dbarron(z7_Arkansas)

"Patience, in twenty years, it'll be a big caudex".

Hehe

Question: Would regular pruning of the top growth in conjunction with a large pot or in ground lend itself to developing such?

Nothing that interferes with growth would cause it to produce more growth...so prune for other reasons, not to think to stimulate caudex growth.

I suspect a large pot (but appropriate sized) would help. Just remember, you have to move it around.

Yovan, Your plant will grow a larger caudex over time as mentioned, but this is not different than a tree growing larger in caliper/circumference over many years of growing. Man made measures such as Pruning will keep it shorter, but the caudex will grow according to it's genetics and age.

Many seedlings from the same seed pod will have different characteristics and some may grow larger caudex's than others. If a large caudex is what you seek or prefer, then it might be good to plant seeds from a A. arabicum, Thai Soco, as these cultivars have more of a tendency to produce a wide caudex (greater chances of width, but not always). These arabicums/Thai soco's do not produce the large colorful blooms. Most in a range of White, Pink shades.

I have found that with my seedling over the years, that if they are going to grow more horizontally across that they start doing this at an early stage of grow. So much is in the genetics and most times we do not know until we start a large group of seedlings.

Rick

Some say cutting the leaves in half, or cutting half the leaf off of every leaf will move growth to the caudex. I have no real world experience with this. The marias garden site on you tube has a video about this. I believe she has real experience with this method. Great page either way and she has a ton of plants. Heres my 27 year olds caudex. 13" tall and 16" wide.

To me, that sounds like 'I don't have anything to do, so let's make a project of cutting every leaf as it emerges'. *sigh*

Thank you all. I guess God is going to take me away before I see my adenium's caudex being large ?

Beautiful plant Abrahamx.

This is where an actual Caudex and Exposed Roots are different. For myself the caudex is the widest part/girth of the base prior to the root mass and not a root mass that has been raised and exposed.

Albeit this is what is done all around the world. It is confusing to someone just beginning into growing these plants.

I love the look of the exposed roots. Just do not call it the Caudex.

Rick

... I guess God is going to take me away before I see my adenium's caudex being large?

BONUS ... it will likely bloom before it gets big ...

*lol* bragu_dsm has a point. And there is always the other option, throw money at it and buy one with an already large caudex, if that is important to you.

Cutting/Snipping leaves is generally for the purpose of allowing more light into the plants canopy to allow shorter branches to develop more.

Outside of snipping for shipping purposes or hanging to reduce transpiration.

We all have different interests in these plants whether it be for Blooms, Leaves or Caudex. Purchasing plants already started and being able to see what it's possibilities will be or starting from seed is all personal choice. I have done both and this allows me to have a larger specimen to enjoy, as the seedlings will take much longer to achieve the same in growth. Especially depending on where you live and what conditions and/or length of growing season you have. Neither is a waste of money, your choice.

Rick

Beautiful plant Abrahamx.

This is where an actual Caudex and Exposed Roots are different. For
myself the caudex is the widest part/girth of the base prior to the root
mass and not a root mass that has been raised and exposed.

Albeit this is what is done all around the world. It is confusing to someone just beginning into growing these plants.

I love the look of the exposed roots. Just do not call it the Caudex.

Rick

Perhaps true but as you say, that IS what most folks call and think of as a caudex. the true caudex does not really grow much at all. Its not any bigger than it was when it was 5 years old. Thats what people call a caudex so just go with it I say. Why buck the trend. Never once have I heard some one mention exposed roots. I hear what you are saying but till just now it has always been called a caudex. I've never heard it distinguished as such even by the top experts. So I have thousands of people calling it a caudex and you calling it exposed roots. I think I will stick with caudex for now. If the general standard changes I will change my terminology. It should not be confusing to someone just beginning to grow these plants. They are taught grow and raise with a transplant. Then one day after growing these for 30 years some one tells them they are wrong and that they are exposed roots and not a caudex. It really dont matter what you call it. It is what it is. And not at all confusing. I'm just going with the flow.

Cutting/Snipping leaves is generally for the purpose of allowing more
light into the plants canopy to allow shorter branches to develop more.

Outside of snipping for shipping purposes or hanging to reduce transpiration.

Yes leaves are usually stripped to not asphyxiate the plant and can be useful in allowing branches to get more light but it also re distributes the plants energy to the caudex instead of growing the leaf bigger once cut. Not my theory, but it makes sense to me. Like I said, I have not tried it. Not with adeniums any way, I have used this technique with other plants specially when cloning a younger plant.

Purchasing plants already started and being able to see what it's
possibilities will be or starting from seed is all personal choice. I
have done both and this allows me to have a larger specimen to enjoy, as
the seedlings will take much longer to achieve the same in growth.
Especially depending on where you live and what conditions and/or length
of growing season you have. Neither is a waste of money, your choice.

I have a 5 foot tall plant from seed. Its been 7 years now but was just about as tall after 5 years. I dont consider that a long time. They grow much faster from seed as opposed to a bigger purchased plant that you may not know the age of. They grow much faster in their first 2 or 3 years.

To me, that sounds like 'I don't have anything to do, so let's make a project of cutting every leaf as it emerges'. *sigh*

You dont have to cut every one as it emerges. Or even every single one on the plant. Its not a big deal if you miss a few. You just cut the ones on the plant. With a little skill you can cut a bunch of leaves in one chop. Even a very big plant would take you about 5 minutes at most. Plants take years and years to grow. It takes patience, a few minutes once or twice a year is not a big deal to me. I dont do it anyway but you asked so I gave the suggestion I have heard of. Plus even if you did cut every leaf as it emerged would mean a split second cut every month or so. Leaves dont come out very fast.

Patience, in twenty years, it'll be a big caudex.

Or what some might call a big exposed root system.

Going back looking at my 5 plants they basically dont have a caudex if root growth is not counted. They are all grown from seed but if you look at the original soil level and where the roots start the "caudex" is only about an inch tall or less, plus then I have new stem growth growing out of the caudex. The plant pictured here is abou 8 years old, planted from a seed from another of my plants. It has been transplanted(and raised) once. If you look though from where the roots start and the stems start is really no transition zone(or caudex). I know cuttings generally dont grow caudex's but these are from seed. Looks good either way just no "caudex zone". Just food for thought. I had never looked at it in this way before.

Same with these. This is my 27 year old plant with a 25 year old one in the background. The foreground caudex is only about 3" tall and maybe 4" wide. Not big for a plant 3.5 feet tall and wide. Virtually no caudex.

We are all entitled to our own opinion and this is a good thing. I do not think there is any need to be offended, as this is what it seems here. Was not my intent. Made a comment and felt it would be noted for anyone interested. I am very well versed on what most call a Caudex and this is fine, not trying to sway anyone here.

My opinion. Yes, many call the widened root mass when raised, the plants caudex. This is fine, but "Caudex" means the Trunk of a tree, if you want to get technical which I do not really care. It is all in the eye of the beholder. When I mention that it is confusing, it can be for someone first getting into growing these. There is nothing wrong w letting an individual know. They can develop their own opinion.

What is the issue w mentioning that and what a Caudex is?

When we speak of Arabicums/Thai soco's these get a wide (caudex) w/o raising them.

Your plants are beautiful specimens. I think that most here would agree, as are many of other peoples plants.

I think this needs to be put to Rest.

As I have said, Gorgeous plants.

Rick

Not offended at all. Just thought it was a good point and something that should and could be looked into and discussed. When searching a pic of adenium caudex more than half of what you see is exposed root mass. I was trying to point out how it appears that the "caudex"(not the exposed roots) does not get very big at all. While folks are trying and asking about getting a bigger caudex, I believe they are really asking how to get a bigger root mass, as the caudex does not appear to grow much. the ones I pointed out have not got any bigger in 20+ years. dont need to put it to rest. Or at least I believe it is a good conversation to have. As I mentioned, I do agree that the caudex is different than an exposed root mass, and maybe we all should get on the same page with that(or not, but a common consensus would be nice) You must have just mis understood me. No offense taken and nothing wrong with having a conversation about a caudex or anything else for that matter.

All very true Abrahamx. I have admired your plants for quite sometime, atleast I think they where yours (photo's of them on your deck) a few years back now.

All good points and healthy discussion is a good thing. We can all learn from it and it sheds light on thoughts that many may have and just do not ask.

Rick

I admire nice roots (and nice caudexes), but I'm more for the flowers (lol). I'm looking fwd to starting mine into growth very soon.

if it's for flowers I wouldn't bother planting adeniums, but caudex is # 1 to me

why not? Adeniums flower more than most house plants from what I have seen. What would you recommend for flowers? Most Adeniums dont have a very big caudex anyway. my largest one is over five feet tall and as you can see from the pics above, the caudex is hardly even there. I cant even think of a plant that flowers more and more often.

Somewhat as mentioned above, we all have different goals and we should just celebrate that adeniums appeal for many different reasons.

Right off the top of my head, African violets tend to flower a lot more than Adeniums, Abraham. :-) Then too there are some orchids whose flowers last for months and may flower more than once a year.

While I do enjoy Adenium flowers (the singles more so than the doubles or triples), I am one who finds the caudex+fat exposed roots to be the main attraction.

Just because I like the flowers doesn't mean I don't appreciate the rest. And there are cactii, orchids, and AVs flowering in my windowsills at this very moment (among other things). We *can* have it all, at least till our available space fills up.

This might be out of place, but I believe that this thread was started by Yovan in request of

"Caudex , how to get a big one".

For some reason it has become about more than that which takes away from it's original purpose.

Maybe best to make start another thread as to not take away from this one?

Rick

"Right off the top of my head, African
violets tend to flower a lot more than Adeniums, Abraham. :-) Then too
there are some orchids whose flowers last for months and may flower
more than once a year.

While I do enjoy Adenium flowers (the singles more so than the
doubles or triples), I am one who finds the caudex+fat exposed roots to
be the main attraction."

Fair enough. I'm not familiar with those. I'm sure the adenium is not THE most flowering plant. Flowers on adeniums last 2 or 3 weeks and flower more than twice a year from my experience. Mine usually flower constantly from may or june till october ish. I also find the caudex+fat exposed roots the main attraction followed by the branching and lastly the flowers. I for what ever reason am not a fan of the doubles or triples or even the newer colors.

I think a good end answer is that there is no real way to get a bigger caudex. They dont grow very large either way. If you want bigger roots replant and raise them often. If you want wider, plant in a shallow wider pot. Time only as far as getting a bigger caudex, plus like I mentioned maria from marias garden does claim that clipping the leaves helps form a larger caudex but I also think she was talking roots as I believe most are when they say caudex. I honestly feel this is about as far as we can go with the conversation unless someone out there has some crazy technique that no one has heard of yet. So time, raise and replant in a good medium and perhaps try cutting the leaves. At least look up the video under marias garden and perhaps call her. she has thousands of plants so I imagine she is not just guessing on the technique.