Okay, let's back up here. I think we're missing what I'm trying to explain. So, as a recap - citrus are not "acid loving plants". That was my first point :-) They actually prefer a neutral to mildly acidic environment - 6.5 to 7.5, but would certainly not fall into the category of azaleas/rotodendrons, for example. Otherwise, they'd never make it in California, where our soils and water are more alkaline. So, that was my first point. Secondly, I was postulating that the reason MeyerMike and other's container citrus were responding to acidified water wasn't because citrus "like it that way", as they do not, but that this has to do with the mix. Steve made a good analogy - using a much more porous mix (and there is nothing at all wrong with that, it is a GREAT idea for container citrus that have to live indoors for many months) is almost akin to a hydroponic environment. Is because such a porous mix with little readily available organic materials makes it harder for the roots to grab the nutrients (macros and micros). So, but acidifying the water, it helps those nutrients to be more readily available. Now, I use a much finer mix. I do this mainly because I can, first off (my container citrus being outside all year 'round), and secondly because I have to due to my very, very dry and warm summers (we get no rain to speak of all summer long, only in the winter). Otherwise, I'd have to be watering 3 times a day during the summer, which is not realistic. So, my mix allows for nutrients to be processed and made available, without running out of the bottom of the pot, so to speak. Think of it in this way: It's like 2 freight trains full of products. One is going at about 3 mph. You can walk along side the train and take off whatever you'd like to - that's my container citrus. The second train, however, is going 100 mph. It you're going to get anything off that train, all the doors better be open, and the products falling off the train - that would be the more porous 511 or gritty mix. This is the point I was trying to make - it may not be necessary to acidify your water. I do not and my trees do very well. But then, my mix is probably somewhere between the gritty or 511 mixes, and the actual soil in the ground. And, acidifying water isn't because citrus like it more acidic - it is helping the nutrients be more quickly available in a very, very porus mix with little readily available organic material (until the mix starts to break down as it ages). And Al, our citrus (especially younger citrus), will also become chloritic during the winter, and it IS due to the locking out of micros due to a combination of lower temps, our more alkaline soils and our heavy winter rains. So, we see both a general nitrogen deficiency chlorosis, as well as a manganese deficiency, and to a lesser extent, an iron deficiency (not really a true deficiency, as we have plenty of iron in our soils here, just that it becomes unavailable when these conditions exist). We use a cheleated micronutrient application like S.T.E.M. or GroPower's micronutrient product. Mike, I would never doubt your incredible success, but as Al has pointed out, you're getting the results you want, but it is based on other reasons. Nothing at all wrong with that, I was just trying to make a fine, citrus cultivation point, as acidifying water has because synonymous on forums as "citrus are acid loving plants". They are not. I respect your incredible success with your citrus, I don't think anyone has done it quite like you have. Your trees are outstanding, and not just because your acidify your water, but because of all the other fantastic things you do to make your container citrus the envy of everyone on this forum. Patty S.

Socalnolypia, I have Thomasville Citrangequat is a Kumquat hybrid as well, and I know for sure it has no problem growing in Atlanta outside unprotected when it has matured enough, of course in a ideal spot against the south or east wall of the house. If we talked about Kumquat hybrid between the 2 slighty hardy citrus, the off springs were usually less cold hardy compared to their parents! Atlanta winters have been pretty warm and stable for the previous 34 years. https://www.currentresults.com/Yearly-Weather/USA/GA/Atlanta/extreme-annual-atlanta-low-temperature.php Here is Dallas - Lowest Temperature for Each Year https://www.currentresults.com/Yearly-Weather/USA/TX/Dallas/extreme-annual-dallas-low-temperature.php By comparing the 2 reports from Atlanta and Dallas, we can see that in the last 10 years the lowest temperatures in 2 states were not much different. Dallas was not always warmer than Atlanta. By the year of 2011, 2013, 2016, Atlanta was warmer than Dallas and by 2017 both were tied at 15F in lowest winter temperature records.

Steve - Congrats on the getting from graft to flowering in a season! I noticed some of my citrus are going through another small flowering cycle too. Hope you can get at least one fruit from that as a prize. :-D

The fruitless under the can light Meiwa has finished its growth spurt with a total of 44 linear inches of new twigs with fresh leaves. It is now tied for the second biggest of seed grown Meiwa kumquat trees I picked the fruit off the other Meiwa tree at half ripe and the skin was sweet and the flesh was very juicy but not much flavor in sweet or sour. I was afraid a mouse would get it and it was the only fruit from a seed grown tree. I also picked all the much ripper fruit from my grafted meiwa and the fruit was sweet skinned with semi sweet tart flesh. very much worth eating. This will actually be the last entry for this thread from Me and I will continue this discussion in "4 seed grown 2 year old Meiwa kumquat tree for year 2019". I will leave a link to the new thread when I start it. forget what I said above. I did not expect this much change in one of the trees. Steve