild to stepparent, but that there was a natural parental preference in such a custody dispute).

(5) California: Cal. Fam. Code 3040(3), 3041 (West 1994) (authorizing nonparent custody based on finding that an award of custody to parent would be detrimental to child and award to nonparent would serve best interests of child); Cal. Fam. Code 3101 (West 1994) (specifically recognizing stepparent visitation on divorce or death of parent). In re Marriage of Hinman, 6 Cal. App. 4th 711, 8 Cal. Rptr. 2d 245 (1992) (court had authority to award custody to stepparent, estopping natural mother from denying that children were "of the marriage" where she so claimed in pleadings); Goetz v. Lewis, 203 Cal. App. 3d 514, 250 Cal. Rptr. 30 (1988) (court does not have jurisdiction in divorce proceeding to determine custody of child not of the parties, but may, by statute, grant visitation rights); In re Hirenia C., 18 Cal. App. 4th 504, 22 Cal. Rptr. 2d 443 (1993) (former female cohabitant of preadoptive mother had standing to request visitation where child had been placed with both women as foster parents prior to adoption).

(6) Colorado: Colo. Rev. Stat. 14-10-123 (1987) (nonparent has standing, under state provision of Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act, to assert custody of child where he or she has had custody of the child for six months). In re Custody of C.C.R.G., 872 P.2d 1337 (Colo. Ct. App. 1993) (court could consider stepparent's claim to custody under provisions of Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act); In re Marriage of Dureno, 854 P.2d 1352 (Colo. Ct. App. 1992) (trial court may grant visitation privileges to stepparent where stepparent has acted in loco parentis).

(7) Connecticut: Conn. Gen. Stat. Ann. 46b-57 (West 1995) (provides standing to any interested third party to intervene in custody dispute, establishing jurisdiction in the superior court over any minor child of either or both parties); Conn. Gen. Stat. Ann. 46b-59 (West 1995) (provides jurisdiction to grant visitation rights to any person on divorce). Patrell v. Ayers, 5 Conn. L. Rptr. No. 10,249 (Super. Ct. 1991) (person who is not biological, adoptive, or foster parent does not have standing to seek custody; statute applies only in dissolution, annulment, or separation); Temple v. Meyer, 208 Conn. 404, 544 A.2d 629 (1988) (denying visitation rights to stepfather, but holding that only relevant criterion was best interests of child).

(8) Delaware: Del. Code Ann. tit. 13, 733 (1996) (authorizes court to award custody to stepparent based on child's best interests).

(9) District of Columbia: No statute.

(10) Florida: No statute. O'Dell v. O'Dell, 629 So. 2d 891 (Fla. DCA 1993) (court had no jurisdiction to grant stepfather visitation rights); Meeks v. Garner, 598 So. 2d 261 (Fla. DCA 1992) (stepfather had no right to claim visitation or custody of stepchild after custodial mother died); Music v. Rachford, 654 So. 2d 1234 (Fla. DCA 1995) (lesbian cohabitant cannot pursue custody of child); Taylor v. Kennedy, 649 So. 2d 270 (Fla. DCA 1995) ("psychological father" who had lived with natural mother for much of last six years could not assert right to visitation with child).

(11) Georgia: Ga. Code Ann. 19-9-1, -2 (Supp. 1996) (court may place custody with a third party on divorce or death of parent). Howell v. Gossett, 234 Ga. 145, 214 S.E.2d 882 (1975) (in contest between father and stepfather after death of mother, stepfather must show that father is not a fit and proper person to have custody).

(12) Hawaii: Haw. Rev. Stat. 571-46(2) (Supp. 1995) (custody may be awarded to persons other than the mother or father, where such award serves the best interests of the child; person with de facto custody in a stable and wholesome environment is entitled to prima facie award of custody); Haw. Rev. Stat. 571-46(7) (Supp. 1995) (allowing court to grant visitation rights to any person on divorce on showing of best interests of the child).

(13) Idaho: No statute. Stockwell v. Stockwell, 775 P.2d 611 (Idaho 1989) (visitation granted to stepparent under theory of in loco parentis).

(14) Illinois: 750 Ill. Comp. Stat. Ann. 5/601(b)(2) (West Supp. 1996) (state provision of Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act, permitting person other than parent to petition for custody or visitation if the child is not in the physical custody of one of his parents). In re Marriage of Carey, 188 Ill. App. 3d 1040, 544 N.E.2d 1293 (1989) (under Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act, a nonparent, without showing that the natural parent is unfit, may obtain custody of the child if the best interests of the child so dictate).

(15) Indiana: No statute. Caban v. Healey, 634 N.E.2d 540 (Ind. Ct. App. 1994) (affirming visitation to stepmother who had acted as child's parent for most of child's life); Collins v. Gilbreath, 403 N.E.2d 921 (Ind. Ct. App. 1980) (court may grant visitation to stepparent on showing of best interests of child over objection of natural parent).

(16) Iowa: No statute. In re Marriage of Halvorsen, 521 N.W.2d 725 (Iowa 1994) (courts do not have authority to grant visitation to stepparent); In re Petition of Ash, 507 N.W.2d 400 (Iowa 1993) (stepparent not entitled to visitation).

(17) Kansas: Kan. Stat. Ann. 60-1610(a)(4)(D) (Supp. 1995) (in dissolution proceedings, court may award custody to stepparent if child is in need of care as defined by child protection laws or if neither parent is fit to have custody); Kan. Stat. Ann. 60-1616(b) (1994) (specifically recognizing stepparent visitation on divorce). In re Osborne, 21 Kan. App. 2d 374, 901 P.2d 12 (1995) (under UCCJA, stepmother had standing to intervene in ex-husband's custody action with his ex-wife after ex-husband's death); State v. Taylor, 125 Kan. 594, 264 P. 1069 (1928) (stepchild is child of marriage where stepparent stands in loco parentis, thereby giving court jurisdiction to decide custody of child).

(18) Kentucky: No statute. Simpson v. Simpson, 586 S.W.2d 33 (Ky. 1979) (court may grant visitation to stepparent who stands in loco parentis to child).

(19) Louisiana: La. Civ. Code Ann. arts. 131, 133 (West Supp. 1996) (custody may be awarded to person in whose home child has been living in a wholesome and stable environment); La. Civ. Code Ann. art. 136 (West Supp. 1996) (specifically recognizing stepparent visitation on divorce). McKinley v. McKinley, 631 So. 2d 45 (La. Ct. App. 1994) (stepfather awarded custody of stepdaughter, on finding that her best interests would be served by not separating her from her half-siblings).

(20) Maine: Me. Rev. Stat. Ann. tit. 19, 752(6) (West Supp. 1995) (court may award custody to third party where parent unfit); Me. Rev. Stat. Ann. tit. 19, 214(a), 752(6) (West Supp. 1995) (allowing court to grant visitation rights to any person on separation or divorce on showing of best interests of child).

(21) Maryland: No statute. Evans v. Evans, 302 Md. 334, 488 A.2d 157 (1985) (court may grant visitation to stepparent on showing of best interests of child).

(22) Massachusetts: Mass. Gen. Laws Ann. ch. 208, 28 (West Supp. 1996) (on judgment of divorce, court may award custody to third person if it is in the best interests of the children).

(23) Michigan: Mich. Comp. Laws 722.27(1)(a) (1993) (court may award custody of child to one or more of the parties involved or to others); Mich. Comp. Laws 772.27(1)(b) (1993) (allowing court to grant visitation to any interested person if reasonable).

(24) Minnesota: Minn. Stat. Ann. 257.022(2b) (West 1992 & Supp. 1996) (person having de facto custody of child for two years may petition for visitation). Simmons v. Simmons, 486 N.W.2d 788 (Minn. Ct. App. 1992) (court may enforce visitation rights of stepparent under stipulation in dissolution action).

(25) Mississippi: Miss. Code Ann. 93-5-24(1)(e) (1994) (court may grant custody to nonparent if parent is unfit). Milam v. Milam, 376 So. 2d 1336 (Miss. 1979) (after death of mother, in contest between father and stepfather, the burden is on the stepfather to prove that the father is mentally, morally, or otherwise unfit).

(26) Missouri: Mo. Ann. Stat. 452.375(5)(3) (West Supp. 1996) (when court finds that each parent is unfit, unsuitable, or unable to meet the demands of custody, custody may be awarded to a third party; under these provisions, any person may petition the court as an interested party). In re Interest of G.A.W., 867 S.W.2d 704 (Mo. Ct. App. 1993) (in contest between stepfather and father after death of mother, trial court erred in granting custody to stepfather in absence of finding that child's welfare would be manifestly jeopardized by father's unfitness).

(27) Montana: Mont. Code Ann. 40-4-211(4)(b) (1995) (state provisions of Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act, giving standing to person other than parent to petition for custody if child is not in physical custody of one of parents). In re A.R.A., ___ Mont. ___, 919 P.2d 388 (1996) (amendment to Montana's Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act, under which remarried custodial parent's spouse may be awarded custody of parent's child on parent's death, without termination of the noncustodial parent's rights, is unconstitutional); In re Marriage of Miller, 251 Mont. 300, 825 P.2d 189 (1992) (stepparent's only venue for custody of stepchild was child abuse, neglect, and dependency proceedings); Pierce v. Pierce, 198 Mont. 255, 645 P.2d 1353 (1982) (stepfather had no standing in divorce action to request custody of stepchild, and doctrine of equitable estoppel was inapplicable).

(28) Nebraska: Neb. Rev. Stat. 42-364(10) (1995) (in dissolution of marriage, court may include orders relating to children, including placing children with third parties); Neb. Rev. Stat. 42-364(10) (1995) (visitation shall be determined according to the best interests of the child). Cavanaugh v. deBaudiniere, 1 Neb. App. 713, 493 N.W.2d 197 (1992) (court may grant visitation to stepparent, and will enforce contract between parties concerning support of stepchild); Hickenbottom v. Hickenbottom, 239 Neb. 579, 477 N.W.2d 8 (1991) (court has authority to grant visitation to stepparent who stands in loco parentis).

(29) Nevada: Nev. Rev. Stat. 125.480(3) (Supp. 1995) (court may award custody to third parties). Fisher v. Fisher, 99 Nev. 762, 670 P.2d 572 (1983) (stepparent is "concerned person" under Nev. Rev. Stat. 159.044(1) (1996) governing guardianship proceedings, and thus stepparent had standing to assert a claim for guardianship of a child in a divorce proceeding).

(30) New Hampshire: N.H. Rev. Stat. Ann. 458:17(VI) (1992 & Supp. 1995) (establishing best interests of child standard for custody cases and allowing custody to stepparent); N.H. Rev. Stat. Ann. 458.17(VI) (1992 & Supp. 1995) (specifically recognizing stepparent visitation on divorce). Stanley D. v. Deborah D., 124 N.H. 138, 467 A.2d 249, 251 (1983) (stepparent may be given custody on showing it is in best interests of child).

(31) New Jersey: No statute. Klipstein v. Zalewski, 230 N.J. Super. 567, 553 A.2d 1384 (Ch. Div. 1988) (visitation to stepparent granted under theory of in loco parentis).

(32) New Mexico: N.M. Stat. Ann. 40-4-9.1(K) (Michie 1994) (where any person other than parent seeks custody of child, no such person shall be awarded custody absent showing of unfitness of parent). Rhinehart v. Nowlin, 111 N.M. 319, 805 P.2d 88 (Ct. App. 1990) (trial court has authority to grant stepparent visitation with spouse's child if important to child's welfare).

(33) New York: N.Y. Dom. Rel. Law 240 (McKinney Supp. 1996) (in action for divorce, court may grant custody to third party, and third party has standing to intervene); N.Y. Dom. Rel. Law 72 (McKinney Supp. 1996) (granting visitation rights to third parties under extraordinary circumstances). In re Carl S., ___ Misc. 2d ___, 637 N.Y.S.2d 607 (Fam. Ct. 1995) (stepfather of children placed in foster care is entitled to seek visitation); Boland v. Boland, 186 A.D.2d 1065, 588 N.Y.S.2d 485 (1992) (stepmother lacked standing to seek visitation with former stepdaughter).

(34) North Carolina: N.C. Gen. Stat. 50-13.1 (1995) (allows any person to file action seeking custody of child). Peterson v. Rogers, 337 N.C. 397, 445 S.E.2d 901 (1994) (visitation statute was not intended to confer upon strangers the right to bring custody or visitation action against parents of children unrelated to those strangers).

(35) North Dakota: N.D. Cent. Code 14-09-06.1 (1991) (authorizes an order for custody to a third party). Seigneur v. Olson, 519 N.W.2d 15 (N.D. 1994) (after death of custodial father, custody awarded to stepmother on showing of "exceptional circumstances" including abandonment by mother).

(36) Ohio: Ohio Rev. Code Ann. 3109.04(D)(2) (Anderson 1996) (custody may be granted to third party on divorce); Ohio Rev. Code Ann. 3109.05.1(B)(1) (Anderson 1996) (specifically recognizing stepparent visitation on divorce on showing of best interests of child); Ohio Rev. Code Ann. 3109.11 (Anderson Supp. 1994) (custody may be awarded to stepparent on death of custodial parent). In re Dunn, 79 Ohio App. 3d 268, 607 N.E.2d 81, 81-82 (1992) (stepmother properly awarded custody of children after custodial father's death, where evidence showed custody to mother would have "devastating and detrimental effect" on emotional stability of children).

(37) Oklahoma: Okla. Stat. Ann. tit. 10, 21.1 (West Supp. 1996) (authorizing appointment of nonparent guardian following death of custodial parent if it would be detrimental to child for noncustodial parent to have custody). Looper v. McManus, 581 P.2d 487 (Okla. 1978) (court may grant visitation to stepparent on showing of best interests of child).

(38) Oregon: Or. Rev. Stat. 109.119(2) (Supp. 1994) (stepparent in dissolution action may petition for custody or visitation); Or. Rev. Stat. 109.119(2) (Supp. 1994) (specifically recognizing stepparent visitation on divorce). In re Sorensen, 138 Or. App. 80, 906 P.2d 838 (1995) (child's stepmother could intervene in custody proceeding between child's parents); In re Shofner, 137 Or. App. 54, 905 P.2d 268 (1995) (court had authority to award stepfather visitation with wife's child).

(39) Pennsylvania: 42 Pa. Cons. Stat. Ann. Rule 1915.6 (West Supp. 1995) (one who has physical custody of child may intervene in custody proceeding). J.A.L. v. E.P.H., 22 Fam. L. Rep. (BNA) 1543 (Pa. Super. Ct. 1996) (former lesbian partner of woman who conceived and gave birth to child during long-term relationship had standing to pursue "partial custody" of child, where partner stood in loco parentis to child); Walkenstein v. Walkenstein, 443 Pa. Super. 683, 663 A.2d 178 (1995) (stepparent has standing to pursue custody if he or she stands in loco parentis to child); Spells v. Spells, 250 Pa. Super. 168, 378 A.2d 897 (1977) (court may grant visitation to stepparent who stands in loco parentis).

(40) Rhode Island: No statute.

(41) South Carolina: S.C. Code Ann. 20-7-420(20) (Law. Co-op. Supp. 1994) (provides for an award of custody to either spouse or any other proper person).

(42) South Dakota: No statute. Quinn v. Mouw-Quinn, 22 Fam. L. Rep. (BNA) 1492 (S.D. 1996) (court may grant stepparent visitation rights where "extraordinary circumstances" exist).

(43) Tennessee: Tenn. Code Ann. 36-6-101(a) (Supp. 1995) (allows for an award of custody to parent or some suitable person); Tenn. Code Ann. 36-6-303 (Supp. 1995) (specifically recognizing stepparent visitation on divorce). Henderson v. Mabry, 838 S.W.2d 537 (Tenn. Ct. App. 1992) (stepfather granted temporary custody of child after death of custodial mother).

(44) Texas: Tex. Fam. Code Ann. 102.003 (West 1996) (third parties may bring original action for custody of child); Tex. Fam. Code Ann. 102.003 (West 1996) (allowing court to grant visitation to interested parties). Jacobs v. Balew, 765 S.W.2d 532 (Tex. Ct. App. 1989) (stepparent does not have standing to seek custody absent another reason, such as the unfavorable environment provided by the parent).

(45) Utah: No statute. In re Interest of JWF, 799 P.2d 710 (Utah 1990) (stepfather who had legal obligation to support child had standing to assert custody); Gribble v. Gribble, 583 P.2d 64 (Utah 1978) (court may grant visitation to stepparent).

(46) Vermont: No statute. Paquette v. Paquette, 146 Vt. 83, 499 A.2d 23 (1985) (relevant statutes empower court to award custody to stepparent who stands in loco parentis).

(47) Virginia: Va. Code Ann. 20-124.1 (Michie 1995) (court can award custody to person with legitimate interest, including stepparent); Va. Code Ann. 20-107.2 (Michie 1995) (specifically recognizing stepparent visitation on divorce). Kogon v. Ulerick, 12 Va. App. 595, 405 S.E.2d 441 (1991) (common-law right to visitation extends only to parents; note that this case was overruled by statute).

(48) Washington: Wash. Rev. Code Ann. 26.09.240 (West Supp. 1996) (allowing court to grant visitation rights to any person on divorce). In re Marriage of Allen, 28 Wash. App. 637, 626 P.2d 16 (1981) (children not common to parties are nevertheless subject to the court's jurisdiction to determine custody); Palmer v. Palmer, 42 Wash. 2d 715, 258 P.2d 475 (1953) (court does not have jurisdiction to determine custody of child not common to parties).

(49) West Virginia: W. Va. Code 48-2-15 (1995) (granting visitation to interested third party on divorce of parents). Honaker v. Burnside, 182 W. Va. 448, 388 S.E.2d 322 (1989) (court may grant visitation to stepparent on showing of best interests of child).

(50) Wisconsin: Wis. Stat. Ann. 767.24(3)(a) (West Supp. 1995) (provides for an award of custody to a "relative" of child; "relative" of child includes stepparent under Wis. Stat. Ann. 48.02(15)); Wis. Stat. Ann. 767.245(1) (West 1981) (specifically recognizing stepparent visitation on divorce where the stepparent has acted in loco parentis). In re Custody of H.S.H.-K., 193 Wis. 2d 649, 533 N.W.2d 419 (1995) (court has equitable power to hear petition for visitation by unrelated person where court determines that person had parent-like relationship with child); Cox v. Williams, 177 Wis. 2d 433, 502 N.W.2d 128 (1993) (court was without jurisdiction to grant former stepmother standing to seek visitation, where after custodial father died there was no pending action before the court in which stepmother could intervene; stepparent may seek visitation only in actions for divorce).

(51) Wyoming: No statute.

1996 National Legal Research Group, Inc.

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Comments (21)

kkny
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Dear Ima,

Many of those cases and statutes were decided/enacted before the Supreme Court case, Toxell, which basically held that anyone other than a biological parent (or adoptive parent) has a very hard row to hoe to get any visitation.

So waste your time/money with lawyers, who will be so glad to take it.
finedreams
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I believed that if stepparents are acting in the best interests of the child and also in cases when steparents completely replaced both parents, they should be given visitation rights and custody. I do know a person who was raised by her stepfather while biofather was not in the picture, after mother's accidental death, DD stayed with SF and he got full custody. SF was the only father figure.

I think that no matter how hard it is, in some case stepparents can win. But...it is very uncommon for stepparents to even go through this ordeal to obtain visitations or custody. Which leads to a conclusion that when relationship ends stepparenting ends as well (in most cases).
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Comments (18)
My hairdresser for many years and his wife divorced - she was having an affair, sadly. She had befriended me, and I know for many, many years, she had wanted a love life and either he didn't or couldn't. I embarrass easily, and didn't push for details on this subject as I was HIS friend/client first. Anyway, the bottom line is that I think he accepted some culpability for her straying, but also, I think he wanted an out. He bent over backwards to keep the kids in their home (which had been his parents' home, passed on to him/bought for a small price) so he suggested the nesting arrangement and it worked for many years. In fact, my hairdresser couldn't imagine the kids not waking up on Christmas morning w/o both parents, so he invited her and her bf to spend the night Christmas Eve (not the affair that ended the marriage, but a later bf/housemate - we weren't sure if they were an item as he was foreign and much younger - just weren't sure!) Anyway, it could work, but I think because both of them knew it was over and maybe, on some level, both were happy to move to the next chapter? That being said, I doubt had he had a gf, that the arrangement would have been so cozy. I guess we women are more territorial at times? Don't know, but I don't think the ex-wife would have invited him and a gf, had one existed for the same arrangement. I looked at him like he was nuts when he told me about it - he burst out laughing, said, "Heck, I loaned her and the guy she cheated on me with the camper one weekend. I figure it's easier on the kids for me to try to make their mom happy, you know? Besides, she's the mother of my kids - they shouldn't have to choose sides on Christmas..." it sounded logical - not sure I could do it, but it worked out well... D
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colleen777
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
When my Ex divorced for the second time, ie our girls' stepmother he didn't want his second wife, SM to have anything to do with our children. Even though most people thought I was nuts for doing it, I was the one who insisted that SM would most absolutely be part of their lives likely forever.

What sense does it make to rip her out of their lives OR rip them out of hers. That is just vindictive. She shared time with them.
imamommy
Original Author
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I love the way you think Colleen
finedreams
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Unfortunatelly in most cases it is not up to BMs to make SMs stay in the picture. It is absolutelly not up to me to insist my DD continues relationship with SM after my X ended his 2nd marriage (a month ago). i would absolutelly not object and would wecome them continuing relationship. Their relationship is none of my business! But it really isn't up to me.

I suspect my DD would ocassionally see XSM because she would probably be CP for for my DD's brother (my X is always gone on business trips plus since he left his wife for TOW, his exwife would fight for full custody).

The thing is that it is not up to the other bio parent to decide. How can i tell her SM that she needs to continue seeing DD? I feel very bad for SM, she ended up being left for TOW and she had no suspicion of it and had no clue about affair. Poor woman is devastated. But her future relationship with my DD is not up to me at all. I even wonder that if she is mad now at X (now her and mine X lol) would she even want to see my DD?

I myself am very family oriented and am very much into being involved with everyone. i am still very much close to XMIL and XFIL. My DD's SM wasn't this type, she was nice but not overly warm. It leads me to suspect that she will not be in the picture. But who am I to insist she is?
imamommy
Original Author
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I think its cruel to deny a child to continue a relationship with someone that cares about them. I'm sure not all step parents develop close relationships with the children, but if they do, I see it as cruel of the biological parents to cut that person out of the child's life. Children should have as many loving people in their lives to care about them. It makes them feel more secure.

Are you punishing the step parent because things didn't work out? The reality is that the children lose a friendship that they may care about. Will they get over it? Only the child knows and may never share that with their parents, especially if the parent's are open with their feelings on it. I see nothing wrong with allowing a step parent to call, write or take a child to the movies or park every once in a while. It doesn't have to be regular visits but to cut off all contact and then a child that thought the step parent cared about them may feel abandoned by it. There's nothing you can do if a step parent has no interest in maintaining contact, but if they do, who is it going to hurt if they keep in touch????
finedreams
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Of course if stetparents want to maintain respectful contacts with SKs they should. Why not? But I don't see any cases when they do maintain that contact. I don't see anything wrong with stepparents calling or visiting etc. Perfectly nice. But i don't see it happening. It sounds all very good but it simply isn't happening. Nobody is going to hurt if they keep in touch, but who are you talking about? Who keeps in touch? You don't, and no one else I know does. So who are all these SPs who maintain contact? Maybe you know one or two but that's about it.
imamommy
Original Author
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
By the way parents treat their children as their property, I don't see that being offered as an option. I have kept in touch with one of the children I raised for several years. Colleen says she's allowed her kids' step parent to keep in touch. I don't think it happens because of what happened when I broke up with my ex. He didn't want me to call or come around at all. He was probably wrapped up in his own feelings and not thinking about the fact that I was the only "mother" figure his kids had ever known. He let me see them for a while because he was still pursuing me to come back but as soon as he met someone else, that ended. It wasn't until a few months later that he began to allow his daughter to visit me and spend weekends with me because his new wife didn't want his kids around. His son's that were teens didn't come to see me because they chose to hang out with their friends and ended up on the wrong path. I can't do anything about that. If parents could put aside their feelings when a second or third marriage is falling apart and ask the step parent if they are going to stay in the child's life, then the step parent would know that's an option. Many probably assume they have no rights and that's been pointed out here several times.

Tonight I had that talk with my DH. He told me if I wanted to continue seeing SD if things didn't work, he would let me. Perhaps it's something step parents that have this concern about should consider getting a written agreement to that effect. Courts may not always allow step parent visitation but they may be inclined to enforce a written contract. But, a written contract shouldn't be needed. The biological parents should realize that if a step parent becomes attached to their children, that it's in the childs best interest to continue that relationship.

It's only my opinion that in cases where the step parent doesn't want to visit the child, it's due to problems with the child during the marriage. Whether it is that the child did not like the step parent or they just didn't get along, then it's not surprising they don't visit and the child is probably glad the step parent is gone.
finedreams
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
What is that to do with allowing or not allowing? If somebody does not allow you to do something with young children and court does not help, then why not restart it when children are grown? Your x's kids are probably grown by now, so who can allow or not allow your phone calls or visits? It all sounds like excuses.
fiveinall
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I am so sick of hearing that step parents have no rights. The laws need to be changed across the board to keep the best interest of the children in mind. Being a biological parent doesn't make a person automatically a good or fit parent. I as a step parent know that if anything happened to my DH or between my DH and I that I would fight tooth and nail till my last penny was spent to be a able to see my SD. I am just as much a parent to her as anyone if not more. Why step parents are treated like such second class citizens is beyond me... there are plenty of bio parents out there that aren't worth a crap but we don't assume all bio parents are crap do we?
I enjoyed your post whether the info is old or not. I would love to see a step parents rights organization pop up to start making changes to all this bs....
imamommy
Original Author
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
In my case, I kept in touch with the "daughter" I raised. Her father didn't allow me to see her for several months after I left but then began letting her come spend a lot of time with me when his new wife didn't want her around and was mean to her. After I moved away, I continued to drive five hours each way to go get her & keep her during spring break or summer. She was going to be in my wedding to my current husband and backed out at the last minute without giving me a reason. We haven't spoken since and I suspect it's because her dad had a problem with it. She will be 18 in a few months and if she likes, she is welcome to resume visiting me. She and my other daughter (who is the same age as her) had planned on living together when they are grown up. As for the boys, they have both changed so much that I didn't recognize them. They hung out with their friends, didn't finish high school, covered in tattoos, one has a drug problem (and maybe the other does too) and they are no longer interested in seeing me. I was the one that gave them boundaries and when I left, they were left to do whatever they wanted. They were probably glad I wasn't there to tell them what to do but I don't know how they feel now.

The only issue that I see with waiting until they are grown is the problem I have in my situation. At the time I left, I have no doubt that they didn't lie awake at night, wishing I were there. They were probably glad I was gone. They were going into high school and both had some anger problems. They had a lot of anger over their mother leaving them, especially the older one. The daughter was only 1 when her mom left & I was the only mom she ever had. The boys were 4 & 6 and the oldest one had a lot of guilt over it because he's the one that showed his dad where she hid her drugs. When you leave step children behind and have no contact with them, they can grow up and resent that you abandoned them, they can change so much they are no longer the children you knew. I think it can work in some cases but the longer you are out of their lives, the harder it is. My son's father didn't see him from the time he was 12 until he was 18. Do you think they can just pick it up from where they left off? Do you think my son is going to forget the hurt of his dad leaving him? He still loves him and wants that relationship, but kids don't forget when they have been deeply hurt. Saying to a step parent, just wait til they are grown is ridiculous. You can't put anything on hold for years and expect it to be the same or anywhere close to it.
callieandkarin
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Count me in as one of those "rare" cases where a step-relationship transcends a marriage. My Dad and Stepmom divorced when I was 13. My Dad was the NCP. Yet, thanks to both of our persistance and love, I continue at age 38 to have a vibrant and close relationship with my Stepmom.

Unlike the BMs represented here, my Mom encouraged our relationship. She, like Colleen and many others on here, subscribed to the "more love is a good thing" theory when it came to her children, and would never have denied us a good relationship with our SM. I thank her for that as an adult today.

And, now it comes full circle. I am engaged to a man with two kids, and am enjoying the experience of the SM/SK relationship from the other side of the coin. I have gone into with eyes open about the challenges and the rewards, and I constantly try to apply what I learned as a Stepkid to my role as a Stepmom. But, no matter what, I always know that a great step-relationship is possible and can last a lifetime. Because I have lived it.

Hope that gives some positive reinforcement to those trying to navigate the landmines of stepparenting and this board.

And to the OP, having made solo pick ups, I echo the previous advice to keep the transfer quick and business like.
finedreams
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I never said "just wait", you said you weren't allowed to see them, so if you want to be with them, then why wouldn't you at least try it now? If I weren't allowed to see my kid for some strange reason, i would try to restart it at any point in my life. I would call, and call, and go and knock on the door even after 20 years. But you don't, and who blames you? They aren't your children so you stopped pursuing it. i bet you would never stopped pursuing relationship with your children, no matter how late in life.

You just refuse to admit that in majority of the case stepparenting ends when relationship ends. Even if you maintain some form of contact like being in touch once in awhile it is still not the same as parenting. i keep in touch with a lot of people but I am not their parent. There is a big difference between keeping in touch and parenting even grown children.

I talk to my DD every other day, and email daily. I talk to my parents at least every other day. Because we are parents and children regardless of anything else going on in life.

Even if SPs keep in touch what former SPs talk to their former SKs every day? Do you know any? Name one. Possibly the ones who completely replaced both parents and raised SKs on their own. How many do you know?
finedreams
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
It is great to hear that you maintain close relationship with SM. It is very positive and healthy and says a lot about her willing to go this extra step and stay in your life and your mom and dad supporting it. You are right, you are one of those "rare" cases.
imamommy
Original Author
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
of course it will not likely be a "parenting" relationship, but in most cases, the children have parents to continue to "parent" them. The step parent that is no longer married to their parent can have a "friendship" relationship and I think it's important for the parents to allow that to continue if the step parent and/or children have a good relationship. And what information do you have on my efforts to pursue seeing them? I haven't shared that one way or the other.

We can agree to disagree. I think it was unfair to my SD that her mom had a BF for five years and when they broke up, she is no longer allowed to say his name. She liked him a lot but her mom doesn't want to hear his name. He may or may not be interested in seeing SD anymore (or her sister who also liked him) but BM could think of her kids and tell them, "things didn't work out with exBF but that doesn't change how much he liked you girls. You are welcome to call him or write to him if you like." But I don't see too many parents do that because they get wrapped up in their feelings after a break up and don't think about the children. My SD's mom, instead let SD read letters he wrote after the break up, criticizing BM for her drinking. SD tells DH that she now hates mom's exBF. But he never did anything to SD.

In fact, I see the biological parents using their children in the break up of their marriage all the time, with threats and demands, all in the name of the children when the real goal is to get even for the end of the marriage.
finedreams
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
the information I have is the one you provided. You were very detailed in your description of your relationship with ex's kids.

I am not sure what about BF's situation with SD. This was a BF not a DH, and it seems like one of the many. I do not know if it is healthy for a child to continue relationship with every BF or GF. Maybe he was not a good influence or whatever, maybe mom knows something neither SD nor you know. You can't seriously expect chidlren to treat every BF or GF as a life long stepparent. It is actually mom's fault that she makes every BF such a huge part of child's life. It sends children wrong messages and it causes a lot of damage. I bet you SD is suspicious of what is going to happen with current BF. Of course marriages also end but at least there is more commitment or sense or permanency for a child.
imamommy
Original Author
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I don't expect every BF/GF or even step parent to have a lifelong relationship. What message or damage to you think it causes to a child (especially small ones) that meet mom or dad's new SO/spouse, like them, enjoy doing things with them, feel like they are liked back, etc. and when the parent breaks up with this person, the person vanishes. Kids tend to blame themselves for everything when they are little and don't understand why this one is gone now and they liked that one. I know it's unrealistic to expect a GF/BF of a few weeks or even months to maintain contact, but when that person is in it for years and the child likes them, then at the very least, the parent should be able to set aside their feelings and make sure the child knows that they are not the reason he/she left and that person didn't stop liking/loving them. and allow some contact if the child or step parent desires it.

It's sad when parents go through a string of relationships that the kids are exposed to and no, not every person in those situations is going to stay in contact. But to allow phone calls or letters & cards is not asking too much, in my opinion. But some parents forbid it and that is what I feel is wrong.

As for my situation, I have written and the only one that responds is the daughter. The boys may someday come around if they get their life straightened out.

From what we know, SD's mom dumped the BF right after DH and I got married. The exBF called DH and told him he was devastated by the break up and he was planning on proposing to SD's mom. I'm sure SD is concerned with what is going to happen with current BF. BM is telling her they are getting married in December (in the next two weeks) and she isn't even divorced from her first husband. (that's been discussed on a different thread)
finedreams
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I see no damage in SPs continuing relationship. I keep saying it would be nice. But I don't see it happening anywhere with the exception of one-two cases. I would see damage in children watching mom and dad having BFs and GFs one and off and expect children to get attached to all of them. But in normal situation there is no damage at all. It would be great! But IT IS NOT HAPENNING. We can talk here how great it is, but I don't see any evidence of this relationship hapenning.
colleen777
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Ha. My Ex actually linked up with SM at a daycare where my children were going. He left me for her, and actually it was humorous to see her thinking she knew more about raising children than I did. He, after divorcing me, married her, and she was their stepmom. And actually I did see after I got over my anger that she was a pretty good person. Eleven years later she left my ex by moving in with and finally marrying his ex best friend. My Ex was livid, of course. Ha Ha. I could have used that to the hilt.

It was sad to me to watch SM try to have a relationship with our children, and my Ex and now also her Ex also tried to stop that relationship with everything in his being. I was now the one who held all the power. I could have blown her out of the water. And you know what, many people told me here is the biatch who stole your husband pay her back. It was actually one of my daughters' friends who said to me, SM is really trying hard here, give her some slack. That statement made me think.

And the friend was right. It did make sense. There was no reason why I should stand in the way of a relationship simply because my Ex moved on, or was forced to move on.

I have been married to my second husband for 15 years now, a marriage that I think will go on until we die. My EX is now into his third marriage, and now what I say to my girls is this. Your dad's new wife is in fact your stepmother, but it isn't the same this time for you. They are 20 now.

And yes first SM, and her mom and her dad and her sisters and all their children have special times with "my" kids, and none of them wanted to say goodbye. I say you are all more than welcome because that is what my girls want.

Is it hard? You bet you it is hard. It is likely the hardest thing I have ever done in my life. But when you have kids it isn't about you anymore is it.
mom_of_4
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I personally was very disheartened to see that there was no statute for florida that allowed sp continual involvement. That is one of my biggest fears should something happen to my DH. I just hope that I never have to cross that bridge.
imamommy
Original Author
16 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Part of the reason I started this thread is regardless of what the laws are today, laws can be changed.

As finedreams points out, when a subsequent marriage fails, the step parents rarely stay in the child's life. In my opinion, that happens when the bio parents prevent it or if the marriage failed because of problems dealing with the children, then of course a step parent would not continue seeing the children.

The issue isn't about whether it's happened in the past or even if it's happening now. The issue is to get parents thinking about what's best for their children instead of themselves so things can change in the future. Anyone that has been in the family court system for over ten years can see that things have changed tremendously. My first experience with it was in 1991 and since then, it's completely different. New laws, new procedures, etc. Will step parents ever have a legal right? I don't know but it's something to think about. Or forget the right of the step parent and think of the "child's rights". Does a child have the right to continue contact with a step parent they have grown attached to? Unfortunately, the ones with the rights (the parents) may or may not care what the child wants.

Stepparent custody and visitation

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