Sit on the money.

I’m not exactly sure what you mean. Would you characterize the contractor choosing to use the demo crew/apprentices to lay the hardwood floor as a customary practice? Does laying hardwood flooring require a specific skill set and threshold level of experience? I’m assuming the contractor’s decision is cost driven. I want the job done to professional industry standards, and it was disconcerting to see the demo guys laying the floors. Joseph, I would greatly appreciate you elaborating further.

Laying hardwood is not technically hard. It popping tongue n groove together using floor nailer and cutting length so no obvious pattern Its time consuming but easy. The hardest part is making cuts around door stairs etc. The more technical comes when sanding stain n seal. Im no pro but installed prefinish all the time very easy. I also installed my own in unfinished oak and hired a professional to sand n poly.

When we installed hardwood throughout our main floor, we found a super meticulous guy. He literally spent days prepping the subfloor, and he spent about a day for each three stair treads. I didn't mind as he charged by the project and not by the hours. But I'm not sure how he made a living this way.

We have since had hardwood installed in other rooms by two other contractors. These were experienced professionals and they honestly did a good job. But the difference in quality to the first guy is stark. The work of the first guy is 100% flawless, whereas the other guys don't always break up all the accidental patterns, or have unattractive clusters of boards that don't quite pair, or the floor is almost but not quite level, or there are minute gaps.

If you didn't have the two parts of our home to compare, you might not be able to tell.

But let me assure you, a statement of "laying hardwood is not technically hard" is an oversimplification. Anybody can be taught to do a passable job. Doing a great job takes years of experience. The same is true for most other professions (counter tops, carpenters, cabinet builders, sheet rock, tile setter, painter, ...).

You might not mind, and the differences can be either gross or subtle. But if I point it out to you, I'm sure you'll notice, even for the subtle flaws. Now, if you want to pay for perfection that is a different question. If the first guy charged by the hour, there is no way I could have justified hiring him. As I said, the other guys worked at the top of industry standards (but that doesn't mean flawless).

But as Joe said, hold back payment until you have inspected the work and you're happy with it.

I’m really not equipped to inspect the flooring to determine whether the job was done to industry standards. Should I retain an NWFA Certified Wood Flooring Inspector. Is it obnoxious to bring in that kind of oversight.

Another concern is that if something goes wrong, I suspect they will each blame the other.

The boards were delivered on Monday morning during a rainy day. They started the installation on Tuesday morning, also raining. The boards were stored in the main room of the first floor. They started on the second floor. The heat was set for 63 degrees. So, acclimating for less than 24 hours. ( Note: we are not living in the house during the remodel. I was at the house yesterday with the interior designer.). Who does the readings? I am almost certain no one took moisture or humidity readings. How long is the wood supposed to acclimate after delivery?

Photos? How far along have they gotten w the install?

What trade are they apprenticing for? Does the project manager have a background in flooring and/ or carpentry? It’s not unusual for a construction company to have the same employees perform more than one function. They may not have enough demo work to have dedicated demo guys, and therefore demolition is done by employees who are also tradesmen. When I had my kitchen done, the “demo guy” also built the pony wall for the island and installed most of the appliances.

I don’t have photos. I would say they have completed about 1/4 of the 2nd floor. I just put a stop to it. I asked the project manager (and yes he has a background in carpentry) about acclimating, and he said the “delivery guy took a reading of the wood and the floor where they were stacked and said they were good.” Sigh.

Shady, I think they are carpentry apprentices. Very young guys. Early 20’s. The PM admitted it was about utilization. The decision to use the demo guys to lay the wood floor was about cutting costs.

They are laying hardwood floors and are not even in possession of a meter. I don’t even think the PM understands why readings are necessary. Of course, he said they have done this many times before without any call backs or complaints.

A little insight...

..."A substantial number of folks who do have the skills and training are moving into retirement time, or they're around 50 years old and they don't want to work construction," Courson says. They're hitting a point in their lives where they don't want to install flooring, climb ladders or install plumbing, he says.

Wood flooring, in particular, becomes a hard sell for these workers, says Jason Cantin, a wood flooring inspector and owner of The Flooring Guru in Tampa Bay, Fla. A number of wood flooring installers who left the industry during the recession were working new construction, and they were "getting beat up then" and they don't think work conditions have changed today, he says.

A friend of his left wood flooring and started a gutter installation business.

"He has a good standard of living and, honestly, it's easier work than the stuff he was doing," Cantin says. "Find an installer without knee or back problems. You don't have those problems with gutters … The pay is similar, the demands on your body are less, the stress is less."...

https://www.woodfloorbusiness.com/business-management/the-next-generation-the-labor-shortage-and-how-companies-get-by.html

/sigh...

This is one of the problems with internet advice so be careful that you don't cost yourself a fortune following the advice of people who don't fully understand your situation and are just making a lot of assumptions.

First, let's talk about acclimation... The required acclimation time for flooring is zero minutes. It would be better to think of it as acclimation when needed (though usually needed). If moisture readings were taken when delivered and were at the baseline moisture content for your geographical region, then they don't need to acclimate. That is rarely the case, but it does happen. In my area there is a flooring retailer with an acclimation room which helps get flooring to the baseline for our area. So the “delivery guy took a reading of the wood and the floor where they were stacked and said they were good,” would be acceptable so long as they really did the readings, and it would be sufficient to charge you for those workers taking the day off.

Next, yes, what you are describing is customary in a lot of areas. In reality, flooring installation just isn't hard. The hardest part about laying hardwood flooring is squaring up the layout, which again isn't really hard but does require you to have some basic understanding of the process. It is completely doable by someone who has never installed hardwood before and is willing to take extra time. In hardwood installation experience gets you speed, any amateur willing to take their time can install hardwood floors, any finish carpenter or apprentice finish carpenter should easily be able to install it properly.

This is not taking anything away from flooring professionals, the ease and speed at which they do what is time consuming for others is impressive. However, even the hardwood companies around here will often send their less skilled workers to install and reserve the skilled workers for finishing.

Finally, be careful about insisting on methods after the contract is signed. That is a great way to simply hand your checkbook to your contractor and dare him to do his worst. You get a lot of control over results, but few over the methods used to achieve those results. If the floor is installed properly then you can't insist that the installer have any experience that wasn't in the contract or required by regulation. The moisture content thing is a great example of this, you can't force a contractor to stop work because he didn't take a moisture reading, you can force a contractor to stop work because the floor he is installing is not in an acceptable moisture range. As crazy as it may seem, being right doesn't require intentionality. You either suffer damages or you don't, and stopping work without damages actually damages your contractor and gives him recourse against you.

So if you insist on a flooring professional install, you should expect to pay the entire amount he was going to pay his people to install, plus the entire cost of the professional installer, plus any markup on that professional install that is in the contract. Since he has to pay his people for doing nothing, you have to pay his people for doing nothing. Not that this will be the case for you, but anything less would be a gift.

Post pictures of their work. And ask for the records of the moisture readings. “Bob, I need the documentation for those moisture readings, with r date and time, and where they were taken. We need this for warranty purposes. Thanks!” As in, how did they document it? Take pictures of the meter? Record it on a chart? That’s your game changer right there. If they are doing the job correctly, well, that requires documentation in order for a warranty to be in force.

RED FLAG: "The heat was set for 63 degrees."

The heat (and humidity control) must be at LIVING conditions. Do you LIVE at 63 F? I certainly don't and I LIKE a cool house at 19.5 C (68 F). Most people live around 21 C (70 F).

The floors must be installed in the SAME living conditions as the homeowner's preferred range. And they must STAY THERE forever and ever and ever and ever.

The SUBFLOOR moisture reading is going to be critical. The wood and the SUBFLOOR (assuming wooden subfloor) must be within a 3% MC of each other.

So it is POSSIBLE the wood LEFT the storage facility in good condition. It is POSSIBLE the wood maintained its conditioning over night in the house. The ISSUE could be the MC of the SUBFLOOR in the home.

And that's where the MC readings for BOTH become a big concern. As bry911 points out, things *could be hunky dory. But it usually isn't. Get those MC ratings for the subfloor and the wood at time of delivery. That will give you all the information you need to either continue or to suspend wood installation.

We live at 65 in the winter and 75 in the summer. We had our floors delivered in January into the unheated garage in Maryland, where they stayed about a week. Then we moved them into the house overnight and they got installed the next day. The flooring guys also painted the walls, laid tile in the kitchen, and did the crown and base, and sanded and stained the old hardwood floors. They are incredibly meticulous and did a fabulous job. That was about 6 years ago and all is well. 2 years ago they came back and painted the house, and barn. They prepped and did repairs including mortar work on the chimney. They had to rebuild a couple barn doors due to water damage and rot. They also instances gutters and downspouts, boxed in porch pillars and built a railing around the porch.

The MC ratings for the subfloor at the time of delivery were not taken. I guess we will assume the delivery guy announcing “you’re good“ means the moisture content of the wood planks were within the baseline. Going forward, do we have them start over after proper acclimation with documented meter readings? Or do we let go of what has been done and do it right fo the remainder of the installation? We obviously prefer the former.

What's installed is installed. First things first. Start with CURRENT moisture content (MC) readings. We can't change the past, but we certainly can learn from it and move on.

If everything looks good, then keep going...but I would HIGHLY recommend the heat gets turned up to LIVING conditions. And that is where ACCLIMATION comes in. Right now everything is set up to handle 63F. You have to get everything up LIVING temperatures AND THEN start install again.

I would leave the installed wood as it is. BUT I would ALSO put down in writing (texts and emails are AWESOME) that the GC will take full responsibility of this floor for the life of the floor in the home.

Do everything you can to ensure the NEXT part is installed properly.