Aprille I have WS2000 and boy he sure is a blooming fool.
I have the same problem, I have had him for 3 years now and he does not grow very high but grows very wide.
I think you should give him one more chance and if by next year he does not shape up well do what you got to do.
Maybe he needs to be moved some where with more sunlight.

Isn't it fun and exciting cleaning out the yard to make space for some new ones.
But in the back of your mind you still sometimes feel sad getting rid of them.

Niecey

Hi Niecey, thanks for your reply. WS2000 did really well in his first two years, then he started slowing down, the blooms have not looked as gorgeous as they first did. I got him from Wayside before I discovered other rose nurseries or this forum. He gets a lot of sun during the year, 7+ hours I think in the summer, that spot hardly is shaded unless the sun is down. I might give him one more year as I do like his blooms and fragrance.

I agree, as much fun as it is to make room there was that guilt factor - I kept apologizing to them all for taking them out and trying to explain to them why I was doing it! lol - kept saying to myself I really am a crazy person and needed to be locked up!

Aprille

Aprille I think most of us here needs to be locked up for things we have done to our roses at one time or the other.
We are like kids in a candy store, or maybe "Toy R Us"
So many pretty colors, fragrances, classes and forms and just want them all space or no space.
Niecey

Just out of curiosity...do you know if the non-bloomers are getting enough water? I have WS 2000 on order from DA because I heard good things here.

I think Devon_gardener had posted good comments about Bewitched earlier this year...I remember a pic with lots of blooms. That's why I'm wondering about the water issue.
I have a sprinkler system but I don't think the water reaches all of them in the same quantity.

rainbow 2007 - I hand water and usually give these extra water. My Bewitched is a 3 cane wonder, for the first couple years it was just two canes and then finally last year it grew one new basal. Black Magic has not grown any new basals. I'm going to use Mills Magic Mix on them this spring, I'd used some last Fall on my potted roses out front and they grew like crazy - I was totally blown away by the results.

Aprille

Oh wow Aprille -if I live closer to you, I would love to adopt your roses. We just bought the property next door and counted 14 dead rose bushes. All had drip system to them...problem was, the property was vacant for 1 year.

Kasie

Aprille, there's a lesson in the note that WS 2000 does great in Toronto, and poorly for you in CA Z9. I suspect it needs a bit more winter than you can give it, to excell.

Jeri

Another note on WS 2000. I bought 3 a few years ago. They were very slow to get started. One was almost SP'd. I moved the sickly thing from a protected spot near the house to a new spot with more exposure, sun and less competition. It exploded in year two and has become a spreading monster.

My WS2000 was full sun so far and bloomed pretty well; now we replanted in a spot that will get afternoon shade because in the previous spot it was always pink except in very late fall.
But, FWIW I doubt that the problem is lack of winter chill. Maybe you got a bad clone from a not so good source? The decline would indicate problem with the specimen not problem with winter chill. Is it on the right rootstock for your area? Is it possible that it is virused? What is the provenance of your WS2000? I would investigate these issues before deciding on the fate of this rose. Maybe you should replace with another WS2000.

I have bewitched for about 9 years. It always has been one of my best bloomers and became so again when we got some rain in late fall. This rose hates to be pruned too low. Every 3 year I give him a harsher pruning and it doesn't bloom till it reaches 7' tall. So I do not prune it back more than to 4' in spring. Even then it will be one of the latest to bloom but after that it is nonstop.

As to Black Magic, I tried 4 (!) and all acted like yours in different locations in my yard. No new basals and two cane wonders, ugly bush. I assumed that this rose is not a good variety (grafted on dr. Huey) for my area but thought to be great in CA. Now I wonder.

WS2000 does bloom well here so I seriously doubt that your problem has anything to do with lack of chilling hours. Mine bloomed very well except during the extreme drought and watering ban. My WS2000 was in full sun where the blooms were pink most of the time so this winter we replanted it in a spot where it gets shade in the afternoon. I would rather try to focus on its provenance - maybe it is virused or not in the rootstock that your soil is happy with.

My Bewitched is about 9 years old and one of my best bloomers. This HT hates hard pruning and if it is pruned back below 4' it is not going to bloom here till reaches 6'-7'. In spring it starts a bit later than other HTs even if I prune back to 4' but it is a nonstop bloomer after that.

I don't know what to say about Black Magic. I tried 4 and all behave like yours. Their rootstock and my soil might not be happy with each other or BM just hates my climate or yard. However, I always thought that it was a great rose in CA; Baldo praised this rose a lot and I think Beth NorthCA posted some great pictures of this rose at HMF. So I assumed it is a great rose for CA. Now I wonder....

Aprille, I have found, through reading on this forum and my
own experiences, that if you don't have a great plant to begin
with, you will have a bad experience with the rose. There are
bad roses, but of the good ones, if you don't have a grade #
1 healthy plant, that has vigor, you are going to have problems.
So I would say, get rid of the ones that you are not in love
with and of the ones you love, replace them with a quality,
new plant of it. There is guilt, at first, when you get rid of
some roses, but in the long run, it's liberating to start over
with new space. Good luck, Aprille.

I sympathize, Aprille. I agonize over every rose I remove--even diseased sticks--but always feel great afterwards when I see the space opened up for a rose that may just be deleriously happy in my yard. It's really fun to try new roses, looking for those perfect matches.

I also have no patience for non-bloomers. Eight blooms over a whole year? Get the shovel!

Colleen

Thank you each and every one of you for your wonderful input and advice. I really love this place! Where else can I come to for expert advice, sympathy (when roses don't do well) or to just share the joy of my roses.

Here is what I have decided to do. Black Magic & Bewitched are going. WS2000 I've giving one more year.

Thank you again - you are all so wonderful!

Aprille

Wow, my Black Magic is a huge blooming monster in Coastal Southern California! I guess you never know.

BTW, I posted my cast offs on Craig's List's "free" board and I had offers to take them off my hands within seconds.

About 8 years ago I decided that HT's were not worth garden space based on their flower production-- with the exception of some superstars like Quietness and (for me) Belinda's Dream. I have concentrated on shrub roses, floribundas, Bucks, and now teas and chinas and I have the garden effect I've wanted. Lots of color, fragrance on the air. When the DA's are happy, a lot of them bloom like crazy! Hope WS 2000 will do well for you, it can be glorious..