nothing that will block the site line of traffic ...

and the forsythia has the potential to do just that.. if it is not renovation pruned every other year or so ...

one thing that takes any amount of drought and lack of water.. on my sand.. is daylily ... though of course.. it would need some water the first year ...

and being rather common.. if you have any friends with clumps.. you could probably get nice chunks for free.. or a pie ... mmmmm pie .. lol

ken

Funny I have Stella d'oro daylillies that I wanted to move but it's hardly enough..I don't mind pruning the bush..I needed something for the unsightly fence area that will be away from the street..wasn't thinking anything huge..more small medium sized...but wider like shrub or something larger than daylillies...I was going to dig up some regular orange lillies that were here when I moved and see if they spread over time..but I kinda want to just keep it simple and have somewhat instant gratification lol

Start over with the thinking. What are you trying to accomplish? Screening the fence from where? Is there any real reason to take the tree down? Do you have a big dish pan?

Decide what you want to do, then worry about the expense. Many plants are cheap/free is you are willing to be patient. And the amount of money you are blowing on trees - I could do a lot with that kind of money.

This is the tree I am having removed. It was here when I moved here and I've always hated it..it's in a weird spot, it's not attractive in any season, and it kills most of the things planted near it..I will replace with a crab apple or cherry tree(not the huge variety)

I love the forget me nots... where exactly would you put those in the pics I posted? How often do they bloom? Is it just a quick spurt or is it all summer?

Ok so doing some research I came across this variety of Salvia and I thought this may look nice up behind the fire hydrant and to the right of the forsythia bush (the area by the fence that was unsightly) tell me what you guys think, and what I should know if anything about this plant

As far as the tree goes we are removing ourselves so we have all the tools to do so(well he does I'm not doing it lol) the only thing we'd spend money on is renting stump grinder. And the new tree which is $100. A lot of money yes, but it will finally save all the other plants/shrubs that are struggling near it..

I'm not at all clear why you want to plant this spot at all. It seems to have no relation to anything else in your yard, certainly doesn't hide the fence, and the little strip of grass near the bottom must be a real PITA the keep shorn--too small for a mower. Why not just leave it to grass like the entire rest of the area?
Any planting I would do would be inside the fence.

Before planting anything, once you've decided on your goals, I think you need to decide if that area is a flower bed or just lawn with plants in it. At the moment it lacks definition and just looks like a rather scruffy bit of grass with a few random plants in it. The row of stones and the serried rank of hyacinths are formal features whereas the situation calls for something informal. At the moment it is neither one thing nor the other.

If it is to be a flower bed it needs delineating clearly and good soil preparation. Plants like forget-me-nots won't thrive if just scattered in rough grass.

If it is to be grass with plants in it the lawn needs improvement and better care and the plants need to be tough ie shrubs. The Forsythia has the potential to be much bigger so one or two more shrubs would easily fill the whole space.

I'm not sure the tree is responsible for the plants struggling. Many beds do well much nearer to trees than yours. The cultivation of the area and the choice of inappropriate plants could be the problem.

I would appreciate a flower bed like that as I drive by. I always recommend planting zinnias or some other annual easy to grow from seed. The first couple of years in a perennial bed are not attractive but zinnias pop right up and bloom all summer. This buys you time to find and plant desirable perennials.

I have a lot of stuff growing inside my fenced in area. This area is developing and the little scruffy grass you see is part of the work in progress. I planted 4 ice plants in between the scruffy grass just yesterday and wanted to get ideas just so when you drive down it's a nice little area to look at. I have many bulbs that haven't come up yet, along with dianthus and salvia(purple variety). I'm obviously not going to accomplish hiding the entire fence just that area that has the dead leaves etc showing. I am working on covering the fence eventually I already have climbing roses and clematis that are on their second years so they're still getting settled. Just wanted some ideas that's all

"What we have here is a failure to communicate."

You are looking for plants suggestions of what to plop in empty spots. We are saying that doing so is just going to end up with the same sort of spotty appearance you aren't happy with now.

Salvia greiggii is a zone 7 plant. I had it as a pot pet for a while, but wasn't willing to keep moving it up in pot size.

It's fine, I just was looking for some ideas like "pop in a couple hostas with one of these in the back for a little height to camouflage the ugly patch of dead stuff behind the fence that everyone sees as they drive down the street" not obv those words, but just a couple ideas that would help fill in to make it come together a little more and then I'd mulch around etc. Everything has just thawed out fully so I haven't got around to pulling up the grass that grew back since last year, or putting mulch down. Hence me asking here in hopes for a couple easy ideas to help get me through until these flowers etc start to fill out more. It doesn't matter now anyway because I just dug up some nepeta walkers low and day lillies I had in the yard and were big enough to finally split up, along with some bellflowers I had. I know it's hard to tell because my yard looks so bare in the background but believe it or not along the fence going straight down the street I have a few beech trees growing, viburnum(but it's like a 6" twig right now) a New Dawn climbing rush bush way at the other end, and 2 purple smoke bushes on the inside again both babies going on their second season...then if you go to the right of said perennial bed I have 2 CanCan climbing rose bushes, clematis, and ornamental grasses that again have not come up yet... so where it looks like a random odd bed, I agree, it's just trying to do as much as I can on a very limited budget so I do what I can each year in hopes it all of the sudden finally comes together once everything establishes. I want to eventually not have grass on the slope behind the hydrant because I can't mow it, and my trimmer cord w extension cord doesn't go that far from outlet on house and batteries last like 20 minutes tops.. which means I get about 20' mowed and still have 50-60' to go... but that's another project entirely!! So that's why I don't want grass there and the neighbors have a habit of walking their dogs on the grass and letting them pee all over it so it just looks bad and has burnt patches with crab grass. I'm far from a landscaper and a novice when it comes to gardening so I look here because I feel I get a lot of great ideas. I realize the pics don't do the area much justice, but I promise it looks a little more 'together' in person. I know I won't win garden of the year, but I'm trying to just make a nice area that's all... but I guess I will just wait and see how the nepeta and bellflowers fill in along with the day lilies I put in between the ice plants (where the scruffy patches of grass were) so thanks for the feedback.

Could the slow growth of plants you mention be due to a nutrient issue in the soil?

Several houses in my neighborhood have slopped yards and have planted assortments of hostas, ferns, and heucheras all down the slope. During the winter it's just mulch, but I think your forsythia and maybe a couple of dwarf conifers in addition to shade plants may look good. I say this assuming the crabapple you plan to add will provide adequate shade?

Also can you remove the dead leaves along the fence to help with aesthetics?

Again, so much of this depends on what you hope to accomplish, along with your personal aesthetic. One thing I think the space could benefit from is mass planting. Right now it seems to be a bit of this, a bit of that; a hyacinth of this colour, beside a hyacinth of another. Which may go along with what you said of buying a few things and plopping them in. You have the space where you could buy 50 bulbs and plant them together in one section - then make another section and do the same thing, etc. And the effect would be more overall impressive. One of the reasons why Cathy's in the post above works so well is because it shows off mass plantings. Things like echinacea and Brown-eyed Susan, which are so strong, very tolerant and can bloom on and on. And you can really get this stuff on the serious cheap - get to know your local garden club sales and learn to buy/plant in the fall - two of the biggest cost-saving tips I ever learned...

I've tried to plant coneflower there twice and they burned right up.. and that's not from seed either..that's from a nursery..I had the regular coneflower, and 'Pow Wow' both never caught on..I had black eyed Susan's and they came for one season and never returned? But the reason for those bulbs there now was due to Brecks messing up a rose bush order and offering me free bulbs of whatever they sent..I didn't want to waste them so I tried to just put them in somewhere..there were 150 bulbs total of miscellaneous flowers so yeah there's not much of a pattern there.. more just took advantage of free unexpected bulbs and didn't know where to put them all so tried my best to make something work...figured I'd see what they looked like once they all come up and see what ones did okay there and which ones didn't then move as needed. There are bulbs behind the hyacinth that are close to blooming now..I don't even rem what they were??!! Like I said I didn't get to pick anything or have a plan..I expected roses and got a runaround for over a month with apologies galore and they sent me a box of a trillion whatever bulbs as a 'gift'. I didn't think the hyacinths looked so bad there? It's nice color to see when everything seems old and dirty..that's how I looked at it at least..putting in groups is a good idea..it didn't say what colors were what more that they were assorted colors..so I basically guessed while planting..the little purple hyacinth by the fire hydrant was me saying "idfk where to put these and I don't even care at this point aka 130 bulbs later" dug a scoop out threw em in and said whatever happens happens with those...I am raking the leaves tomorrow, I've already raked pretty much my entire yard and had asked DH to rake by that part of fence and he has been 'getting to it' for the past 2.5 weeks! Lol so I have to just do myself as usual. I think I have some pretty good soil tbh, lots of huge worms and a nice color and texture..really dark loamy feel with tons of worms I would figure that means it's good soil, but again I could be wrong?

I'm not gonna lie this post has me feeling very different about the area I was trying to make better than burned up spotty grass with crab grass and rocks, broken glass from street, and so on...once again my yard was a weed breeding ground when I first moved here, no good grass, only weeds...and since then I've planted so much stuff but you can't see it unless you go into my yard so that's why I wanted to try and do something with that little corner so it could be nice to look at when I drove up to the house..but I'm not good with garden design and again haven't had much money to invest into it so this is what I'm working with for the time being...I know it's not perfect, or some breath taking landscape..but I didn't think it looked as bad as I feel it looks now after reading...just to show you guys I'm not just one of those people who buys whatever and plops I will post pics of my yard that I've been trying to work at for so long..and if you knew what it looked like prior you'd see that I am trying to get some type of esthetic from all this work..although I'm afraid I post the pics that I think are improvements you guys will pick apart and then I'll hate those areas

I think one of the design difficulties is that the bed at its present size is too small. I would consider enlarging it and planting a border of ornamental grasses in a large semi circle that would wrap well past the fire hydrant. My choice would be Pennisetum alopecuroides, or one of its cultivars. Of course there are other grasses to choose, I just happen to like the graceful Pennisetums, though it's possible they might be a little too large for this area. I would interplant with any of the classic combinations suggested for these grasses. Sedum Autumn Joy is a classic choice for the Pennisetums, but something smaller would be better if you chose a smaller grass. Either way, there are lots of possibilities. I would choose something much lower growing to plant in front of the grasses. Bulbs could be added as foreground too.

I'd have no hesitation to tske down the maple. I agree, it isn't very handsome, but aside from that most maples have difficult roots to garden beneath and there are surely small trees with friendlier roots.

Good for you, Ness!

Please don't let the opinions of outsiders who haven't seen the site and haven't a clear picture of this little corner of your property dampen your enthusiasm for implementing an attractive little niche. You have CLEARLY demonstrated the ability to create an attractive landscape.

Maples are known to exhibit allelopathic inhibition on other plants, some species very strongly so. Perhaps that's part of the reason that you've had problems.

Sorry if I came across too negative. This shouldn't be a big project. Just a bit of tweaking could sort it out. One of the problems is the air of indecision about it. Does it want to be an informal group of shrubs and perennials or a formal flower bed? For example, you have put a border of stones (what one old gardener referred to as 'the dog's grave' style of flower bed) but then you have planted your ice plants outside the border in the grass. So what function does the border have? I would personally remove the stones altogether as they distract visually and will be a maintenance problem when the grass grows through and over them. If you want to keep the hyacinths, a simple thing you could do right now is mark the colours. One way is just to tie a pink, white or blue thread around each stem. Then collect them up in colour groups and replant in clumps rather than straight lines. You can do this as soon as the flowers are over. You don't need to wait for all the foliage to die down. They will have much more impact that way. In fact anything will have more impact in groups rather than dotted about. The area would have more coherence and impact if you stuck to maybe just 4 species, including the Forsythia, with spring bulbs interspersed in clumps. You could do it with Daylilies, Hostas and one other - whatever thrives with little help in your area.

I don't think anyone here is being overly critical or negative. In fact, the opposite. You asked for ideas, and people have responded. Of course, I come from the performing arts world, where you are given critical feedback after every rehearsal/performance in order to achieve a high degree of art, and very often that criticism comes from within. This has taught me that I can get a very strong vision of my art - what I want to achieve - and then I work towards that goal, sometimes against some seemingly impossible situations. Honestly, it's what drives most artists.

People have made some good, constructive points above, from their respective points of view. Focus on what you want to do and what you can reasonably achieve. Think outside the box. It's your space, you know what the deal is, you look at it every day, and in the end, you are doing the work and paying for it, so forge ahead.

On that note, continuing with your project, do you have have any gardening groups nearby? It's garden sale season and people are digging up and dividing their gardens front left and centre for church garden sales, etc. As money is an issue, look to these sources for a much better value for your money and some fantastic advice and support - which is priceless.

I didn't think everyone was being overly critical, I like to hear others opinions on what to do. I think it was more what was being said had me thinking this area looked way worse than I thought was the case...I knew it wasn't anything spectacular which is why I'm trying to get opinions on what are some other ideas to bring it together maybe. The rock border was put there when I first started messing with this area and everywhere I dug was another big rock..I literally dug out thousands of rocks from yard and I'm not exaggerating! And the majority of the rocks were ginormous boulders to where I had to rent a bobcat just to move them to another potion of my yard. So when the bed was very small and no forsythia bush was planted I made the little border wall with the rocks to try and do something with them to make some sort of something to make the bed look like it had its own area..now that I planted the ice plant and lillies, I agree the rocks don't really serve a purpose so I will just remove them. I do agree with that. As far as the moving bulbs and attaching ribbon per color that's a great idea! I also agree the bed is too small...you have to understand that where I love to make huge flower beds and have lots of little areas in my yard to look at, my DH is not as enthusiastic about it (it's to the point I have to hide receipts from the nursery so he doesn't give me crap about it lol "NO MORE PLANTS!!!") so I started small with this..but I agree it just looks off as far as size..which again is why I come to all of you with my questions because I know something is off and don't really know where to start to make it all come together nicely...you ALL have given me some great ideas and I will find a way to make this look better with keeping those ideas at the forefront. As far as the maple goes, I 100% think it's the reason I have so many struggles with planting remotely close to it..along with it being ugly IMO. I have a maple in my side yard you can see in my pics above, it's the giant tree to the left in the first pic. I LOVE that tree! It has so many curvy limbs and the fall colors are spectacular! But this problem tree has no esthetics to it whatsoever along with being in a stupid spot(not from me I swear! Lol, it was here when I moved here!!) and along with the money I waste when I plant things in its path and they die from this tree taking its nutrients..I had to move one of my climbing roses last year because it wasn't doing as well as its counterpart, which I thought was due to it receiving less sun than the other. But when I dug it up it had the maples roots wrapped around its own roots! I hope it bounces back in its new location..it seems to be leafing out..just a lot slower. I wanted to put a crab tree in the location but the type I wanted doesn't seem to be anywhere? So I was thinking about a pink weeping cherry, or maybe a redbud? I wanted something that flowers..I already have some dogwood trees but it doesn't flower that great as I hoped..although it is fairly young(4 years) . And my neighbors all have these pretty flowering trees that I'd love to have. But don't want too many issues...do you guys know of a tree that gets around 20-30 feet high that also gets wide as well that flowers and seems to do ok in full sun zone 5b MA climate?

From your pictures of the other beds, it's obvious you are doing a lovely job. I understand getting stuck on a bed and not knowing what to do (I'm currently having such an issue with 2 beds).

I agree with others about reconfiguring the bed so it is larger and to keep all plants within its bounds. For edging, I'd simple edge with a manual lawn edger.

I agree with the idea to clump like colored bulbs together in clusters. It sounds like watering can be an issue, so drought tolerant plants would be good. In my zone 5b established catmint is tolerant to drought (a lot more than salvias). Also, if the area is shaded, my hostas and heucheras do great with zero watering once established.

It's all about what you need that bed to look like to give you joy, no one else (except for DH, but only if he helps! ;)

it's only the forsythia that could get out of control..but I won't let it.

==>> traffic flow was just a variable i wanted to make sure you kept in mind .... nbd ...

but you also posted this in the shrub forum... and imo ... you dont need another shrub out there.. that you need to cut back all the time ...

ken

That's true ken, thank you. Now with my ADD mind I am past this flower bed because I am going to rework some of the bulbs , edging etc and go from there..but now that I have you all roped in (HA) what would be a nice tree to replace the maple with? I have tri colored beech trees aligning the fence on the outside (they are on their 3-4 year idr?) I love those trees but they are reallly slow growing..a little TOO slow for my liking..but I want something that grows somewhat tall, but wide as well...I want seasonal interest, and flowers would be nice but not a definitive feature I guess if the other trees have better interest..and a faster grower would be better because I can't take having a yard full of twigs anymore hahaha...or maybe I should just post this question in the tree section?? Haha

Maples will have extensive roots to deal with, you will not be able to replant close to the old stump, even having it ground out. Another eyesore is that fireplug. Would the city let you paint it dark green?

I would suggest some hydrangeas...either paniculata or arborescens. Possibly either in the corner of the fence either inside or outside it or instead of the tree. Some like limelight get 8 feet or taller and some such as little lime or bobo are much smaller. They begin to flower in mid to late summer and they can be left on the plant over winter for interest. The smaller arborescens like Annabelle or Incrediball and others are much smaller. Most of them don't really need constant pruning if placed right. They are some of my favorite plants. They can be pricey but very small plants can be purchased from Bluestone Perennials inexpensively. Just my two cents. Good luck with your lovely yard.

Thank you ladies, I did consider hydrangea..it's still not out of the question but I have reconfigured that area quite a bit..I have made the bed bigger..or should I say, I'm in the process of making it bigger..by the time I started to tackle it I was racing against the sun and it got dark out. What I did was moved some of my plantings I had inside the fenced area...I moved my 2 big clumps of my 'Huskers Red' penstemon, aka beardtongue over along with the rest of my bellflower clumps...I will try to give an idea through awful drawing over a pic lol...okay so the green w purple and blue in it is the catmint, the orange and white are the red beard tongue (I had limited colors in my iPad photo editing so pretend the orange is dark red/burgundy), the 2 ones with green with blue squiggles going up are the bellflower and the pink dots are the pink flowering ice plant..I figured right by the fire hydrant it gets really yucky and dry so they'd probably do well there, then the 2 little green w yellow are the daylillies...I just and trying to think what to put over to the top right of the beard tongue? It's kind of an empty spot so maybe was thinking of a small spirea?