I purchased 2 Shiranui last year from Harris Nursery. I bought the $36 tree first and then bought the $50 tree. Canopy size was about the same. The only difference was the slight difference in pot size and the $50 tree had a slightly larger diameter of trunk. Both were top heavy and had to be staked. What's funny is that the $36 tree is blooming and not the other at this point and they were purchased only one month apart. Harris trees all have a bend near the canopy. I don't understand why that is so.

My trees had the powdery stuff as well. I inquired about it and Ruth told me it was a nutritional spray.

I would not get the least expensive/younger tree. With the older trees you will get a better root system and, to me, that is the most important thing. My $36 tree has fruitlets on it and not the $50 one.

Harris trees are healthy trees. Don’t worry about the leaf miner damage, it’s not dangerous. Hose them down and with a little TLC, they’ll look perfect. Those trees look waaaaay better than almost anything I’ve gotten from FW. They’ll do great!

I’m sorry you are not happy with them, Alanna :(. My Bearss has the white powder on the leaves too, but I figured it was from the pesticides used prior to shipping. I also had minor CLM damage, but personally, I’d rather have that than scale or others. I’m going to double check mine for mites now. Dwarf or standard, the Harris tree is much more developed than my ST that was more from FW. Judging from other reviews of Harris trees, I think they will be flourishing in no time :)

The problem I see with Harris trees is that most varieties are on standard sized root stock. As of this minute, only 5 are offered in dwarf which I would prefer.

Alanna, beautiful trees and I must say mines looks as big as yours. You are smart to check it over the way you did for pest and other issues. In fact, many isolate their new acquisitions for a few weeks until all threat of pest from them are past. Many treat them with pesticide and clean them off before bringing them in near their other trees.

You have a good head on your shoulders and have learned much from here. Keep it up. Those little white bumps look like eggs of some sort and one looks like mealy or a piece of perlite. Hard to say. Did you try and squish or pick of that white speck of a blob on the second pic up from the bottom? Was it juicy looking? Do you have a magnifying glass to examine those little bumps well? Do you have a good horticultural soap such as 'Safers' so you can spray the whole tree down a couple of times?

Mike)

Mike - it is most likely eggs. I’ve seen it before on other trees. I sprayed both trees thoroughly with HO mix with Castile soap. Tomorrow I’m going to clean each leaf with rubbing alcohol and Saturday I’ll hose them off outside, but wait a few days to do HO again because I don’t want to burn the leaves (it’s finally supposed to warm up and be sunny here). I plan on keeping up a regimen of pest control over the summer, as you recommended mike, to help keep winter issues to a minimum.

Denise - I also am slightly concerned about how big these guys will eventually get. I don’t know much about rootstocks, but I’m pretty sure FW also uses semi dwarfing at best. Right now I can handle them all, but things have the potential to get out of control in the next two years. I guess I have to keep working towards that greenhouse goal!

Kelley and Laura - you are completely right; I’ll take CLM over scale any day. And those most recent ST’s everyone caught were so teeny tiny. I was surprised FW even sold them. I probably being a bit whiny, but I wish my bearss canopy was bigger. It makes me sad to think how long it will be before it fruits. I know that overall the trees are heathy and will do great after a summer of good care and sunshine.

I pulled the roots out to see what size pot I should put it in. Ruth said it would be fine in something shorter than it’s current 14” sleeve, but there were thick circling roots at the bottom. She said I could trim them, but there is one main super thick root growing straight down, hits the bottom of the container, then splits in 2 and starts circling. Is it okay to trim that main root?

I see that white residue on many nursery plants. It's surprising how hard it is to wash off.

I want to order from Harris, so the pics and discussion are very helpful, thanks!

The CLM makes me nervous. Doesn't it spread? None of mine have it, currently. I know it's mostly a cosmetic issue, but isn't it tricky to get rid of?

Great trees Alanna! Was it the Bearss with the thick roots? To me that sounds like the epitome of a healthy and almost well established tree! The canopy may look smaller but it looks like the stem/trunk they used as the scion is quite thick. I think it'll bounce back quickly and create a full canopy this year!

Edit\\ I forgot to add that the upside to receiving a smaller canopy is that you can be confident the new canopy will be healthy and pest free since you'll be personally attending to it. It's certainly lovely to get a larger tree when it comes in the mail. But almost every discussion about mail order trees mention some kind of problem whether it's pest related, nutritional, or cosmetic. I bet your Bearss will have a much shinier and luscious canopy than your Shiranui by summer's end!

If I'm not mistaken but they have to pass stringent test in order to ship out trees from Florida now and I'm thinking CLM is without a doubt not acceptable before shipment across the states.

Nice looking trees. Goid ion

Alanna, Ian Tolley says it does not matter if you use non-dwarfing rootstock for container citrus:

http://www.abc.net.au/gardening/factsheets/potted-citrus/9437354

Alanna- I also received a Shiranui from Harris last week. It looked in size and condition just about the same as yours. Lost the first one from them 4 months after receiving (but it wasn't their fault) so trying again. Hate the yellow/white sticky spray that covers the leaves and a pain to remove. Isolated for 12 days and just finished removing all the yellow with a sponge soaked in alcohol, warm water and Castille soap. Had to change the solution several times as so much stuff caked the leaves. Takes a loooooong time, and removed damaged leaves as I cleaned. Sprayed with neem oil, equal parts warm water and alcohol, and Castille soap- then repotted. Looks nice all cleaned up.

hibiscus don't worry abut the citrus leaf miner. They will find you sooner or later if they are already in year area. All you can do is spray for them on a regular basis. I am thinking about getting some tulle from the fabric store and wrapping them around my trees after spraying. For 99 cents a yard, it would be a cheap experiment to try.

The shiranui I got from them years ago is doing well. I do wonder if something is going on with Harris though. They used to have much larger selection. At least on their website. Just a few years ago they had at least 12 different mandarin varieties.

Hi Alanna - have been looking over my shiranui and haven't seen any CLM leaves on it from a quick glance through the the canopy but do have the powdery residue on the leaves. I am in the process of getting ready to put it outside (finally). Need to decide when (or even if) to repot.

All of the new growth (four tiny stems) on the Bearss lemon are dying. One shriveled up and the rest are dropping there leaves. It’s really sad and disappointing. I know that overall it’s a healthy tree, but boy is it sad to see new baby growth shrivel up. It must be stress from shipping

jenny - I’m definitely reporting my shiranui. It is not root round, but it fills the container pretty well. I plan on changing over to 511 anyway, so I’m just going to put it in a slightly bigger pot when I repot everybody next week. My shiranui has lots and lots of clm damage, but none on the bearss. It looks ugly, but it’s fine to leave the damaged leaves on the tree. I got most of the white residue off, but not all.

Why on earth would Alanna contact Harris?

Alanna, your trees look to be in strong shape and will start to put out new growth that will adjust to your growing conditions. It is not unusual for the tender, new growth to wilt and die when they have been under stress from shipping, potting up, spraying and changing climate temperature. They will adjust just fine under your care and will flourish this summer and fall.

You will be pleasantly surprised by how much growth your Bearrs Lemon will push out this summer. I do not know what rootstock your little tree is on, but if it is like mine, it will put out new branches and the canopy will widen out in no time. To give you insight, here are a few pictures of my Bearss Lemon from Harris.

Jinny - I try to keep reminding myself what great before and after pictures I'll have! Even trees that I got in September/October have put out quiet a bit of new growth, but they also lost a lot of leaves, so they're patchy. I know by summer's end they'll really fill out. Here's hoping the Bearss will too.

You lemon looks great. That was a lot of growth in the first month or two.

Bearss are generally fast growers. I have 2 at my lemon farm; but mostly they just fall on the ground; because my people have Meyers. In addition to the Meyers we have about 20 varieties of citrus; but the only ones that get eaten are the Cara Cara and other oranges, the Pixie mandarins, and the Chandler pomelos. Later this year I will plant about 20 Kaffirs for a new project; and maybe half dozen Seville oranges... just for novelty; and because I have them.

My new Bearss is doing the same with some of the new growth - I had no idea it was due to stress, though it makes perfect sense. I’m sure they will be back to normal here in a few weeks.

Alanna, how is your Bearss lemon doing? I came home from vacation today to find a bunch of die back on the top. I’m sorry to hear about your ST - hopefully it will recover quickly and look even better :)

Hi Kelley,

Was it too hot and dry while you were gone? That's odd that there would be dieback, unless it's just the very new growth. Mine all died too. Post a picture.

The Bearss lemon is pretty much the same, after the initial loss of the new growth. It hasn't sprouted any more new growth, but it also hasn't lost any more leaves. It's leaves are still on the yellow side and a little droopy and dull - that's how it was when I got it. It's mostly unchanged even after I repotted it in 511.

The Shiranui on the other hand has dropped about half of it's leaves and the new growth that was 'in progess' when I got it, is still very pale and hasn't grown at all - I think it's stunted because it should have started to green up by now. Most of the leaves it is loosing, were unhealthy looking to begin with, but now it's looking a little more naked.

All of my trees are having a hard time adjusting to the 511, except for my Meyer. There's been lots of leaf drop, droopiness, and leaf dullness. I followed the rules of repotting exactly and worked quickly, while keeping the roots wet. Next time, I'm going to be less agressive with 'cleaning' the roots. I was so paranoid about leave the old potting medium on the roots, that clearly I shocked them. It must be something I did if more than half of my nine trees are in shock and one dropped all it's foliage. The ST is total bare now and the Key lime has dropped tons of leaves too - which is weird because it's always been my hardiest plant. It's been 11 days since they were all repotted. The first 8 were spent out of direct sun or inside when it was too cold and the last 2 were spent in morning sun. I'm hoping that by the end of the week, they'll start to perk up a bit, so I can move them to their summer home this weekend. If they're still looking limp, I may leave them in partial sun to recover a while longer. I hate to loose out on the good weather and delay any new growth, but I'd hate to loose any of them way more! Keep your fingers crossed for my Santa Teresa.

Alanna, I wish you and your trees good luck. I know how repotting can be so worrisome. I think you are doing everything right and I agree with you about leaving some old soil on in order to minimize root damage. Bare rooting always damages roots.

So, how to minimize root damage in the future? These are the steps in bare rooting:

• Soak the root ball before you start. Hold the tree by the trunk and dip the root ball in and out of water. I suspect that this damages some roots. Perhaps holding the root ball in one hand will minimize that damage. Then, aim a jet of water to remove more soil. I believe this causes additional damage. Using a tool, such as a screw diver, to untangle roots to release more soil may not be a good idea. Next is burying the root ball in the soil mix followed by pressing down on the soil mix to firm it. I doubt that this causes much damage but I may be wrong. Also, some people use a dowel to push the soil mix into the root ball. I think this is a bad idea.

I have not mentioned that the root ball must be kept damp at all times and the tree be put in the shade for it to recover.

Have I missed anything?

Any suggestions for minimizing root damage?

What stimulating new root formation by removing apical dominance by cutting the tips off some roots?

Long post warning -

Bare-rooting and subsequent repot will always damage roots. For young plants with less of a root mass it is the easiest process. For larger plants with lots of roots that have never been root pruned is the hardest. Invariably the roots are tangled mess inter-twined with each other. These are my "rules of thumb" having done this many times for many different types of plants. I have only few citrus but the same process applies.

I am assuming the target is to remove all of the nursery soil and the plant is fairly large. The best time to do this when they are actively growing and healthy. For most tropical plants they are the strongest around late June. For citrus late spring is also good only if it was not sulking in poor indoor condition all winter. You have to prepared for a set back the first year - especially for large plants

One thing that seems to bother a lot of gardeners is root pruning. But this fear only you can overcome. It is an essential part for repotting and future plant health just like top pruning is. So all the rules apply. That is prune all crossing, circling and bent roots as much as possible. I routinely will chop of thick roots. They only occupy space. This encourages much better branching of roots and makes repotting much easier.

Always inspect the root ball before embarking on this journey. The soil should be on the dry or slightly damp side otherwise the weight of the soil can tear apart the roots. You can always mist the root ball after taking out.

At this point I will chop of all the circling roots at the bottom and sides. For the bottom I slide of a inch or two of the soil with roots. These are pretty useless roots and are an indication of poor growing condition and watering habits. Or it was left in the pot way too long.

If the ball is a dense mass I may opt for the two step method using wedge cuts. This involves cutting wedges vertically through the soil. Imagine the root ball to be a six wedge pizza. In this method 3 of the alternate pies will be completely removed and replaced with new mix. Next year the other three will be removed and replaced. A bit of the old soil will still remain but is minimal.

If I opt for complete bare rooting then I will also do a good bit of root pruning. The target is to keep planning how it will repotted with fresh mix. If the root ball is a random mess it will be very difficult push in new soil, especially in the center core under the trunk. I will prune thick roots near the center. At this point I would want the roots to uniformly flare out of base in all directions. So that it is easier to sit in on a mound of soil and push new mix in. The likelihood of voids is much less.

Using jet setting of your watering device to remove soil should be avoided. It does incredible damage to the roots. After all the same jet setting is used to clean patios and driveways and cannot be good for roots. Very fine hair roots are not a problem here they will regrow - the problem is tissue damage to the visible fleshy roots. These will die and rot. Use the shower or mist setting.

As a side note - most root hairs are not easily visible. And they regenerate fast from those fine visible light colored strands.

Use a root rake or chopstick (with a fine point) to drag through the roots as if you are combing them. Some damage will still occur but far less since the rake/stick will slip past most roots. If it is badly entangled either prune it or comb it in short bursts. You can combine this with periodic dunking in water. Just be careful that the weight of the wet mix does not tear apart large chunks of roots.

If you are still with me here then ...

Next mound up at the bottom of the pot like a hemisphere. Situate the plant on the mound. See, it makes it a lot easier if the center mess roots are pruned away. Once you are happy with height and position add soil a little at a time and push in the soil through the gaps using a chopstick. Vlad does not like this -yes it will damage some roots but it is a balance between some damage and leaving voids. For large plants I will also shower intermittently with water to help the new mix settle better.

At some point the plant will be semi stable in the pot. At this point I will tie the root ball to the pot. Remember most anchoring roots are gone by now. I will normally prep my pot with wires before hand. The goal here is that root ball should not move at all. And you can lift the pot holding on to the stem.

Finish adding the rest of the soil and pushing in. I also shake the pot and bang the pot lightly against at table or wood to help the soil mix fill up the voids.

Finally water it thoroughly several times till water runs clear. Leave it in open shade for a week and monitor daily. No fertilizer. And protect it from strong wind. Sometimes I will add a thick layer of sphagnum moss on top to prevent the top layer of soil drying out. After a few weeks I will remove the moss and save it for future use.

Tropic, excellent post. Thank you.

Thank you so much for writing out the whole process tropic. There are a lot of small details we forget to be aware of like a rootball that is too wet will weigh down the roots and possibly break them. It happened to me this month and took me by surprise since it was the first time my tree had a long rootball. I'll be saving your post for future repottings! I've only just begun my collection :)

Thanks folks. I do not have any large citrus but I have other largish plants. Since it is citrus forum - here is an illustration to encourage you folks to not be afraid to prune roots.

Here are some pics for a small chinotto in 511 in 8inch pot being transferred to a gritty mix in the same pot with less soil than before. I did not prune any leaves. This was march 2017.

Initial:

This is after quarter to third of the bottom roots eliminated.

This is after untangling the roots. See that long root hanging that appeared from within that terrible mess. It will make repotting a mess too.

So out it goes and some more.

Kvetch, to prevent root breakage due to heavy root ball you could try putting the pot into a large container of water. Then, hold the tree as horizontally as possible while pulling the pot off.

Tropic, how did you secure the wire?

Tropic, that was a wonderful lesson. I'll be able to be much more daring when I do a couple repots this week on some bigger trees. The pictures and detail are really helpful. As Kvetch says this is going in my file for future repotting. Beaucoup thanks.

Nancy

Normally, in bonsai you pass a wire through two holes in the bottom so that you have a U shape sticking up through the pot. Then you wrap around and over the root ball and twist them together. In this case I wrapped it around the trunk snug. The plant will be pulled towards the bottom so have enough soil below the plant or it will keep being pulled lower as you tighten. A pair of wire is usually used, I used one in this case. This works nicely for pots that have "feet" otherwise the wire at the bottom will prevent the pot from sitting flat. This was the case for this pot but the pot is not stiff enough so it works.

A better way for pots without feet is drill four pairs of holes and have 4 wires attached to it like this:

A plant that is tied has a far better chance of growing roots. Otherwise any movement of the plant (especially if it is top heavy) will cause the root ball to jiggle in soil and damage newly forming roots.

Nancy - thanks. My advise is to go after the center core of the plant when removing roots. This is where most of the thick useless entangled roots will be. This is also the most inhospitable area (especially with peat based soil) where there will be much less finer roots. Removing 1/4-1/3 roots of a healthy plant is never really a problem for all plants I have subjected this to. Next time around in a few years you will find it is much easier.

Wow Tropic! I'm scared, excited and feeling daring. My biggest complication right now is that I fractured bones my dominant hand and gardening has taken a hit. Have a Shiranui that just has to repotted in the next week, and will have to coach husband through your directions. He gets terribly impatient, and thought if I plied him with wine, he might slow down but don't know now. Want a steady hand with those roots.

It's going to be an challenging project and I'll report back. Love your method and excited to try. Need a robot.

Funny coincidence Nancy since I cut a finger, pretty badly, on my left hand a couple of weeks back and lost the dexterity temporarily. I find it hard with gloves so I am instructing my wife to do some of the tougher tasks where both hands are needed. I, or rather she, repotted a whole bunch of conifers and deciduous plants, probably around 25 or more. She sort of knows the ritual but I have to keep reminding her the steps.

If you already have your plant in a well draining mix you can leave behind a chunk of the old root ball with the old mix. Do not feel pressured to bare-root it completely in this situation. You can chase back some of thick and curving roots. Give it a uniform haircut - you just do not want a random mix of long and short roots sticking out of the bottom. Makes it hard to repot.

Have pruners, pot, mix, screens, wire, mister, water, etc ready. Have a checklist. No need to hurry. If I run out of time, I would leave the (semi) bare-rooted plant in a bucket of water for next day. Better than being tired and hurry the process.