You pretty much walk into the dining room in both of them. You could define the spaces a bit more with a half wall or columns/posts. Lots of options there. In the first one, I think I'd take bedroom #3 and make it good sized bathroom. Take the bathroom & loft space to make bedroom #3. That's a lot of bedroom for such a tiny bath!!
Site planning does have a lot to do with it, but if you have an idea of what you're going for, getting ideas with plans isn't going to hurt anything.
Reading the info around in here is absolutely priceless...

How many people in your family? What part of the country?

You say you don't like the front door opening into the dining room - but that is the case in both these plans.

Both your plans have you going through the master bath to get to the closet. You must be OK with this - I definitely would not be.

Both plans have 2-story rooms - again, I am not a fan. It sounds like your budget is closer to modest than unlimited; I would advise against planning spaces that have to be heated and cooled, but provide no function.

In both cases the path from the bedrooms to the laundry room is a maze. Ideally, laundry should be on an outside wall to easily vent the dryer.

The Abigail is a bit better in terms of natural light - at least the kitchen has a window. The dining room in the Bradford is going to be downright gloomy.

Any time I see "Flex room", I read "Here's a space that doesn't serve an obvious function in the home, but maybe we can pawn it off as a Mom Den". An efficient house plan will have have rooms designed to do double duty (office/guest room, for example), instead of plopping in rooms that may or may not be used much.

Assuming you have kids, the Abigail has no second living space. If adults are having a conversation in the great room, it will be drowned out by kids playing Mario Kart in the loft. Depending on how many kids, the little Flex room probably isn't going to cut it.

jannicone - We would certainly appreciate that! We found many plans
online that we liked, but haven't found a builder who will allow us to
bring in our own plan. I've emailed a number of builders, and they
either don't build in the area we're looking to build in, are out of our
price range, or we just haven't heard back at all. It seemed like Drees
and Schumacher were our best/only options, but I'd be happy to contact
anyone you know in the area.

One Devoted Dame - I know!! I saw that and thought it was strange too! We would obviously choose to have a railing. :) Thank you for your feedback - those are
certainly great things to know! We are very new to this process, so any
tips are helpful! We hadn't really looked into using an architect, but
maybe we'll have to do that.

Lori Wagerman_Walker - Yeah, know they both kind of walk you into the dining room, but I think the Abigail doesn't feel as though you are walking into the dining room quite as
much, because it is a little more sectioned off with columns. We
actually did discuss adding a second bathroom upstairs. We also talked
about adding a full bath downstairs, instead. So that if we used the
flex room for guests, they would have a full bath to use downstairs, and
it would be easier for older guests, so they wouldn't have to use the
stairs. But yes, we do have a pretty good idea of what we're looking
for, and there are just so many options!

If you are building on 20 acres you can do much better than this. These are houses meant to be built close together on small lots.

There is no guest toilet on the first floor in the second plan unless you do the optional guest suite, and even then it is a full bath, not really a powder room for guests.

I am really not a fan of either but the second house would be eliminated immediately for a number of reasons.

They both have TV on the master bedroom wall with no buffer and both have master closets connected to master bathroom. I don't like either of these details due to noise and dampness, respectively.

"Open to below" space can make your rooms too cold downstairs and too hot upstairs in the winter. Railing vs short wall -- a short wall helps reduce noise from downstairs disturbing the bedroom closest to the railing. A TV in the loft of the first plan may fight with the sound of one downstairs. (We have a vaulted ceiling, short wall and game room more down the hall but still have a lot of "turn that down" going on.)

Consider your furniture with the stairs have that many bends/turns.

AnnKH

Currently, it's just my
husband and I, but we plan to have 1-3 children. We are looking in the
Raleigh/Durham area of North Carolina.

Yes, I realize that
they both kind of walk into the dining room, but the dining room in the
Abigail is a bit more sectioned off.

I think we're okay with walking through the bathroom to get to the closets. What would be your issue?

We
both would like a 2-story great room - I realize that it's wasted
space, but we like the openness of it and the natural light that the
wall of windows brings in.

Regarding a second living space,
that is something that I like in the Branford, compared to the Abigail.
We discussed possibly trying to close off the loft in the Abigail for
the exact reasons that you mentioned.

I appreciate your feedback!

Personally, my closet is thru our master bath and I fracking love it. Hubby's door to his is in the bedroom. They actually back up to each other and buffer our bedroom from the garage.
I love mine because I can go in the bathroom, turn on all the lights, shower (including singing), get my clothes, blow dry my hair, put on the rest of my clothes (middle aged fat woman, hot flashes suck), get completely ready without waking him. We leave at almost the same time in the morning, but of course he's up & out in 5.
However, we have absolutely no problem bouncing around each other in the bathroom, one on the pot, one in the shower, doesn't matter to us. We only have 1 sink too!! I needed the counter space way more than I needed to stay out of his way while teeth brushing. :)
I know some people aren't as brazen as we are... YMMV.

I don't like the clothes near the steam from my long showers. I'm concerned about mold in the closet. Plus, now I want the bathroom to myself. Our closet is a buffer between the family room and the master bedroom.

If you do build a house with a vaulted or open ceiling, consider where you put the thermostat for upstairs. Ours is in the hall and because of the rising heat in the winter, will not trip on to heat the upstairs bedrooms. An HVAC company suggested moving the thermostat into one of the bedrooms to get a reading of an occupied space. I had our unfinished storage area sheet-rocked upon move-in and it has provided valuable storage over the years.

This is a great time for you. I remember selecting our forever home as a pre-child couple and watching our three grow up in the space.

My objections to a clothes closet in the bathroom:

- I don't want to have to lug laundry baskets through the bathroom to put away clothes.

- I'm lazy - I don't want to have to go 20 extra feet (as in the Bradford) to grab a sweater out of my closet.

- If Hubby is doing anything in the bathroom, I don't want to go past him to get to get to the closet - nor do I want him interrupting my bath to get to his closet.

- If you insist on closets in the bathroom, make sure you put in plenty of ventilation, so your clothes don't end up damp. You end up with a lot more volume that needs to be dehumidified.

- Corners are the most desirable spaces in the house, and the Bradford ties up a lovely corner with a big closet. Yes, the closet has a window, but sunlight quickly fades clothing, and you aren't going to get a lot of cross-ventilation from that window. How much time will you spend in the closet, gazing out the window?

In the first plan the powder room toilet is closet to the master bedroom than the master bathroom toilet.

All the bedrooms upstairs have no sound insulation from one another. I could go on and on, but those are the first 2 things I noticed.

The second plan requires walking through the kitchen to get from the garage to the rest of the house and as ODD mentioned is a fat house that will have an oversized roof and won't let in lots of light.

You can do much better.

As others have stated, first find the land and then find an architect to work with. Find a small builder, not a production builder. Production builders build fast and build to the lowest common denominator. Meaning they build the minimum required.

As for not hearing back from other builders, that's because the best ones are busy now. Call again and be prepared to wait for them.

As others have stated, first find the land and then find an architect to work with. Find a small builder, not a production builder. Production builders build fast and build to the lowest common denominator. Meaning they build the minimum required.

Yes. Talk to people you know. A local custom builder would be a definite plus.

You have no land and can't decide on a plan or a builder. Hopefully you at least have a budget.

You said above "Also, if we decide to go with a builder like Drees, they purchase the land that we select as part of the process, so we'd have to at least know that we like some of their floor plans prior to getting the land and working with them."

Do you mean that you'll find the 20 acres, and the builder (Drees) would purchase YOUR property? That's a red flag in my book (we talked to one builder for our house who wanted to do this). What if you select your property, and Drees buys it, then you change your mind about using that builder? What if that builder goes out of business? Why would the builder purchase your land - the one we talked to said they needed to use the value of the land to get financing for the build. You don't want to be in that situation.

Really, you can find an architect in all sorts of price ranges.

Problems with the Branford:

As mentioned, the first thing you see when you walk in is the dining room. The second thing you see is the angled staircase.

Speaking of the staircase, winder stairs are about the most dangerous.

The laundry is quite a distance from the master bedroom. Imagine hauling laundry from the bathroom or closet, through the living room, then the kitchen, then around the family foyer and finally into the laundry room. No thanks!

Like others I'm not a fan of walking through the bathroom to get to my clothes for all the reasons stated. YMMV.

The closet shouldn't get an outside corner of the house. Outside corners should be saved for rooms that we use more than a few minutes a day.

The family room will not be 21'10" of usable space. The actual usable space is more likely 13'10" based on the fact that the entry to the owners suite interrupts the usable space towards the bottom. Meaning you need a pathway.

Don't you like your guests? Making them sleep off the kitchen?

And then to get to the bathroom, being in full view of the outdoor sunroom or deck.

Speaking of dining, notice what a hike it is to the dining room from the kitchen? Now imagine doing that night after night carrying hot plates.

Open to below sounds nice until you actually live in it.

The angled closet in bedroom 4 makes for unusable space inside.

The entry into bedroom 2 is just wasted space.

Why do the bedrooms upstairs only have a single window? How depressing.

"Don't you like your guests? Making them sleep off the kitchen?"

As long as they have breakfast ready by 7:30 am I will like them.

Anm - Do yourself a favor, contact a few local architects and talk with them about the benefits of designing a home with them. You don't have to be another vanilla cookie.

You don't have to be another vanilla cookie.

I'm a gingersnap, myself.

Oh good lawd, if you are buying your own land and building, your options are endless. Don't marry yourself to either of these plans as both obviously have issues. Check out smaller custom builders and definitely hire an architect. Now is not the time to saddle yourself with a subdivision plan. As others have said, your land will decide a lot.

Especially on large plot of land there is nothing wrong with building a simple rectangular house with a single peaked roof and direct exterior exposure of every room in the house except powder rooms, the pantry and secondary bathroom.

And furthermore (lol), with 20 acres, you might consider doing a one-story plan. I'm not sure if basements are feasible in your area but, in my experience, 1 story plans with a walk-out basement would be ideal long-term.

If you can't afford the forever plan at the moment and also don't have any kids to fill it up right now, you could have an architect design a house to be built in 2 stages. The main part to accommodate a young/small family and an addition to be added as the family get larger, in quantity and size.

Have you read this thread below on Schumacher builders? The first post was made several years ago, but there have been some recent posters, too. Lots of information on this builder.

Houzz thread on Schumacher homes

It wasn't a big deal until we had kids but now it's awful.

^^^ I approve this message. ^^^

-- Mom of 6, 5 of which are BOYS.

See, this is another area where I think it's more a matter of preference than any hard and fast rule. We have a five-year-old and a two story great room and we love it - it's nice to be able to keep an eye on the goings-on upstairs when she's up there alone or with friends, and she likes that she can also keep an eye on what we're doing downstairs. That said, we don't have a t.v. in our great room (by deliberate choice unmotivated by its two-storiness), and I might feel differently if we did. We also really love the light we get from the big wall of windows (and it's a south facing room, so we couldn't get anymore light just by reorienting the house).

@Kristin - I probably wasn't as clear as I should have been in my posting. When I said that orientation is critical, I meant that, with proper orientation and design, any house can be light and bright. Certainly, a one-story house, with windows oriented to the south and east in North America, will be lighter and brighter than a two story house with windows facing north.

And unless you're backing onto a forest, as we were, you definitely don't want a lot of big windows facing west.

So, a floor plan that would work for a design around light coming from the south won't necessarily work for one facing in a different direction. And we don't always get a choice about orientation: where the road is, the slope of the land, the setbacks (or, what we call here in Aus, the "building envelope") can limit which direction the house can face. That's where the issue of designing to fit the site comes in.

As to whether you want a two story or not, I agree that's a matter of taste, but I wouldn't go for it solely because one thinks it will be lighter than a single story. Like the song say, "It ain't necessarily so" :)

I would ck with the local lumber yards and get recommendations for local builders and stay away from tract builders. IMO....track builders are the worst out there.

All, you have been so very helpful, and we truly appreciate
all of your feedback! It’s clear that we need to look into the possibility of
using an architect. To be honest, I think we had read and seen some things that
made us feel that an architect would almost certainly be out of our budget, but
as one of you pointed out, you won’t know unless you ask. We’ve already started
our research, and my fingers are crossed that we’ll find an architect who is
able to work with us within our budget! If any of you happen to live in the
area and have any recommendations, we would really appreciate it!

You all have also opened our eyes to a few things we didn’t
really consider, or didn’t realize could pose an issue – having to walk through
the master bath to get to our closets, the placement of the laundry room, the
cons of a 2-story great room, etc. We have a lot to think about and consider,
and again, we really appreciate all of the great feedback!

Chispa – we LOVE your suggestion! That had never really
occurred to us, but it makes a lot of sense. Since we don’t have children yet,
and it will be a couple years before our family really begins to grow, our
second story will remain largely unused for a while. If we could have our main
level built now, and leave the second level unfinished, for example, we could
save up front, and use what we’ve saved to begin building our events venue even
sooner!

Lastly, as most of you have pointed out, we should find some
land! We have been doing research and have spotted a few pieces of land we’re
interested in, but like the builders, have had trouble getting in touch with
realtors to take us out and show us the property. We finally have a meeting
with a realtor tomorrow evening, so the process of finding our land will hopefully
be underway very soon!

It's Spring! So go out and hit the local Parade of Homes thingies. TALK to the builders, who are usually there. (Sometimes this is more likely on weekends than on weekdays) You'll rapidly get a feel for who you like and who you don't want to work with. You can do two other things this way: Get a feel for what given room sizes actually are like, AND start getting an understanding of who costs what. Bonus - those homes on the parade that are architect designed will usually have contact info for said architect. Be warned - everybody gets innundated right after a parade, so even after you've TALKED to builders, it might be a while before they follow up with you - they're trying to follow up with the 100 or so people they talked to.

Keep up the land shopping. Hint - if you can't pay cash for the land, then use it as collateral on the construction loan, you may not have the best current plan. At the very least, you should be able to cover the cost of the land with what you get out of your current house when you sell. In my neck of the woods, the best land parcels never actually get listed. They're snapped up by people "plugged in" to the local network. I got around that by using the GIS system to locate likely parcels and contact their owners.

When considering leaving an unfinished upper space, do take into consideration that all the expensive stuff must/should be in place when you do the original build (plumbing, electrical, HVAC, etc) or you will pay a LOT more later. Thus, unfinished upper space doesn't save you an enormous amount of money up front.

First you find the land, then you get an architect that designs a house for the place you want the house and it might be on a hill which will have an effect on the design of the house. Do this in order instead of trying to make a house plan fit the land.IMO there is no point in critiquing either of these plans without knowing where they are going.

shead agreed... You're better to build small with room for expansion, than build "unfinished" areas.

Shead and Lori, I understand! It was just a thought that came to mind - we'll obviously need to talk with the architect/builder to see what possibilities we have if we go that route.

Go find land! :) ha... keep us posted!

I certainly will!! :)

BTW: If you can't find an architect locally, there are several here who will work remotely with you.

I would think carefully if you want to have a first floor master bedroom with the rest of your bedrooms upstairs with a newborn. With small kids I want a space that can be the toy room that is not part of the living/dining room area that I personally like to keep picked up from toys. The flex plan provides this space, but it would not have any site lines or connection to the kitchen or the rest of the house...my 2 year old would certainly not have played in the flex room while I made dinner. I guess the flex room could become a nursery if you made a door in the closet...it just does not seem ideal

A first floor master is great with a newborn. Just put a bassinet/pack-n-play in your room. Plus, they are great when recovering from injuries, surgery, or just aging in place.

I had a Little Tikes play tunnel and a toy box in the family room until my stair-step aged children outgrew them. I could see them right over the breakfast bar but it wasn't immediately visible from the front door.

Yeah, our thought was that if this is our forever home, we want it to be accessible when we are aging. It's also just more convenient, in my opinion. I know some folks have mentioned not wanting to walk the extra few feet through the bathroom to get to their master closet and grab a sweater, but I'd also rather not have to walk up a flight of stairs to grab a sweater.

We planned to use either a flex space/guest room/bedroom downstairs as a nursery, and we had talked about using the sun room area off of the kitchen as more of a play room, so that we can keep an eye on the kiddos while we cook, etc.

@anm6831, we access our closets through our bathroom and love the set up. I actually vote for having all clothing (undies, etc.) in the closet to not have to go back into my bedroom to retrieve forgotten items from drawers. DH is notorious for leaving the bedroom door open :/

We built our home ( used an architect and custom builder) 32 years ago. It has a master suite on the first floor, but we wanted to be upstairs while the kids were young. So, that is what we did. Our " kids" are now 34 and 35 ( and not at home!),and we are still sleeping upstairs! Our room has 5 windows and nice views. Of course the first floor master is still there in case we need it in the future.

DH and I are residential lot developers. We will sometimes build spec homes when a new section is developed. In order to keep the costs down we always have walk out basements with plenty of Windows. We do not finish that space because we figure that the homeowner will want to make their own choices,. Maybe this is a way that you can keep costs down at the onset. Once the kids arrive/grow you can determine how you want to use that space.

Enjoy the process!

I forgot to add, 20 acres is a lot of land. Our first home was on 14 acres ( DH was from the city so he wanted LAND)! We were there for 8 years before we built our current home on 2 acres. Keep in mind that your 20 acres will border on other properties and you can sometimes be reaponsible when something happens. We got a call from an irate property owner because one of our trees had fallen on his property. It was not a dangerous situation and had caused no damage. But, we still needed to deal with it. We had dirt bikes come whizzing by our deck, horse riders were cutting across the front yard, a bullet came flying by us and pinged off our downspout, and hunters were killing deer down by our pond. Gosh, I miss that place. :)

grapefruit1_ar - I can't remember if I mentioned this in my original post, but our long term plan is to also build a barn wedding/events venue on the land. So, we're looking for a bit more land to encompass our house, the venue, parking area for venue, etc., while also maintaining a barrier/privacy from any neighbors.

We actually did look at a few house plans that had a downstairs and upstairs master suite, but I wasn't sure how I felt about that. It just seems like whichever one we aren't using would be a large waste of space. I suppose whichever one we aren't using could be used as a guest suite, but we also don't have that many guests. :/

I would definitely be open to the possibility of an unfinished basement to cut down on cost up front.

So many things to consider! I appreciate your feedback! :)

Well...with this level of complexity in land selection, site planning, architectural design, possible phased construction...have you considered working with someone who knows something about what your situation actually needs...

Someone like...an architect?

Might save you a lot of time and money. Really.

Flo Mangan - We are certainly doing our research before making any final decisions, and are aware of the issues we may come across finding land, due to zoning. We'd like to avoid costly mistakes, as well!

Virgil Carter Fine Art - Yes! We are in the process of setting up meetings with a number of local architects to see if they can assist us.

"I'm inclined to choose the option that lets me have more customization, to ensure that our forever home is EXACTLY how we want it"
There's a species suited to that; Homo Architectus. The subspecies Homo Architectus Customis Residentialis is particularly well suited.

"It’s clear that we need to look into the possibility of using an architect."
Make that a certainty, I'm with you.

"I think we had read and seen some things that made us feel that an architect would almost certainly be out of our budget"
Devious lies to defame the art. No, it is true it's a significant expense, but it's a valuable one. The good ones will keep you on budget.

"You all have also opened our eyes to a few things we didn’t really consider, or didn’t realize could pose an issue"
Kudos. Being open to feedback here can go a long way.

Good luck finding that architect. And the land..