Mrs. B. R. Cant gets my vote, too. In my coastal climate the blooms don't open well on young plants. Notice I didn't say small plants. The thing was easily 8 x 8 before the blooms opened well.

I grow Angel's Camp Tea. It does mildew, the color fades, and It isn't my favorite. It's a real survivor, tho.

I've got most votes for Mrs B R Cant (this forum and the other roses forum), so I'm thinking of getting it. The only problem is that I dont have a 3 metre diameter space available. The max I can spare is 1x1.5. It might just grow into the other roses that are next to it. HOpe that wont be a problem. Or maybe I can prune it to keep it narrower. I don't have much experience with tea roses and am ordering a whole lot this year. Will need lots of help and advice from you guys. I'm also seriously tempted by TIC. Just saw the most gorgeous photo of it on the other forum. Still waiting on some more votes before I make my decision. Thanks a lot.
Sanju

Sanju, since Mrs B R Cant is going to smother at least one and probably two rose bushes from her 1.5 meter spot, I would put my least favorite rose bushes on either side of her. Then I won't be too heartbroken when I can't find them one day in the not too distant future. :))

Sherry

Sherry, I can't believe she can be that vigorous! LOL! I suppose after growing HT's with 4 of 5 upright stems, I just can't imagine how Teas grow out here. There's a palm tree on one side and the other side is a floribunda called Iceberg, but its a fair distance away. Oh my god! I have no idea what I'm doing. I'll probably have to move all of those into pots to make space for these huge tea roses. What rose would you vote for of the four above?
Sanju

Sanju, We are in very mild Coastal Southern CA.

When we began planting Tea Roses, we put them on 3-ft. centers, as we had done for HTs. Then we became concerned, and went to 4-ft centers.
We'd have been far wiser to go to 8-ft centers.

I know that sounds loopy, but it's the truth.
And we are now removing some roses.
Some will just have to remain as grown-together thickets.

Jeri

Sanju, I voted for Angel's Camp Tea on the other forum (it never mildewed for me) but an equally good choice, if you're hesitating about the truly humongous Mrs. B.R. Cant, would be Mrs. Dudley Cross. It is a very beautiful rose, has no thorns, and changes color beautifully. It also makes a very good cut flower. I've had one before and had to have it again in my present garden. After taking into consideration the opinions of others, I would look at all the roses on HMFR and then choose the rose that is the most exciting and appealing to you personally.

Ingrid

Sanju, if you have a corner in your garden, I think I'd put Mrs B R there. The back of the corner is going to be dead space anyway so you might as well fill it up with Mrs B R Cant. Tea roses do not grow like HTs. HTs go up and not out. Teas go out and up. Several teas that I have apparently are the type that grow out for a few years and then get taller. It's quite an amazing thing. Mrs BRC does both simultaneously - at least on Fortuniana rootstock which is what mine is. When you have a 5' cane growing nearly horizontally in one direction and another growing nearly horizontally in some other direction, you have a 10' diameter bush which is what Mrs BRC can do. She will be a huge 3-dimensional bush - not just tall and slender like a HT. I have seen mature tea rose bushes with canes like tree limbs (3-4" thick) and the bush way over my head. In Florida some people (including Malcolm Manners, I believe) prune rather hard in the spring just to reduce the size from last year's growth. I think some prune again in August (high summer).

Well, a picture is worth a thousand words so...

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At Florida Southern College by Dr Malcolm Manners

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Posted by TexasLynn (probably young since it's not very tall)

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Googled from unknown origin

See what we mean??

Sherry

Sanju,

If you want another vote, I'd go for Mrs. Dudley Cross, primarily because I can't look at a picture of her blooms without catching my breath. It's so very beautiful!

We planted it last fall but it hasn't bloomed here yet, and isn't likely to anytime soon. It made it through the unusually cold winter here in perfect (almost evergreen!) condition... and then the rabbit trimmed it almost to the ground. Fortunately, some more of that variety will be delivered shortly. :)

Best wishes,
Mary

Here is a link that might be useful: Mrs. Dudley Cross

Sherry, what marvellous pictures. Makes me wish I had all those huge shrubs in my garden. Alas, none of my roses as yet have grown half as tall as that, as for the width, the less said the better. I think I'll put Mrs B R Cant on hold for now. Once I get a bit more experienced at growing teas(like next year) I might just dig a 3x3 metre circle right in the middle of the lawn and make it into a specimen plant. So that leaves Mrs DC, Angel's Camp Tea or TIC.

Mary, I agree that Mrs DC makes me feel the same way. Especially in the 'Roses for Warm Gardens' book, the colours are so beautiful, yellow, shaded with a mauvish-pink. I will most probably go for that one and perhaps give in to my weakness and order TIC as well. Thanks everyone for your help.
Sanju

I posted a message before this one, which seems to have disappeared. I probably didn't submit it or something. Anyway, Jeri, just wanted to say that what you said did make sense to me. I've decided to wait till next year to order Mrs BRC. And say thanks to Ingrid for encouraging me to check out Tea roses. They do appeal to me much more than hybrid teas, now that I've seen how they grow like shrubs. I might slowly change the whole look of the garden, put more shrubs and climbers in the ground and perhaps keep the HTS in pots for a cutting garden (to get the flowers in the house). Thanks a lot for all your help.
Sanju

Mrs Dudley Cross and Mrs BR Cant are two of my favoriter teas. Monsieur Tiller is another tough tea rose. Louis Phillipe, a china is almost bullet proof even in dry shade here in South Louisiana.

Thanks brhgm. I have already ordered Mons Tillier. I think Louis Phillipe is not available at that nursery (not sure, will check). And I'm noting down your votes for Mrs DC and Mrs BRC. Can't wait for my first order of Tea roses!
Sanju

I have Tipsy Imperial Concubine in a container here in southwest Florida and it has been spot free for me without spraying since last fall.

Mrs. BR Cant gets my vote as possibly the best tea out there, as well. She would not like, nor look good, if she were kept pruned too small. She is destined to be a big girl, and I would not consider planting her any closer than 10 feet from another rose.

In time, you may eventually find space for her, if other plants do not work out. She is as close to carefree as any rose can get. I never spray. She is well worth the garden space!

Sandy

Seems like Mrs B R Cant gets the most votes. I haven't heard anything bad about her as yet. I'm still undecided just because of the space. I have lots of lawn, probably time to start digging a big circle and planting a beautiful shrub like Mrs B R Cant. TIC on the other hand, will fit in perfectly (have lots of spots for her). Thanks everyone, your help is much appreciated.
Sanju

Oh yes, reduce the lawn! Lawn is no comparison for Mrs. BR Cant. You won't be sorry. If you feed her some nice rich compost, you'll be greatly rewarded.

Sandy

I love Mrs. B.R. Cant. I seem to be the only person who can say that Mrs. Dudley have difficulty in a "no spray" garden in Tulsa, Ok. Whatever type of black spot we have here, she seems to get it. I think she may be related to Marie Van Houtte, and I don't have trouble with her, but I do with Mrs. Dudley.

Sammy

Yes, why not get both, Mrs. B.R. Cant as a lawn specimen and Mrs. Dudley Cross for elsewhere, assuming you live in a dry climate as I do, where she is completely disease-free, as are all my teas. You just can't have too much of a good thing. No one ever talks about a lawn, but I'm sure you'll have endless comments once Mrs. Cant reaches a certain size. After all the praise here I'm racking my brain as to where I could put her in a garden that has zero space and no lawn to rip up. Oh well...

Ingrid

Ingrid, not to question whether you know if your garden is full or not, but I remember a long time ago you were asking about big noisettes to plant on a slope - I think along your driveway. Did you ever do that? I'm just curious, and also wondering how big your lot is. Being nosy :))

Sanju, don't mean to hijack your thread.

Sherry

No worries, Sherry. I avidly read every single thing I can on this forum, have lots to learn. I'm also a miserable girl this day, my DH left for overseas (on work) yesterday and I have a whole week on my own. Any conversation is appreciated at the moment. Luckily my two girls(7 and 5) are at home with school holidays, but they are too busy dancing and playing to be bothered by me! Well, its still good to have some noise in the house till they're in bed.

I think I will get all three (TIC, BRC and Mrs DC) and get Octavus Weld next year. The lawn does seem to be wasted space now. Thanks everyone.
Sanju

Absolutely, Sanju, when in doubt, buy them all!! :))

Sherry

That's right, Sherry. That's all the encouragement I need. My husband, of course is going to think I am out of control this year. I was bad enough the last two years. But he has gone away, and I am depressed :(, so what choice does a poor girl have??
Sanju

Sherry, I did plant the noisettes on the slope and they failed miserably. I watered like mad but that place was a suntrap and nothing flourished. I do have two left which I moved closer to the house, Mrs. Wood's Lavender Pink Noisette and Bermuda's Kathleen (not a noisette of course). They're starting to take off now. Our property isn't very large, about 1 2/3 acres. Well, I suppose that's not small but my last country place was 5 acres so it's all relative. At any rate, my planting area is confined to the only flat space, which is around the house. Lack of water is one reason and not being a mountain goat is another.

Sorry Sanju, although it did just occur to me that you might like the plants I mentioned. Bermuda's Kathleen is apparently a seedling of Mutabilis and very pretty. I'm sure you need even more roses to buy. So sorry your hubby is away, but think of how good he'll look to you after a week.

Ingrid

Ingrid, I will check those roses out, but don't remember reading those two names on the nursery website(I've been to their website atleast a million times). I will write it down for next year, I saw this really gorgeous rose called G Nabonnand on another nursery website. Have you heard anything about it? It looks good enough to eat, the whole plant is absolutely smothered by the flowers and apparently it flowers all year here in Australia. This obsession on keeps getting worse.

I am a bit better now that its not a weekend, just telling myself DH's gone to work, he works long hours anyway. And, yeah, it will be good to see him in 5 days, just before Easter. Its great to talk to you guys. Thanks,
Sanju

I don't personally have G. Nabonnand, but have heard many people on the forum say good things about it. If you're really interested, you might write a separate post and get reactions from people who actually grow it.

Well, I hope Malcolm and all you Mrs. B.R. Cant lovers out there are happy. After having sworn over and over again that I would not buy another rose (and being really sincere about it), the thought of not having "the world's greatest rose" simply would not leave me alone. Over the last few days I've studied my place endlessly, searching for a large flat spot to hold this rose, and there simply was none that had any sun. This morning I had a Eureka! moment as I stood outside the house and looked down the driveway. It's very long and the terrain along it is hilly, but more than halfway down there is a flat spot where what we call the studio is located. About 20 feet away from the studio I found my spot for this rose! It just hadn't occurred to me to plant roses that far from the house but there is a water connection there and a huge rose like that would be a wonderful introduction to the roses around the house that aren't visible until you go around a curve on the driveway. Sanju, it just goes to show where there's a will there's a way. I need another rose like I need three eyes in my head but I've become convinced I have nothing quite like THIS rose in my garden. Oh gosh, how many times have I said that, and it's always been true. They are all different....

Ingrid

Ingrid, I am so happy for you that you found a spot for this marvellous-looking rose. Now I've decided to jump in and take the plunge too. I will make a space for it once I have it. I've got my young 17-year-old niece here (since DH is away, she's giving me company) who has agreed to dig a large circle for me in the grass. It's exciting that we will both be getting it at the same time and will probably compare notes. Mine won't come till July or Aug though.

About G Nabonnand, I'm going to ask after the ordering season is over, don't want to be tempted into any more. But definitely it is one I will consider for next year.
Sanju

Oh good, as you say we can compare notes on how our respective roses are doing. That's wonderful that you have your niece to dig the circle since you had hinted that your husband is not a keen gardener. Even though yours will arrive somewhat later I'm sure it will catch up. I'm still waiting to make sure the on-line nursery that has this rose listed really has it. At the moment not many nurseries seem to be carrying it but I'm determined to acquire it as soon as possible, before it gets too hot to plant a small rose. I'm getting very excited about this project!

Ingrid