Thank you, Paul! That would be wonderful. Carol

And in case you're wondering, its not 'William Lobb' either.

Jeri, my reply somehow posted and then disappeared. I'd be more than happy to document any interesting roses I discover! I don't get out and about as much as I used to due to my daughter's special needs, but I am determined to find creative ways to visit more potential OGR sites. If Paul's offer still stands, I would dearly love to travel his way and also explore anything OGR in his area. Wherever I go, I will take photos and notes as I spy old favorites and mysteries. Welcome to Portland if and when you arrive! If you need a rest stop. Let me know. :-) Carol

Thanks, Paul! Carol

I wonder if Brandon's is 'Eugenie Guinoisseau'. I don't think it's the same as Carol's, which may be 'James Vietch', or maybe 'Laneii'.

:-)

~Christopher

This is of no help in diagnosis, but I too have an unnamed, once-blooming, strong pink, shortish, suckering, Hybrid Damask-style moss rose that doesn't match any of my other mosses. I don't have any of the three Christopher lists, as it happens. I've excluded the ones Paul excludes which are all in the garden. Mine isn't as strongly colored as 'Rose de Rescht', which is currently in bloom. It was collected by another gardener who shared it with me. None of this very useful, but I think it's interesting.

Something else to note, this rose is 6 feet tall and bursting into bloom above the sheared quince hedge.

I'm attaching a few more photos of blooms, foliage and prickly canes. Carol

Evening shots of bloom, opening bloom and mossy buds.

Largest bloom, fading. Color is not true in the photo.

Foliage.

Thorny canes. Some almost rival Stanwell Perpetual and some are not as well armed.

Christopher, thank you for the suggestions. I'll check out both of them. I looked at James Veitch in the past as a possibility but veered away for some reason I can't recall. I'll revisit that possible ID. I hope Brandon posts more images of his fuchsia Moss. I'd love to compare the similarities and differences.

Melissa, how delightful that you, Brandon and I are all members of the Fuchsia Mystery Moss Club! Do you have photos of your unidentified piece of history?

I brought the cuttings inside and put them in a vase. My Moss smells as strong and delicious as RdR, but the perfume is a little more sweet lemony Damask rose and RdR is more heavy Damask rose to my nose. Carol

Sorry for the disjointedness of the posts. My phone is temperamental and will often delete any post that I try to have multiple pictures on.

I may also try to go back to Bush park today to see if there are any labels associated with this rose

Carol, if your rose grows to that size, I think we can scratch off my suggestions for identities. I haven't had my coffee yet, and will be working another long day, so I'll come back to this later tonight.

:-)

~Christopher

while Christopher's suggestions come closer to a match, I don't think any of those three mentioned are it either - I grow 'Laneii' and its definitely a deep pink, not fuchsia-of-the-de-Rescht-sort. 'James Veitch' is close too, but it finishes with definite grey-violet tones, not unlike 'Cardinal de Richelieu's odd "day old liver baking in the sun" slatey hues as it finishes. I cruised through the Mosses this morning, and not one of them resembles Carol's fuchsia Moss. I have quite a few light and medium pink Mosses, and two yellow/orange ones, and several darker purple types, and even one striped one. But nothing in the garden has that fuchsia/pink color - in the Mosses.

Does no one think it could be 'Madame de la Roche-Lambert'...?

HMF

@Marlorena:

I doubt it. I once had 'Mme de la Roche-Lambert' and the blooms were quite large for a moss (3.5 - 4 inches) and it was decidedly red-purple. The color was closer to 'Henri Martin' than any other Moss I grew. Also, I recall the bloom form was very cupped, even as it approached the finish. So, I'm doubtful Carol's rose is 'Mme de la Roche-Lambert', but it was a reasonable guess!

This photo is very close to how mine looked: http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=21.313075

Thank you all SO MUCH for your ongoing help with ID possibilities!

Marlorena, I thank you for your suggestion all the way from England. Your ID is one I had considered, too. Two great minds! :-) But the largest blooms on my Moss are just over 2.5", and HMF says MdlR-L boasts blooms of 3.25". As Paul noted, the size of my Moss' blooms are definitely on the small side. Unless the shearing and neglect is affecting bloom size, I'm guessing my mystery is still unsolved.

Christopher, please have at least a couple of cups of coffee, and I hope the work day today isn't high on the hectic scale. I truly appreciate your voice in this conversation! To note: this Moss doesn't show any real mauve-colored tendencies. The blooms remain in the pink range across their cycle: almost Rose de Rescht raspberry-fuchsia at opening to mid pink to a final paler pink with a slight grey tone and white at the petal bases. I'm about to post a faded bloom or two for reference. Let me know if you want suckers from the mother plant. I'll be digging them.

Brandon, I so appreciate the comparison photos and descriptions. I wonder if we have discovered the same Moss which somehow traveled to Portland and Salem or two different mysterious Mosses. I'm about to post more images. The homeowner said I could "dig up the whole thorny thing because it's just another painful job to trim." Would you like me to send suckers for propagation and comparison later this fall?

Paul, thank you so much for your ongoing research and shared experience! As you noted, my Moss blooms are on the smaller side, they are almost fuchsia and they do not show signs of crimson or mauve-violet. No "liver" coloring. (Vivid description!) This moss seems to open with a bowl shape and then loosens up to a more "tousled bed-head appearance." Faded bloom photos below. I'm becoming more and more intrigued with this rose every time I read a reply and we (most likely) eliminate IDs.

Height: Could the rose be "climbing" to reach sunlight and thus taller than usual? The quince hedge is 6 feet tall.

Carol

Photos coming below.

6 foot sheared flowering quince hedge with Moss rose reaching through the top.

Open and faded blooms. Colors are a bit off, a little too yellow-toned in general and the faded bloom looks a little too lavender in the image. It's pink. The nearly open flower is more raspberry than the image.

The bloom colors in the first 3 photos on this thread are most accurate, and the cultivar comparison photo colors are darn close.

Very faded bloom.

Buds and foliage.

Younger and older foliage. Note the extra leaf on the older example.

Whatever it is, it is a beautiful, healthy specimen -- and the mossing is so lush!. I love the "comparative" photos with other, named varieties. How is the fragrance?

Hi, Monarda. The fragrance is delicious! Old rosy Damask with hints of sweetened lemon. Carol

I should also note that this rose is not watered, and Portland hit high 80s and an unprecedented 90 degrees this last week, so the flowers are a blowsier than usual. They usually hold their lovely form longer and with more certainty. By the time I collected samples for the comparison photos, the blooms were thirsty! (See photos #1-#2 for typical fine form.) Carol

Somebody probably "removed" that rose, to plant the Quinces ... but left some root behind, and it returned. That's the way "De la Vina Mystery" grows up through an 8-ft. eugenia hedge, in Santa Barbara.

Ha, ha! I'll bet you're right, Jeri. These OGRs sure are tenacious once established. If I had an acre of land, I'd collect every mystery I could get my hands on! I love these old rose survivors which are so intertwined with human history.

Last two photos below just to emphasize how similar the color is to RdR. RdR is plunked in a single smaller vase at the front. Mystery Moss blooms are clustered in a second vase behind.

In a low light room on a cloudy day. All of these blooms combined are scenting my entire dining room. Wow!

In my brighter kitchen with a lovely view of my microwave in the background. RdR looks much smaller because its high shouldered self is sitting on top of the vase and facing upward.

ok... so 'Mme. de la R-L' is discounted,... I looked at my plant today and took a photo, and notice the foliage is a bit different to yours too, so that's ok... but I've been looking for another Moss rose perhaps for a future order, and one I have singled out is 'Marechal Davoust'. Further research on HMF shows what I think are a lot of similarities to your rose including and especially the foliage. I notice it's grown all over the world, and sold by Rogue Valley Roses... perhaps the blooms are larger again, not sure about that.

Have a look at these links and see what you think...

HMF

I am particularly interested in the similarity of this faded bloom to the lilac coloured one you have shown earlier. Where it looks muddled. Allowing for colour differences as this is from New Zealand, but otherwise it looks identical to me.
HMF

..this is yours copied below..

I still have no clue what your mystery is... maybe something that was sold around the turn of the century.... might be worth a peek into the West coast nursery ads on eBay from that time period, to see if any fuschia mosses are listed? Sometimes I see surprising things.

Either way, that is such a stunning rose, and I have fingers crossed that your cuttings take. I would love to try my hand at such a good looking moss!

Does anyone else see something "Bourbon-ish" about this rose? I remember a mossy Bourbon from my various readings, and I think it sported to a climbing version which Vintage Gardens used to carry. I'll have to root around for the name and look it up on HMF.

:-)

~Christopher

OK, scratch that -- looked it up, and that rose had light pink blooms. I'll check some other things, now that I'm home from work.

:-)

~Christopher

I went to Bush park and the closet sign to the rose said 'Louis Gimard'. Not saying that it is, but maybe?

Now that I posted that it is not as clear as I had hoped it would be.

Carol, it would be awesome to be able to compare the two roses. I may take you up on the offer. But to save money on mailing maybe we could meet up in the Portland area sometime in the fall. I go to exit 292 often on the weekends.

Brandon, that could very well be ‘Louis Gimard’

Carol....maybe 'Marechal Davoust'? Otherwise, there's a photo of 'Rene d'Anjou' that looks a lot like your rose, though others don't quite match. Interestingly, check out the HMF profile of the person who posted that pic -- the poster is in Washington. The website for Heritage Roses Northwest seems to no longer be up, but there is a facebook page for it.

:-)

~Christopher

Thank you so much for the additional photos, Brandon. Gosh, Louis Gimard (?) is a gorgeous thing! I think it's slightly different than my mystery, but.... Paul what do you think?

Brandon, I'd be glad to do a meeting this fall to hand off cuttings/suckers. I think you and this Moss are destined to be together! :-) It would be great to hear about a side by side comparison with your Moss down in Salem.

Christopher and Marlorena, two great minds again! If it weren't for the bloom size, I'd say that Marechal Davoust looks like a good candidate. Maybe the blooms on my mystery are a bit on the small side due to ongoing water and nutrient stress? This rose gets the opposite of care--anti cultivation? Paul, what do you think about M Davoust as a working guess? Does anyone out there grow Marechal Davoust?

Rene d'Anjou....I'm not sure....Going back to HMF....

Carol

It makes me think of Laneii as we grow it in the Sacramento cemetery. Is it extremely resinous at the bud? And with a somewhat silvery reverse? Ours is quite the magenta pink, with very succulent-looking round buds.

Anita, initially VERY round buds. Globular with a slight point at the tip. They remind me of peony buds except for that slight point. Yes, resinous! My fingers were scented after even briefly handling the buds. How large are the open blooms on the Sacramento Laneii? My rose's are a bit larger than Rose de Rescht but under 3". Your photo looks like it could have been taken of my mystery rose.

Paul, does the Sacramento Laneii look like yours?

Carol

This is a very interesting thread. It is so beautiful how all you guys put your heads together to solve a mystery rose. And every single detail is counted for and that is what makes it more interesting with your passion, dedication and being a true and great Rosarians. I really applaud you guys for doing such a great job. Carol, I hope you will get to bottom of your mystery rose.

Jin

I have 'Laneii' out in the garden, but its not in flower yet. I don't think its as deep a fuchsia color as the mystery moss though....

Paul, when your Laneii blooms, could you take some photos and make some comparisons? My Moss rose may not be Laneii since what looks like a close match is growing in CA conditions, but maybe NW Oregon Laneiis are darker this year due to unseasonable sun and heat at flush time? I don't know how anyone sorts out these OGRs! Lots of shared experience, lots of data and more than a little luck? :-) Carol

Still looking like Laneii to me. I am not 100% sure that the rose that we grow under that name in the Sacramento cemetery is correctly identified, but Gregg Lowery confirmed it, and I have seen this rose growing in several other gardens under the same name. Confirmed the size of the flowers today - see how bright magenta pink it is?

Also took a photo of the very thorny cane. We prune ours to about 3 ft high because we like stimulating bloom further down on the canes (several lateral buds will grow secondary canes and bloom if pruned - otherwise we just get flowers at the top). I think it could easily grow to six feet if competing with a shrub.

It blooms in little clusters, too, just like your rose, Carol.

Thank you so much for the research, comparative descriptions and photos, Anita! The Sacramento Moss sure sounds like and looks like my Moss in so many details. I'm certainly feeling like Laneii is a solid tentative ID. I wonder how many versions of Laneii are in commerce?

My Moss (you can see that in my mind, I've already embraced it as my own) will probably be out of bloom when I visit Paul's garden next weekend, but if his Laneii is in bloom, maybe we can give it a close examination, and I can take some photos for comparison. (My photos will look nothing like Paul's professional quality images, so no one get your hopes up). Again, much thanks, Anita!

Stay tuned for more to come in the second chapter of the Mystery Moss story....

Carol

My photos are from my phone, of course! Gregg Lowery said that they found this rose in several locations in Northern California so it makes sense it would be in Oregon too. I simply love this rose, and deliberately get my fingers sticky from its moss so that I can feel and smell it for hours afterwards!

Still waiting for first blooms on ‘Laneii’ here. Not many actual prickles on this one, it’s all moss from top to bottom. I have to mention that I have no recollection where I got this plant from (18 years ago) and I cannot say that I am certain of its identity, so this plant may not be useful as an identification tool.

Thank you for the photo and other information/background, Paul! Whatever my Moss rose is, it's thorny! I hope your Moss is in bloom when I visit. I'd love to see and smell the flowers as well as check out canes and foliage. Maybe my Moss will indeed turn out to be Laneii and yours will become the latest forum mystery? Carol