I am growing Duchesse de Brabant in a large container. She is definitely cold-hardy here when grown in the ground, of course, but that may not be the case when grown in a container. So, I will move her to the garage this winter.

I know you are looking to grow her in the ground, but thought I'd bring up this option in case others tell you she won't make it for you in the ground there.

Randy

Louise Odier may be worth trying. Bourbons in general are past my blackspot tolerance level, so I've never bothered sorting them out hardiness wise.

Of course, you can have double yellows. You just can't have them that repeat.
There is Harison's Yellow, and this guy
{{gwi:280123}}
Williams Double Yellow from Pickering

As for Duchess de Brabant, is there *anyplace* that gets escaped heat from the house? Maybe under a porch? Tender potted roses really should stay above 20, and to do that they need a heat source. The worst case scenario around here is that it has to be elevated 35-40 deg. above the outside temperature, and that just doesn't automatically happen.

Thanks, Randy. We have an unheated basement that doesn't freeze unless DH leaves the door open - then we have no water.

I plan on putting down landscape cloth over mu entire front lawn - which isn't huge - and building beds there with one curving path through it.

It might make sense to put down some gravel and sink a tub in the middle of it surrounded by bulbs and hardy perennials.

Thanks for the input.

Thanks, Mad Gallica. I think I'll do the D du B in a pot, as suggested. The basement will be fine for overwintering, I think. If not, I'll find out.

:)

As for double yellows, Topaz Jewel does great here, as far as new dawn, i have it and white dawn..they grow to about 12' here, but still bloom well..they just don't get huge, which can be a plus?
yes..if you get snow cover that stays all winter, then a layer of straw and the snow will go a long way toward helping them through the winter. donna

I just planted Louise Odier last year, but she did extremely well over winter. I protected her with about 10-12" of soil and then, of course, she was buried all winter under a ton of snow. Here is a photo from yesterday, lots of buds and almost four feet tall already.

{{gwi:280124}}

You should definitely give her another try. Although we are listed as zone 5b on the Canadian zone map, I think we are considered zone 4a or 4b on the U.S. version. Our weather is probably about the same.

Judith

Donna, thanks for the heads up on Topaz Jewel. And Judith, you have made my day with the news about Louise Odier.

Where do you order from? I love Pickering, but they don't carry any bourbons.

Louise Odier is hardy in zone 5 Chicago without protection. Buck roses are worth a try. Rose de Rescht and Jacques Cartier are pretty hardy. Sharifa Asma is one of the hardiest Austins.

I grow both Louise Odier and New Dawn. New Dawn actually has more die back some years than Louise Odier. I would try them both and winter protect the first year. I know I am "5b" but my LO is very hardy with no dieback at all to speak of. If you can overwinter LO and only have to trim several inches after each winter, she will be fine.

I grow a tea in a pot and overwinter it in my unheated garage. It does great. It sounds like your basement would be fine for overwintering.

I have a "mystery rose" that I am still fairly confident is a Rose de rescht, and I will second that it is a hardy rose. It sat at this house unattended for three years; four if you consider that I didn't do anything for it last year. I only tip-pruned it a little this Spring; virtually every cane was green.

I fed it Good Morning Roses and it has about a hundred buds on it, ready to pop, and this is in mostly shade! (Until I get her moved, that is.)

Sue, welcome back. You've been missed. Hope the dogs are well.

I think you and Riku need to talk, he pushes zones.

It may depend on your budget and what you are willing to try and possibly lose.

You do have some good starts from the responses above.

Carol

Thanks, all! And Carol, we lost Sierra to cancer last year, but we have a neglected geriatric Malamute we adopted from the idiots across the street, along with her Lhaso apso brother. And Sparky was hit by a car last year but, lots of surgery and $ later, made it.

I'm so glad you remember me.

:)

I still have a hard copy of the thread I started when I decided to move here.

hi sue - i grow all of the roses (all own-root) you mentioned in fairly exposed zone5 areas. i believe i covered/mounded 4-6" soil, leaves, etc., their first year. but after that, they were on their own. and, they come thru in fine form, better each year as they mature.

i have several 'unsingle' yellows (depending on how you define yellow), aside from the austins, good ol summertime, joyce barden, francesca, eden and poulsen's yellow that have all managed to survive, if not flourish.

someone mentioned bourbons, ie louise (i love this rose), i have many, in fact, after hmusks, they are the backbone of my gardens. i do not, however, have any yellows :( ... well ... not yet :)

good luck, christie

Madame Isaac Perriere made it through the winter here. Jury's still out on whether she'll ever do anything. I grow Dr. Van Fleet. Years of losing almost all the canes happened until this year. We've had extreme amounts of rain and snow and most of his canes made it through. So I was right in guessing it was the moisture, not the temps that caused cane loss on him.
I grow Zephirine Drouhin. I get a couple flowers. Madame Plantier is a new one, surprising me with her toughness.
Gruss an Teplitz is doing fine, still a baby. Other than that, I grow the usual tough ones, madame Hardy, Felicite Parmentier, Harison's Yellow, White Rose of York, red rose of lancaster, etc.
There are a lot of people reporting success with David Austins in cold climates lately.

Hi SueinNYC

Still doubting ? I remember the sarcasm of the first one but remember the warm welcome in 2001.

I can't add more to what I probably said in the original thread ... bourbons Mme Odier and Prince Napoleon are the best here for survival of cane by covering ... latter a quiet one in the world but just as good as or superior to Louise for bounce back. Canker a roll of dice for me and some years can lose up to 80% of the canes but does not stop them as up come basals and a few blooms in bad years.

Prince Napoleon has 7 or 8 canes and about 4 or 5 new basals this year. Shorter than Louise.

MIP was doing well until last fall when I unfortunately I step on her bent canes putting up the Xmas lights. Snapped all of the large ones off at the soil line so back to the beginning for her and up are coming basals. Problem with MIP for me is her canes stiffen up by season 2 or 3 and she is difficult for me to bend down without snapping.

Province de Panache and MIP a close third. These Pickering are still alive and bloom but not as good as the top three for consistency and density of bloom.

Boule de Neige - a struggle and sure all clones suck
Coquette des Blanches - short and reliable
Eugene A. Merlitt - new 2 winters
Gruss an Teplitz - (steadfast recovery but to the ground with protection so in my world it has china in it)
Honorine de Brabant
Mme Doré
Mme Ernst Calvat
Mme Lauriol de Barny - touchy with blooms if damaged
Mme Pierre Oger - no problem but weak still - a low grade from 2004
Reine Victoria
Rose Eduardo - (not pickering)
Sir Joseph Paxton - (really winter touchy and do not recommend)
Souvenir de la Malmaison
Zéphirine Drouhin (inconsistent wintering but last year was awesome - cane survival good and finished year with 5 to 6 foot canes in zone 3 and a smattering of repeat - this year smoked to the ground, but 5 new basals.

You can do it.

i found out that you don't need to live in a cold climate to lose a rose... i have a potted Love that had i had to remove 50 % of it due to winter death, and we are mild here. go figure

Remember to water well just before the big freeze. I water 20 gallons per rose.

Carol

So happy to see you back and gardening again

I'm looking forward to your roses next year---

If I remember correctly you had some great climbers when you lived in the city.

again Welcome backBTW----Mrsflowers from Pa recently moved to a small town in NY state----near Oneonta----.

Florence

Sue, I got my Louise Odier from Pickering last year. They have a selection of about 18 bourbons to choose from, all lovely roses.
All my roses, including Austins, Portlands and hybrid teas made it through winter with no problem. I do apply protection, however, since none are planted more than 2-3" deep. As Riku said, go for it.
Judith

Thanks again, everyone.

Florence, I had a lot of climbers because my entire plot was 20 x 100 and included a house and parking spot! I had nowhere to go but up. How is Oneonta treating you?

I'm going to lay landscaping cloth over the entire lawn and dream a garden this winter. I think I'll go to Pickering for the roses - I'm closer to Ontario than anywhere in the states.

Does anyone know a good source for peonies and bulbs?

When I gardened in Wisconsin (zone 4/5) I grew a few tender roses in pots and overwintered them in our unheated attached garage. I removed all of the foliage in the fall, watered the pots real well and then slipped them into 55 gallon black plastic garbage bags, folded the open end over and made sure the bagged roses did not sit directly on the cold cement floor. The plastic bags helped keep the potting soil moist. For some reason the only rose I ever lost was Mutabilis. :-(

These I had good luck with:

Francis Dubruiel
Lady Hillingdon
Devonensis (the bush, not the climber)
Baronne Henriette de Snoy
SDLM
Mons. Tillier
Eugene des Beauharnias
Rainbow
Tipsy Imperial Concubine
Irene Watts - which was probably Pink Gruss