I don't think it takes getting SD "mentally tested" to figure out that a 15-year-old girl with a mother who's had so much scary creepy drama going on, and who has been at the center of numerous court battles already in her young life, and who has two parents with (ostensibly) very different lifestyles and ideas about even how to have a good time, is going to be confused, with loyalties torn, mixed emotions and sometimes act a little "crazy".

I also don't think it's a "game". How else could it go? What model of harmony, predictability or undivided loyalty does she have?

Only thing I can suggest ---since you can't erase SD's mother from her life--- is to try and be as stable and as loving a family/home as you can be, and hope that it gives her an alternative way of looking at life, besides that it has to be scary drama 24/7, with guns and physical fights all the time, etc.

What are you and DH fighting about all the time, regarding SD in particular?

Okay, I have to ask. Ex lives out of state. How on earth do you know she gave the kid a joint and corona for her bd?

to Kathline - SD and the friend she took with her during visitation both told us. I know the ex smokes pot and I made a half-hearted comment about having SD drug tested when she came back. She confessed to it immediately because she thought we were going to have her drug tested. (My thinking was not that she had smoked pot but that she had been exposed to it - I was slightly taken aback with her confession, not something I expected for a few more years)

SD has a "problem" with being truthful when she wants something. She has lied to us repeatedly about going places and who she is really with. This is 100% the ex coming out in her. She has been on "house arrest" for a month at a time twice in the last 8 months and is currently on her 3rd round of house arrest for telling us she was staying at one girl's home and then going to another girl's home that we have told her repeatedly she is not to hang around (the girl's parents allow her to have parties that involve pot and alcohol and the mother has taken 3 girls that I know of to Planned Parenthood to have them put on birth control without their parents knowledge - it's kind of underhanded to me). She maintained that she was at the girl's house that she said she stayed at right up to my husband calling the girl's mother and asking her if she spent the night there and even when the other parent told us no she was not there she still maintained that she was. DH and I fight mostly about parenting things. He would rather let her do as she pleases than deal with her tantrums when she doesn't get as she wants. I, on the other hand, am tired of her thinking she runs our home and enforce the boundries and limitations that we have set for her. She keeps saying that she wants to make her own decisions but as of yet she has not shown the capability to make a mature, responsible decision. She knows and admits that when she lies she knows I am going to bust her on it but she doesn't care because she wants to do as SHE pleases..........she calls her father because she knows he'll say yes and I'll say no. I even got sucker-punched verbally a few days ago about her grandmother offering to pay for her to go on Spring Break in Florida that I knew nothing about - and she wanted to go with a girl that I personally have busted for shoplifting and have told her I don't want her around because even if SD didn't shoplift, there is always guilt by association.........

"This is 100% the ex coming out in her"

I would be very careful of labeling the child 'just like her mother' even if she is. My SD is 'just like her mom' in a lot of ways, but we try very hard to work on certain behaviors that are troubling & resolve them. We realize that there is genetics and modeling from her mom that are working against our efforts, but if there is any hope of changing a behavior, it will be lost in comments that identify her bahavior with that of her mom. She may end up feeling like she has no control over it, she'll think it's just who she is.

My parents used to tell me that I'm just like my grandma. She could dirty every pot & pan to boil water. She was also a packrat. But, I loved my grandma so when they said that, I took it as a compliment to be like her. I wanted to be like her too. I used to save boxes of junk, mostly papers. When I cooked and pretty much destroyed the kitchen in the process, I thought, 'well, this is how grandma did it and she was a fantastic cook'. I didn't realize until I was much older, that when my parents told me that, they were not complimenting me, they were being critical of the negative things in my grandma.

Telling a child that they are 'just like' someone that YOU see as negative, remember that the child may not see them as negative. Also, if it's seen as an expectation, they may try to live up to it. (being like mom)

Without some professional help, I dont think this girl is going to make it. I think she is playing both parents, dad because he is a pushover, and mom because she gets sympathy for the "terrible way she is treated at dads" . I would be a little careful about just believing what she says goes on at moms. I dont doubt mom uses drugs, etc, but giving a child a joint for her bd sounds a little over the top. Its highly possible that your sd was, and is , using MJ, and said mom gave it to her to deflect anger and cover up the fact that she uses.

If she isnt being honest ABOUT you, she probably isnt being honest TO you. She has some bad anger issues, and if they arent addressed professionally, she is likely to end up pregnant, arrested, or strung out.

I have seen kids like her before. I know this is just my opinion, but the description of her certainly fits the mold. Its everyones problem. Yours. Your husbands. Her mothers. Hers. It will take all of you working together to get to the bottom of it, to make a difference.

Perhaps a good start would be for you to suggest to your husband that he and you take counselling to help you find ways to deal with her behaviour. From there, maybe he will realize he cant just stick his head in the sand anymore.

This has got to be rough on your marriage. If your hubby wont go , go yourself. You are going to need the wisdom of solomon and the strength of hercules to get through this one. NOthing wounds and destroys like an out of control teen.

Good luck

I know her mother has her own issues but this girl sounds like a typical teenager to me. She took 3 girls to PP for bithcontrol; so she did something to help out her friends that their parents werent willing to do. This i think is a GOOD thing, IMO too many parents are in denial about their kids having sex. She lies about where she is going and who she is with; I remember being a teenager and I cant think of one teenager who didn't do this.

She has more emotional issues than the average teenager because of the issue with her mother but all in all I think she sounds pretty normal.

On the other hand, I think that your husband needs to work on understanding how a partnership works. It sounds like he wants to let her get away with anything with out any dicipline which doesnt fly with you. I think that you two need to work out the parenting roles with SD.

While I agree that in principle a visit to PP IS a good thing for teenagers, God help the person who makes medical decisions for MY child without MY permission, unless it's a life or death urgent emergency situation.
And I too remember being a teenager and not lying about where I was or who I was with- and I don't recall any of my friends doing so either. I guess I must have moved in different circles. Anyway, just because many teenagers do it, doesn't make it right. You know the old Mom saying, "If all your friends were jumping over a cliff...."

You know the old Mom saying, "If all your friends were jumping over a cliff...."

My mom used this but said ... if they all jumped off a cliff ... you would have to find new friends so do it before the cliff incident happens. :)

I mentioned to my husband that I believe we need counseling but he's of the mind-set that only crazy people need it, probably going back to his Ex and her committals. I can't make him see the difference in our situation and HER. She's nuts, we just need help in communicating and understanding things. There is a big difference to me.

I don't tell SD she is just like BM, I point out the likeness in the 2 to DH. I try to make him understand that it's pretty much "learned" behavior at this point with SD and WE need to be the ones to change it in her.

As for SD's lying - I have radar, trust me. I know when she is telling the truth and when she is lying. She has littlr "mannerisms" that give her away every time. Example: She spent the night where she wasn't supposed to and got dropped off at our home by the girl's mother. I was home and saw the whole thing. I didn't say a word, I figured I'd give her the opportunity to tell us the truth. I waited 2 days and she actually thought she had gotten away with it. When I told DH I was calling a "family meeting" and what had gone on he didn't believe me. We sat down and I asked her where she had been Friday night, she lied. I said, "ok, let's try again, where were you Friday night?". She lied again. I said "ok, think about this before you answer - where were you Friday night". She lied again. He picks up the phone, I know he doesn't believe me, and calls the mother where she was supposed to be staying. She said no, she wasn't here. I ask her again, KNOWING FULL WELL WHERE SHE WAS, and she lied again. How do you deal with that?

As far as what goes on at Mom's - we KNOW. BM's ex husband has admitted to things, his brother was visting at the time and saw things, and I think my drug-testing comment really threw her for a loop. We explained to her that if it comes down to another battle she will have to go before the judge and tell him the truth. I know she wasn't lying about this, she wasn't giving off any of her ususal "signals".