When I make a refrigerator pickle (Claussen type half sour), its brine is just plain salt and water to taste (also use plenty of dill and garlic!). The cukes have BOTH ends trimmed off, and then they sit in the brine at room temp for 24-48 hours. Then, I add only about a tablespoon or two of white vinegar. This just helps to stop further fermentation as well as reduces any scum or mold white its in the fridge. Mine last up to a year in the fridge, but they do get a bit soft after about 6 months.

Okay, guess I'm totally confused about the vinegar issue. I looked at past posts re: ratio, and at one point someone asked about using a similar recipe that was for a processed pickle and refrigerating instead of processing. The answer was that it wouldn't be safe because there wasn't enough vinegar to prevent botulism. Other recipes for refrigerator pickles use full strength vinegar, others use half vinegar (which is what I did this time), others use the ratio of the original recipe (4 parts water to one vinegar). These don't ferment before they go into the refrigerator. What determines how much vinegar to use on a refrigerator pickle? Thanks,

Lu

Hard to tell. Refrigerator pickles can be most any type, thats not heat processed. That includes, sours, half sours, dill, sweet, sweet mixed, and even bread and butter types. When I replied, I wrote about a CLAUSSEN BRAND HALF SOUR pickle that is ONLY found in the refrigerated section of your supermarkets. These are just salt brine and have a small amount of vinegar to prevent further fermentation, even in the refrigerator. They half sours are not fermented fully, and are refrigerated about 1-2 days after the cukes get put into the brine. at that time, the brine gets a small dose of vinegar to stop is fermentation action. Any thing else using a salt brine and FULL fermentation will stop its fermentation if vinegar is added. For the amount of vinegar used in a refrigerator pickle, thats all up to you and what you prefer. I do know that Annie, doesn't like vinegar, Splenda, pectin, PIckle Crisp, or many other items we use and take for granted when home canning .

Ken, that's not true. I use vinegar in sweet pickles, in pickled beets, in hot pepper jelly, and I like it fine. I just don't like a brine that has so much vinegar I can't taste anything else. I dislike Splenda intensely, but I will use Equal, it's less offensive to me. Dad agrees, BTW. I don't like the chalky texture of Pomona's Pectin, but I don't like most commercial pectins. Pickle Crisp I've only used a couple of times, so the jury is still out, although when I've used it my pickles aren't any more crisp.

What I truly dislike is all the commercial preservatives, chemicals and additives that we put into or get in our food today. It's not even real food, for crying out loud.

My grass fed beef doesn't need a 10% solution of flavor enhancement (salt and water, BTW), my organic beans don't need a preservative and my tomatoes aren't sprayed with any pesticides, insecticides, herbicides or any other "cides".

I like real food, grown naturally, without a bunch of "fake" things added. I'd rather do without than eat most of them, and that especially goes for those preservatives they insist on putting on salad bar vegetables. And that's why I grow and can my own food, so I don't have to eat all that other stuff.

Annie

On this issue of Botulism the use of refrigeration will reduce your risk. If you were to can your pickles and store them at room temperature then acidity of the brine is a big issue when lessening the risk of Botulism toxicity.

chervil2

Annie,
i guess I just like more things.. I don't drink quarts of vinegar brines either. All of the other sweeteners are awful tasting to me, except Splenda and Cyclamates. With these, I do have plenty of herbs and spices in my brines, so the pickle taste is still there, not bland, or watered down. Safety is still an issue with my short process times, so I 'stretch the envelope', when it comes to making sure the product is safer (acid wise) than a recipe would make it (hence added acids, etc.). Because I have no choice as to a pectin for a no sugar product, and being a diabetic, I cannot boil down a fruit juice, only to increase its sugar, and get it to gel without some outside help. A boiling down fruit juice might have a nice taste, but because its water has been removed, the result is more sugar. For a diabetic, a cup of apple juice has more sugar than a fresh apple. A cup of apple juice would be equivilent to eating about 4-6 apples in a few gulps.

Your confusion is over the TYPES of pickles. There are refrigerator pickles, which are meant to be made and kept for normally no more than 2 months. Then, most fully fermented recipes I have are kept for 6 months, approx.
Finally, a quick pack pickle MUST have at least half vinegar that is 5% acidity to be able to be safely processed and kept on the shelf.
The other two do not have as much vinegar.
Here is a long section from a group on making pickles.

Also, here is another one you can copy and paste into your browser from MSUE. It will have all the safe, tested, and update recipes for you. Scroll down to the section on pickles. If you will stick with recipes, and methods from current, reliable sources, you will be safe. :
http://web1.msue.msu.edu/imp/mod01/mod01p.html

Here is a link that might be useful: FAQ's on food preservation.

I just made a batch of quick refrigerated pickles and I have a question.....

first off, let me say my experence is limited. I used to make pickles by just adding some seasoning, pickling spices, garlic and water, put them in a tupperware, and refrigerated until they tasted OK.... they didn't alwas come out great, but definately edible. Recently I began to grow some Burpee Picklers, and I've been successful, so it was time to try my hand at pickling again.

A couple of weeks ago,I boiled a mixture of pickling spices, dill weed, pepper, and sea salt; let cool, and poured over sliced cukes in a cleaned store bought jar with garlic and onion added, with also a small amount of 5% acid vinegar. The pickles taste good, but too sweet for my taste (can taste too much of the cinnemon from the pickling spice.)I call them sweet and sipcy. I let the jar sit at room temp for about 24 hours, then refrigerated.

Tonight, I made a new batch. Boiled dill seed, dill weed, "it's a dilly" seasoning (has garlic, lemon peel in it also)and sea salt. After boil, I removed the residue, and poured over the cukes with small amount of vinegar, hot & sweet pepper, garlic, and onion, and topped of with some whole dill greens. It's sitting on the counter as we speak, and I planned on putting in the fridge after about 36 hours. Now, the questions..... am I way off base with my technique? can the pickles be harmful if left ut too long? what effect does the vinegar have in this process? Help, Help, Help!

Commonsense,
Avoid the sea salt. It does contain minerals that can make the taste of a salt brine based pickle less than appealing. Pickling salt is mined and refined to be as pure salt, with no anti-caking additives or minerals etc. When I make a HALF SOUR, salt brine based, pickle, I do NOT boil anything. I add the dill weed and seed heads and garlic to the empty jars, pack the jars with cukes that have been washed and BOTH end tips removed. The mixture sits on the kitchen counter for up to two days, THEN a dash of vinegar (about 2 tablespoons per half gallon jar) is added and its placed in the fridge. Yes, you are way off with your technique, especially by not using the proper salt, no matter how pure it is still sea salt, which is just sea water that has been dried. If you want the flavor of dill, you should not add other spices. A pickling spice mix at best, is for use when you don't care too much about the combination of flavors, but are wanting a sweeter spicy pickle. Regular pickling spice mixes do poorly with a mostly water based brine, as many of the spices contain essential oils that 'bloom' when they get cooked or mixed with an acidic vinegar. For a truely dill flavored pickle, you can also try using a prepackaged mix from Ball and/or Mrs. Wages. These mixes contain the extracts and spices and salt alone, and usually need no additional spices. Here, I use them for my half sours and also do add fresh dill seed heads and dill weed, along with cut up fresh garlic cloves. Following the proper methods will give you a safer and more tasty product with no 'surprises'. Also, tasting the brines prior to adding to fresh cukes, when used as a fresh curing agent as opposed to a heat canned product, will give you a better insight as to the end result which is obviously the taste you want to get. I don't think they can be harmful if left out for a day or two, but because you may not have followed some, or all of the 'rules, its a 50:50 chance if left out unrefrigerated.

thanks KS, gonna out them in the fridge right away.... I'll make sure to use the right salt next time. I'll report on how the latest batch came out, but as you noted, it will be pretty much a suprise. Hopefully I luck out. Thanks again.

I just made dill pickles and used a brine of 7 cups water, 1 and 3/4 cups 5% acedic vinegar, and a half cup of both pickling salt and sugar. I put the garlic, dill and cukes into hot jars and poured the boiling brine on top.
After 3 or 4 jars, I could see I would need more brine. I added to the pot, 7 cups of water, the salt and sugar, but forgot the vinegar. As my husband was rearranging the jars behind me as I made them, I have no idea which jars are good and which have no vinegar. I realized on my last jar, and added a splash of vinegar to the pot, but don't know if that will help.
Can I test the brine when I open the jar, and know by the taste if it is safe to eat. Or will the brine give me botulism if it has gone bad. I'd hate to lose the whole batch, but I'd hate worse to poison anyone with my pickles. Will refrigerating them help?
Help!!!
Louise

I am a bit confused as to what kind of pickles you are making. Are you fermenting them, making refrigerator pickles or quick pack pickles? If you will tell us what kind you are making we can help you out more.
If you are making quick pack and canning them now you need at least half vinegar 5% acidity to water ratio. If this is what you are doing then dump the brine and start all over.
There is no way to taste to see if something is safe. That would be a good way to get botulism if you had improperly canned something. You cannot see, taste, or smell botulism.
I use this recipe:
KOSHER DILL PICKLES (HEINZ RECIPE)

4 lbs pickling cukes
14 cloves garlic, peeled & split
1/4 cup salt
2 3/4 cups distilled or apple cider vinegar 5% acidity
2 3/4 cups water
12 to 14 sprigs fresh dill weed
28 peppercorns

Wash cucumbers; remove 1/16 inch from blossom end, cut in half lengthwise.

Combine garlic and next 3 ingredients; heat to boiling.

Remove garlic and place 4 halves into each clean jar, then pack cucumbers, adding 2 sprigs of dill and 4 peppercorns.

Pour hot vinegar solution over cucumbers to within 1/2 inch of top. Immediately adjust covers as jar manufacturer directs.

Process 10 minutes in boiling water bath.

Makes 6-7 pints

This post is from years ago but hoping someone can help me.

We intended to make dill pickels that were shelf stable.

We mixed 4L of water to 1L of Pickling Vinegar and 3/4 cups of pickling salt

Then boiled them for 10 minutes

Let them sit out overnight to cool

NOW, reading more recipes they say that you cannot safely store pickles without half the vinegar. SO NOW WHAT?! Are they all garbage or can they be stored in the fridge. That is a very expensive mistake.

Dang, it's too late for me to help. Refrigerate within 24 hours and use soon is the normal recommendation.

That's no where near a safe amount of vinegar for pickles according to any of the trusted sources. What you do with them is your own choice, of course, but I don't think I'd be confident enough to eat them. I've seen recipes with 2:1 water/vinegar ratios, but never any with 4:1 ratios,

I"m sorry to be the bearer of this bad news. :-(

Annie