Another note: I want no windows in the master closet and it
is based on my past experiences and not negotiable.

1

I like that the kitchen lines up to the dining, but the pantry
is far from the garage and it is far to the back porch for grilling and the
view is through the dining room.

1b

The kids rooms are different and smaller, which is ok with
me as once they move out they won’t be used much. Only have 1 kid, but may
adopt one that is older.

2

Kitchen is close to grilling, but dining no longer has a clear
view. Has more storage and we can head into the house with one door to pool
bath and the kitchen so fewer exterior doors to worry about, but will have one
from the living room too. Pantry is smaller and so is pool bath.

2b - see 1b notes

3. Similar to two, but moved the lookout which means it will
have a view through tree tops in most directions and will be further from the
clear view, but still have it. Game room got longer so more space for playing Kinect.
Have a larger storm room that can be used for storage too.

3b - see 1b notes

4. Kitchen, dining, living, all have a view and more
exposure to the front which is south. Footprint is smaller, but the entry is a
bit odd to me. Not sure I like the angled entry, but on the other hand I do not
like an entry that doesn’t have a foyer space and I don’t see how a foyer could
be added without making it an obstacle or protruding out in the middle or
something. I just can’t picture either what is there or another protrusion
anywhere on the front under the porch.

4b - see 1b notes

Since no one else wants to play, how about another variation on the kitchen in the back (3), with the stairs more central to the living area? I know you said not to get too detail-oriented, but when it comes to kitchens I can't help myself. :P

It's probably a little out of proportion, but by turning the pantry I'm estimating the kitchen changes to ap 14.5' wide. The island would be 3.5 x 8'. The pool bath has a door off the kitchen, so this might be a non-starter, although the view of the door is blocked from all but anyone at the clean-up sink.

Why aren't you working with your architect to establish a concept and develop it? There's more to architectural design than simply connecting rooms together.

'

Thanks mama_goose - I can't remember the reason but according to the architect the overlook has to go on the left or right side of the living. I'm guessing it is structural.

Virgil - this is from the architect, he asked us to decide in which direction we want to go. I just re-drew them so they are more readable for review. We have lots of others that didn't make the cut as in even considering them. As you can see from the one I posted from the architect it is hard to read and missing dimensions that I had to use a ruler to get and knowing this forum always asks for dimensions I figured I'd improve readability and add back in the elements from 4b that we asked if we could take those and put into 1 instead of the spiral staircase he had used. He was going for a larger storm room and trying to save space. I didn't draw every single adjustment from the different drawings as it got to too much measuring and since I'm asking about the general arrangement I figured in the interest of time I could save some by copying and pasting some. If it affected bump outs significantly I adjusted my drawing as compared to the architects. Again aiming here only for the general arrangement and not the details. I may not have the garage exactly aligned as he had for example.

ETA I did take the liberty to add the different secondary bedroom arrangements we have been presented with and that are workable for what we need onto each iteration, even though the original didn't come that way.

I flipped the DR and stairs again. With the pantry turned, it still looks as if there's a clear shot to the stairs up. However, the DR view is still bisected by the shared kitchen/LR wall:

I like the one room deep #4 with a reimagined entry - perhaps centered on the porch and bumped out. With your acreage, you can stretch to the max and create a gracious circular drive and a real airiness to the main living spaces.

I am sure your architect can come up with a better solution for the entry. :D

#4 would work with kitchen and dining open to each other, with a slightly extended pantry and bath. The long porch wall could be a galleria of 3 or 4 windows:

Do you have any exterior elevations that would go with the interior floor plans? I’m not understanding all the unnecessary jigs and jogs unless they are there to conform the interior to the exterior.

I also do not like that you’d have to go through the kids game room to access the kids bedrooms. Having adopted an older child, I see this layout as VERY problematic if you do end up deciding to pursue that in the future for a variety of reasons.

mama_goose - thank you for taking it beyond overview as it helps too. Just a note there aren't actual walls between the dining/living/kitchen/hallway/etc. I was just trying to show the arrangement more than anything and quickly. The actual drawings from the architect does not have walls there.

just_janni - that is my preferred as far as the kitchen/dining/living and all the light that would be in those areas. But I just couldn't get past the entry part. Maybe there is some other way and I think that entry might be an artifact from an even older version where it also served as a hallway to the kids area. I'm just doubting we'll get to something I'd be happy with there.

shead - can you please expand on the game/kids living area and bedrooms off of it? The people I know that have them love them so we specifically asked for the kids living to be by the bedrooms. I'd like to understand better so we can think through it. As to the bump outs - the master bath and living got bumped out to have a view and also in response to my husband saying he didn't like the area flat. The kids bedroom ones I'm not a fan of and has been discussed in the past. We have seen elevations for everything on the architects computer, however I stopped taking pictures about 10 iterations ago because we've had so many of them and already discussed changes to what was presented so no point in taking a picture of an already outdated drawing. I guess I should have done it for these, but my general feeling was still of unhappy with some of it.

I'm still not happy with the kids area. I'm happy about the higher level location as we want the family bedrooms all on one side of the house, but the rooms end up being oddly placed to me in either. We have been through so many different sketches at this point that I'm loosing faith (made a post about that in the past). These were the ones closest to something to work with and I'm still not wowed although they meet most of our wishes we provided the architect so maybe my expectations needs adjustment.

Well...in my opinion you are driving yourself crazy over floor plan alternatives, for no real benefit or gain at this point. I could be wrong, of course.

The reason I say this is because architects experienced in residential design work simultaneously in three scales: site planning, floor planning and exterior elevation/roof planning. For example, all those notch-os and bump-os on your floor plan have very strong effects on your exterior elevation and roof plan. But are the effects positive or negative? The only way to know is to study the exterior of the design, and the floor plans are explored.

And, what about the pedestrian and vehicular access routes to and from the house. What about views? What about site drainage? The only way to know is to study and consider the siting and site planning for the house. Siting and site planning have strong impact on the form and placement of the house.

Your 30-year experienced architect may have done all that, reviewed it with you and your are knowledgable and in agreement with the direction of the design. If so, I apologize.

But what we are seeing on this thread gives the appearance that the architect has handed you some floor plans and asked your opinion of them, without any thought to site planning and exterior design.

And what is the underlying concept for developing the house? Is it to be a craftsman style house; a ranch house; and International School modern house? As I've said in a previous post above, architecture--successful architecture--always has a guiding concept for development of the interiors and exteriors. It's about much more than coupling rooms together.

This, in my opinion, is where you should be spending your time and your architect's time.

Virgil - Our architect has done that and I'm guessing he is getting frustrated with us as to the many iterations and maybe that is why he wants us to pick a concept that we can continue to work on. I don't think any bumps or whatever is set in stone. He just wants us to pick a concept to start working on the details and I don't feel like we are there yet. Unfortunately some of the elevations like the bumped out front bedrooms aren't visible in 2D and I missed that until I drew it up from the plans so because of that I've decided I'm going to continue to draw them up as sketch myself so I see things better. He has said several times to not worry about bump outs or much until we pick the general concept to work from. We are going for a nod towards the hill country look and all limestone with metal roof.

I'm afraid to post some of the older stuff that I do have photos of because I really don't want the focus on those. I think I have a photos of about half of the plan iterations, but not site and elevation as no point in taking it when the plan didn't work or they still had the scale wrong for the site. Still battling that one 6 iterations later.

Here's an elevation and the plan from one of our iterations and the concept was further developed except we went to regular stairs and back to investigating spiral stairs. The exterior has some funky things on it due to the layout that we noted when reviewing it (see to the left of the front door, odd roof thing on the right of main etc.) beyond the interior not meeting several of our wants/needs and I'm not a fan of angled rooms.

Here's a site plan that went with the original post and it still doesn't have the scale corrected on the drawing. The house and all need to shrink by 50% to match the scale of the survey. The power is being moved, but would actually be well beyond the house even as it currently sits. We just want a better view and see it as little as possible. We've had numerous conversations about this and don't know why it is not corrected yet. Personally I would prefer the house to be along the tree line angle, but we haven't talked about that yet because we always end up talking about the scale being wrong. We took measurements and put them in to hopefully show the architect at our next meeting to have this finally put to rest.

Thank you and my apologies. You have done your homework! Living in the Texas Hill Country myself, things now begin to make sense. Good luck!

Virgil, thanks, but not sure any homework is helping me at all. Maybe this is how the process is, but I'm stuck on being able to pick a concept to move forward with. I just made some comments on each one where I noted things I liked and didn't like and sent to the architect. Maybe he can meld something together to make us excited about it and also fit our budget. I did really like his aires suggestion even though we have now with the stairs upped our budget yet again.

I was hoping to see the elevation with the aerie, but I suppose it won't be added until you decide on which side it will be located.

mama_goose - we've seen it just that I didn't take a picture of it as the size and stairs/alignment etc. was going to change. At first I took pictures of everything and then with all the changes it just didn't seem important anymore since it wasn't staying that way.

We may be meeting today and if so I'll take a picture of it no matter if it is where we want it or not or the right size - depends on if we can all find a time to meet due to lots of other things going in our life. Our original meeting time has turned into us needing to go for an emergency orthodontist appt.

@lyfia, line of sight parenting is critical in adoption, for many reasons. Also, just because you adopt an older child doesn’t mean that their emotional and intellectual maturity will match their age. Felt security will be a big issue and a new child feeling so separated from parents may not fly for a long time. There’s really no room here to expound on the MANY issues you might face that could be lessened by a better floorplan but it might be worth it to you to contact an adoption social worker with lots of experience and pique their mind about what they’d recommend based upon their experience. I had to take some things into consideration regarding my son when we planned our current new build. You might also have to consider handicap accessibility issues as well depending on what adoption route you may pursue.

shead I really appreciate your perspective and will gladly listen to any advice you can give me. Since this is something that may or may not happen I don't want to plan the house around it, but rather consider ideas that allows flexibility if need be, but also understand that there are many different issues to consider. I talked to my friend who is a counselor at a childrens advocacy center about the room arrangement as she also has this setup in her house with 4 kids although she has bedrooms first and game room after the rooms. She didn't seem to have issue with it but maybe because she knows we are a family that adjust as needed.

Is the concern that the bedrooms are too far away or that the game room that is meant to be only be used by our kids while hanging out with friends and xbox game playing by the whole family isn't as visible. The idea isn't that she is going to spend her time in there the rest of the time, but she wanted either a larger room or a space where she and her friends can hang out. I thought the game room part was a good compromise as I don't want her and her friends closed into her room, but also understand they want some privacy and this gets the xbox kinect out of our living room. It is very similar to the usage of our friends although some uses it as a playroom for younger ones which seems less successful.

BTW by older we are talking tween or teen.

These are not bubble diagrams and none of them are very helpful. Stop using a computer and hard straight lines. Use a soft pencil or felt tip pen with colored pencils or markers. The designs Shown are stiff as a board and difficult to comprehend. If your architect is wondering where it all went so wrong, it’s when the client took over the design and now the entire world has been invited to participate.
This happened to me once when I left a roll of tracing paper and a scale at the client’s house. I would get fat envelopes in the mail with drawings in #2 pencil that I had to copy to increase the contrast. I now save rolls that are almost used up for home visits.

So RES should I tell the architect to stop using the computer? I’m just redrawing what we got so I could see it better as the originals requires me to measure sizes on room etc. and hard to read at times. I don’t know where to go from here with the architect. We tell him what we like on each iteration. I’m not drawing things for him. I drew his drawings for me using the dimensions I measured on the drawings. My title says just past bubble diagram as we stated with general locations With no shapes. Now we get the shapes as shown in the original posts, which I redrew so I can see them better of which I shared mine here and Have already described my reasons for.

Go back and design without the computer. A computer is only useful for designing an office building with a written program or construction drawings. I became an architect when all work was drawn by hand and computers required punch cards. You could spot a good designer from across the room. A 2D computer drafting program is the worst design tool imaginable. You are constrained at every task and there is no awareness of scale and nothing is more essential than scale for creative design.
I only use a computer in the design phase for renovations but I stop when I have an existing conditions drawing. Your diagrams are useful graphic representations of a program but they are only for reference. How spaces relate to each other is far too complex to be restrained in any way. When I’m designing I use a handful of colored pens and pencils and usually have a section and elevation or a perspective sketch developing at the sides. What I am looking for is a hierarchy of relationships: small ideas that reinforce big ideas. Your diagrams bring everything up to the same level. To even understand them I would need to sketch them and there are just too many of them. I like to consider all possibilities but if there are more than three I know something is wrong.

I’m sorry I can’t expound right now as I’m on vacay with my family and typing on my phone is cumbersome. I would want at least one secondary bedroom off a main corridor and easily accessible to a bathroom. Older tweens and teens can also pose a flight risk depending on their background so, as a parent, I’d want to be where I could hear them during the night.

Sorry I'm not an architect but are people really bashing another architect's process because they aren't drawing bubbles by hand??? If so you are completely missing the point of this post and discussion and are being bogged down in the detail of a computer. Perhaps you are the ones who should be thinking outside the bubble and accepting that a box can theoretically show the same concept. Some people act like there is only one way to do things on this forum.

Of them all I like 4 the best. But I would not want that angled entry. I would want a ton of glass/windows along that front wall and a feature door that was not angled on the home. So I would have the whole front area be as deep as you need an entry to be and make it a really beautiful large expansive area.

Modern Exterior · More Info

Cortona Exterior · More Info

SeaThru · More Info

@lyfia Before selecting one of the options, I suggest you consider whether the plan meets your life style and whether the room sizes relate to what you plan to put in them. (If you’ve already done that, so much the better!) I suggest laying out furniture, cabinets etc in each room. Your plan appeared to have a small, formal dining area. I personally like Mama Goose’s informal dining area. Which fits your life style? Just glancing at the plans, it seems a lot of space is allocated to the kids’ game room, but the kitchen (heart of my house) and MBR seem a bit small. I’d also consider laying out the kids’ game room with double glass doors that abut the hallway so you can see what’s going on in there. 😁 I put a high priority on views and windows— wish I had put more than I did into my new build.

RES and ARG and others how do I make him work a little more fluid? I would say he is not of the school that it has to be done on the computer as our first ones were hand drawn and I resisted moving away from that, but he started and then he asked if we could move towards the schematic phase and I assume this was because of money. We paid him what is in our contract to start this phase, but I did say I would like to not get too deep into it without having more worked out, but don't know how to go back to more sketching.

WARNING very long from here:

So far how it has worked is we gave a list of wants/needs for every room we'd like to see that includes some things as bedroom needs to fit a king size bed with 2 night stands, want 2 ac systems, want family bedrooms on same ac system and with privacy, would like an exercise room away from family bedrooms (I work out early and don't want to wake my light sleeping husband, access to closet from master bathroom, a den for my husband to sleep in which also has access to to master closet/bath, an entry that is not a walk through area from one part of the house to another, etc. We have gotten sketches and sat down and gone over those and said what we like and don't like and talked about other options.

Actually the first plan sketch I was more excited about, but my husband said he prefers to have a single story house with all main rooms downstairs. This meant due to space we needed to move the location of the house. We also went through some talk and sketching about where shop and house would go based on moving the house to a different location. The first sketch at the new location didn't meet many of our wants, then moving to a different shape things got more into meeting our wants as in family bedrooms nearby but still privacy, but some pieces still missing which took several iterations to manage to happen. I did sketch at his office what we were talking about on top of what was drawn and then the next one skipped it completely so we did the same again and now that one is finally understood. It was we need a walk through mudroom and not off to the side so all things gets dropped there that needs to be or can be otherwise it goes into our house and ends up wherever. Oh in between there we also got a bunch of drawings for individual rooms to fit the things we had shown that were very large. Larger than need be for our requirements as those came up to a little over 4300 sq ft. This made me just draw some boxes to see if that size was really needed to fit what we required. Ie the dining room was 22ft long which seemed excessive for us to fit a 108" table considering we have it now in 14ft x 12 ft. It is a little tight, but workable and a couple of feet would help and be enough. Note I think I have the order right, but I'm not hundred percent sure based on having a porch and then no porch, but I thought the angles came before the more rectangular shape. We could also have had a few in between. I had to go on a hunt to dig out any we had left as I have no pictures saved.

1st sketch

After changing location

shape change and some extra things we didn't need

After feedback on not a fan of the angles (excuse my marks on there trying to figure out a size in the room marked dressing which was way too large). this was our first computer drawing.

After this one due to some sizes seeming very large (feedback to architect) and lots of measuring was needed on my part to figure out the which was the size of a room and if things would fit so this is when I started doing a computer drawing in ppt to check sizes as some rooms seemed very large and others I wasn't sure how to place furniture etc.

Then back to a hand drawn one where most of the angles were removed.

The feedback on this was we like the shape overall, but the kids living didn't meet our needs and I really didn't like the walking through the entry. We need a laundry room and not a laundry closet, mudroom needs walking through, pool bath access not requiring a walk through the garage - hazard, exercise/bedroom more private and not in middle of the house and near a bath. Concern about the heat of the sun in the front of the house etc. (porch came out of that). We had some in between with some of these things again discussed, but I can't find the copies of those. Then came the computer one I posted above in response to Virgil.

Then we have the combo's I redrew already posted along with the last one in the OP with the spiral back in and a larger storm room and we talked about back to the regular stairs and the angles not being our first choice, upping our budget again and here we are needing to decide on something. I sent an email asking him if based on what he knows now about our likes and wants if he was starting from scratch what would the house look like? We are meeting on Friday since last week we had to cancel.

What can I do to help things? I know I do I have some strong likes and dislikes of certain things. I have given up on some already and I'm willing to consider some angles as long as furniture placement and closet space doesn't suffer. We need 7ft minimum in the kids rooms, clothes and toys are stored in it.

For garage placement I'm open to it's location, but it needs to be placed in conjunction with our shop so driveway and entry point through mudroom works. The shop is a little tight to fit on the left in front of the house (can't go in the back due to land slope) and on the recommendation of the architect we picked the right side as it is visible either way a bit as you drive in (right or left), but slightly less so on the right and the orientation allows covered open storage for trailer, tractor etc. hidden from the house, driveway, and neighbor. If on the left it would be more visible by us or the neighbor and from the drive towards the house. The architect is using 80x80 rough dimensions placing it. We liked how he put it with the house on the right and the L balancing the shop which sits on a lower slope on the land when on the right a bit more so than if on the left. The shop placed that way also shields the view some of the residential power line that need to cross and goes to our neighbor downhill on the right.

I guess the rooms fit our lifestyle although some seem a bit larger than needed. This is my reason for drawing the rooms so I can get an idea of what fits and I can easily draw in boxes for furniture and test them. Just looking at a drawing doesn't always tell me the size is actually ok and I don't remember the measurements and it gets busy with noting it on the small drawings. It helps since some of the drawings have been quite small and not always the same scale. One thing I figured out from this was that we had an extra 1/2 bath we didn't need as well, I just didn't see it on the drawing. At least that was better than things missing.

@mtpo - we don't have any formal areas - a single dining area as we are very informal. We do need room for our existing large table though to seat family and friends. 9' long and 3.5' wide.

I don't want a large master bedroom and agree the game room in some of them is too large. The master closet is way too large as well.

@AS - I'd like windows there, but we need to go less modern looking as DH can't get on board with that at all.

The OP said. "I’d like to hear your thoughts of likes and dislikes of the drawings"

My earlier comment pointed out the difficulty of understanding the drawings in their current condition. What is missing is what architects are taught in the first semester of design school: graphical and conceptual hierarchy .... the grading or weighting of concepts and of the graphical values that represent them. In other words, the communication of a design is greatly dependent on the quality of the drawing.

Not everyone in design school can draw well but in order to survive they quickly learn how to emphasize the most important information in a drawing.

Every line on this drawing is contrary to good design communication. I won't bore you with a breakdown but notice how well the exterior wall thickness is drawn and dimensioned.

IMO such a large and complex design program will continue to be variations of a rabbit warren of corridors until some spaces are put upstairs - a basic use of hierarchy - and your architect should have already explained it to you.

Lyfia, you must love to carry laundry, since in all the different plans, you have the laundry room as far from the children's bedrooms, and your Master bedroom as you can get. (56+ feet from your M Bedroom, and farther to the other two bedrooms adjacent). Carrying that laundry will get old fast. It is closer to the exercise/guest room, however. I'd work on functionality with your architect a bit more. Best wishes on your new build!

Jazz Easy, our original had we wanted laundry closer to the bedrooms it's in our original wish list, but the architect wasn't keen on when I asked if it could go in a few different areas nearer the bedroom. He thought that would be odd, but did put one nearer, but then it was a laundry closet which will not work for me. I also do laundry at night with the delay start feature so don't want it to be so that it wakes anyone up. I tend to get up and start fixing breakfast and stuff while it is in the dryer and then take it out of there so nice when it is closer to the kitchen. Near the mudroom is good too so our dirty stuff from outside can go straight into the laundry and we can hang pool stuff in there to dry on the hanging rack we want. I also stand and fold laundry in the living room while watching a recorded TV show. Generally only time I watch any TV shows. So not matter what there will likely be some back and forth. Our laundry is presorted in our closet or kids bathroom into re-cycling bins so it is just grab a bin and carry to the laundry. The kids have a slight more distance in any of these than they do now. We have about the same distance, but a straighter path than currently. Since each location has a good and bad with it I decided no matter what there would be walking involved. If for some reason I can't carry I'll get a cart like my MIL uses to transfer it and until then it will be good exercise.

Well...this is a long thread, with lots of illustrations and discussion points...but I'm not sure that it really answers the OP original question, "...need help in deciding on house plan direction..."

At least I don't get any coherent direction from the comments. Maybe I'm the only one.

From my perspective, the primary need is to establish and stick to a single overall organizing concept...a concept which includes and involves site planning, exterior architectural character as well as the size and arrangement of major and secondary interior spaces.

The location of the laundry room is simply one very small component to deal with.

This sort of focus and refocus on how to couple rooms together can continue till the cows come home...and not be any further along towards development of the design than it is now...until and unless someone comes up with and commits to an organizing concept.

Good luck!

So Virgil I thought that the architect should be able to help with that. Does it look like that is what he is doing? I only know how we live so all I can provide to the conversation with the architect is the things that relates how we live. Should I stop doing that and would that help. I think by now hopefully he knows what they are. Should I not comment on what we like and don't like in response to drawings. Should I stop worrying about if things fit into the rooms etc. Would that help?

When you say organizing concept what do you mean?

What can I do to help things along? I asked the architect this and his response was unlimited funds, which wasn't constructive for me to know how to improve from our side.

What Virgil means is the same thing I have said: there is no hierarchy of ideas. In the drawings everything has an equal conceptual weight as well as line weight. When I originally saw this post I couldn't find the front door and gave up. There's no furniture or counters so there's no sense of scale, a common problem with computer drawings where the operator can zoom in and out. There's no zooming in architecture.

Lyfia, I sense and understand your frustration.

It's normal for many consumers to be fixated on function. Is the dining room big enough for my table? Is the laundry convenient? Where should the farm sink be located? How many pendants should I have over my island?

These are normal and important issues for many consumers. Unfortunately, the answer(s) are usually "it depends..." since there are an endless series of criteria to consider, and choices which could be made.

Designing a custom home is an endeavor which is chock full of choices to be made. Functional choices are only one category among many.

Some of these issues include siting and site development; form; function; budget; schedule, etc. Then there are less tangible categories to consider: what is the purpose of the new house; what do you really want the new house to be; what will make the house appealing, enjoyable, rewarding, comforting, supportive to live in--now and in the future?

All of these things (and more) may have equal weight in evaluating and making decisions. Functional issues such as location of the laundry room are just one among many categores for making decisions.

Have you had discussions about some of these categories with your architect? Are your decisions/selections embodied in the schemes he has given you to examine and evaluate?

My sense is that it may be helpful to shift your attention to other categories of decision making, beyond functional (if you have not done that), while not ignoring functional items important to you.

If it were me, I'd be looking for some overall organizing concept for the house, which could help make decisions in all of the areas where decisions will be needed. Google "organizing concepts" and see if some of the images and information may be helpful. Have seen and read some of the books on architectural residential design? If not they may be helpful. There are some good older threads here on Houzz discussing them.

Hope this helps. Good luck!

Lyfia....since you asked myself and others about your process in your lengthy reply, I've meant to get back to you but have been too busy as I wanted to give it some thought. I'll shoot for the weekend.

Lyfia, I don’t know how many times you’ve revised plans buts it’s a long process. We did it at least seven or eight times to get to where we wanted to be and even then, as we built, made changes because once on site and in spaces we realized windows should be bigger or stairwell slightly over etc.

Do you feel the overall shape and spacing of rooms is what you would enjoy as a family?

Virgil, thank you - I looked it up and I see pictures like these (https://www.pinterest.com/pin/19632948348455555/ )and I read this article as well (https://www.yourownarchitect.com/spatial-organization-in-architecture/). To me the plans appear to have an axial concept, but to be honest I'm not sure I want to learn about it too much further. I'm swamped at work and needing to learn enough new things there at the moment to feel like overload with this too which is why we hired an architect. Or am I off base and I'm supposed to know these things to be able to work with an architect.

As to books I own and have read the following ones:

Get Your House Right: Architectural Elements to Use & Avoid

Patterns of Home: The Ten Essentials of Enduring Design The Ten Essentials of Enduring Design

The Not So Big House: A Blueprint for the Way We Really Live (Susanka) A Blueprint for the Way We Really Live Susanka

Not sure at this point if I want to read anymore. Maybe a how to work with an architect to achieve something that lo

I'm not sure how to step back from the function of the house though and look at other things - not 100 percent what other things to look at beyond does the elevation work and outdoor spaces work with the site. The siting seems good to us by providing us with the view that exists although it is through a bunch of large live oaks so not always a clear view and also affords us privacy from roads/neighboring properties and works with drainage. The shape of the house with the sort of L sticking out front looked like it balanced the shop that will be to the east of the house better than when the shape was just a rectangle and the driveway location seems to work with drainage and access to shop and house.

The function and how tasks I do in the house will flow are the most important to me and the second one is light in the main areas of the house. We have discussed these things with the architect. The most important for my husband is the shop and second (which is also functional) is his own den to go watch TV/sleep in when he has difficult sleeping and access to the master bath/closet without someone (me) from the master or kids disturbing him or him disturbing me while sleeping (our schedules are very different). He wants quiet overall.

RES - I'm not sure the lines or measurements like that bother me. I never even noticed those measurements. Could be because I'm so used to looking at multiple layer 2D drawings of transistor layouts that my brain has to convert to 3D so maybe I'm just used to filter certain things out. So should we ask the architect to highlight things differently or? I seem to not fully understand what we should ask for. I don't think the hand drawn ones had any emphasis on anything either.

ARG - thank you and much appreciated. Any advice on how to suggest your charrette method at this point to the architect? We did have something where we went through and sketched relationships after the rectangular plan, but .

AS - well I think we are on 14 or so now. Just got another one yesterday afternoon via email he said he was sending the site and elevation too each in separate emails, but haven't seen those at all yet in my email. There are some things I like and others I don't at all in most of the plans. If I ignore hallways/stairs/reach-in closets and such then locations of rooms work in general, but is very spread out and too large in some cases. If I look at the hallways and how to get to places I don't like how the kids area is done at all from a functional standpoint. It is too far to go wake someone up and no easy quick checking in on anyone in the kids living.

ARG - thank you and much appreciated. Any advice on how to suggest your charrette method at this point to the architect? We did have something where we went through and sketched relationships after the rectangular plan, but .

Ok, after a hectic week, I'll attempt to respond. The thread's gotten a little convoluted and difficult to follow so this is probably better addressed in a dynamic back and forth question and answer phone call as opposed to via this static dialog box and I tend to not get involved if there's many other forum designers already weighing in as they all tend to talk past each other but here's my thoughts.

It looks like your architect has decent methodology and talent. A lot can be garnered from a drawing. Eero Saarinen mused "To me the drawn language is a very revealing language: one can see in a few lines whether a person is really an architect". So I don't think the problem is there as we've all seen so many other times on this forum.

What may be happening is you've got all these boxes to check off and you're trying to check off every one. Somewhere in the thread you noted compromises but I don't know to what extent those where. It's a subtle slippery slope from a creative process to a box checking one. Start with big ideas (the parti in architect speak) and work toward the smaller ones.

So, with that said, I'd try to get your architect and ALL decision makers at the same table for a four or five hour design session to sort everything out. Starting with the big ideas that everyone is happy with and working toward the smaller ones. I illustrated one below (or above....lol). IIRC, you wrote something about your husband looking at one version and not liking it (I think it had to do with one vs. two story) which lead me to believe he was not part of any process, just a commentor of the end result. I could be wrong but in any event, ALL decision makers need to be part of the charrette.

Here's a link to another Houzzer who was in your same predicament. We got her local architect to try a charrette (I actually had a couple of phone conversations with the architect about how they work) and it went well. There's also an embedded link to another architects blog where I describe the process. https://www.houzz.com/discussions/3598813/we-fit-an-architect-into-our-budget-and-it-was-so-worth-it

But good luck. Exciting times ahead!

There is a lot I like in this plan. I very much dislike the entry though.

I would love to see the exterior.

ARG - Thank you so much! I really appreciate the information and making me feel better about my architects work too even though I don't feel we are there yet. I am trying to see if he'll do this with us and I will happily pay him for his time if he feels this is outside our contract. It is just trying to convince him without offending him that I need to work on before bringing it up as I'm a very direct person.

AS - there is some I like and some I don't like at all. I'd love to see the exterior too as I really dislike the entry as well. He didn't send the elevation, but he is a bit computer challenged so getting this by email was a surprise. I did get a site plan in the mail, but not the elevation. I think there are some bump outs that will make it look odd too.

What I like:

- Open, kitchen, dining, living area and kitchen close to porch for grilling

- Access to lookout from main areas of the house

- some storage closets

- mudroom walk through

- general arrangement of family bedrooms in same area and so it can be on the same ac system for cooler temps at night and warmer during the day

- closet separation from the bathroom for the kids rooms and some privacy from the kid's living

- regular stairs

- pantry not so over-sized as in other plans

- storm room size

- bedroom privacy

- 4' hallways everywhere

- size of some of rooms are good and would fit what we need

- pool bath have exterior access

- m. closet (dressing) has no windows

What I don't like:

- siting - the clear view is north and the m. bed, m. bath, and bed#2 have the clearest view. The rest is through trees and their canopy and they are mostly live oaks which keep their leaves during the winter so it is a peak of a view vs. a clear one. Seems like the main rooms should take more advantage of the clear view, but maybe that has something to do with west being that way too. Although the western sun is blocked by trees that sit higher about 1/2 mile away (not on our property) so it never hits the house as it is today. It is also moved over about 30 ft from where it was before, not sure why that is which also diminishes the view. Also the new electrical is shown all wrong and would run through the shop as it is placed and the equipment apron is supposed to be on the east side of the shop so we don't have to look at the tractor and trailer.

- would prefer sort of a main shape of a house and the others looking like additions to that main shape, but I can let that one go if need be.

- the pool is not what we expected as we needed a pool that also has a swim lane - not just a swim lane and where it is placed I'm afraid it would have a lot of drainage running into it and requiring retaining walls to avoid it along with stairs to it. We prefer no stairs for access.

- light is blocked from the southeast to kitchen, dining, and living with the hallway wall, stairs, and pantry.

- The entry and how it interacts with the porch. Only a few ft in front of the front door and the porch divided into two areas where one is small to not be useful for anything but provide some sun protection.

- Kid's bedrooms very far away to go and wake-up in the morning and having to walk back and forth to kitchen and getting to those bedrooms in the morning feels like a maze to me. My mornings are wake-up, laundry, work out, shower, laundry of WO clothes and then meal prep for breakfast and dinner, wake kiddo up, kid eats, then goes and gets dressed while I clean-up/finish up and then I have to keep her on track while doing this or 10 minutes to get dressed can turn into 30 min. Then kid comes back and grabs her lunch and puts stuff into her backpack in the mudroom and always have to go back to her room for something and then we finally leave. The house just doesn't seem like it will make my mornings easier, but rather harder. I'll get a workout for sure and so will the kid.

- the kid's living is too far removed from the main part of the house, oversight is just not simple without walking through the maze which could be good for sound, but also not for a quick check-in and a lot of yelling from kitchen or walking to get there for example to tell them dinner is ready. Might also get too noisy for the den nearby with xbox Kinect play which can get very loud at our house.

- bed#2 and #3 shape is a bit odd and two different sizes. Haven't measured to double check that 2 is 1 foot x closet smaller, but from looks it appears to be.

- some rooms are over-sized such as m. closet, m. bed, pool bath, laundry, mudroom (although we need a lot of closet space here so it would be utilized)

- view from 4th bedroom walking out is into the mudroom (door will never be closed to the mudroom)

- storm room has an exterior wall (may or may not be important)

- longer walk to the laundry than before and more turns and it holds our cleaning supplies as well except the bathrooms has their own.

- some other more detailed things, but I don't think we are at the point of details yet.

ARG - BTW I found this - https://www.lifeofanarchitect.com/design-in-a-day/ and I sent the link to our architect asking him if we could do something like it and offering to pay him for his time. Hopefully we can work something out and work towards an end in sight.

So we met with the architect yesterday and I was able to see elevations so for those that asked below are pics. We talked about several changes overall and spent 3 hours there doing some sketching and talking about the things I could put my finger on that I didn’t like.

I had no luck as to the charrette idea as the architect said this is what we have already done and then asked if we hadn’t accomplished the goals of the main rooms all having a view which they do so can’t point to anything there. Does the room sizes and general location not flow as We have talked about and yes they do and other things like that where I can’t really say anything. So we are there with the general layout as is As I can’t really communicate or even know myself what it is that isn’t working for me.

i described my issue with the distance from kitchen to Kids bedrooms and the result is some adjusting of hallways, walls and an intercom to let them know dinner is ready. I bit my tongue on this one as my husband finds the arrangement great. He wants the noise contained. I want ability to check in without disturbing. Moving the hallway closer to living areas is the compromise we are doing.

nothing on the odd shape of the kids rooms. If we want some privacy to the bathroom that is something we have to live with Apparently. Some things were addressed and others not Such as the entry. My husband is fine walking straight into the living room and I’m not and the architect agreed that is not the best choice. He is going to work more on that part.

Talked about windows and bedroom window sizes and locations on more than one wall. I didn’t think I should have to bring that up. So now I’m feeling like I need to learn about window placements too.

siting will go back to as before. he has the north arrow located wrong so from now on I will just go with what he has and adjust in my mind.

anyways I’m good at writing very long posts so better stop now Or it will be another book.