Oh dear. There are similarities to a situation I am in right now. I don't have advice (I keep coming here for that), but I know you will get lots of good feedback here. That's been my experience.

Is there a Senior Center near you where a) your could get some advice now, and b) if he comes to you, your FIL could participate in some programs to give him and you more 'space'?

Are any other family members involved/concerned? (Possible back-ups?)

Have you considered ECHO housing (a backyard elder cottage)?

The link below has information on this option. In any case, it's a good website for elder card.

Here is a link that might be useful: Caring.com ECHO housing

My question is....how do you make that final decision that will alter your life from here on in?

Don't you mean alter FIL's life? After all, this arrangement would last only for his life span...or when he might need full time nursing care.

IF he came to live with you, and had an easy chair and his own TV in his room...chances are he would seek private time as much as you & DH would.

Look into any senior daytime facilities that DH could take him to, where he could make friends his own age and do more than just sit around. Not every day, but maybe 1 day a week, or more if FIL wants.

You said he was not a difficult person. So, what are the stresses you're looking for?

We too are facing the possibility of my DH father coming to live in our small home (with no backyard to speak of). He is 85 and very active. He walks every morning and goes out and dances at least three times a week but he is having problems with his eyes. He's had a couple surgeries and an infection that has been going on for months now.

We're at the time in our life where we're working on getting our last child out the door. He's 21 but loves living at home. Even though he has a good job/career, So. Calif. is a tough place to find something affordable.

Anyhow, the sad thing about our situation is that my FIL has one son (50yrs old) living next door to him and a son and daughter (48 and 55) living two blocks away. None of them will offer to help or take DFIL in. We live 600 miles away but are the only responsible and job holding members of the family.

I will be very interested in what everyone has to say.

Jodi-

Check with your local Senior Citizen Club for infomation. Do you have a Council on Aging usually is County related. Could you find a place in FL he can go to at least for awhile and the people will contact you/keep you informed about him.

Why do you say he won't consider an appropriate elder facility? Just because he's being selfish, doesn't necessarily mean you need to turn your life upside down for him.

I'm not being cruel here. For the last 12 years of my mother's life, I was her main caregiver, BUT she was in a senior citizens apt. where they looked after their residents. Not assisted living, but there was some support system, a lot of activities, and many caring people. And, since it was in the town mom and lived all her married life, she had lots of friends there. She stopped driving, so I was responsible for her shopping, dr's visits, minor repairs/cleaning of her apt. Eventually, Mom needed more help that I was able to give--and we hired a home health aide to come in a few times a week to help with some of the cleaning, mom's personal care, health issues, etc.

I just don't think you should limit yourselves to one solution. Your FIL might enjoy living among other seniors his age--if you could convince him to try it. No matter what change is proposed to most folks of that age, they resist mightily. They just don't like change--it scares them. Alternatively, why not have a home health aid in--someone who can help him around the house, and set up his medications properly. We found those M-T-W-R-F-S-S boxes a great help. I'd fill mom's pill boxes once a week, and it helped her remember what she needed to take and when. If you hire a home health aid, there will be a nurse who is your father's case manager who will evaluate what services he may need and get him all set up. If he has health issues, some of the cost may be covered by his insurance, even. but even if it isn't, we found that the home health aids were very inexpensive, considering what they did for mom, and were well worth the extra $40-70/week.

another option might be to find a companion to come in and live with him. Someone trustworthy who would look out for him in return for a place to live.

And honestly? this may sound selfish--it isn't really--I don't think one should take in a parent unless it's an absolute last resort, and there are no other options. It's just too hard on everyone. No one is happy, and I don't really believe losing their independence is good for our older relatives. The goal, as I see it, should be in finding ways to allow them to remain safely and healthily on their own just as long as they possibly can.

One point that always needs to be remembered when discussing the care of elder relatives. Today is probably as good as it's ever going to be. You believe you can handle his condition as it is now--but are you prepared for the time when he needs more and more help? Are you going to be able to handle all the medical things you're going to have to do for him? treating infections, managing bedsores, etc, etc, etc.

If you do decide to bring him to your home, make sure you investigate all the changes that will have to be made in his insurance, so he doesn't lose coverage (for example, drug insurance is managed by each individual state--you're going to have to figure how the change can be done seamlessly, so he doesn't run the risk of not being able to get/afford any of his medications.

good luck.

wow tough.....The kids dad has his mom living with them now and she is not got alzhemiers but something....and she hurts the kids feelings abunch....I am going to check out this echo living that someone posted above...their dad would never put in in assisted living etc but as a last choice...I feel sorry for the new stepmom to the kids as she focus's her "meanness" to Sydney Carly and me and I am not even there LOL...I pray we never have to go thru this....no answers just hugs and prayers and patience with what ever you choice....STacy

I like azzalea's post. Maybe he's happy where he is and wouldn't think of moving in with you. I also agree he needs someone to supervise his meds, maybe do a little cleaning/cooking and run errands if he can't drive. I'd be inclined to try that first and see how it goes.

I know you worry about him and want him safe but he may relish his independence more than you know. I'm pretty sure I would.

It almost sounds like you are describing my situation, but I am a woman, it might be different for a man. I will be 80 in March and I am living with my daughter and her husband. I have my own room with a lift recliner, my bookcase filled with books and my computer, desk and chair, plus of course my single bed and a small chest and large chest. I have a closet and full bathroom just outside my room. I spend most of my day in my room playing on the computer or reading. I do toddle out to load and unload the dishwasher and sometimes do a bit of cooking, although my son-in-law is the main cook. The only television I watch besides a few football/basketball games, is Wheel of Fortune and Jeopardy. The television is in the family room and we watch those two shows during dinner. So far, I have all my faculties, so time will tell how it goes in the future.

Before I moved in they built a ramp onto their deck and put a rail on each side of the door into the family room where there is one step down. They made the bathroom more elderly friendly with some grab bars, tub rail, etc. and replaced the glass type covering across the tub with a shower curtain. I gave up driving when I moved here.

He is in FL, you are in NY. He has made some medication errors. I would think your present situation must be very stressful with the distance.

I like Azzalea's post too. I very much agree with this:And honestly? this may sound selfish--it isn't really--I don't think one should take in a parent unless it's an absolute last resort, and there are no other options. It's just too hard on everyone. No one is happy, and I don't really believe losing their independence is good for our older relatives. The goal, as I see it, should be in finding ways to allow them to remain safely and healthily on their own just as long as they possibly can.

I think first you should try to keep him in his home either by hiring a home nurse/health aide (some may not be able to give meds) or as Azzalea suggested someone to share the home in exchange for caregiving/housework/ getting him to the doctor/ect. OR.. look into a retirement village (with apartments, patio homes, etc.) of some sort. They usually have nurses that visit as needed.

Once he needs more care, other arrangements will have to be made. Take one step at a time. Good luck.

Is he fairly mobile? Does he drive?

Apart from the mixing up of the meds ... is his mental capability reasonably good?

Does it appear that some further deterioration may be imminent?

How amenable is he to co-operating in searching for alternative means of helping him cope with daily needs?

Does he know of some support capabilities that may be available to him?

What kind of senior support and care agencies have you been in contact with near his area?

How desirous is he of continuing in his present circumstance?

Is he capable of paying for some extended support and care which may be available, if that is required?

I assume that, lacking current income on your husband's part, it might be nigh impossible for you to be of much help in providing extra care in his present circumstance.

Perhaps if you look around, there may be some services available which will help to keep him better cared for, in his present lifestyle.

I do not envy you your dilemma.

Stepmother suffered cancer for a time, but Dad pretty well looked after her, with some back-up from brother when (seldom) necessary.

Though Dad was deteriorating some (but able to drive nearly 2,000 miles to visit friends, alone, in three days) brother didn't feel that he was in bad shape, living in a seniors' apt., where he could move to a room where he went to dining room, later.

After visiting a friend, en route to have lunch with another ... he drove out in front of a large truck and we are fairly sure that he suffered pretty well instant death.

Next day, on visiting the trucking co., I found that the driver was off work, they called and I talked to him, saying that I was sure that my brother and sister would join me in expressing our regret that he had this load of pain to carry as a result of this experience related to our father. He thanked me for calling - several times.

When old step-uncle, mid-80s, with no offspring, having had three hip replacements and suffering substantial resulting pain, but insisting on keeping beef cattle in the barn, had a wife in the house, if he did not return from choring within a reasonable time, measures would start.

But on her death, with no one in the house, and refusing to wear one of those emergency calling buttons, his safety was of some concern to a number of us who cared about him, as we feared that he might fall into a snowbank and be unableto extricate himself. So I, being reasonably free, spent a couple of months with him, including assisting with the chores, until the cattle went on grass.

I did not get involved with the situation much in the next fall, as he had had the summer to make arrangments. In the second winter, when he suffered a spell, he called some relatives, they took him to the hospital and he died there a few days later.

The purchaser of the farm didn't need the house, offered it to me, and I'm now sitting in what was their dining room.

Good wishes to you and yours as you work your way through this situation.

Investigate various channels ... sometimes, after some searching, we find a situation which turns out to be ideal. But of which we'd had no inkling, at the start.

ole joyful

It will be very difficult. My friends mother moved in with her when she was 93. She is now going on 101. My friend and her husband never complain. They are both wonderful. However, they haven't been able to take joint vacations in years. They go away, but separately. They have a daycare lady come six days a week which allows a little freedom but it's a big commitment. Ideally, you could talk him into assisted living near you. Long distance is very difficult. My FIL lived 7 hours from us in an assisted living facility and even though he got good care, it was difficult being so far away. If he were to be nearby, you could have him over for dinner, take him to the theater, etc. With men it is even more difficult because they don't reach out to other men the way women do with other women...most men anyway. Good Luck.

We moved over 500 miles away from home due to DH job. We had to leave his parents. They have lived in their own home for well over 50 years. The first year we were here Dad fell and broke his hip before Christmas. We went up at Christmas because we had no other time coming and Mom had persuaded the Dr. at the rehabilatation center to let him come home for Christmas -because we would be home-. We went to the R C and and to our eyes he was not ready to come home. they released him anyway. We had set up a visiting nurse to come and a therapist. The therapist told us from day one that he should not have been allowed to come home. The visiting nurse had Mom in tears because Mom never knew that Tylenol PM had a sleep aid in it and she just thought that it was Tylenol for night time use. Mom has meds in the house that are outdated by YEARS. V N told her they could be harmful. mom didn't believe her. She takes all medications out of the bottles and puts it in a large round medicine dispenser that the top rotates on. But the meds are NEVER emptied out of it, you just add more when it is low... Dad takes more meds than we think he should. I am a whole lot younger than them and I CAN't remember if I took my meds !

Dad would not eat right so the new prescribed meds were often either not enough or too much. So Dr. Mom decides to self medicate him....The nurses set up a system that was hooked through the phone line that took his pulse and weight and oxygen level and some other things and the data was electronically sent to the county nurses. Mom had such a hard time getting him on the scale and was so stressed about getting up in time every morning to do this at the 'correct ' time that we all made the decision to put him back in the rehabilatation place he had been discharged from ' for the holidays'. Dad agreed that he was too much for Mom to handle on her own and we had to have him admitted to a care facility before we left to come back home because the insurance would not allow him to be put in the rehabilitation again because he had not been re-injured.He was in the facility nearest their house because Mom needed to drive to see him every day. and she's not supposed to drive. She is blind in one eye and can't see well out of the other one.So instead of going and coming back home, she would leave after breakfast every morning and drive there and eat lunch and dinner with him and leave before it got dark because she can't see in the dark. While he was in there she got pulled over by the police because she got confused by an officer directing traffic by the elementary school....

~SORRY SO LONG~~~ But, it is now 4 years later and they still believe they need no help. We have offered to move them in here with us or to help them sell and purchase a smaller house near us. They refuse. ( Well, Mom refuses, Dad was interested) They don't want or need to go to an assisted living facility. They don't need help with cleaning or laundry or ANYTHING.
Dad is not supposed to be driving, he is 87 , is on oxygen and can't control his feet, he uses a walker to walk/shuffle.It takes him forever to get to the car . They have no garage. A bit ago they got in the car to go out to eat and Dad went to back it out of the parking space and his feet got tangled up and he ended up spinning the car out and up over the curb and into the front yard , just missing the electric pole in the yard. Mom is 88 and blind in one eye and CANNOT drive because she can't see well out of the other. She is to have cataract surgery this Monday and she calls DD who lives closeby and admits to her that she doesn't know how she will get home from the hospital because SHE is the one who helps Dad into the house. Dad is going to drop her off at the hospital she said. DD asked her how Dad was going to get back in the house without Mom's help and Mom didn't have an answer. ( DD is a single divorced mom who can't get Mom to the hospital and son to school at same time. Especially since Mom just called her today to tell her they may need help - that they think because they are calling for snow, Dad might have some difficulty.)
We have a huge house here. We offered them the master bedroom, and attached bath and an additional bedroom next to the master they could use as a living room. They would be by themselves at one end of the house and only have to 'socialize' for meals. Nope they don't need help. They have friends who live near them. We have never seen any of these friends call or come by or ask if they need help when we go up. AND we do not tell them when we are coming so they cannot be telling all these friends that they will be having company so do not call....

sorry sorry sorry to hijack your thread, but it is so hard to get help for people who do not think they need it.

I know.
Try . Try . Try. That is all you can do.

Moving someone in is very stressful to a family, totally changes the dynamic. As assisted living facility might be the best, esp. if he's messing up with meds. You can try the ECHO somone suggested. If he MUST move in... there are services that will come pick him up in the mornings, take him to movies, shows, etc... (for socializing) and then brings him home late afternoon. This way, he's out and about and when he gets back, it's a short period of time he's actually there. You hate to say it, but, it's kind of a babysitting service for adults. Some people love it. Esp. if they are used to being active. I know it's hard but you and your husband will have to sit and talk this over as it CAN be life altering for everyone involved... Good luck. Difficult subject, isn't it??

I have a relative who has her FIL living with them. When they go on vacation, they check FL into an Assisted Living facility for what they call "respite care". It's really just another name for a temporary stay, kind of a hotel arrangement with supervised care. He enjoys the change.

It's a way not to feel "stuck".

Sorry everyone...this is the first chance I have had to get back on the computer. I can't believe how many wonderful suggestions you have all given me!
First of all, DFIL would probably love to live with us. There was a short time ago that we had proposed to him about moving with us to a new home in another state, and he loved the idea. That has changed now, and we were not sure that he could live with us here because the house is so small. Anyway, at least we know that he would probably like to live with us.
Secondly, (in response to joyfulguy), he does have his faculties about him. He cooks, drives, shops, etc., BUT
he is getting weaker each time we see him. He has also had different things happening which require new medications and he is getting "sick" of going to doctors. Since we are the only ones to care for him, my husband feels terrible about him being so far away with no one around. Most of his friends have passed away. He would never consider moving from his condo to any kind of AL home. That is why we thought that the best thing would be to bring him here.
I do have the concern that if my DH gets another job, he would be alone for most of the day.
The ideas given about different services that could either have someone come here or pick him up and take him for a few hours were very interesting and worth looking into.
I actually feel badly for my husband because he will be the one to run him to the doctors, make meals, etc. since I will be at work.
BTW, my DFIL's last phone call to us indicated that he was having trouble swallowing, but since he was so sick of going to the doctor's he was not going to do anything about it. Things like this is what makes my DH worry so much.

It sounds like your DFIL has very poor health. Think of the comfort, peace, and happiness you can add to what very well may be his last few years. A loving home, a comfortable corner of his own, and two people that care under the same roof.

It sounds like a win-win situation for everyone. I personally wouldn't feel bad about my husband actively helping care for his parent in regards to the doctors' visits, meals, etc. It can be a bonding time for them and besides, that's what we "kids" do...return the caring favors to our parents.

You can still schedule time for you and DH to go places alone, and encourage DFIL to be as interested in his own pursuits as much as he can be.

Im so sorry this is happening for you and your DH. My friend has her mother living with her and the stress is killing her and her husbands realationship. Her mother is physically fine but her mind is not good at all. My mother lives around the corner from me and her mind is fine, she has a few physical problems but nothing that is too concerning. But she is afraid and will not admit it and does not take care of anything.I feel she may be depressed but that only angers her when the subject is broached. She has decided to let me do it all. And I can no longer take the stress of it. She came to stay with us for 3 weeks after her last surgery and I discovered how really capable she is, and when she got home she went back to her old ways of not caring for herself,or her surroundings. We do have a nurse come in and an aide 3 times a week and she does everything they tell her. At this point I think it is a manipulation on her part and Im choosing to ignore it. Enough about me. My concern for you is that he is too far away for you to make a sound judgment call. Could he come and stay with you for 2 weeks and see how he functions physically and mentally? How are his activities of daily living? Keep a little journal and have someone come in and assist you for a few weeks, then review where he is at. It is so hard to know what is really going on if you havent spenT daily time with them. Long distance relationships can be so tough, because you can only visualize what must be going on. I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers as you make your toughest decision ever.

Urge your FIL to see his MD. Difficulty swallowing can be a symptom of cancer of the esophagus.

My mother lived with us for over 6 years before she got to the point where she needed more care than we could give her. Here's the simple truth: it will be the best thing you've ever done and it will be the worst thing you've ever done. It is both a win-win and and lose-lose. You'll feel good that you've done this thing for him but it will seriously effect your life on all levels, every day. He will know that you love him and have given him a safe place, but at the same time he'll resent giving up his freedom and he will resent you for it. Everyone will have days when they are angry and frustrated. Those will be balanced by moments of pure joy and grace. It will never be easy, but it will be a good thing.

Your FIL has gone through some changes that you and his son can't anticipate. Things he hasn't let you see in short visits. Those will be hard for his son to face ("Dad was never like this before...") and even harder for the father to face. Forgetfulness, slow verbal responses, diminished physical capabilities, fear and the repetition of stories are all very common past the age of 80. One of the hardest things with my mother was the fear. She had always been strong, but at some point became fearful of everything; even loud noises and some tv shows affected her. It doesn't sound like a big deal but for many elders it can be debilitating. Dependence on drugs and alcohol are also more common than we want to think among elders. Even if those things weren't part of his life before, they may be now. You won't necessarily know that until he's with you. Just be prepared for it.

He'll miss his friends, his routine and all the things that made him feel happy and comfortable in his old place. You'll miss your freedom, your privacy and your spontaneity - everything has to be planned just like having a two year old in the house. It doesn't matter how independent he is right now, within a couple years that will change drastically.

It's hard but as the DIL it will be mostly your responsibility to keep peace between the father and son. You are the one who will have to be understanding of both sides and both feelings.

Be sure you plan in time for you and your husband to vent to each other honestly about his father. My DH and I started taking a walk every night after dinner just to get out of the house together and it gave us a great opportunity to talk about my mother and smile about things that had made us crazy earlier in the day. By the time we returned home we were OK and ready for a nice evening with Mom.

The best thing you'll ever do and the worst.
If you have specific questions or want to chat about this, don't hesitate to email me.

Kate (solstice98@att.net)

OK...here's the update. We asked FIL on Sunday if he would like to come and live with us. His initial reaction was excitement, but then he was feeling badly because he knows we live in a small home and he thought he would be putting us out. We convinced him that this was not the case, and we asked him to think about it for a few days.
So, we will know what's going on soon.
Thank you all for your quick and wonderful responses.
This forum is truly a lifeline for me. I learn so many things here and I never feel alone.

I agree with Kate (solstice). I've been there and done that.

I hope this works out for you. I'm at the front end of this with my mother. I would like to suggest that he allow you to contact his doctor or is it doctors... sometimes there are misunderstandings about medication and what they are to take, when, etc. One of my friend's mother was on so much medication from several doctors that when they took in all of the various bottles for evaluation - her primary md was amazed and appalled! By changing &/or eliminating medications, her life was dramatically improved. I think this is more likely in a larger town - not one where you pretty much deal with one druggist or facility.