I'm pretty sure they graft their own trees, but I think they don't do it year round. They grow on a yearly crop schedule so if they're out this year you will probably have to wait until next year. They grow the grafts inside in a greenhouse and then transfer them outside to screened-in shade houses. I believe they have at least 3 growing grounds far away from each other. And they're developing another larger, state-of-the-art facility in a very sparsely populated part of the state, mostly in response to HLB. They take that threat very seriously. Unfortunately for mail order customers, they supply most of the state's retail stores and that's the bigger part of their business and so probably takes precedence.

Too late now for charts. I have most of the trees I want to have. lol. I am familiar with the chart and referred to it many times for other things. When people see "dwarf" anywhere, common sense is that they expect a tree to top out around 6-8' max., and I see there is a disclaimer on the chart that if the tree is containerized and pruned, the tree can be maintained at that heighth. Here is my background. I have been growing citrus since 1984 or so and always believed dwarf trees topped out around 6-10' depending on pruning habits. I have grown semi-dwarf stone fruit trees in CA and they were about 12-14' tall with pruning. Computers were not invented then so I believed whatever FW advertised because I had no way to dispute it at the time. No Google when computers first came out either. To find out 40 or so years later that the root stock used by FW is not a true dwarf as advertised is shocking. My trees from them have always been small. The first group I had were either in wine barrels or planted in the ground and they grew slowly. After planting some in the ground, a few years later I moved to another house so I really did not get to see the inground trees mature. I took my containerized trees with me to the new house and 3 years later again had to move across country and left those trees behind. At no time, did I ever have a tree get older than 5-6 years old due to moves. Because of short-term ownership of FW trees, I believed all my trees would remain small. The Owari and Meyer I currently have are 3.5' tall x 4' wide right now. They are 15 and rarely pruned. After joining citrus forums and FB pages for the past 6 months, I see now that I have not been caring for them as I should by changing out the soil annually or fertilizing monthly. I did fertilize quarterly as commonly instructed. I am embarrassed by that but it wasn't done intentionally, just out of ignorance. Now that I see everybody else's trees in comparison, I feel bad for my trees and have seen the errors of my ways. I am 57 years old and my husband is 60. We do not want to deal with huge trees in large containers because of the weight factor as the trees mature and the trees need to come inside the house for the winter. The more you prune, either the canopy or the roots, the trunk stem is going to get bigger and heavier with age. That is my major concern. The majority of the members here are young and have a long time ahead of them before walking in our shoes. Dummy me didn't check the tags when buying from the big box stores either. I just focused on the varieties available. lol. That is the citrus addiction which I suffer from. lol. Anyway, that is why I am so focused on root stock now. Hindsight is always 20-20. I really need a dwarf root stock to continue enjoying this hobby as I go further into my senior years. Suzanne, I was composing this as you posted. No I have not seen a 100 year old bonsai.

Thank you Lucky. My NZL tree is in transit today from Four Winds. I have never ordered an entry level tree before and will be comparing it with my premiums that I have ordered in the past. I know that's not fair. I went with the entry because nobody at Four Winds will answer my question as to when the premium sized trees will be available to purchase. I think Kendra told me they are in production and Ashley had no idea. In two years, mine will be the same size as the premium. Your NZL is nicely structured. I hope mine will be as good.

Denise - what is funny is when searching around to see if citrus blossoms produce droplets of nectar like what you describe (we have seen peony buds do it) , apparently about 5 or so years ago, a research study was released that said that the caffeine naturally found in the nectar of both coffee shrubs AND citrus, may have had a beneficial effect to encourage pollinators. They speculate that despite the bitter "taste" (from the insect's perspective), the caffeine in the nectar actually helps pollinators like bees, to "remember" these plants as good sources of nectar by stimulating parts of their little brains (just like what happens in humans). The plants have adapted to produce just enough not to repel the insects but to still supply enough caffeine to be effective to produce the desired brain activity. Here is a lay article about the research - http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/science-sushi/2013/03/07/2634/ Here is a copy of the research from NIH - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4521368/ And this is a link to a paper on earlier research (from about 20 years ago) regarding caffeine in citrus flowers - https://www.researchgate.net/publication/239445039_Caffeine_in_Citrus_flowers So I think you were on your way to getting the equivalent of a good cup of coffee when you tasted the drops! LOL Steve - am hoping my NZL will do okay through the rest of winter and get over the "February/March" hump!