I spend my days in this world. No one is retiring. No one has left. But everyone is prepared to. They're being offered jobs from all over. Most of us are hanging on to see what's going to happen in the courts.

maddie, that is a shame. 🙁

eta but you must be very proud of him. I wish him luck.

" Well, I have. "

I didn't say no one did. I said I've never heard such talk.

Here's a thought though. I wonder if when looking at each direction of US-Canada migration stats for each of the last 20 years, in which direction were moves made in greater absolute numbers? And, which direction involved a larger percentage of the population of the country they were leaving?

I don't know but I have a suspicion that at least for the percentage movement, the southerly direction was a greater relative number.

My DIL is a postdoc in evolutionary biology at a prestigious private university in the SF Bay Area. She and my DS are starting to think that they may need to leave the country so that her career can continue to flourish in academic research. As a psychologist, he will probably be able to become licensed and work in any anglophone country.
My nephew, a geophysicist in charge of a climate study at a top public university, was informed last week that there will be no more funding- and no more paychecks for him. He is not employed by the university, although his wife is. He has three young children and a mortgage.

My comment was a response to a deliberate expression of schadenfreude that was vile, contemptuous and incendiary. Many comments seem to either disregard the importance of the word I used, don't know what it means, or disagree. All fine but other comments made in my direction seem to ignore or have misunderstood what it was I was saying. If you missed it, you missed it. If you don't recognize it, you don't recognize it.

Did it anger me? No, of course not. None ever do. But it came from a person I don't think much of and who has done the same before. I wanted to highlight it and nothing more.

I also encourage my Jewish American friends to leave

And go where? Yes, antisemitism is a problem in the US, but it's just as much of a problem, if not more, elsewhere.

We have a few science-adjacent professionals in our friend group, some of whom are not US citizens and others who are.

The non-citizens are preparing to return to their home countries within a year or so because their jobs are no longer secure. The US citizens are considering early retirement because their jobs are no longer secure.

I'm not a scientist, although I was a science major in college. My husband (an immigrant) is an engineer. We are leaving the US within 2-3 years. My immigration to his country is much more convoluted (and expensive) than immigration to the US.

There should be a forum where personal issues can be sent, using a new ”flag” option. Take it outside and let everyone else continue with the topic.

Petalique I read very little of this thread, and what I did read wasn't worth comprehending. But what seems apparent with all the bickering is some don't understanding anything anyone is saying.

The list has been compiled from past examples indicating his dislikes.

Elmer I do wish you would quit with the "low self esteem" garbage when someone says something you dont like. It does nothing to enhance your argument. If you cant make your case without psychobabble diagnoses then just leave it alone please.

I don't think that making the argument that Americans know practically nothing about Canada is the best argument for being peevish about Canada expecting us to know something about Canada. Why don't we? It is no excuse not to. Canada has long been a very good friend to us.

When I travel in Europe I am generally taken for Canadian. I am flattered.

I know someone who moved to Canada and is now a Canadian citizen.

patriciae

(K) Yawn at your hostility. Sad.

We need science and the humanities. No fair minded humanistic person wants to close the doors to learning, discovering and enrichment.

Who but a fearful controlling power monger would want to thwart discovery.

I am reminded of how (it is alleged) the Khmer Rouge and Pol Pot killed intellectuals, destroyed books and believed those wearing eye glasses were intellectuals, educated — the perceived enemy.

The newly communistic China did the same thing to their educated. Reeducation camps. Death for many of them.

patriciae

The same happened in Russia/USSR, didn't it? Exile to Siberia, anyone?

Nowadays, I think they just push you out a window - or poison you.

P.S. Is there an alternate definition of 'insult' that most of us are unaware of...?

" The same happened in ..... didn't it? "

No, I don't think so.

" The same happened in ..... didn't it? "

Carol is right and factual. Nothing you can dispute, written in stone and proof positive. Russia has about 1500 + political prisoners locked up. We had about a thousand until Jan 20th but were released by a man who almost became a political prisoner himself.

Russia arrested thousand who even looked like they were going to protest the "special operations" in Ukraine. Men, women and even babushka's were sent to one of the 700 prisons in Russia and many are in Siberia.

Poison or a window is the common way they deal with troublemakers but on occasion they'll control the problem through other means, with one even being accidentally being shot down in his Jet.

Very strange I have to explain this, but I have to remember most here, are part of this ideological group I'm explaining below-so I guess I will have too.

Scientists with ideological biases probably WILL benefit to leave the U.S. They now carry a "stain" on their reputation and will have to work hard to restore their character, which could take a while. I don’t feel sorry for them at all. They should have had the courage to stay true to science instead of succumbing to ideology. This has spilled into other areas of so-called "science" also.

Gallup polls show a significant decline in public trust in science, dropping from 70% in 1975 to just 57% in 2023 among Americans. I believe this became most apparent during the COV!D pandemic. Scientists who were SUPPOSED to be legitimate and unbiased touted on the national stage-acting more like activists and peddling half-truths and unreliable narratives about the virus. These particular scientists actions spread distrust, tainting the credibility of science itself. A few dishonest scientists were unfortunately driven by ideology and still to this day, cast a dark shadow over the scientific community as a whole. So...public trust has "left the building." This continues to be a huge problem.

All of us, who were questioning these ideological-captured scientists and especially the intelligent and brave doctors who dared to PUBLICLY challenge this dishonest narrative-speaking truth based on evidence-were silenced, canceled, and vilified. People were forced to take a jab or lose their job. People were on airplanes forced to wear masks-but could somehow eat while pulling their mask down on each bite. People could go to restaurants and do the same-ridiculously being forced to believe the virus "miraculously" could go no further than within their own table. Many lost their businesses. There were so many other senseless actions we were forced to obey. And no, we won't forget.

Now, the scientific community faces a huge task of rebuilding this trust. It will be a steep climb, especially for certain fields and cities and universities that participated in this embarrassing dogma and ideology.

FYI, I'm not getting into a COV!D back-and-forth here-it's been done to death. Just thought you needed a reminder that for many Americans, this misinformation/disinformation became really powerful when scientists-who were once widely respected-started being questioned.

***Scientists must continue to be questioned and work hard to get to the TRUTH-instead of letting their DEI, political ideology, or self-interest influence their studies and data.

demeaning and deriding expertise

I didn't realize this was a thing. I myself respect experts, particulary in science, but in any field including the trades, respect knowledge and experience.

thinks he knows everything better than everyone else.

I do not, however, respect people like this, wherever they may be found.

Lucille, what about jack of all trades, but not an expert in any? Do these gain your respect? I mean it's me to a tee, I'm so knowledgeable of so many subjects and trades and semi experienced to experienced in many areas it's hard not to be a know it all, but my know it all is limited to summaries lacking details.

It's hereditary, for example my little bro got a 2 year certificate from a vocational school and started as a technician at 3M building the designs scientists and engineers created. They can design the stuff but have no clue how to build it, and once built the prototypes were junk.

He moved to Kodak doing the same thing, than to another company working in R&D, They promoted him the technical engineer and years later to Scientist! They went through a lot of engineers and scientist promoting them to unemployed because they had the diplomas they didn't have the ability to apply the knowledge for any practical application. He told me many of these professionals were book smart but dumber than a rock. Could these be the scientists moving to Canada who should only be lab assistants?

"Uneducated are easier to control."

The VERY uneducated that doesn't even vote, maybe. And, the SUPER educated who doesn't realize reality and ONLY reads books, are VERY easy to control and be brainwashed. Unfortunately, probably most of those vote.

I recall Solzhenitsyn as the first person I became aware of at that time - not technically a scientist tho...

Ah, the war between the book learned person who doesnt know how to do anything versus the completely uneducated person who has no idea what there is to know so thinks they know everything.

patriciae

Kevin, my father was a doctor and a scientist/cancer researcher and I loved and respected him. My grandfather was like you, experience and knowledge in trades, built his own home, gardened, cooked with my grandmother, worked with electricity, I loved and respected him.

it's hard not to be a know it all

This is different than

thinks he knows everything better than everyone else.

You should be proud of your knowledge and experience. That is different from people who enter conversations and think their opinion is the only one that counts.

thinks he knows everything better than everyone else.

This shoe doesn't fit you. It may fit other/s.

-mostly because most of us don't have a reason to pay much attention to it -

I didn't say that people didn't have a reason to be interested in Canada. I simply said that for whatever reason, what happens in Canada doesn't usually appear in headlines in US media. I'm not responsible for that so I don't know what I don't know.

Hmmm, Elmer, seems that you did say it.

Being interested and paying attention are two different notions for me. If not for you, fine.

If someone is interested in something, they find ways to learn more and (for matters that change) to stay current.

When there's a written media piece, or a segment in a news show, or a book, or whatever, about a topic one is not interested in, then no attention is paid to it.

It would be nice if Americans looked past the Main stream media event of the day. Not a hopeful point of view of course. We as a nation could put out a little effort and know something about our supportive neighbor. We have the internet so learning more is not some deep dive or difficult project. So we ought to know and value our very supportive ally in Canada. We don't as a whole and that is a comment on us, not them. now we seem to have hit the wall there with our insular view of the world. This is not going to go well for us.

patriciae

patricia, you know as well as I do that the US has an embedded tradition of isolationism and disregard of the rest of the world. It's chiseled into stone. It's been that way for centuries, fostered perhaps by our geographic location. We have a national proclivity to pick and choose which few international matters to follow with all the rest being ignored.

Afghanistan was big in the news for over a decade. Have you heard anything about it lately? How about Iraq? Had you known anything about the significant cultural and religious diversity that Iraq and Iran once had and still have but to a lesser extent? I was schooled on that by a European colleague right after 9/11.

I was never taught European history in my K-12 experience in any depth. Were you? How about Mexican history? I got a bit more of that because of location and its regional influence but not much. No Canadian history or study at all.

Remember the person in this forum last month who thought Cinco de Mayo was Mexico's Independence Day? (It's not).

I don't read books about topics I have no interest in and I suspect neither do you or does anyone else. An exception for random things that may come along that are recommended that triggers a curiosity.

It's human nature, that which isn't right in our face is too far away to be seen or concerned about.

Elmer, so then you understand that commenting on something that is right in your face has nothing to do with jealousy or an enjoyment of seeing the misfortune of others. It seems that you think it is. It is not.

It is only natural that a Canadian would comment on what is happening in the USA.

Whether we like it or not, the USA is always in our face. I find your country interesting, to say the least. I like my neighbours, I am interested in them, and don’t enjoy seeing their misfortunes. We also enjoy their victories. (Well, maybe not in hockey. Go Oilers) 😀

We have a reason for our interest.

Go Cats =Panthers. Sorry, could not resist. A former neighbor founded the team. RIP Wayne!

Then I can assume that your comments are full of/ motivated by confidence issues, jealousy and resentment. Sounds fair. Deal.🙂

-

eta A comment of Elmer’s has disappeared. I can’t imagine why it would be flagged. Anyhow, Elmer said that he knew what motivated the comments of another poster.

I thought it was fine that we could then assume what motivated his comments. I thought it was a fair deal.

Elmer, I had European history in 6th grade. I still remember the heading of a chapter "Assassination of ArchDuke Ferdinand, The Powder Keg of Europe".

Patriciae, your comment made me think. When I was young and we got the paper every day, there would be a story sometimes noted at the very end "by Associated Press". You could look up that story on the Associated Press and see the entire story and information about what the piece in the newspaper used. I was astonished. I had no idea there was actually indepth reporting on things though you had to go digging to find it. I think the problem today is all we are offered is mainly people's opinions and even that is relegated to short pieces. There is no unbiased indepth reporting anymore. So everyone just chooses whoever's opinion they like and will die defending it. I wish we could go back to reporting just the facts.

HU-892

I am not a big hockey fan, but our province is just buzzing with Oiler fever. I love how much fun everyone is having. It’s fun to see. Even Calgarians are cheering on the Oilers!

" Then I can assume ....."

Adult comments and comments of elementary school age children are usually different.

murraysmom, we had classes from about grade 5 to grade 9 called current affairs.

Each day, one row, each kid in that row was given a topic. International news, national news, provincial news, city news, and human interest story. And one kid got to tell a joke or ask a riddle. It rotated throughout the month.

We had to bring a story clipped from the newspaper and read it to the class. We would discuss it after.

I can’t imagine that happening now. 🙁

Elmer, I don’t think elementary school age kids have commented here. I don’t understand your comment. Can you explain?

Nope. That comment is clear as my others.

Okay. 🤷‍♀️

I would like a clarification, though. I’m not aware of any school age children on this forum.

Can anyone else explain it to me?

Ouch Elmer. Inadvertent I am sure.

Well I did get a fair amount of European history. More I think than American. I also had current events in 8th grade, had to learn the current leader of each European country and so forth. Not much on the rest of the world of course. Still it was a shock to learn that Germany was such a young country when WWI happened. How did we not get taught that?

With a large community here of all sorts of Hispanic and indigenous American people I have been aware of more history here to a degree. I am always interested in history and cultures. It is not always history as we think of it. It is a common misperception about Cinco de Mayo.

Back when I was trying to figure out why Lincoln was so set on keeping the Union together I did research on our neighbors and realized at that time we were being squeezed by France in Mexico and of course Britain in Canada. Presumably this is a part of our desire to control our sector of the world in spite of it not being our international right to do so. Interesting concept that.

patriciae

patriciae, I kind of think I know what Elmer was saying, but I gave him the benefit of the doubt, and gave him a chance to explain. I‘d hate to think that it was meant to be an insult.

That wouldn’t be nice at all.

I just thought the way it was said was funny. I dont actually understand the allusion to kids though.

It is an interesting point as to when we decide that we dont have to learn things that "dont interest us". That could be very maladaptive indeed.

patriciae

It seems that a comment of Elmer’s has disappeared. 🤷‍♀️ I’ll go back and clarify.

In case anyone is wondering, I never delete comments I've made. If there's an error, I correct them and say so in the same comment.

I've seen some on this thread wishing for unbiased news.

Here you go:

https://join1440.com/ (that is a link)

Chartreuse, I have seen refernce to 1440 before but didn't follow up. I was a bit skeptical about them saying "just the facts". How does one know these days? I just looked at it now and will give it more attention. Thanks for the link.

murraysmom - here's a link from a reputable source that checks all news organizations' legitimacy, biases, and facts.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/1440-newsletter/ (that's another link)

Thanks, Chartreuse!

I don’t trust anyone wholeheartedly-and neither should you.

But I firmly believe RFKjr. is genuinely dedicated to uncovering the truth. Due to the deceit and corruption within certain organizations and Big Pharma, the public deserves the real truth from authentic and impartial scientists-not the corrupt, biased “activists” masquerading as scientists who have dominated these institutions for years. If there’s one thing about Cov*d-it shattered our illusions and exposed the corruptness in these institutions.

RFK JR. doesn't need a thing about science or a virus, and all he needs to know is how to manage people who do know science and virus, and to provide what America NEEDS. Note the caps on needs, and not what a political party wants.

Lets review Secretary Becerra's bio. Impressive 24 year career doing nothing in Congress and a Lawyer. His bio doesn't say he knows a toot about science and viruses. In fact there wasn't a qualified individual appointed by the last administration worth his weight in beans.

By the way RFK Jr. is worth $15 million so saying he's focused enriching and puffing up himself is absolutely ridiculous.

" It could be but he has absoultely no idea what he's doing. He's clueless and foolish. The profound damage he's causing will take years to fix, and some of the horrendous mistakes will never be fixed. "

I'd say this statement alone would be something a clueless and foolish person would say, misspelled word and all.

Every damn appointee of the last administration were fools and have already PROVEN they were clueless.