That's a valuable lesson learned, Russell.

A word to the wise: Have your bare roots shipped late winter/VERY early spring -- otherwise, forget them. That certainly applies to all the U.S. suppliers, but it applies also to all the Canadian vendors.

Money saved on roses that will never thrive is money wasted.

Yes, remember all their grafted roses were harvested in late November, December and very early January. They've been in cold storage since. Imagine a bare root rose stored in your refrigerator since the first of the year.
Now, own roots are another story. Unless shipped in hot weather, they could be a bargain if included in the sale.

I bought 9 bare roots this year (within the last month or so) from the red tag sale at J&P and so far, 7 of the nine are thriving (one took my breath away tonight as its already a foot tall and putting on 4 new canes! I actually stopped and went WHOA cause two days ago it was nowhere near this big...) and the other two are branching out slowly, but given that they are antique climbers, and were tiny when they arrived, I figured they would go along slowly. I planted the climbers in large pots while I wait on my hubby to get the fencerow tilled and I am wishing I hadn't had to do that. I bought four hybrid teas and 5 climbers for the fencerow.

Why are you supposed to not plant bare roots this late? I would love to know if my area is better suited since we have a longer growing season or if its still iffy they will do well. I can see how some may not do well after being stored for so long. I truly do. But so far all of mine look amazing, or look like they WILL be amazing....I did put them in shade since we are over 95 and approaching 120 heat indexes in my little neck of the woods, and my hubby put a soaker hose around them misting them all day.

I am just wondering what the reason, other than the shorter growing season affecting how well they establish themselves before winter, would be for not planting bare roots late in the season....I am serious, not trying to be difficult. I really want to know.

The growers harvest all the bareroots at the same time in late fall. If you buy them this time of year, they have been in cold storage for quite a while -- more than 6 months. And different growers do different things with that storage, some good, some bad, and you may get a perfectly good looking bareroot that won't grow for reasons that are not related to your growing conditions. That's the main reason to get bareroots as early as you can for your zone. Nevertheless, I also bought some from this J&P sale, because I do know how they keep their bareroots in storage -- in big temperature and humidity controlled vaults that optimizes the process. So this source, I say go ahead. Most others, not so fast.

The other reason is that bareroots have an easier time establishing themselves in cooler weather. Bareroots have no feeder roots. The roots you see on the plant are basically just the type that anchor the plant. So, the plant has to grow the feeder roots, and it has an easier time of that if the top is not dried out. If you have high temps when you plant a bareroot, you have to take special care that the tops stay reasonably moist, while there are no feeder roots to provide its own. If the top dries out all the way before the feeder roots get going, you will have a dead plant.

Good luck, Kathy

I received 9 today, and 7 of them are trying to throw new canes.... in a dry box. I will update, but if this was fall, I would have bought these, sight seen, in a heartbeat.

If you are in a warm climate, prune them slightly, after a week give them a Super Thrive tonic, and STAND BACK!

Beth

I see leaf!

Parti, you are doing everything right, so there is no reason not to plant now. When I was in Phoenix, I often took advantage of the Red Tag sale, and rarely lost a plant due to precautionary measures when it was 110. And J & P is really good about refunding plants that don't make it to your door. Just call and tell them.

Two hints I learned; do NOT feed them in the heat, you do not want to encouraged them to grow. Instead, plant them with triple super phosphate (wink) so they work on there roots instead.

Secondly, they sell shade cloth at Home Depot, cheap. During July, my garden looked like a bunch of bee keepers. But by August, when the humidity rose and the day started getting shorter, I could remove them. I did a minor (as opposed to major in January) pruning and in Sept.........we were off!

Beth

Thank you! I think out of my almost 100 roses, only two or three really are not thriving, and I DID have two bare roots, in March, from Edmunds fail to grow (they replaced them and the new ones are doing famously, but all of my others are going nuts, even in pots! I don't need shade cloth cause I have 32 pecan trees to do the shading for me! LOL Now at the grooming shop I am getting sunburn on some of the roses this week. didn't have any at all last year so I am trying to figure out where to put them or something to put over them. WIth them being at work, in a retail type environment, I am trying to make it LOOK NICE as well as practical. The new container watering system is ordered and I expect that will make the Hybrid teas at work do even better.

I ordered 3 last month. One arrive dead. Two had mold on them. None of them put out leaves. I emailed them and asked for a refund. Never again.

Nadia,

That is not typical of J & P. And they refunded, didn't they?

Beth

Well I am sorry you had a bad time, but 4 of my 9 are putting on blooms. All 3 Dream Weavers and my Rio Samba are putting on buds. The ones that looked rough are now beginning to put on new growth at a fast rate. They all look like they will be fine. Even my CL Sally Holmes' are putting on new leaves and canes. I would likely do this again. I am SO FAR very happy with the purhcase.

I really do wish that those who said DO NOT DO THIS would tell me more as to why they think that way.....

Parti,

There is a disease among Rose Fever sufferers, that if I cannot, you can't. But all micro environments are not equal.

I could not grow Heart of Gold to save my life, and I loved Perfect Moment, sent to me three times by J & P; the third bush became my favorite of all of my roses. If Jackson and Perkins had not stayed with me, I would not have been able to do it. I occasionally shop Weeks, because we had a fabulous dealer in Phoenix, but I have not found that here.

Does anyone know how to change your profile. Mine is (gulp) outdated!

Beth

I think that because I am an educator in my field I like to have explanations when someone says "DON'T DO IT!" and that may never go away. My entire life is full of contradictions, so in rose growing I guess being an anomaly is no different than being a renegade in dog grooming. LOL And that I am. I teach things and do things that other groomers say cannot be done yet I do them every day. Like yesterday we groomed 29 dogs in 8 hours with 4 people and some people say you cannot do more than 5 well in that time.......well we do it every day.

As for changing your profile, at the bottom of the page you will see a link for members pages. Click that and it gives you the option to change your profile.

BTW here is a pic of one of my Dream Weaver bare roots that are not yet three weeks in the pot with my others in the background....I would also hate to think that a large mail order nursery would sell a plant with a warranty (which these were covered I am pretty sure) if they felt like most of them would fail. Doesnt make sense to me. YES some will fail just like some from every nursery fail every year. MOST? Not so much.

{{gwi:270326}}

I am unsure about J&P roses' Red Tag Sale. Never bought roses from them online. I bought J&P roses from local nurseries. Somehow it's been a hit and miss with my J&P roses - some are really thriving and others are blah. I have had VERY good luck with my roses from independent rose vendors. Their roses always seem to be superior to the J&P, Weeks, etc. I wonder how their rose growing techniques differ so much.

I have bought roses during special sales from independent rose nurseries - Roses Unlimited, EuroDesert Roses, and Long Ago Roses. I also bought roses from Ashdown Roses which is not in retail sales (they are involved in other areas of the rose industry). I have never experienced a major issue with the "sale" roses or customer service from these independent rose vendors. Whenever possible, I highly recommend purchasing roses from independent rose vendors. :)

EuroDesert Roses currently has a an amazing sale on 150+ roses at only $8.95 each. Their shipping prices are reasonable too. EuroDesert Roses has lots of rare roses! :)

Here is a link that might be useful: EuroDesert Roses

While all but one of my original batch from the Red Tag sale are in, and seeming to do well (xannot really tell for two weeks), my second book had four more roses in it. It arrived today; the roses are just thrown in and the box was smashed, no dirt and dry as a bone. I refused the package.

Now I am short a Lagerfeld, Olympiad, Love and St Patricks. And I cannot find anyone who has them. The holes are dug and will take away from the beauty of the roses that are in.

How Jackson and Perkins will handle it, stay tuned. It was too late to call them (you Easterners take off so early, laugh).

Does anyone know of a place that might still have these roses? I feel like this when I go to the mall; they are showing tweeds and I am wearing my bathing suit.

Beth

I think it is important for everyone to know that J & P has filed for bankruptcy. Reorganization; coming out with a 2011 catalog.

But they are cutting corners. Like on tape. Seems my Fortuniana roses had one piece holding the box closed, and when it hit Arizona, sigh, the plants had all kicked their dirt off. Oh, well.

Luckily for me in Souther Cal, Armstrongs has some of the nicest pots I ever saw. So I traded in Lagerfeld, Love, St Patricks and Olympiad FOR Fire and Ice, Just Joey (yesssss), Perfect Moment, Ingrid Bergman, BLACK MAGIC, Welcome home (brother to Mellow Yellow, one of my favorites in Phoenix, can someone compare them?), and Intrigue. Ohhh, is that more, you say? Count again, I am SURE it is even.

Beth

It is sad, but the "Jackson & Perkins" of today is not the same company as the Jackson & Perkins of history -- of a long, proud, history in roses.

The name was sold, and they have the rose rights, but that doesn't mean they operate as the proud, old firm did long ago. Ignore the name.
Pretend it said "Wayward Gardens," and proceed accordingly.

Proceed with caution, all ye who enter here.

Jeri

Giggle. Ten years ago they were kings!

Is Wayward still around?

Beth

Yeah, I think they are -- but J&P is pretty much the same thing, now.
It was the NAME they bought.
And the rights.
And, I guess, the reputation -- theirs, now, to ruin. :-(

Jeri

Did anyone get a J&P catalogue this spring, or did anyone buy Peppermint Splash? I'm trying to find out if they are calling this variety a hybrid tea or a grandiflora. Thanks for any help anyone can give me.

I bought mine in the fall. Love the striped roses it puts out but having some major suckering issues with it. I have decided I MAY have to root it if I want it to grow without the rootstock taking over. It is literally the ONLY rose I have that suckers.

Do you know if they classed it a hybrid tea or a grandiflora? I'm trying to get it right for the ARS Handbook for Selecting Roses and without J&P having their roses on line this year, it's tough.

HMF has it listed as a HT but the catalog I had listed it under BOTH classifications, which confused me to death.

http://www.twofloralavenue.com/roses/

The confusion is that it shows up as a Grandiflora on the HT pages......the two links here are actually J&P pages.

Here is a link that might be useful: Search page

Phil -- Grandiflora. It's only in their Spring 2010 mail order catalog -- totally missing from their big wholesale catalog for 2010. But the mail order catalog says this:

NEW Peppermint Splash. Grandiflora Var. JACdrama (PPAF)
A unique blend of white, red and peppermint-pink splashes and speckles.

Enormous blooms, each one distinctively different, open with perfect high-centered form, releasing the evocative "high summer" aroma of fresh honeysuckle. The petals aren't exactly striped-- instead they're a swirled confection of rich pink against Christmas and snowy white. For lovers of one of a kind beauty with an artistic twist, this new rose is absolute tops!
Own-root rose. Exclusive.
4 1/2 - 5 feet Height/ Red and white (turning pink) striped
4 1/2 inch blooms -- late spring to early summer
Pointed ovoid buds / 20-25 petals / 14" to 18" stems
Large glossy dark green foliage
Light sweet honeysuckle scent / full sun
38663-X7R Bareroot $18.95

Kathy

If it's the Peppermint Splash on HMF, it looks very interesting.

Jeri

That is another thing. They LIST IT as OWN ROOTHi Debi,
This is a grafted rose and the whitish/ pink flowers are coming from the root stock. Trace the stem that is producing these off color roses back to the main stem and cut off as close as possible with your shears. The root stock that we graft roses on is fairly aggressive so if you do not keep it cut back it can overshadow the Peppermint Splash and choke it out completely.

thanks
Bob
Staff Horticulturist

BTW this rose arrived in a 6 inch pot, not bare root and I SWEAR It wasn't supposed to be grafted according to what I read when I ordered. I still say my roses I bought at the red tag sale are doing well. All but one is budding out and ready to open any day now and they are getting HUGE fast.

Boy, that is WEIRD!

Jeri

So, Jeri, you think I am right to be confused? LOL I truly thought I bought an own root (read the ad again) and now they tell me its isn't, its grafted, but I am TELLING YOU there is no way the 6 inch pot held a graft. There were 5 or 6 "canes" coming out of the soil....sad thing is I LOVE this rose. LOVE IT! I raise parti cockers (black and white and red and white) so I have a penchant for multicolor anythings. this rose is STRIKING. When its not pink. Or whitish. And solid....I thought maybe it was reverting to whatever it came from, but then they said otherwise.....I cut off two more of the pink blooming canes today. I have 12 or more buds on the part that DOES bloom striped Its easy to tell which ones are which early on. ANYWAY......

Oh yes, I think one WOULD be confused.
Apparently, "Bob The Horticulturist" doesn't have any clue what they're selling.
He reminds me of another clueless "Horticulturist" they used to have.

But, FWIW, I suspect these plants ARE on their own roots.

As to the solid colored ones, I noted that no parentage is listed for this rose, and I betcha it's a sport from something else -- and that it reverts.
It is also (per the HMF description) pretty much semi-double.
But if you go to HMF, and go to the Member Comments section on it, you can find two members commenting.
You could then ask the people who commented whether the rose was own-root or budded for them, and whether its color is reasonably stable.

BTW, I, too, like striped roses, but never equated that with the fact that I'm a breeder/exhibitor of Dalmatians. :-)

Jeri

Isn't it funny how you learn things about yourself in places you never thought you would! LOL My kennel name is Particentral. My POODLES are parti colored as well (except my white toy I show). I like unusual, so that is how I equate the two....I mean people think cockers they think ASCOB or black. SO that is my take on it anyway.

I tend to agree the PS is an own root. I bought a Veteran's Honor at the same time. Also in the 6 inch pot and own root. Same thing as the PS> Lots of small canes coming up from the pot....I will just keep cutting off the weird canes. LOL I love that rose a lot when it does what it is supposed to do.

I'd be disappointed if I bought a particolored rose, and it was THAT subject to reversion.

I know other sports have been held back from introduction for a long time, until a fairly stable clone had been isolated. ('Brilliant Pink Iceberg' is one example.)

I think if yours reverts that commonly, I'd complain.
Maybe you just have a "lemon."

Jeri

I got PEPPERMINT SPLASH in the test roses a few yrs ago. It almost died on me (grafted). I actually thought I had lost it and was upset when they didn't market it. They brought out a couple of the other roses from that batch for sale tho. Then I found out it was being offered in Europe under the name "Rachel Louise Moran." Last yr, I discovered it hadn't died, so I named it RLM, thinking it wasn't going to be marketed here in the US. Then, all of a sudden, J&P decides halfway thru the season to market it under the PS name. So I was glad to see it would be available if my poor whimpy test plant decides to biff it. It's still not doing very well. I imagine it would do better as an ownroot.