Great rose idea, McNastarana! A good cover story, too. :-) Carol

I love your idea Carol! Thank you for going into detail, as I needed it. I do have Veilchblau, but have had no luck in rooting it so far. Cramoisi Superior climbing sounds great, I will have to look it up and check it out later, hubby wants me to spend time with him, we just got back from his nephews birthday party and am a bit tired. Thank you all for the great ideas!

I think I need Mermaid to mcnastarana.

You're more than welcome, Alana. Enjoy your couple time! Carol

Alana, Not sure if one of the Barbier ramblers would work for you. i grow a few of them trained horizontally along a wooden fence. Lovely in bloom to my eye. I grow: Albertine, Paul Transon, Leontine Gervais, Alberic Barbier, Rene Andre, Alexandre Girault, Henri Barruet and would like to say they all do well for me here in Central North Carolina. Flexible canes which help in attempting to keep them manageable. I have Cecil Climber growing up a tree and quite vigorous As Carol wrote, Veilchenblau would be a nice choice as mine does well in our growing area. If you are having trouble rooting it, maybe bury a couple of the canes in the dirt with a brick placed on top and see if it will root for your that way; may get something this spring. You have Secret Garden Musk coming too? Do you have a spot picked out for that one yet?

Instead of spreading out some climbers/ramblers, maybe plant a variety of roses as hedge that would grow to you liking for height and width.

Patty

I do have Secret Garden Musk coming, I was going to stick it somewhere else though. I have one more question, this spot I'm talking about most of it get's sun from top to bottom, but there are a few places that a foot or two at the bottom doesn't receive much sun, but after that foot or so gets it pretty much all day, would there be certain variety's that would do better there?

Patty I do have Paul Transon, and Leontine Gervais, but placed them up front on trees up there. I gotta run again, but thanks so much for the help and ideas, ya'll keep them coming!

Ok I think I will start with Paul's Himalayan musk, my already rooted Cherokee, La Mortola, Mermaid, White Lady Banks and Alberic Barbier. If anyone has any suggestions on which ones/one would do better in the one spot they have to climb a few feet for their sun please let me know. Thanks again everyone for your help!

I can't wait for my roses to mature! The ones I have and the ones I'm getting :)

Mermaid and also Mme Alfred Carriere do fine with some shade. I don't think they, along with many of the other big climbers and ramblers are fast to get started though. MAC can take several years to get going, but is well worth the wait. Mermaid, in my experience and from what I've read can be temperamental about deciding whether or not to grow/live at all; I'd probably suggest getting a larger plant to start off with, if available. Of course, she's a brute once she takes off, so I would put her where she can just do her thing (ie grow into a vast, fearsome monster) and not even think about pruning or primping of any kind in the future, if you value your life... ;-)

In case it's not clear from the above, I think they're two of the most gorgeous roses ever..

Thanks for letting me know these would take a while to get on with the growing. I'll be to put the fast growers away from the slow growers.

I ditto what Comtesse said about MAC being slow to start and one of the loveliest roses. She's tough, too, once established. I grew mine from a band and planted her on a French drain. Yes, really. She's huge now, 12 years later. Sweetly fragrant and blooms late spring through fall here in Portland. Carol

Carol I do have a MAC coming from Burlington, so I can put her back there too . Comtesse said she does well in shade so, I guess she will do good where she can climb to the light so to speak.. That just leaves me ordering Paul's Himalayan musk, La Mortola, Mermaid, White Lady Banks and Alberic Barbier. Hopefully I'm able to get white lady banks from a friend. She had trouble getting it to root last year. She did get the yellow, so if I have to I can make do with that , I've just always wanted the white form :)

Carol I may have to try Climbing Cecil too, since she is so tall and dense, I do have the spray form though, I think I read somewhere she can climb, do you think she would work if I root her. Maybe she will root easy for me, since I'm not the greatest with it. I keep getting better though :) I also meant to tell you I do have some type of honey suckle in one small section that has been there forever. It doesn't get real big though, and I actually made some jelly from it last year :) My husband likes it.

Thanks so much everyone for your help, and if you have any more tips and advice for what I'm doing that will be great. I plan on getting some rebar, and make the tripods with them that I read about, to help them reach the trees. That should work right? Or do I just need to use one to help them get there?

Thanks again everyone for your helping me with this..

Carol one more question, you mention Quinces, I was reading n them and there are so many different kind, flowering edible, is there one I can get for my climate that can do both and are disease resistant, because some are prone to diseases I was reading, Thanks in advance and hopefully someone can help with this :)

Hi, Alana. Nice rose choices!

Cecile climbing and Cecile spray are two different plants. Spray grows tallish but does not climb. It's really a big shrub. The climber is like a rambler. You could place a Cecile spray in between and a bit in front of your various climbers/ramblers to create a step down from the back row of big boys and girls. This would make your (thorny) flowering neighbor barrier deeper and create a sort of baffle effect.

Flowering quince (Chaenomeles japonica) is often heathy but can get disease in high humidity or poor drainage. It will take some shade and grows well in sun. It is a good thorny, spring blooming barrier plant that will sucker (not uncontrollably) over time. The website southernliving.com has an article on flowering quince and its cultivation and pests. The article shows up in a Google search.

If there is enough shade, another plant that might work in the mix is good ol' evergreen Camellia japonica used in place of staggered spray Ceciles or quince plants. When mature, the Camellia row would make a year round screen. However, camellias don't sport any thorns to ward off stray teenagers, darn it, and in my experience, they do grow more slowly than all the above.

FYI, in case you haven't experimented, honeysuckles are pretty easy to root. Even I can do it. Ha, ha. I believe that some are invasive in your area, so it would be worth researching the variety on your property to see if it's a good one to intentionally propagate. Ones that are approved are often listed on local university horticultural sites, and the cool thing about honeysuckles is that you can purchase one and make oodles more with ease! I have propagated a dozen Lonicera periclymenum 'Serotinas' over the years. Oh, and another cool thing is that honeysuckle vines attract bees and hummingbirds! I have a honeysuckle-Blush Noisette rose combo that is closely guarded and frequently visited by a hummingbird every summer. My daughter sits on the porch and watches for our tiny visitor.

Carol

ok, wow, alot of information to digest and go over. Thank you so much for going into detail. I don't think the honeysuckle I have is invasive because it's pretty much stayed put the 15 odd years we've had this property, but I'll still look it up. I've never tried rooting it. Thanks for going into such detail about it all.

Not to overwhelm you! I know whatever you do will be lovely, Alana. I just had some thoughts, so I shared...and shared...and shared.... :-) Have a lovely day! Carol

Not too overwhelmed, just alot to digest! Thanks Carol!

Just catching up here... Honeysuckle jelly sounds interesting! :-)

I presume it involves the flowers, not the berries, which I seem to remember are supposed to be poisonous...?

Yes you use the flowers, take out the end of them, where the pollen stuff is, I can't think of the right term. Use them just like you make rose jelly, my husband liked it better because it's not as perfumey.

Are you trying to block the whole back fence area or just stop them from looking at you while you are sitting outside? If it's the latter, why not just plant some roses up close to the sitting area and be done with it. You can't see them, they can't see you and you've saved a ton of money. Of course if you are really just trying to come up with more roses then go for it..... lol

Alittle of both toolbelt68, lol, but it's mostly the later, but for that part of the yard, the tree climbers would be better, anything else would have to compete with tree roots, so I need them to be vigorous :)

What about New Dawn? It blooms in the shade and grows fast..........

Thanks summersrhythm, I may look into New Dawn , but I've already got a great list I think. She does look lovely though!

Alana, I was just checking out Rose Petal Nursery's web site, and noticed that they have 'Arcata Pink Globe' on offer. For some reason I thought of you and your living fence plans. It seems like a lovely rose that might be a nice addition to your family of roses.

I also agree with Carol that some camellias in the shadier spots would be lovely. They don't grow quickly, but there are some rather gorgeous varieties out there, and winter flowers are a fine thing. I have a friend who has planted many camellias out in his woods, and they have thrived in the dappled light. Many are small trees themselves by now, and they are a beautiful sight in winter.

Virginia

You know Virginia I was actually looking at there website today and saw they had it as well, I added it to my wish list for when I get more money I can spend. I wonder if I'll ever be able to grow all the varieties that are on my list.. Maybe one day :)

Thank you for the thoughts on the camellia, my mom grows quite a few of those, so I may try to root some of hers. I think hers have stayed kinda small though? Maybe there are different kinds?

Camellia japonica grows into large shrubs/shrubby trees. Camellia sasanqua is medium and can be espaliered. The tea camellia, Camellia sinensis, is medium and bushy. (Camellia lover) Carol

Alana, that's funny that we were both noticing that rose at the RPN site today. I think it's a very good-looking rose in photos, although I don't yet know it or grow it.

Carol, I've seen large sasanquas and japonicas here, but there are some varieties that stay smaller, and as I'm sure you know, pretty much any camellia is amenable to being pruned to a desired size. I have a 'Tama-no-ura' camellia that seems to grow sidewise like it wants to be espaliered. If I had any garden design sense whatsoever, I could probably figure out where to put it so I could espalier it, but sadly, I seem to have missed out on the design genes.

Alana, if your mom's shrubs are fairly small, they may still be fairly young, have been pruned to size, or just a variety that doesn't get that big. In our neighborhood, there are many decades-old japonicas and sasanquas that are large shrubs/small trees, but the trend with newer plantings seems to be either smaller plants, or plants that are pruned to stay small. One variety I would especially recommend for your conditions is 'Professor Sargent'. It grows more quickly than your average japonica, tends to have an attractive growth habit, and gets back to blooming more quickly than almost any other camellia after freezing weather. Oh, and it has a fairly long bloom season, too.

Virginia

Thanks Virginia! I thought it was funny we happened to be looking at the same site at almost the same time and at the same rose! I know some of my moms are some she rooted off her dad's after he passed, that was another reason for trying to root a couple.. I love the look of Professor Sargent ! Thanks so much for the recommendation.

Good points, Virginia! You and Alana live in wonderful areas for growing big, beautiful camellias. I always think of camellias as evergreen, spring blooming roses. The highest compliment! Carol

Yea they are beautiful aren't they Carol :)

Just wanted to share this everyone! I got cuttings of my Neighbor's huge camellia's that were growing in the trees. One, the stripy white and pink is fragrant! I hope they root!

Alana, it's highly likely that the first camellia is a very old cultivar. It's called 'Hikarugenji' in Japan, but in the U.S. (and elsewhere?) it's usually called 'Herme' (pronounced like 'Hermie'). And it's fragrant, and rather gorgeous. I also have a neighbor who grows it; she gave me permission to take cuttings, but I haven't got a Round Tuit yet.

Here's a photo I took of 'Herme': https://www.flickr.com/photos/87333171@N08/15196146787/in/datetaken-public/lightbox/

If I had to guess on the other two, I'd say the red one might be 'Lady Clare' and the white one might be 'Silver Waves'. There are many similar-looking cultivars for both of those, so I don't say that with much certainty. They're all lovely camellias though... Enjoy!

Virginia

Thank You Virginia. They should all be available from around the same time. These people are probably in their late 50's early 60's and the lady's husbands mother planted all of these. They are kin to my husband by marriage. They are such sweet people. She also has a bush a bee pollinated I may get cuttings of because it bloom's two different flowers. They dug it up as a seedling from where I got my cuttings from.

I actually already got cuttings from 8 or more different varieties. One was red, the white, two different pinks, a more double red/pink, the stripped and a couple of others. I'm really thinking of getting the bush, because of the different colored blooms.

I think you could be spot on about the names, the only one I'm not sure of is the white. Silver Waves is a mid-season bloomer, and this one is a early season bloomer.

I got MAC from A Reverence for Roses last Summer and she is 10ft + now. Mermaid came from ARE about the same time and is 12 ft in several directions..not slow to start here lol but maybe slower in colder zones.

I love that pink striped camellia!

Thank you! I'm so hoping that stripped one roots!

Oh Alana! Thank you for posting the camellia pictures. I love camellias and have tried to grow them several times, never with success. Camellia Forest carries camellias that are hardy in Zone 6 but still no success here. I think that the clay, the alkaline subsoil and water in addition to the zone is just too much of a challenge.

Cath

I have clay here but I think our clay is slightly acidic. Not sure about rain and all. I sure do hope these root Cath!

I just wanted to update this on the Camellias I was trying to root was a fail. I think that last 4 days of really late hard frost must have done them in. I will be trying again this coming Spring making sure there is no late frost coming when I try again.

Alana, I have a no-name seedling camellia here that's taller than me, and perhaps older than me. It's a japonica, but starts flowering earlier than most other japonicas. I'm thinking it would be a good plant to get spread around since its bloom time is mostly Nov/Dec, before we start having to worry about freezy weather here. Anyone who grows camellias in areas with freezing temps should try to have early and late bloomers, as well as those with a long bloom season.

If you're interested, I'll try to root a few cuttings for you.

The first photo is early November, the second is early December. The bees really love those stamens!

Virginia

OHH! That would be wonderful Virginia, Thank You! I know that you liked the stripped camellia so if I can get some rooted I would more than happy to send you one as well :) It would be nice to have a fall bloomer with the spring bloomers.

I guess there's no way someone in 6b could grow camellias. : ( These are so beautiful and probably smell divine.

Alana, I'll try to root a cutting or two, and will certainly share with you if I have any luck. It should begin blooming soon, only the prolonged heat may delay it some this year?

Virginia

vaporvac, most camellias are fragrance-free. There are a few varieties that have some fragrance, but I don't know if any of them are cold hardy.

There is an ancient variety called 'Kumasaka' that looks a bit like the camellia I have, and it's rated to 6b. Other cold-hardy camellias here... 'Kuro Delight' is another good-looking possibility?

Vaporvac, I have two books on growing camellias in cold climates. Both are by William Ackerman, Growing Camellias in Cold Climates and Beyond the Camellia Belt. Some of the camellias are even rated to zone 6. I have not been able to carry them more than one winter but I hope you can.

C

Thank u both. I've always coveted growing them and just assumed it was impossible for me. Cath, where in zone 6 do u live?

Well that's great Vaporvac! If I get more extras rooted I don't mind sending you one.

I've been trying to root my neighbor's silvery mid pink (unknown variety) camellia. If I succeed, I'll drop you a note in case you're interested, Alana. The original plant dates to the 1940s, but I'm guessing it was cutting grown as a pass along. So, the variety is probably much older. Some of the roses in the garden are old classic varieties dating to the early 1900s and before. The hollyhocks were started from pass along seeds and the irises are antiques. My elderly neighbor's parents were very frugal, pass along gardeners. My favorite kind! :-). Carol

Vaporvac, I live near Dayton, Ohio.

Cath

We're neighbors, Cath!!! I'm in Cincinnati! We'll have to share what does well for us, although our substrate is very complicated since the glaciers ended here and there's a lot of upwelling from very deep ancient rock. Still, you're the closest on the forum, for sure. : ) Unfortunately, I'm just a rose newbie, but a passionate and eager learner! I have quite a few roses, I'd be happy to share once they're cutting size.

Vaporvac, I'm an oldie but have difficulty growing roses here. Your experiences will be of great value. I almost said that my contribution will be the roses that don't grow but then I remembered Etoile de Hollande. I planted it a few years ago and it promptly died. OK, I thought, it doesn't like it here. Then Melissa highly recommended it as a good rose that was also tough. Having faith in Melissa's opinion, I tried it this year and it has grown very well in a tough spot. I am delighted! But left wondering how many times we should replant a rose in order to know it will not grow for us. I usually max out at three if it is one I have fallen in love with. Am I being stingy?

Cath