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eleanor_alden

Need help with floor plan, third bedroom size???

Eleanor Alden
4 years ago
last modified: 4 years ago

We are building a second floor extension over our existing living room and mudroom so my space is defined by that foot print and is a little tighter than I would like. We have a toddler planning on definitely a second child and maybe a third(if we end up with one of each definitely stoping at twonotherwise we will wait to see what the dynamic is like and decide if we want a third)I can get two 12.5x10 rooms with good closets in easily the third room is tricky.I can get to 12'6"x9'8" maximum so not far off with a slightly smaller closet but pretty close just a couple of inches shorter but this leaves a pretty narrow(liveable but tight) hallway running through the entire extension.My current thought is to make it smaller, 10'9x9'1 leaving a nice wide hallway to the bedrooms and use it as a playroom now and a quest room with a Murphy bed and a teen hangout/kids tv room later, as I won't allow tv in bedrooms and we have a Michigan basement(think dug out cellar) so currently there is only one tv in the family room.My concern is the room being too small to be used like that? Could I get in maybe a soda bed instead of a Murphy and a comfy chair or a lovesac thing and a tv when the kids are older and have it be useable or should I bite the bullet and make it full size?Also if we did end up with kid number three we would move that wall to extend the room, my husband does this for a living so that isn't a concern we are using full span trusses so none of the interior walls will be load baring.The only other thing I can think of is extending the whole extension out a few feet to the left(as you look at plans) creating an overhang but I don't know how complicated that gets, how far I can go with only one row of support posts and what kind of foundation needs to be added for support posts.Any thoughts and opinions would be very welcome I've been tinkering with this for months, we only get one shot and we will on a farm(my husband also grows hay) so we will never move and I want it to be right!This is my first time posting so I apologize if it isn't clear and also resale value is not a concern our value will always be mostly determined by the land and we won't be selling until we are ancient and have to move into assisted living so we care more about it being perfect for us( I already moved the fridge sink dishwasher and food storage into a room directly off the main kitchen where I prep and cook and I love it) thank you so much!
I don't know why but my phone won't let me type a comment it keeps deleting what I type whenever I hit the space bar u will switch to my computer in a minute but mean while:
North is to the right. We cannot dig out or extend the foundation for various reasons if we could just sink support posts into concrete extending one side a few feet may be doable as long as we don't get too close to the well but that is pushing it. Current plan is to build straight up. The house is an L shape the stairs are next to the master if you look at the plans to the right of the bathroom is a large landing/open laundry(our cu4rent nursery) our stairs are off there. This is over the living room mud room and first floor bath all of which was an extension on to a 100 year old farm house what is now the master master bath and nursery was just a sleeping loft over there original foot print.
The bathroom layout is not set and I hope to rotate fixtures to move the door 90 degrees the fixtures are in place to make sure I don't adjust the bathroom size and not have enough room for everything and the necessary clearances. They are not set in those spots. Sorry for the bad plans I am legally blind and can't draft anymore so I have to do my thinking through on an app I am not a huge fan of.

Comments (23)

  • ptreckel
    4 years ago

    You will need to post plans...

  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago



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  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago



  • PRO
    PPF.
    4 years ago

    A more complete plan would be helpful.

    How does this relate to the 1st floor? Where are the stairs?

    Which direction is north?

    If you are thinking of "extending the whole extension out a few feet", then you are not constrained by the existing footprint.

  • Lindsey_CA
    4 years ago

    Why such an awful path to the bathroom for the two kids in the far bedrooms?

  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    North is to the right. We cannot dig out or extend the foundation for various reasons if we could just sink support posts into concrete extending one side a few feet may be doable as long as we don't get too close to the well but that is pushing it. Current plan is to build straight up. The house is an L shape the stairs are next to the master if you look at the plans to the right of the bathroom is a large landing/open laundry(our cu4rent nursery) our stairs are off there. This is over the living room mud room and first floor bath all of which was an extension on to a 100 year old farm house what is now the master master bath and nursery was just a sleeping loft over there original foot print.


  • PRO
    PPF.
    4 years ago

    You are unable to extend to the east towards the kitchen?

  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Unfortunately no, I cannot extend towards the kitchen the entire rest of the first floor already has some form of second floor above it the master the nursery the bathroom or the attic space redoing all of the roof lines taste this more relatively simple project my husband and one of his workmates could knock out to being an absolutely massive engineering problem. the overall boundaries shown in the extension plan is every inch of available space if we take the walls from the first floor straight up so that every inch of first floor has a second floor above it the only options for extending AR a couple feet to the West over our existing deck would probably be the easiest job I'm not sure that buys us a whole lot possibly a few feet to the South probably no more than about three maybe four though given the location of our well and only then if we can just sink support beans without having to attach them to the full foundation which I am not sure we can do we could go a few feet to the north we've got about 4 feet there before we hit the belko doors that are the outside entrance to our cellar, working within the constraints of the house and foundation that already exists is the biggest challenge the foundation is in good shape but because the living room and that entire side of the l of the house were added much later they are a dug out crawl space underneath the little room off of the kitchen where I have my sink in my fridge is also just dug and creating a ramp leading to the full depth basement that is only under our kitchen and dining room messing with this kind of foundation is a ton of work, and risks messing with the stability of the existing house. We would have to Jack the whole thing up and basically rebuild entire foundation to set a whole house back down on it is not something that is reasonable for us to do.


    that's why I think the reality is if we need three full size bedrooms it will have to be the tight hallway ivory worth the space every way I can possibly think of the only way to get more space or Lemonade's access to the bedrooms in the far corner, my question really is will be smaller third bedroom be functional initially as a playroom and then eventually as a small snug style TV room and guest room for teenagers or should I just go ahead and accept the hallway from the get-go and make the third room full size.


    Unless someone sees a particularly brilliant option with extending something out a couple feet to the West over our back deck which is pretty big so depending on how many support posts we would need in the center breaking up that deck we could probably actually go six feet or so in that direction if you really really wanted to, again I don't know what kind of foundation of support posts would need, I don't think extending the footprint is practical just why I said I believe we are constrained by where the walls are underneath.

  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago



  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    I'm really fine with all of the bedrooms being small 12 by 10 is the smallest I really want to go for a kid's bedroom I accept the 9'8 since it's the best that I can do for the third bedroom unless we get lucky on tying in to the existing wall which would make it 12 by 10 as well. There is a whole wall of desks in the kitchen outside of my u shaped workspace we have a really big family room and built in storage everywhere they do not need more than clothes and some toys in their bedroom when they are little. The office has floor to ceiling bookshelves with a library ladder built ins for boardgames and puzzles in the dining room and movies in the living room as well as the open wall in there that backs up to the kitchen for toy boxes and my son's play kitchen etc plus we have 60 acres and a giant teepee outside as well as a slide off our deck and a separate swing set, our whole place is very kid centric. The only thing we don't have carved out is some flexible space for sleepovers and teens to hang out in in winter as their rooms are a little small to be their only space and I'd like them to be able to have some extra private space which is why we are doing three rooms regardless of how likely we are to have kid number 3(20% chance)


    I would rather have an open large hallway where we can add more shelving or just not feel crowded but it isn't worth it if the little room will be too small to be functional as a tv room

  • PRO
    PPF.
    4 years ago

    I'd rethink the bathroom, and try to put 2 bedrooms so they are facing south.


  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    I want the third bedroom, we need a spot for a guest bed for Nana who comes over about once a month and I want the ability to create a full size 3rd kids room in case we need it. Anyway you re jigger the south-facing bedrooms to make them the main bedrooms you either lose the ability to have a third full size room for you lose the doorway access to the bedroom in the southwest corner. Believe me I've tried it I might try reposting this is a simpler question because really my concern is is the small room if we initially made that third bedroom the smaller size so we have the big open hallway is that still big enough to be a 2nd TV room with a sleeper sofa and a couple of chairs or one of those big lounge bean bags to be a comfortable teenager hangout space. Had the extra info in case somebody sees something that I can't but the requirements for this extension are at least the possibility of 3 full size bedrooms as close to 12 x 10 is humanly possible or larger and us not having to mess with the foundation as it exists under our house except maybe to extend West a couple of feet that's the only direction where it's possible but it was an have to be a pretty big bonus in what we get upstairs for me to be able to sell that to my husband who will have to do all the work.

  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Holy crap! What are the dimensions of the rooms? Where would you put the bedroom doors? Both at the end of the hall so the one room just has the little doorway or both in that little center section or one in there and one at the end of the hall?


    Does that leave just s 5x8 bathroom? Thank you so much!!!

  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Any thoughts on where to put closets? Or just put a hanging armoire next to the dresser?

  • shead
    4 years ago

    I would do two bedrooms right now and a modest bathroom and leave the rest open as a loft space/kid's play space. You can always add walls later if needed, especially if your DH does this for a living.

    The thing is that life rarely ever goes according to plan. We had one son with the intent to have a second child when the first was 2-3 which didn't go according to plan. When he was 4.5, we had TWIN girls (surprise!) so stopping at two was never an option. Now, we have four! Plan your house as reasonably as possible but leave enough leeway so that if things don't happen in the order you think they are going to happen, you still have options :)

  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Okay have reworked the plan, the bedrooms aren't exactly equal but are all 12x10 or bigger and they are close enough that one kid doesn't get the short stick and different enough in layouts to look unique so I'm happy there and the bathroom has just enough space to tuck the toilet into it's own little room to make sharing easier if we decide to. I don't get any extra closet space in the bathroom or hallway but I can live with extra linens and things being over in the laundry room. Any thoughts?


  • PRO
    PPF.
    4 years ago

    Just for fun, extend these 2 walls and then look at the room sizes.

    I was thinking a built in where the blue is for linens and other.



  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Definitely worth looking at, our poor house had all the character ripped out of it over the years so I have been adding in nooks and built ins wherever possible. Inwould probably still draw a straight line for the two bedroom doors but I'll look at it

  • PRO
    PPF.
    4 years ago

    I just was curious about the room sizes, not suggesting to move doors or walls. These 2 "hallways" are included in the sq ft for each room, but don't contribute usable space.

    Extending the walls temporarily will show the actual sq ft.

  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Ah sorry I misunderstood and know the two little hallways do not contribute to the square footage totals how the floor plan app works that I use means that I had to originally build them as a separate little room and then delete the one wall so the square footage count is just for the main rectangle of those bedrooms not including the hallways

  • Lyndee Lee
    4 years ago

    If you move the two bedroom doors to the red line which is at the corner of the bottom closet, you would create a more spacious and interesting hallway. Neither bedroom would lose usable space. Enlarging the main hallway and shortening the tunnel in the top bedroom will make furniture moving much easier

  • Eleanor Alden
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Okay, so we looked at furniture floorplans and actually found the south east bedroom the least functional so final plan is going to be to move the two doorways and remove the closet making that the spare room and giving us a nice large hallway with room for built in shelving, and we can always build the closet later if we need it to be a full time bedroom. Thanks everyone for the input