Carrie in Angelo,
I just sprayed some roundup around some new plantings in my yard. The grass is dying just fine. As long as it stays warm like this, I suspect you will be quite successful. You probably will want to get right after it, though.
Have fun!
J.D.

There have been repeated posts on these boards about Roundup having very limited effect long term on common bermuda especially if you are carving a bed out of the middle of a bermuda lawn. I would start by digging out as much of the bermuda as possible and placing a deep edging between the bed and the remainder of the lawn. I would deeply till the area and pull out as many bermuda roots as possible. I would then place heavy black plastic over the area and hold it down with blocks or stones. This procedure is a lot more work but it is the way to go to not have bermuda growing up in your flower bed.

TXred
I don't think it is possible to do too much to get rid of bermuda in a bed planning. That stuff is resilient and tough.

So far,,,,,,,,,, it has worked well for me. I did, however, spray my planned bed areas 3 times while waiting 2 weeks to plant this past summer. Still, I have pulled a few sprigs coming up from roots - but VERY few.

J.D.

We covered our lawn in the backyard with a lasagna bed, no Roundup. We used cardboard and newspapers. This spring I had a few places where the grass came up through the seams so we used Roundup and put more papers in those areas and mulched good. If a stray comes ups, it is easy to pull it out.

Whatever you do, don't plow it...that will spread the bermuda. Did that in one bed and I'm still fitting it!

We did the same to our front lawn in Fall 2004. Covered it with cardboard/newspapers then whatever we had that would compost and covered it with grass clippings (no money for mulch then).

I hear you on the bad neighbors. We put up a 6' chainlink fence on our northside because that neighbor was dealing drugs with lots of young males hanging around (overnight!) and they were driving through our yard, plus their 3 kids were awful, stomping my plants, shooting the birds out of our trees (screaming at my husband when he told them it was against the law), putting crap in my compost bins (broken glass, computer cords, toys, etc.), and trying to get into our storage shed plus their darn dog ran at me growling and barking each time I was in my garden. Daddy is in prison now; mom and kids moved (Thank God!).

Good luck with your new bed,
Peggy

Yikes! And I thought the chicken haters were rotten neighbors! I guess it could be a lot worse!

If you're giving it plenty of time and have a lot of material you can add on top of the cardboard and newspaper, you could just lasagna right over the grass. You'll probably need a good 6" of soil/compost on top of it, and I'd mulch heavily, too. Anything that comes through should be pretty loose and easy to remove. I've done this with several of my raised bed gardens, and it worked out great.

Round up worked for me. I made a "garden room" that was 2,000 square feet in the middle of a bermuda yard. That was 3 years ago and I haven't seen any bermuda. Some tries to creep in from the edges, but Grass Killer works great to stop it from creeping in.
Here is what I did:
Round up every 2 weeks in the fall. I think I sprayed it 3 or 4 times. 1 application of Round up isn't enough.
Then I did the lasagna method, where I put down a layer of cardboard, put compost on top of that, then a 2nd layer of cardboard, and then mulch on top to make it look pretty.
I left it alone until spring. There were so many earthworms underneath the cardboard! It was amazing.

I can testify that just doing lasagna does not work. This past fall I was too busy planning my wedding and didn't get a chance to spray Round up until after November. The grass looked dead, so I figured that the lasagna method would keep the bermuda from getting any sun in the spring and it would die.
I was wrong.
I did the same method, cardboard, compost, cardboard, mulch. When spring came the grass just pushed right up through. By then, there were plants in the garden and using Round up would risk killing those plants. I have spent all summer trying to kill the bermuda using Grass Killer and Round up but I'll kill it in one place and it'll pop up in another.
Hope this helps.

Making a new bed takes work here is a bed I did last year starting in the fall I placed news paper, compost and mulch down by next spring the Bermuda was not gone so I soaked the ground took a big fork (don't know the name of the tool) and started digging up the grass this allowed me to keep most of the soil and mixed in the compost. I took the fork digging it in as far as I could bending it back to left up the grass n soil then repeat every few inches apart so it loosen up the area then pulled it with my hands. I would say digging is the best way to go there are two ways to go about it. One start now wetting the area really deep to get all the grass roots out or wait till spring when it rains really good and get out ASAP to dig up the grass. Now if you have St. augustine grass it's very easy to get rid of the roots don't go as deep. I have part Bermuda and part St. augustine which I've been working for 4 years on the st. augustine to take over pretty big yard to cover but it's getting there.
It seams like a lot of work and it is but taking one day at a time is the only way to look at it and when your done it's gives you a great feeling :)

Today

Best of luck

I guess I'll try a combo of a few things, a few doses of RU, digging up roots (no tilling) then some heavy cardboard/mulch to keep it looking sorta decent.

I won't be able to get out there for a few weeks, eviction papers are being filed on the 9th, I don't know how long it takes for them to leave. If the weather changes and it isn't warmish I'll rethink my game plan.

mikeandbarb, those little things in the 1st pic grew that much in less than a year? How do you do that, everything I plant takes forever to grow (could be because I haven't learned to fertilize yet).

I'm happy to hear yours finally got gone Peg, mines a rapist that violated his parole so he's going back in. Hopefully for a very, very long time. I'm not sure what sort of woman would shack up with a guy like him but one did and they have a son. She's a baddie too, went to court for driving on a suspended license, got probation (again) was driving the next day.

We have a sex offender living a block away, received a warning in the mail from Dept. of Public Safety. He was arrested for violating a 12 year old female. I keep the card with his photo on my computer desk so that if he comes to my door, I can recognize him and take my shotgun to the door with me!

My hubby leaves for work at 3:30am...I have all sorts of outside lights so I can see who is around my house.

Good luck with your bed....vinegar also kills plants...needs some sun after you apply it. We use it on weeds in our alley.

Peggy

Those little thing's grew that big in just a few months. I planted them the first of spring and before summer was here they were that big.
My success growing huge plants is NOT using Round up, No chem's in my yard.
Just add in the compost/manure or the humus manure working it into the soil at least 6 inches or deeper if you can.

How horrible it must have been to be living next to a rapist.I would do all it takes to move if I found out one was living right next to me, but you never know who your living next door to. How many times has someone done something even murder and when police talk to neighbors all say oh they were so quite and always nice, waving when driving by.
Someone like that they should lock them up for good. They have no heart in what they do and I have no heart for a person like that. They can rot in prison for all I care.

If tilling is a no-no, wouldn't digging be as well?
I'm realizing it's not going to be easy and there isn't a surefire method. Some of you seem to have luck with just a lasagna type method, some don't. I'd rather keep the RU money for plants, smother it and pull up a few sprigs next year (and every other year).

I'd like to keep the wildlife (horny toads, tarantula, lizards) coming back, so for now I won't visit the darkside with JD and cweathersby ;)

' for now I won't visit the darkside with JD and cweathersby '

Well, you know, there's always two Sith's. ; - )
J.D.

I never thought of it that way. I use Round Up, and chemical fertilizers, systemic insecticides, and systemic fungicides and have dozens of anoles, geckos, skinks, toad frogs, and butterflies in my garden. My plants do pretty good too.
Darth Vader (Jim)

Having converted much of my backyard into flowerbeds, I can strongly urge you to use RoundUp on the Bermuda a few times before doing the lasagne method. Otherwise the Bermuda will come back strongly and aggressively through the mulch next spring and you will be fighting it forever. You're still going to be fighting it to some extent (nothing can kill Bermuda ... well, maybe a nuclear explosion. Maybe.), but spraying it with RoundUp before smothering the bed will at least give you a good head start.

Carla in Rowlett

Darth Jim & Darth Carla,
I knew there was another.

If Texas A&M signs off on it, it can't be bad - and that's coming from a Red Raider! Go Tech!
; - )
Darth j.d.

Yup, I'm Ms. Organics Only except when it comes to 2 things -- Bermuda grass and Fire Ants. And for those 2 things I do look to the Dark Side for effective treatment.

Darth Carla

Well, I have tried to stay out of this one due to my intense dislike of bermuda, but there is one thing I will share for what it is worth. We moved here 15 years ago, the previous owner had poured concrete OVER bermuda without digging it out first. This was done by a large fountain surrounded by a circular flower bed. I struggled for the longest time trying to determine how the bermuda was getting into those beds. Then it dawned on me when it started coming up through the cracks that it was UNDER the concrete. I had to remove all the plants in those beds, and you can believe that I used Roundup several times before I replanted. For me, it is long live Roundup !!!
Bermuda will come back through anything --- even concrete.

Tarrant County horiculturalist, Dotty Woodson, recommends lasagne gardening. I do too. Just use a thick layer of wet newspaper overlapping to ensure no gaps then cover with leaves, compost, etc. with mulch on top. Let it sit over the winter and plant in the spring. A huge section of my front yard was done like that about three years ago and I haven't had any problems with the Bermudagrass. I just did a section in my backyard and am having very few problems. You can always mow the grass short first, then spray with vinegar, molasses and orange oil (or if you prefer Roundup, use that) and let it sit for a day in the sun, then start layering the newspaper.

How thick a layer of the organic matter do you have to put down?

Guess it goes to show - there's more than one way to skin a C**.
; - )
j.d.

Could it be?
Is that a bit of light I see coming from JD?
If I squint and tilt my head to left, yes! I think I see it.
Someone get over to his place quick, before the moment flees.

Hopefully the neighbors will be gone in less than 2 weeks, the owner of the house had a court date yesterday to file to notice.

JD,
The thickness of organic matter would depend on how deep you would like your "good soil" to be. My soil is about 1 ft of sandy tan stuff and then solid red clay under that. The compost I put down between the layers of boxes was only about 2" thick. It would have been thicker, but I was doing humongous areas and it's just me hauling all of the compost in and then putting it out, so 2" was all I was able to do. The soil that resulted was great for salvias, and lots of other perennials. For my big shrubs I dug a bigger hole and took out the sandy soil underneath the lasagna part and replaced it with compost. When I say compost I mean the compost they sell at our local wastewater plant that is human waste mixed with leaf mulch and chipped wood and then composted. It works really well, but you may not have something like that near you.

On the other hand, I also did my paths with layers of boxes and mulch on top, no compost used at all. The breakdown of the boxes and all of the earthworms that come to the site gives the soil a little boost.

As far as all of this dark side stuff goes... You know that commercial that says "Live and Learn and then get Loves?" Well, my version would be "live and learn ... and then get Round Up". I've got a whole back yard of flower beds that were made BEFORE I used Round Up and I need to just start over and do it again right, but that would require killing thousands of dollars worth of plants, many of them rare and not replaceable.

But maybe the Roundup has stunted my garden. What do you think?
{{gwi:332333}}
{{gwi:322809}}

cweathersby,
You know, if I were you, I wouldn't post pitiful pictures like that. Doesn't your conscience ever bother you? All of that death and destruction. ; - )

I do have an area I need to build up. So, to avoid all of the digging I did last summer, I'm going to do the lasagne. I better get those borders built first for the existing bedS, and finish the waterfall, and do the patio, and ...............
J.D.

Keep your fingers crossed, they had a garage sale this weekend. Hopefully that means he's saving up for jail canteen money and not to appeal the eviction.

When they're finally gone I'll share all that we've had to put up with since they moved in around June 2006. I couldn't make up stuff that good.