Miele W48xx Onboard water heater...Definitive Answer
larsi_gw
13 years ago
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gates1
13 years agolivebetter
13 years agoRelated Discussions
Miele dishwasher water source - hot or cold?
Comments (34)I use a hot/cold mixing valve on my Miele Optima to feed the unit temperate water that is probably around the crystal cycle preference temperature value (a cycle I never run because washing by hand with an RO water rinse leaves wine and beer glasses crystal clear and totally free of rinse aid residue). I expect my Miele heats the water it gets a bit for each regular turbo pot/pan whatever cycle. The claim that feeding the unit cold water is more energy efficient (green) than feeding it hot water can only be true if the energy one uses to heat house water is more expensive per delivered BTU (has to include furnace or gas heater efficiency) than the electricity the unit would use to heat the water instead. Electricity is the more expensive approach in NH, and I suspect that is true many places in the USA. If this were also true in Germany, then the high-end solution would be to plumb the unit for both hot and cold feeds (like even the most low-end clothes washing machine manages to do) and let the dishwasher control the temperature for the cycle without any heating at all. I understand the confusion about why hot water is less "gentle" on crystal. If truly crystal (fused quartz), I would expect the glassware to be highly resistant to detergent effects. (I doubt that there is much fused quartz glassware available.) If borosilicate glass (like original Pyrex), or normal lime glass, then hot detergents might be fairly accused of leaching thereby causing fogging of the glass surface. My previous American style hot washing dishwasher could fog standard glassware after enough washings using then Cascade. kas...See MoreReal Capacity - 6 kg 12xx Miele vs. Big FLers
Comments (7)I have the Miele 1986 which is the 6K model version before the W12xx. It was installed in Jan 2003. I fill it up--it washes and rinses and everything comes out clean...so you can pack it to the gills and things are OK. It holds slightly more than my previous KitchenAid Super Capacity Plus TL. I wash queen size comforters in it with no problem(this depends on how thick or thin your comforter is). I doubt you can wash 20 pairs of jeans at one time but in my machine the regular cycle takes 41 minutes and the machine will reduce the time if the load is small so cycle time is not an issue for me. The machine also handles a 1 item load very well. I am very happy with the build of the machine although it is heavy. It took 4 guys to mount it on the pedestal. Solid sides, sturdy electric locked door. The 220V is great as it can heat the water very hot...very fast if needed. I just had my electric panel replaced last week,...the electrician glanced at the washer since it was at the end of a thick power cord and he mentioned that items that use 220 or 240 volts tend to last longer than those using 110V. First time I've heard of that. I hope others can comment about the size comparison with the super-sized machines. You can load the 6k machine full and expect clean clothes....See MoreMiele W4800 new user experience
Comments (150)I have Miele appliances in my home and like them. I bought my first Miele appliance, a DW and then a washer before I ever knew this forum existed. I never even heard about Miele from anyone...so I am not interested in snob appeal or prestige. I bought my stuff because it was advertised to last a long time and so far having Miele for 12 years things having been going along with out problems. The heater issue: If anyone from Germany walked down a supermarket isle, or watched any TV shows with advertisements they would quickly realize that folks in the U.S.A are in love with chlorine Bleach. It is everywhere, and most of us use it. So this machine was made with a bleach dispenser - for us. If you use bleach there is no need for high temps. The first thing people in the USA balk at with older Miele washers is the fact that they use 220V. Every time my neighbors look at the washer they go into a snit and say..well it needs 220V - I'm not doing that. So by adding the bleach feature which the general population LOVES, it enabled them to use 120V, and allow folks to bleach the death out of everything...getting things clean, white and sanitized. Voltage obstacle removed. My older unit will heat the water to boiling temps...but I rarely need it. Everything even whites come out just fine at a temp of 120F using a cycle that lasts 48 minutes. Sometimes I increase the temp to 140F but this is rare and almost never use a boiling temp. The advantage of 220V is that the washer can heat this hot very very fast if you need it...but with chlorine bleach you won't. So I think for the general population the lack of heat on the normal cycle(which is also not present on some other machines sold in the U.S.A) will not be a deal breaker for them. I am interested in having appliances that will last more than the current 6 or 7 year life expectancy we have now, and I expect to fix my units when they need servicing rather than immediately thinking about replacing them. Replacing is the first thing we think of isn't it? --"Well it's broken, I need a new one" Then we have fun and make ourselves feel good buying something new. It will be interesting to see how long these new super-sized units last....See MoreNewer Miele's not perfoming?
Comments (28)Greetings everyone, After having done a few days of research, I finally decided today on the Miele W1918. I called every dealer in town, and finally found one. Apparently they had one stashed away in a warehouse. I'll see it first hand next week but have already made a deposit. In the interest of confirming my decision, I'd like to offer my rationale for buying it. Hopefully I haven't made too many mistakes in my reasoning, but if I have I would certainly appreciate clarification. Many members here seem to know a lot about Miele washers and washers generally. Our motivation for buying this washer stems from the fact we're about to have a baby in the next few weeks and that we've decided on using cloth diapers. We were told at the time of purchasing the diapers that FL were fine but that it was preferable to have extra amounts of water compared to the normal amount. After doing some Internet research on diaper cleaning, some people also recommended prewashes and extra rinses. We were further advised to make sure the first wash was with cold water and the second wash was with hot water. Therefore, our total needs boiled down to the following: prewash with cold water; normal wash with hot water; "extra rinse"; and "water plus." Since our washer is going to be located two floors down in the basement, we wanted a washing machine that could be programmed to do all of these things. Of the new washers on the market, the only FL I've found with the function "water plus" is the LG Tromm (both the steam and non-steam version). It also has "extra rinse" and "prewash." I'm not certain if the temperature of the prewash for the LG is the same as the normal wash. Over the course of my research I had heard that Miele used to have the option of "water plus" (mentioned on this message board I believe) so I headed down to the Miele showroom to ask some questions. None of the new models had this option, nor had the Miele consultant heard of it (I now find this unusual). The consultant also told us that Miele by default has two rinses and that a third rinse can be added. We were looking at the W4800 at this point. I was told by another Miele spokesperson/technician by phone that the Miele prewash is always in cold water. One of the most useful research tools I found was the operation manuals for the various machines. At some point, I came across the Miele W1918 operation manual. This is when I discovered previous Miele's had the "water plus" option. I also discovered that this Miele had not two but four rinse cycles for cotton loads. It also seemed to me that it had better controls for regulating temperatures for each cycle. Through another useful thread on this message board, I consulted the Canadian version of the Miele W1918 operation manual. This manual indicated a number of other programs that could be added to some of the cycles-- such as "high water level" for cotton rinses and "5th rinse for Cotton Cycle". Therefore, when comparing the newer Miele (4800) to the older miele (W1918), it seemed the older one had more features that suited our needs (of course, it's a smaller machine, but this doesn't matter to us much). This comparison also applies to the same sized W1113 I believe. Bottom line: W1918: prewash (not sure if temp can be set), wash (possible max temp of 95C/203F), 5 possible rinse cycles, "high water level" programming, and "water plus" option. Not sure what the difference is between "high water level" and "water plus". I think one sets the Cotton cycle at a higher water level by default. It also has a max spin of 1600 rpm. Uses 220V (we have a dryer plug but no dryer, so no prob). W1113: prewash (not sure if temp can be set), wash ( not sure about max temp), 3 possible rinse cycles, no water level control, not sure about rpm but the W4800 goes to 1300pm. Uses 110V. Therefore, all things considered, the W1918 seems to me a better machine at the level of programming. It seems less energy efficient, but I really didn't want to take a risk with getting a machine that can't properly clean these diapers. Once we've made it through this phase, we can become more energy efficient with our normal washes. I paid 2300$ CDN (tax incl) for it, and even though it's an older model, I think it's worth it, especially if it lasts 20 or so years (please note, prices up here are much higher than in the states--same model is being sold online in US for 1600$ or so). I also prefer the Miele over the LG because they're built to last. In terms of practical info I'd like to know (other than if my assessment is more or less correct): do most FL have two rinse cycles by default? will the Miele prewash be with cold water (can it be modified)? are five cycles excessive? what other models can adjust water levels or have the water plus option? what other good or bad things does the W1918 have in stock? 1600rpm? What other models come close? Did I make the right decision or am I paying too much? Well that sums it up. Thanks. Hope this also adds some food for thought in comparing the new Miele with the old....See Morelarsi_gw
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