Honestly, I'm very satisfied with the size and placement. However, It's not complete yet. :) I will put lighted pillars on both ends of the low retaining wall(seat). My wife is also asking me to put a counter top for her bbq grill. I'm trying to figure out the best place for it. I'm also thinking of adding 5ft wide stone walkway or crushed limestone that will lead to the patio. I am also thinking of putting a pergola like structure similar to the pergola. It will be on the north side. However, I'm not sure when I will start it. All the pics I posted before can be seen from here Patio/Pergola Build

I have the following saved from a site called Evergreen Garden Works, which is a bonsai site, but it goes into some detail about the physics of soil, what goes on under the surface, the importance of pot size and of the type of soil we use - dense vs aerated. I hope it is ok to paste this here, as long as I have stated where it came from. Sight has provided drainage in her pot, and some people, like Sara, overpot successfully, but this is good info to be aware of. I also thought the info about shallow vs deeper pots was interesting, it is the opposite of what I originally thought. A Pot Isn't Like the Earth The major difference between a pot and the earth is that a pot has impermeable sides and bottom. This reduces air exchange in two ways. First is the obvious, air cannot pass through the plastic, thus we have a contained volume of soil encased 75% with air tight plastic (or high fired ceramic (low fire ceramic will breathe). This is why I design my soil mixes and other environmental factors to 'dry out' the pot once a day during the growing season. Each time the plant is thoroughly watered, it pulls a new charge of air in behind it as the water drains. Secondly, we have to visit our old pot size argument again. When a downward moving table of water reaches an impermeable layer (in this case the plastic pot bottom) it will not drain until the layer just above the impermeable layer (pot bottom) is saturated. Once this lower layer of soil is saturated, excess water will drain out, but a column of saturated soil will remain since the moving table of water has stopped at the impermeable layer. This means that the soil in the bottom of the pot remains saturated at this lowest level after watering, and stays saturated until something happens to change that condition. That 'something' is primarily absorption from the roots in the bottom of the pot, the secondary factor is (or should be) evaporation. You will probably want to read this paragraph again, and perhaps a third time, it is not obvious. Overpotting Most of the water in the pot is removed from the pot by absorption by the roots and not by evaporation. If you overpot, it will take a long time for roots to colonize the bottom of the container and consequently it will take much longer for the saturated layer to become fully aerated (the only factor at work is evaporation). Overpotting will generally lead to too wet conditions and eventually root rot. What About that Saturated Column Thing? Ok, just how high a column of saturated soil do you get in a container? The height of the column of water retained in the soil by an impermeable layer is related to size of the particles. Sound familiar? The denser the soil, the higher the column will be and the more water will be retained. Large particle, highly aerated soils will not support a large saturated volume. This is what we mean by 'well drained'. You can test this for yourself. Take a regular sponge, soak it with water. Rest it in your hand horizontally until the water stops running out. Then tilt the spronge upright. You are now increasing the saturated column. The sponge density won't support a column that high and water will drain out. This experiment also shows that pot shape is related to water retention. A broad shallow pot will retain more water than a tall narrow pot of equal volume. Although it is counterintuitive, a shallow pot will retain more water and 'dry out' more slowly than a tall narrow one (of equal volume).

I really like chicgoans recommendation on make the base cabs extra deep, we will submit that change before tomorrows deadline. The other recommendation of losing the hood to counter cabs is also a good one. The width of the hood will stay the same, but we will eliminate the cabs from under the corbel. Then it should have a graceful arch towards the back wall. A piece of matching wood/moulding laying flush on the back splash should make it appear that extended cabinets are still present without sacrificing counter space. As far as rinsing the veggies, most are frozen veggies that go right into the mw or pot. The only thing we need to rinse daily is celery, but now I piece that cut and pre packaged at Whole Foods. If we need something, I can open the Refrig, turn 180 degrees around and find the sink, and then dice right there or go to the prep zone. Right now, our layout in our kitchen requires us to zig zag around tables, chairs, island, and this will be entirely eliminated with the new design. Now to get from the den to the kitchen, then to the living room to put more wood on the fire, and then back to get something out of the microwave is an obstacle path and a half. There will be unobstructed straight path in the floor plan from den, kitchen and living room and every cabinet in between. We started working on the kitchen renovation last September with a local kitchen designer who was very good and came up with a great looking design. What we did not like was the fact that we could not bring the plans home to review. Any changes meant he had to hand draw everything which made revisions more labor intensive. After the receipt of the initial bid which was very high, we were not furnished with a line item estimate to see where we could save money. At this point I talked my wife into driving several hours north to take a of the Crown Point factory after hearing so much on GW about them. We actually stayed over night and had a great weekend. We got a suite at the Common Man Inn (ask for the CP Discount) a got huge "40 foot ceilings"/fireplace/king bed/river view suite. My wife that she was Alice in Wonderland with the size of the room. My wife and I thought the experience of the tour, and be able to view different cabinets in various design stages and options made it in easy decision to get an estimate from Crown Point. I was impressed by their design approach and price that we cancelled the other designer and went with Crown Point. Since the first layout, I have been able to modify the design to suit our family, our habits, and at the same time keep the total cost within budget by learning what items actually will make the price jump and designing around them when possible. My wife just saw our final number from today that now includes a bathroom vanity and she was happily surprised. Now she wants to order a custom table for the banquette ! As I was typing this my contractor just called with his estimates and as of tomorrow after the last minute changes we are in production.

I feel your pain because I'm fresh off the plan phase and have just had shotcrete. Your pool is similar in shape and close to the same size as mine. I had issues about the narrowness too. I kept stretching and curving to get more width without having to move it to another part of the yard where I have more room, but we'd lose the asthetics of the view. I left it alone and I do still wonder about the narrowness but there's no going back and I'm sure it will all work out. I can tell you that I was just at a pool party where the pool was more narrow and smaller than yours and mine and it didn't seem to phase the kids at all. They seemed to have plenty of room. However, we are talking about ten to fifteen, ten year-olds. On another note, we have a baja/ wetdeck as well. And something you may want to consider, (if you haven't already) are the placement, the size and amt. of steps into the pool which I hadn't even thought of with mine until today when I stepped down into my pool(granted there is no water yet)but our depth is 3.5' off the shelf and even with 3 steps to the bottom, it's still a good-sized step down... sort of a surprise drop, if you're not aware. Now, because you're struggling with the depth thing...if yo choose a 3' to 3.5' depth instead of 4' this may allow you a little more peace of mind as far as the safety issues go for your small child/children. You don't know me from Adam, and I really am not a doomsdayer, but I'd like to share with you what happened to me and maybe it will help in your decission. My son (who is alive and well) was 4 and about 43" and in a 3.5' pool with me right next to him ... looking at him no less... I was not able to see that the water was just covering his nose. I couldn't see any line of demarkation that would indicate to me that he was sucking in the water. My clue that something was wrong was that I realized he was not talking or moving around. And even though he had been taught to hold his breath and had some lessons he just panicked. I finally realized what was happening and got him out in time, but it was a horrific scare. That just reminded me... better to be safe than sorry especially w/kids. Drowning is a such a silent killer and there's no going back. A friend of mine lost her 3 yr old little girl to a drowning accident in her own pool. I don't know if this is too much on a pool info site, but if this helps save you and anyone else from that kind of tragedy, then it's worth the possible discomfort of my opinion. Okay, that's all I'll say about that. Anyway, it will all turn out; right??? Good Luck