Are you in the southern hemisphere? If not, then it wasn't either one because they are spring blooming roses.

'Cardinal de Richelieu' and 'Belle de Crecy' actually aren't very similar, except that thay're both old once-blooming roses with purplish blooms, and even those blooms look very different. CdR turns a dark grape-purple, while BdC goes from a purplish-pink to a slatey-gray as the blooms age. CdR is nearly thornless and nearly scentless, while BdC is a little bristly and very fragrant. Where did you see these roses? Because unless you're in the southern hemisphere in an area where the bloom season starts early, any roses you see flowering now couldn't be BdC or CdR. If you have any pictures, please share.

:-)

~Christopher

Yes :-) In South Africa. It islate spring over here. I am just struggling to post the pics at present but wil keep on trying.

It looked like a deep grape purple when we passed it in the shade. So much so that I immediately asked my husband to stop the car as I've never seem such a deep purple 'cammilia' Now in the sunlighit (and a day later) it is more of a slatey purple and not nearly as pink as the images are posting.

This is the closest I can get to the colour on my phone but it is still
a deeper purple. I never saw either in person but those are the only ones in the rose catalogues over here. As I said, it can possibly be something else as well, as many of the plants in the area were imported by a keen gardener more or less at the beginning of the 1900s or a bit later. The garden has many rare azaleas, rhodendrons, cammilias etc. Imported from the china / japan and us also famous for flowering cherries and crabapples that are quite rare in SA.

that looks more like russelliana than pictures of CdR or BdC

Yes, definitely part multiflora.

I hope you can figure this out because I'm in love with that little button eye. Adorable!!! Of course, then it probably wouldn't be hardy for me. : ( L G, you can go into Your Houzz and edit your profile to include your zone and location if that helps.

I've only seen Russelliana in person once, in the California gold country near Sacramento, and this was the rose I guessed it to be when I realized that this rose had small blooms. The other roses mentioned have larger flowers. What a pity it blooms only in the spring.

Thank you very much for all your comments! You are correct, it is Russelliana. The buds and sepals are a perfect match. It is indeed listed as available in South Africa although I would never have guessed the correct ID from the catalogue description.

L G,

Make no mistake - just because 'Russelliana' has made the rounds as an understock variety doesn't mean that it isn't a GREAT rose, because it is. It will grow almost anywhere and tolerate the harshest abuse, and still produce armloads of pinky-purple OGR style blooms with a fragrance as good as any of the best. Its a clean (disease-free) grower in most gardens, and makes a large-but-fairly-reatrained climber or freestanding 8 foot mass. I enjoy mine a lot and wouldn't be without it.

Thank you so much Paul. I agree, both the scent and the colour is striking. Now to see whether my cutting takes. :-)