How did you cook the pork and what seasonings did you use in the meat mixture? There are lots of recipes out there and I have sort of combined them and do my own but first I put the pork butt into a big pot of water. It will cook quicker and more thoroughly if you cut it into pieces...they don't have to be real small just big pieces. In the pot I toss a chopped onion, some garlic and some cumin and a little chili powder, salt and pepper...Cook until tender and then I cool and shred the meat and remove all the fat. A lot of people like the fat but not me...I take out as much as I possibly can...after it is shredded, I pulse it in my food processor and then I taste the seasoning and adjust it to what I want it to taste like...usually add oregano, salt,pepper,onion garlic, lots of cumin and chili powder ...You can also just buy a package of tamale seasoning in my area...It's very good just not hot enough...we like ours spicy....Ok then I brown the meat, usually I have to do this in batches and then I make a little roux with some fat and flour and then I thin it like gravy with some of the broth from when I boiled it..just so that it is nice and moist but you want it to be mostly meat and not soupy or wet...not gravy...that's the meat..I make my tamales in stages even when I am not sick and this is the first stage. I store it in the fridge till I am ready to put them together. Also, did you not tie them and if not how did the corn husk not come undone after you rolled them? Well I have never seen a real tamale tied...I think that comes from the food network and all the fancy chefs ...truthfully I just roll them up and stack them like you see in the bowl and they stay tight...I just use a big pasta pot to steam because that is all I have but the big tamale pots are not expensive and every year I say I am going to buy one and never do ...You can use your water bath canner to steam them as long as you can raise them up above the boiling water...If the pot isn't full of tamales, then I wad up enough aluminum foil to hold the tamales up straight. One year I made so many I used my big nesco roaster to steam them. I steam mine for about 90 minutes but it really depends on the thickness of your masa...I make mine about 1/8 inch thick but many people put 1/2 in theirs... Here are the two recipes that I have used and that a friend shared with me and some notes as well...I never use beef but they are very good. You can also buy/make chicken tamales in my area and they are wonderful as well but I just love pork. I use lard because that is traditional but you can use oil or a lot of people use very little fat and mostly broth for the tamale dough... Tamales Filling: 8-pound Boston butt pork roast 10-12 garlic cloves 1 1/2 cups chili powder 1 teaspoon cumin 1 teaspoon cayenne pepper (or to taste) Cut pork roast into chunks and boil with salt in water until done (approximately 1 1/2 hours). Reserve broth. Grind pork and garlic cloves into large pan. Add chili powder, cumin and cayenne pepper and "massage" into meat until color is even. Masa dough: 4 cups instant masa harina 3 cups pork broth 2 cups warm water 1/2 cup chili powder 1/2 teaspoon cayenne pepper Mix all ingredients in bowl until smooth. 3 or 4 packages corn husks Soak husks overnight (at least 3 hours) in warm water. Separate and clean. To make tamales, spread a generous amount of masa mixture in center of husk, but toward one end. Use the back of a spoon to spread. It doesn't have to be even or "pretty"-it evens out pretty well while cooking.Put about 2 tablespoons of meat mixture along the center of the masa. To roll, pull the side edges of the husk together and fold just above the tamale and wrap. Fold the "tail" up. Place rolled tamales in pot with steamer grate in bottom. Open end should be up. (Laying the pot on its side to fill makes it pretty easy and pot should be at least 8 inches deep). Fill pot until fairly full so that when upright, tamales do not shift. If you don't have enough to fill the pot, use crumpled aluminum foil to hold tamales upright. Carefully fill pot to about 1 inch below top of tamales with remaining pork broth and warm water. Cover and cook on high until bubbling. Reduce heat to medium and cook until the husks peel away from the husk easily. The recipe said 45 minutes but that hasn't ever been enough for mine. Tamales Filling: 2 pounds lean, boneless beef, pork, chicken or venison 3 tablespoons cooking oil 1/4 cup flour 1 1/2 cups water 2 beef bouillon cubes 1/2 cup canned green chilies, chopped 4 large cloves garlic, minced 1 1/2 teaspoon salt 1/2 teaspoon dried oregano 2-3 tablespoons ground chili pepper 1 tablespoon chili powder 1 tablespoon ground cumin 1/4 cup tomato sauce 1/4 teaspoon cayenne pepper In a saucepan, cook meat in water until tender. Grind meat; brown in hot oil. Sprinkle flour over beef while stirring. Dissolve bouillon cubes in water and add to beef. Add remaining ingredients in order listed. Cover and simmer 45 minutes. Masa dough: 1 1/2 cups lard 1 1/2 teaspoons salt 4 1/2 cups masa harina 2 2/3 cups warm water....I use broth....makes them richer In a large mixer bowl, beat the lard and salt until fluffy. Mix together masa harina and water and add to lard mixture, beating well until the ingredients are combined. To assemble tamales: To soften corn husks, soak them in warm water for several hours. Place 1/4 cup tamale dough in center of each husk and spread it into a rectangle. Spoon 2 tablespoons of the meat filling down the center of the dough. Lift the sides of the dough to the center and press dough edges with fingers to seal, then finish by putting the edges of the husk together and folding around the masa, folding up the "tail" at the end. Cover and steam tamales over medium heat for 1 1/2 hours. Yield: 6 dozen. One more thing....the masa recipe for the first recipe makes a much lighter masa filling than the second one in texture as well....so I really like that texture for the masa the best....I buy masa at Wal-Mart and truthfully I use the recipe on the bag for my masa dough... These are notes from a friend of mine regarding making tamales Making tamales is not difficult but it does take a little time. The meat and chili filling should be made the day before you assemble them. For assembly it is best to have at least two people. This recipe can be halved. If you dont plan to freeze them you can also eliminate the parchment paper wrap. I never did this until the past few years. It does make a difference in storage. I have used this to teach with and it is very similar to what I was taught as a kid. Because we make so many I have found it very convenient to use my large electric roaster. Tamales Filling 5 pound pork butt 5 pound beef blade 4-6 cloves garlic 2 large onions, chopped 2 tsp. cumin 2 tsp. Salt 4 oz. Hot dried New Mexico chiles or c. ground or to taste 4 oz. Mild dried New Mexico chiles or c ground or to taste 4 T. oil 4 T. flour 2 cloves garlic, pressed 1 tsp. ground cumin, or to taste 1 tsp. Salt Place meat in separate pots to cook. Cover with water, skimming foam from the surface as it cooks. Add half the onion, garlic, cumin and salt to each pot. Reduce heat and simmer until very tender 2 to 3 hours. Drain and save broth. When cool shred meat with fingers or a fork. Mix pork and beef together. Red chile Wearing rubber gloves remove stems and seeds from the chiles. Rinse, put in pan and cover with water. Bring to a boil and simmer until soft about 20 minutes. Remove chiles from pan and reserve water. Using tongs, place 1/3 of chiles in a blender add one cup of the chile water and puree. Put through a colander or sieve pressing until all bits of peel are removed. Process the rest of the chiles in the same manner. In a large pan, heat the oil. Add the 4 T. flour. Stir over medium heat until browned. Do not scorch the mixture. Add the puree, pressed garlic, cumin and salt and simmer for five minutes. The puree will be very thick. Add the remainder of chile water or broth until the consistency of tomato sauce. Combine shredded meat with red chile and refrigerate overnight. Next day 10 pounds of wet masa 2 pounds of lard 1 or 2 packages of dry cornhusks 1 jar of green or black olives, optional 1 can sliced jalapeno, optional raisins, optional Note If wet masa is not available in your area you will need a large bag of dry Masa Harina and follow the directions on the package. Put the cornhusks in hot water. Remove silk or debris. Let soak for one hour. Shake water from husks and dry on paper towels. Using a mixer, whip lard in a mixing bowl until it is light and fluffy. Remove from bowl and divide into thirds. Divide masa into thirds. Using the mixer blend 1/3 of masa and 1/3/ of lard at a time. After all three batches are mixed put it in a large bowl and using your hands mix well. Slowly add small amounts of warmed reserved broth until you reach an easily spreadable consistency. Add a little salt if needed. Assembly Hold the corn hush in the palm of your hand pointed end toward you. Spread about two tablespoons of masa on the top part of the husk, leaving about a one-inch border all around. Put two tablespoons of the meat mixture on the top of the masa. If desired top meat with an olive, a couple of raisins and a strip of jalapeno. Bring up both sides of the husk, press them together and then fold over the top to make an envelope. At this point you can leave your packets as they are or place in parchment paper and fold into another envelope covering the whole tamale. Tamales can then be frozen on a flat cookie sheet then placed in ziplock bags for storage. Note. It may be necessary to overlap cornhusks to be large enough to fold. Steaming tamales Stand tamales on end on a rack over water in a large pot. Cover with additional corn husks. Bring water to a boil, reduce heat cover and steam at least two hours or until the masa pulls away from the husk easily. If the tamales are cooked fresh not frozen they should cook in one hour. You can see that the recipes are basically the same and there are many others out there as well but keeping it simple is good for me....I'm 70 and even in good health don't have the stamina I used to have. They are fun to make and fun to eat. I love having them in the freezer...I use them in Tex Mex casseroles, when we have chili I put a couple in a bowl and add the chili ...I just run them under the faucet to wet them, wrap in a paper towel and nuke them and they taste like I just made them. This morning I made them for breakfast, nuked 3 each, covered with warm chili gravy and cheese and for my husbands I topped with two over easy eggs and more chili gravy....He was groaning with pleasure cause he said it was so good.<?B>

Sneaking in late.good job Nancy starting this thread! Alexa, please post a picture of you all done up to the nines. Stacy have fun with your pork haul, been following the conversation on your thread. Good luck with car shopping toomy 10 yr old, 150K van is still going strong but starting to creak.maybe Ill let DS #2 have it. Yikes! AM these years will fly. Sharon the weather is finally turning cool here too and I may try canning again, good luck with yours. Hang in there Goldgirl, one day you will have a life again. LindaC (still want to go to LindaWhatever) let us know what you do with those apples. Pat T: One more semester! One more semester! One more semester!!!....... One more semester! One more semester! One more semester!!!.......that enough? Maggie I have no concept of close up the house, but good luck. Annie, DS #2s English teacher has a photo of a giant fork stuck in a road on her website. I chuckle every time I get there. I hope that chef puts out food worthy of your standards, I know youll be analyzing every dish to see if you can do better. Bring us some good recipes, and pix of salmon hauls. Mimsic feel better. Wednesday night approacheth. Duane, 11 dogs.wow. Glad you have the work but oh boy thats a lot of poop to pick up. Stacie, glad your gallbladder is cooperating until you can deal with it! Doug, my in-laws are dealing with a bunch of elderly cats. You guys are all saints. Hey if the pizza turns out, I have some caputo flour I can send ya. I picked up some at a local Italian store (same one I get my 6-in-1 tomato sauce, also beloved by pizza heads). My DH is the pizza guy here so I may get him to make something tonight. Hmmmm..cool weathermaybe pizza. Sherrmann we are busy w/bdays in October too. I notice lots of bdays this time of year.means people are busy in February when its cold, and nice and warm inside? Darfc. Shaun watch out I might just crank call ya while you are working the phonesFeel better! Rhome410, nice haul, welcome again to the forum. Dedtired I feel your pain. DH has more time off work so he has decided to go on a closet clean out rampage. My closets too. Grrrr. Sometimes being single looks good. Hey Ellen think reciprocation.vacation in New Zealand? Photo ops! Lyra, mixed blessings, eh? Stick to your guns, sweetie. Tobyt, by now you should know is OK for non-liner postings, LOL. Youre an old timer and have earned it! SharonCB, welcome home! Susie hang in there, I think the market will turn around, but not for a while. I have friends in similar boats. Terri, keep your finger on that farm job. Somehow I bet that teen wont last long and theyll be calling you again. Bri29 enjoy the projects, gotta love em. Me? I surf WAY too much. Awwww David. You need a HUG. Sending you a big one. Looking forward to the real thing in November. Peppi, glad to hear the house survived that rain you showed us. And a Foodsaver set up looks PERFECT for that new couple, good thinking! Katiec, my favorite librarian, keep on trucking. Jojoco were couch potatoes. Im jealous! Happygram youre not as much of a lurker as you think you are bwahahaa. Hey we have our own quilter on the forum, Teresa NC7. Go check out her excuse me thread on conversations, if you havent already (too lazy to check). Sprout26, Im craving Utah againtime to think of skiing. Happy Anniversary! cotehele, I have a funny Il Trovatore story (were BIG operaholics). When the kiddies were young, we took them to a student preview. We had prepared them by showing them the movie, telling them the character/story, playing the music (especially the Anvil Chorus) and of course showing them the Marx Brothers A Night at the Opera. DS #2 fell asleep in the car on the way there. He woke up crying I dont want to sit through a three hour opera!. The minute the house lights went down, and the curtain up on the castle scene, his eyes got big and he was enthralled through intermission. We sneaked down from nosebleed to third row center after intermission. After the show he proclaimed mom, if I can sit here, I want to go to operas! Ka-ching, ka-ching.um grow up a bit, kid when you can sit through the Ring cycle, well add you to our subscription. LindaC, every time there is an empty seat by us, I put you there in spirit. Kathleen.enjoy a quiet weekend. I like alternative busy ones with quiet times. [hint: I open a Word document, make it a smaller window, and catch up from there.] Chancesmom, give that girl a hammer and nails and put her to work on that demo. We put ziplocks of time capsule stuff in our bathroom walls when we were remodeling a newspaper, a letter, etc. I asked the future owners why they dont like my gaudy Italian powder room, LOL. Rachel, good luck moving. No info on the new kitchen? My turn? Yikes! Friday we had my inlaws over for dinner, DH put a chicken on his beloved Big Green Egg. Im the only one in the family that doesnt like chicken/beef on that thing. It was a late dinner because he had spent the afternoon in downtown LA talking with a Bee Keeping company. Because of our garden, we now have a hive on our side yard (pretty sure its Euro not African beasties) and DH wants to keep it but move it down to the bottom of the garden. May not be doable, but hell try. Its next to a row of oleanders and he says honey from those blossoms are toxic, so we wont be harvesting any. Saturday we started setting up our sukkah or booth for the Biblical Festival of the Tabernacles which starts Oct 13th. We come up with humorous decorative themes remodeling (hanging power tools from the roof), disco, my favorite a few years ago was mentally ill bible heroes. Lots of those! This year Im thinking it would be topical to choose either Jewish bankers (good AND bad) or Jewish political candidates. LOL. Last night we took the kids, as part of DS #1s bday present, to see The Capitol Steps; he is into politics. We went out to a good Japanese restaurant, his favorite, before hand. Good laughs. Poor kids bday falls on Yom Kippur eve this year. Bound to happen as he was born the day after YK. Today DH and I are going to a swap meet to pick up more parts for the sukkah. I think Ill put up a pizza (Dougs fault) for tonight. I have to start planning Yom Kippurs dinner meal on Wednesday nightDS #1 has asked for salmon in puff pastry, and I suggested it would be good with an avgolemono sauce, with orzo pilaf on the side he is delighted. Whew, it was easy doing this on Word, with the TGIF thread open in another window, then cutting and pasting! Clinking with water to everyone (big water drinker)!

I forgot to say I added about 1/2 cup of applesauce to the bourbon sauce which enhanced the flavor & gave it a nice consistancy. Annie, we spooned a little of the bourbon sauce over the stuffed squash which really brightened the flavor. I'm the lucky one. When we got married Alfred told me that he did not like macaroni & cheese or stewed tomatoes, but he would gladly try anything else I sat before him. And he has always thanked me for the meal, even if it is a sandwich & chips. :-) John, I'm nowhere near as adventurous as you when it comes to food. I always enjoy 'hearing' what's for dinner at your house, even though I sometimes think "Ewwww!" Lol. I don't like fish, so I say ewwww a lot. Don't laugh, but I still have to master making homemade biscuits! I've made them & they ate them, but nobody complimented me on them. :-( I don't know what new dish I'll be trying next, but I'm going to be having fun with the cookie recipe thread. My daughter is coming up today & we're making a shopping list to begin. Our first Thanksgiving meal of the season will be this Sunday at church and everyone loves cookies! Thanks for the encouragement. I'm always lurking here wondering how y'all do it! it's fun to be almost 60 & still learning new things. I had gotten into a boring culinary rut. Betty

In anything that has a usual flavor, substution is either about approximating that flavor and texture, or just making a good dish. I think either the water chestnuts or the kale would work just fine...but you might want to adjust the other flavors to go with them, and make it into a ”new” dish. Garlic (maybe roasted or fried) and beet greens would work. Parsnip (also pre-cooked to get the texture right) and radicchio (Pre-wilted?) would work. Again, making the rest of the dish to go with. The choices you did make, are close to the original and made great dumplings, like enough to the original recipe, I daresay, but there's no reason not to jump off the page, use what you have and slap your own name on the result. ;)