But don't you have to have a good reason to qualify to carry concealed? They don't give that license to just anyone who asks for it.... do they???

I do not have a CCL, but have thought about it for a long time. Many times while driving to work at 1:30 in the morning to where I worked in a high crime area I would have felt safer if I had a weapon with me. Since I didn't I had to slow down to a turtle's pace when approaching a red light because I didn't want to stop. That in itself caused some concern of causing road rage, but stopping would have been far more dangerous.
Since I now have time to take the course I intend to do so. DH has one and has had for years.

Linda

Don't try bringing them over the border ...

... unless you're prepared to lose them.

I don't know whether they give them back on your departure, or whether they're gone for good.

No one carries up here but police or military or armoured car guys/gals.

ole joyful

I say do what you feel is right YaYa...me...i'd shoot my foot off or get the thing taken away and cause harm to me...i know myself well enough to know I couldn't handle it...

Anyone can toss out a bunch of carefully contrived "do you thinks" as a means of trying to convince you not to carry a gun.

Just as someone else can construct a bunch of "what ifs" that will make it seem as if carrying a gun is a natural thing to do.

Neither is really helpful because in both cases it's loaded questions that focus only on the most negative, or positive, aspects of the situation as a means of "proving" that you either should, or should not, carry a gun.

No two situations will ever be the same, and no one is well served with a laundry list of pro/con scenarios...

For example...

"Could you live with it if your gun was taken from you and then used to kill 22 Nuns, 178 small children, 12 endangered pandas, and a furry puppy? HUH? COULD YOU?"

That's about as useful a secenario as "What if you were carrying a gun and you used it to stop the man who killed 22 Nuns, 178 small children, 12 endangered pandas, and a furry puppy? Could you live with yourself if you didn't carry a gun? HUH? COULD YOU?"

I think it's a bad idea. Many of the police officers, who die in the line of duty, are killed by their own weapon being taken away from them!

I don't think an 'ordinary' citizen can assess a situation quickly enough to know when to use a gun. Why not consider a taser gun instead?

The average Joe Citizen cannot get enough education to warrent safely carrying a loaded gun! Not only is he putting himself in danger, but other innocent people who might be in the area.

Let me stand as saying this is NOT a good idea, Des!

I would like to take a course to become more comfortable in handling a gun. And getting the permit would be something I might think about, but I don't think I need to carry a gun. However I do have a handgun at home and would use it if someone tried to break in.

Go for it YaYa.

DH is licensed to carry and he has needed it in his last job when he manned a gym overnight. He didn't need to shoot anyone but a few times troublemakers changed their minds after seeing that he was carrying a weapon.

I wish guns weren't necessary but until someone stops the criminals and nut-jobs from getting guns, I'm happy to have a few solid-citizens carrying.

Woody and I both have concealed carry permits, got them back in 2000. He carries more than I do, I usually don't if he does, but if I'm out on the highway alone picking up trash, I'll carry my weapon for my own safety. It's kind of freaky to be out there alone and have a car full of men slow down to look at you and see if you're alone or not. I feel much safer knowing that I can protect myself if I need to.

Statiscally, licensed carriers commit very few crimes or use their weapons improperly. It's the unlicensed peeps that I worry about. And you don't need a license to have a gun in your home. I don't see the correlation there, about shooting your own kid. I would never fire a weapon at an unknown/unidentified target.

Depending on what state you're in, the rules are different. In AR, anyone can apply for a CWP, or CCP, whatever you want to call it. You don't have to have a reason for wanting/needing one, but if you fill the criteria and pass the background check, fingerprinting and get OK'd by your local law enforcement official, you'll be approved. And it's not cheap, and you have to renew and pass the shooting test again, every 4 years.

DH has a CC permit and carries 100% of the time. I feel very safe and secure when I'm with him, knowing that he's as prepared as he can be, for whatever may come up.

Personally, I don't have a license altho I'm a good enough marksman and would easily pass the course. I don't know what I'm waiting for.

My former SIL was a police officer and carried 100% of the time when off-duty. She never had to fire it while off-duty, but she did need to display it a couple of times to take control of a situation. She taught me many things, including .... just because a person pulls their weapon in self defense doesn't mean they *HAVE* to shoot it ... sometimes they can take control just by showing they're armed, and that should always be the first choice.

I don't, but my husband does. Even so he is in law enforcement, he has the concealed weapons permit.

So far, I have always felt like I don't want the responsibility of carrying/using a gun, but I do know how to use one.

Moni

"Many of the police officers, who die in the line of duty, are killed by their own weapon being taken away from them!"

Most police officers who are killed in the line of duty are killed by gunfire, but it appears that relatively few are killed by their own guns.

In 2004, of the 54 officers killed by gunfire, only 6 were killed with their own weapons.

In the same year, 82 officers died as the result of accidents of all kinds.

I've found one statistic that says that 25% of officers killed in the line of duty are killed with their own guns, but that's not being supported by anything that I'm finding. The percentage appears to be quite a bit lower.

One needs to remember a few things about the differences between police officers and civilians.

A police officer's job is to approach and apprehend a possibly violent suspect. That puts them, and their gun, into situations where a gun may be taken in a struggle. The point at which the officer physically contacts a suspect is generally seen as the most dangerous point in an officer's interaction with a suspect. That's why, if at all possible, there are always two or more officers involved.

An armed civilian, on the other hand, should NEVER be attempting to apprehend a possibly violent suspect. The gun should be a means of defense and, most of all, EXIT from a situation.

"The average Joe Citizen cannot get enough education to warrent safely carrying a loaded gun! Not only is he putting himself in danger, but other innocent people who might be in the area."

Oh, as for that, police training isn't an entry into carrying a gun safely.

There's a great video on Youtube of the Federal officer who, after telling a classful of students that he is the ONLY one in the room (or school, I can't remember) qualified to even handle a gun, he shoots himself in the leg. Some qualifications.

Good friend of mine is a firearms training officer for Washington Metro police.

Several years ago while demonstrating firearms training to a new academy class he blew the tips off two of his fingers with his service pistol.

Another good friend of mine is US Park Police. There are two holes in the wall of the locker room at his station, put there by a multi-year veteran who was demonstrating the finer points of how NOT to handle a firearm safely.

Washington, DC, has also had a number of accidental shootings of officers by officers, including at least one death, due to poor gun handling.

Over the past several years there have also been a number of incidents where officers have left their services arms in bathrooms, including at least two who did so in public schools.

There are similar incidents all over the country every year.

The fact that someone is a police officer is no guarantee that they're going to handle their service weapon in a safe manner.

I don't have a CCL but I have a hand gun for target shooting at a gun club. I think carrying a gun is only part of the picture.

I think if you are concerned then it would also be important to take a course in personal safety which incorporates different techniques to maximize your position -- by recognizing potential threatening situations, assessing the risk, reading nonverbal clues, communicating effectively to reduce the threat, escape options and personal self defense techniques.

There could be many situations where you can't use the gun and then you might have other options.

I'm a chicken! I have a handgun, but have never used it. I can hardly stand to look at a gun. I know I couldn't handle it.

Gayle

I agree with you, Lindakathy. Linda mscippy, would you stop at the intersection with your gun drawn, perhaps wearing Night vision glasses? How can anyone tell the difference between a bad guy and a good guy in time to kill him?

As I see it, one would have to be prepared, with gun drawn at all times, to feel any sense of protection at all. If everyone is armed, how does it help? Cops train CONSTANTLY to keep their skills sharp. They are trained to look for things. And they still lose their weapons sometimes, and kill or injure the wrong person sometimes. All this Wild West I'll-be-a-hero macho stuff seems ridiculous and dangerous to me.

No, I don't have a ccl.

Kframe, you make excellent points for not allowing civilians to carry! Thank you.

I know quite a few people with CC liscenses. I say go for it Yaya.

I would rather know that law-abiding, conscientious people are carrying guns among the bad guys.

Go for it, Ya Ya. I agree with Lydia, and others.

sherrmann says "Linda mscippy, would you stop at the intersection with your gun drawn, perhaps wearing Night vision glasses? How can anyone tell the difference between a bad guy and a good guy in time to kill him? "

That is such a stupid thing to say that I alsmost hate to reply to it, but I am not going to let it go. Why the he!! do you think I would wear night vision glasses? If I couldn't see at night I wouldn't drive at night. Memphis is a crime ridden city and the intersection I was referring to is one of the worst in the city. There have been many fights and shootings there over the years. A truck driver that worked for the same place I worked was stopped for a red light at that intersection a few years ago. He was in a semi and he was shot in the leg. Another man on his way to work on midnight shift was carjacked at that intersection. The same thing has happened to a lot of other people at that intersection as well as many other intersections and shopping areas. How could I tell a bad guy from a good guy in time to kill him??? I would still approach the intersection carefully as I would any intersection where I have to stop. If someone had a weapon drawn and came toward my car I would assume he wasn't going to ask for directions. If someone tried to grab for the door handle I would have my Lady Wesson on the seat right next to me ready to greet him or her.
If the bad guys didn't carry a weapon there would be less reason for others to carry them, but I don't live on fantasy island. Congratulations to you if you do.

Linda

Did you all hear about the guy who shot a father at a Wendy's down in Florida yesterday or the day before? The father went back into Wendy's to exchange his kid's toy that came with the meal and was shot dead. They first reported that he was a fireman but now an EMT. The guy who shot him then shot and killed himself. If he had turned the gun on other people, someone could've stopped him if they were carrying a gun. I don't like guns at all but in cases like this I would rather someone in the crowd have a gun to stop nutjobs like this from killing more innocent people.

"As I see it, one would have to be prepared, with gun drawn at all times, to feel any sense of protection at all."

With all due respect, that is a patently ridiculous statement.

That's like saying that, to feel safe against possible fires one would have to walk around with a fire extinguisher at port arms all of the time.

Here's a good statistic for people, one that even the people at the Brady Campaign haven't been able to refute.

Dr. Gary Kleck, a criminalologist at the University of Florida, has been studying the ties between legal uses of firearms in preventing crimes for over 20 years now.

His studies consistently indicate that Americans use guns between 1 and 1.5 MILLION times a year to prevent or stop a criminal activity ranging from theft to attempted murder.

When it comes right down to it, the person MOST responsible for your safety is.... YOU.

Not the police, who, as has been ruled by the US Supreme Court, have no duty to protect individual citizens, but only have a duty to society as a whole.

Not the courts, which are so back up as to be barely functioning in many places in the nation.

Not the jails, which do virtually nothing to "rehabilitate" people intent on committing crimes, and which, as part of the justice system are also badly factured.

Only you.

The sad fact is that crime can happen anywhere, at any time, to anyone.

So why not take steps to ensure that you're as well protected as you can be? If that includes carrying a gun, that should be a viable option. If you don't want to carry a gun, that's also your right to make that decision.

I don't know why, but we don't have the same gun problem here in Canada. Not to say that it never happens, but it's by no means common. We just don't have a lot of guns here.

"Kframe, you make excellent points for not allowing civilians to carry! Thank you."

Nice transpositional leap into the land of no logic.

You inferred that police officers are far better trained than civilians who carry guns, so therefore they must be far safer.

Nothing could be farther from the truth.

In 1995, when Virginia was debating expanding the CCW program to a "shall issue" status, Jim and Sarah Brady haunted legislators offices predicting that more legal guns in legal hands would result in a spike in crime, gun deaths, and violence as a whole.

That has, in fact, been their tactic in every state that has either changed to, or adopted, shall issue for CCWs.

In fact, the results have been the exact opposite.

In every state that now issues CCWs (something like 44, at last count), holders of CCWs have proven themselves to be far safer, and far more law abiding, than the general populace as a whole.

In Virginia, fewer than one quarter of one percent of CCW holders have had their permits revoked for incidents involving improper use of firearms.

Most permits that have been revoked have been done for non-criminal reasons - death of the holder, holder moves out of state.

And, of those that have been revoked for criminal activities on part of the holder, virtually all have been revoked for incidents that didn't involve a firearm.

Additionally, the number of incidents involving CCW holders and their firearms that are classified as accidents is far lower than for the general population as a whole.

It's been proven time and time again, in state after state. CCW holders are more law abiding and FAR safer than other elements of the population.

It's a pity that knee jerk fear and dislike of an inanimate object rule people's emotions.

I was listening to a radio talk show a few minutes ago. A group of people are going to ask the mayor to declare Memphis in a state of criminal emergency right away.

Sunday night there were 6 people in one house killed in a shooting. Two of them were children under 12. Three other children are in a hospital ; one in stable condition, one upgraded to critical and one still in life threatening condition. I heard a knife was also involved, but mainly a gun. The children hospitalized are 7yrs, 4yrs and 10 months of age.

There was another home invasion in a suburb of Memphis last week and two others I know of since December. Guns were used.

School shootings in Memphis.1 in October, 2 in February.
There may be others, but I don't recall hearing of any more this year.

Recent robberies in Memphis that include being held at gun point. Jan. 14, 18,28,30.

Rapes in Memphis in 2006...337
Rapes in Memphis in 2007....397...many of these were at gunpoint.
I don't have information about 2008 rapes.

Carjackings? Jan20, 2 on Jan. 22. In one of then the driver was stopped at a stop sign in a quiet neighborhood. He was shot then dumped in a field and left to die. Fortunately he survived. Jan. 25...the driver was able to escape and get into a passing taxi, but was shot by the carjackers and was in critical condition.

If these people didn't have guns there would be no need for people who do not commit crimes to have a gun to protect themselves. I guess someone needs to tell them to make nice and not shoot other people. That will solve that problem.

Linda

Kframe makes excellent points with his statistics to back up what he says. Here in Texas it is legal to carry if you have a CCL permit. I feel much safer having one. It doesn't mean you have to shoot someone even if you draw your weapon. If a bad guy sees you have your weapon, he is more apt to flee or face the concequences. Same way if a guy faces you with a knife. I wouldn't bring a knife to a gun fight. If he has any sense left about him, he will dissolve the violent situation and surrender or flee.

Now for another loaded question. If you have a concealed carry permit, what do you carry? Is it a smaller handgun like a .38 special, a 9mm, or a larger caliber like a .40 or .45 ACP? I have a .38 special Tuarus 85 ultra light frame that fits in my pocket easily and is not heavy. I also have Kimber .45 ACP Ultra Carry that is small, but is definatley heavier. It fits nicely in my back pocket with a a long shirt tail covering it or it fits nicely in my coat pocket. I do like to carry the .45 in most instances only for its shear stopping power. If I actually do have to use it, I don't want the guy getting up.
What do you guys carry and why?

CB

McCloud and I are both going to get our license soon YaYa. He just recently bought a 9mm Glock19 with a 16 shot mag., semi automatic. We can both qualify with it. I'm really impressed with this hand gun. I'm not intimidated by it for some reason. Anyway, to answer your question, yes we will be getting one and soon. I intend on being very familiar with it before we sign up. We have a shooting range we can use anytime.

My DH has a concealed weapons license and I have felt much safer many times knowing that he was carrying a gun.

I appreciate KFrame's education and statistics that back him up as well as what all other CCL carriers have to say.

There are so many random shootings nowadays at malls, schools, etc. I can't help but think that if some law abiding responsible citizen was carrying a gun, these wackos would be shot before they killed all of these other innocent people.

I'm afraid no matter what we say or what statistics we have to back up what we say, the people who disagree, will never agree. Their minds are made up. From some of the comments from non-supporters above, it is obvious they do not want to be educated and it falls on deaf ears.

i live close enough to a metropolitan area that shootings are a way of life in some parts of the city. the news is quite depressing.

crime can happen anywhere, but i believe the guy that shot himself had all intentions of suicide, he was going to do it whether you were there or not. he wasn't out for anyone else's blood, he wanted an end to his own life.

gun violence has hit my life both directly and indirectly -- accidental shootings, suicide - so guns are not something i want a part of. now knives, that's a whole other story

i respect everyone's right to protect themselves in whatever manner they feel works for them. i just have to hope i'm not in the wrong place at the wrong time.

maryanne

In middle age, my dad changed jobs and had to work in a bad part of town. He got a pistol permit and carried that gun in his car every day. He was terrified someone would break in and steal it, and use it to commit other crimes. Dad passed away (at 75) of natural causes. He had instructed my brother to get rid of all his guns. He also like to go hunting, and owned several rifles.

I still stand on my convictions.
If those who want to go out in a blaze of glory but will take as many with them as possible know there are many in the world who just might shoot THEM and they just might NOT die but stand responsible for what they've done......I think you get my drift.

Remember two three decades ago, before the advent of the cell phone, all those random, drive by shootings? We don't see many anymore, do we? And we don't because of the cell phone; the shooters will be caught and identified. Bullies back down real fast if they know the odds aren't with them.

Lori

My sister her DH and thier 2 kids have theirs. Brian and I talked about it tons and will go and take ours when he can get the time off of work. sTacy

This has been a VERY funny thread! LOL! Sorry, ya ya, I am not laughing at you... I am just laughing because -- well, just because this thread strikes me as funny!

YES - I think you should get your permit! DH has had once since they became legal in Oklahoma. He only carries when he travels back/forth to camp, and that's mainly because he wants his gun at camp when he's down there. We keep a loaded gun within reach in bed, and either one of would shoot to kill in a heartbeat if needed. Of course, a robber could probably break in and load half our crap without waking us up, but just in case we did wake up...

:-)

You go, girl! Yes, crime sucks. But that's why honest, innocent people should have the right to carry. You got the right - you go for it!

Pity you don't live in the Northern Virginia/DC Metro area, Des Arc...

I'd take you shooting at the NRA Headquarters Range in Fairfax.

My Nana carries a tiny little pistol in her bra. :)

DH is getting his license since he goes to some pretty remote towns for his job (Pharma rep). I'll sleep better knowing he has it on him when he travels.

Blessings,
Haley

I think if I lived in the States, or at least in certain cities in the States, I would definitely consider owning a handgun. The latest statistics showed that Detroit had 366 homicides in 2006. I grew up in Windsor Ontario, right across the river, which only had 3 homicides in 2006. It is much, much harder to get a gun permit in Canada, which reflects the much, much lower crime rate using firearms. But I can certainly see how someone living in or near a high crime area in the States would feel the need to own one for protection, because you are in a catch-22 situtaion. If you live in a country where guns are so accessible, it makes the risk that you may be confronted by someone with a gun much more likely, thus making it more logical for you to own one as well, for self defense.

Therefore, I would never pass judgement on any American citizen who felt they needed one because their neighbourhood is not as safe as it should be. But I would be much more dubious of any Canadian citizen who wanted to own a handgun, because our crime statistics simply do not warrant it.

I usually just "lurk" HI ALL!!!! GLAD TO BE HERE!
I must comment on this post though, because it can impact SO many people.
I remember many, many years ago me and my ex-HD thinking about doing this and my FIL (at the time) asking after we talked very seriously about this subject looking me in the eye and saying "Could you ALWAYS shoot someone when you felt therented by them, could you each and EVERY time SHOOT.. because you CANNOT hesitate for a second if this is what you choose to do."
Opened my eyes BIG time, thinking about it. I decided against it... doesn't mean that's the same thing others sshould do, just my instinct wsa, I couldn't do it each and EVERY time..
"newbie saying HI!" You all are GERAT!

I hate guns!
Thankfully I live in an area where crime is not an issue.Not to say it never happens,it's just a rare event.
I think I would be a nervous wreck if I lived in an area where I had the need to actually carry a gun around with me at all times.
As others have stated,Canada has a very strict anti gun policy.

Scarier yet.
I see alot of "nobody's gonna mess with me, cuz I got a gun"...don't bet on it.

Guns are just downright scary.
Cops go through various training and psychological tests before becoming police officers. They still miss their target sometimes, they still get shot sometimes. Their guns get stolen sometimes. If this happens to trained police officers, what happens with an ordinary citizen?? Homes get broken into, purses get stolen, cars get stolen.......thieves get guns. There's no easy answer. I don't have a choice (living in Canada) but wouldn't carry a gun if I did (have a choice).

"I see alot of "nobody's gonna mess with me, cuz I got a gun"...don't bet on it."

Funny that you see that.

I see a lot of "I'm responsible for my own safety, no one else, and I'm going to take steps necessary to ensure that I have a chance to defend myself if the need ever arises."

No one is claiming that a concealed handgun will make you invincible. At least no one from the pro-CCW side is claiming that.

Some people seem to be assuming that's what we feel.

One of the most interesting people I have ever met is named Paxton Quigley.

She was rabidly anti-gun until some years ago when a close friend of hers was raped and badly beaten.

Her conversion from pacifism to empowerment makes for interesting reading.

Here is a link that might be useful: Paxton Quigley

I've seen the paxton quigley video.
I need to see it again.

So does everyone on this post.

Lori

I had never ever heard of Paxton Quigley until I opened this thread. What an amazing story. Thanks for sharing that link; she's an amazing woman.

As to the original post, I say GO FOR IT. I agree that it's time that more citizens were legally armed. Municipalities are slicing and dicing budgets and it seems like police officers are the easy budget cut. It's nuts.

And something else. Virginia was in the news last year due to that horrific school shooting at Va Tech, but there was another school in Virginia where a shooter *tried* to end many lives.

It was Virginia's Appalachian Law School (Jan 2003) when a disgruntled student allegedly shot and killed three people. Two students ran to their vehicles and got their weapons and the attacker was quickly subdued.

We've all been taught for so long that we should "Give the criminal whatever he wants" and I think that's a flawed ideology.

If more of the "good people" had weapons, I think there would be less home invasions and less crime.

Rose

As I said earlier, if you come over the border - leave your handgun at home.

If the customs people are aware of it, they'll seize it.

I'm not sure whether you may get it back on your return, or whether it may be gone for good.

In addition: if they miss it, and if by (quite likely slim) chance the police here should become aware of it, they'll confiscate it, you'll get a major fine ...

... and you may cool your heels in a Canadian jail for a while. This last may be somewhat improbable, but I think that it's a distinct possibility.

So - if you're coming over the border, my serious advice is to leave your handguns at home.

ole joyful

DH is licensed and carries on his body occasionally when the situation warrants, but he doesn't carry as a habit. He does however always have a gun in his car at all times.

I went through the course with him and could carry if I applied for the permit but never went through with it because I don't really want to carry. Not that I'm not capable or confident in my abilities, I just don't want to be bothered strapping on a gun every day because I don't feel I'm in danger that often. If that situation changed I would get my permit in a heartbeat.

I don't think it's any secret to not carry over the border. You're not even supposed to carry into a state that doesn't have a concealed carry law so over the border is a no-brainer. The training necessary to obtain a CC makes this very clear.

Joyful,

No, you won't get your gun back.

And chances are you'll spend time in a Canadian jail for attempting to import a firearm.

Even getting across the border with rifles and shotguns for hunting has gotten to be VERY involved.

Joyful I admit I don't know what the gun laws are in Canada. Do Canadian citizens have the RIGHT to bear arms? I agree it would be foolish to try to take your weapon across the border. I am closer to the Mexican border rather than Canada. I worry about getting myself back into the US rather than personal property without being hussled for bribes for something or another. I went across to a small border town a few years ago and I was never more nervous and scared. It is a weird feeling knowing you are on foreign soil and at their mercy if they want to harrass you for whatever they want. I am talking about the Federales. I was never more relieved than to cross the river and be back in the U.S. I still appreciate the right granted to us by the second amendment to keep and bear arms. I also appreciate the priviledge granted by our great state of Texas to apply for and obtain a concealed carry weapons permit. It does make me feel safer knowing I have the tools at my side to be on equal footing with some scumbag if the occasion comes up. I hope that day never comes but the law has afforded me some options other than looking like a cat trying to crap a peach seed.

Some people are collectors of handguns. They've had to have had them registered for well over 50 years. There are strict rules as to the security with which they are stored.

If they want to take it/them to a shooting range, they need to get a permit to do so.

There's been some controversy lately, because some such people have had their guns/collection stolen, and some of those guns were used by people who had bought them in the black market in murdering people. They say that when a gun has been used in one rather high rpfile, or several less so, murders, its price on the black market goes down.

A few years ago they started a registry program for long guns, and many fought it. Others said that it seemed strange that people had no problem with registering cars, but resisted registering guns.

It cost huge amounts of money - over a billion, some said closer to two billion - and there was a lot of controversy over that.

Some of us said that we didn't see why that should cost an arm and a leg, for they'd had a registry of all of the handguns for over 50 years, so it shouldn't be too hard to set up a parallel program to register the long guns.

A recently elected government dislikes that registry and is talking about scrapping it.

A billion (or maybe closer to two) ... down a rathole.

ole joyful

Id like to have one but not sure I trust myself.Id be the one to shoot my own foot.I did just buy a flash light that is also a stun gun.On gadgetuniverse.com

I've been thinking of getting my license to carry also. I would definitely shoot to kill- no problem. If it's me or you.... it's not gonna be me! I was mugged in 1985 as I got out of my car at work (I worked in a hospital then). He rushed at me, shoved me against some cars and threw me on the ground breaking my ribs in the process. Horrible experience. Left me vulnerable and afraid. Now, many years later, I would not have allowed him to do this. I'd take my chances with a weapon. There are some circumstances you probably couldn't do anything about but I'm sure some of these aggressors don't count of their victims fighting back.