additives to bread ,,,,?

9 years ago

I have noticed that a loaf of bread that sits on the counter for a long time never seems to get moldy or stale like it used to in years past! Is something added to the bread now to 'preserve' it? Doesn't seem to matter what brand or price, it all seems to never get 'old'!

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fawnridge (Ricky)

9 years ago

I avoid bread unless I bake it. Having joined the cancer battle three years ago, I've become super-aware of what's in the food I eat, cook, and bake. No one ever knows for certain why they get cancer, but if you compare the rates around the world, it's quite easy to make a correlation to processed foods.

I think back to the 60 years I ate anything that wasn't moving (or faster than me to catch) and wonder if a healthier lifestyle might have prevented it. I know without a doubt that there's something in a Slim Jim that could trigger a mutation and all those dirt water hot dogs on the New York City streets may have played a role. I didn't just drink cola, I drank Jolt, by the gallon. Red meat, whole milk, Sugar Frosted Flakes, I am guilty of gluttony and perhaps the cause of my own problem.

My fondest hope is that I'm not too late to undo much of the damage. Food-wise, I'm as organic as possible and though I limit my carbs, fresh baked bread will never come off the list.

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Comments (21)

lindac92
9 years ago
Absolutely.....and some brands more than others. Sara Lee products keep forever! I don't eat things that don't eventually mold or spoil in other ways.
And that's one reason why I make my own bread.
annie1992
9 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Like LindaC, it's one of the reasons I bake bread, buns, rolls, sometimes even bagels, it seems unnatural for anything to last that long...

I used to blame the "squishy white bread" variety, being nearly devoid of any real nutrition or natural ingredients, but it really seems like all of it, from wheat to rye, lasts pretty much forever. It's kind of creepy, even mold won't grow on the stuff.

I have a couple of hot dog buns that have been at Dave's shop since October, when I grilled some brats there for the guys for lunch. They're still not moldy. I know the shop is cold, but 3 months? Now I'm leaving them there just to see how long before they mold...

Annie
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gldno1- Here's the 100% Whole Wheat Bread Recipe. It's designed to be made in a bread machine, but it can be made by hand. I have to give my friend, Mildred from Missouri, the credit for this great recipe. 100% Whole Wheat Bread Bread Machine (changes for by-hand at the bottom of the recipe) Sponge: 3/4 c. lukewarm buttermilk (I use homemade kefir.) 3/4 c. lukewarm water 2-1/2 c. freshly-milled white whole wheat flour (Prairie Gold from Wheat Montana is my favorite wheat variety) 1/4 t. ascorbic acid* 2 t. SAF-Instant Yeast Mix these ingredients in the bread machine pan and set the machine to QUICK DOUGH. As soon as the mixture is well mixed, stop and unplug the machine and allow to sit (with the lid closed) at least 2-1/2 hours, or up to 12 hours (or something in between). I'd suggest at least 12 hours if you are using a whole wheat flour milled from red wheat varieties, for a more mild flavor. 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It's doubled when it reaches the 2-quart line. You can get plastic food storage containers (with a tight-fitting lid and graduated measures on the side) at restaurant supply stores (or through King Arthur Flour - aka dough doubler). For this recipe a 2-quart container works perfectly.) After the bread machine finishes the dough cycle (or has doubled in the dough rising bucket), dump the dough onto a Silpat and with oiled/greased hands deflate the dough by pushing it in the middle with your fist then drawing all edges of the outside dough into the middle (turning the dough inside-out, so to speak). Divide the dough into portions (I scale the dough for accuracy.) Round each portion (make it into a smooth ball) so that all the gluten strands are going into the same direction. Cover and allow to rest 10-15 minutes so the gluten relaxes. Form dough (oil your hands when you handle the dough), pan, cover with plastic wrap for the final proofing - etc.... 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Sue- Is it the wisdom of the ages or science from the experts? This is what I've read from "experts" - I'm just the person sitting behind the keyboard typing after I've gathered a stack of books by my side. According to Shirley Corriher in "Cookwise", salt plays three roles in dough: It enhances flavor, controls bacteria, and strengthens dough by tightening gluten. She even suggests if the water you are using in your breads is soft (low mineral content), you'll want to be sure to add high-mineral salt - which are natural sea salts, not table salt. The minerals in natural sea salt also play into yeast activity. But what is too much salt... As little as 1/3 t. of salt per cup of flour can be enough to noticeably slow yeast growth. Salt can be added intentionally to slow yeast growth. More salt may be added to dough, such as in a bakery setting when you would want to slow down fermentation until the next shift of workers comes on. 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dandyrandylou
9 years ago
We purchase speciality breads from Wegman's and Giant, and even though we eat a lot of bread, I find I must freeze by slice in order to keep them from molding.
sleevendog (5a NY 6aNYC NL CA)
9 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Compare homemade bread...flour, yeast, salt, water. Then look at store-bought bread ingredients.

Our weekend Boule, makes two loaves, lasts 24 hours. Does not mold right away but for freshness we use it or freeze it. Within 12 hours. Frozen we use it by a few weeks. Mostly for quick soup croutons or toast. Slice half a loaf for sandwiches and freeze.

-a co-worker friend wanting an up-coming early retirement business for his wife, bought a bakery business. Oddly it was set up with all equipment and 'kit' delivered pre-mixed ingredients...just add water. No baker experience needed.

Smells nice, sort of, but not a true from scratch bakery. They are still a bit clueless but turned it into a social small town coffee shop that seems to work-ish. Not a great retirement business but it is holding expenses. Barely.

So many fast food places are 'factory' pre-parred, then shipped. Starbucks sandwiches are made in a factory then have months in those wrappers. (found that out when they had a re-call and the dates were months ahead). ick.

It just isn't practical for most families to bake their own bread or sandwich breads. I do buy a good sprouted grain at Costco for my dad...six loaves at a time that he freezes. Takes your hits with preservatives if you can't avoid it but try and balance that with better whole fresh foods on the bread.
plllog
9 years ago
Acidic breads keep better. I use well aged sourdough starter and/or vitamin C in my home baked breads, as a necessary treatment for the anti-nutrients in my freshly milled wheat, but they also help the bread to last nearly a week on the counter in a Bee's Wrap (beeswax infused linen).
Nancy
9 years ago
DH has always been big on sandwiches. The last few years he has bought a loaf of bread, eaten a few slices, then buys another loaf. He says the bread tastes "off". I don't really notice it so much, I like almost ALL food, but I wasn't surprised when I realized how the bread wasn't molding, & it did start to smell just old. His diabetes got worse so now he doesn't eat much bread, I make most all our bread. Milk is the same way it seems to me. At one time milk pretty much spoiled by the time it reached expiration date. It often lasts about a week past that now, although I can't drink it that long. Doesn't taste or smell sour, just off.
sheilajoyce_gw
9 years ago
Our milk lasts longer now that we are empty nesters and the kids are not here to open the refrigerator every 20 minutes to see what is in there!
plllog
9 years ago
My friend is a milk connoisseur (who can taste which dairy it's from). He also thinks the milk doesn't taste right after being open a couple of days, or in the fridge a week. It picks up flavors from the carton and the air. Spoilage is another story. Ultrapasteurization will give it longer holding time, but also kills the good things in the milk as well as the bad (e.g., can't make cheese out of it) and does affect the flavor a lot. That's the biggest change I know of with milk and might be what you're seeing. In general, holding it very cold (mid 30's) will keep both the milk and the flavor, if it's in glass and well sealed.

Many breads use dough conditioners. They help the sponginess and take away some of the need for artisanship that doesn't lend itself well to large scale baking. They've been used for more than 100 years. There's nothing new there. But one can become more sensitive to them. It's also possible that the flavor of the flour itself has changed.
laceyvail 6A, WV
9 years ago
I've been buying Mestemacher Bread, made in Germany, through Amazon, usually the Three Grain or Rye. Ingredient list for the Three Grain: whole kernel rye, water, wholemeal rye flour, oat kernels, barley kernels, flax seed, salt, oat fiber, sesame seeds, yeast. In addition, the package states: Freshly ground in our own mill from whole grains, a statement I don't think even most small specialty bakeries could make in America.

What makes it even more astonishing is that the bread is shelf stable for a year from the date of baking. I'm flabbergasted by this, but I trust Germany for stating only the truth. And the bread is delicious. (BTW, normally the cost for 6 packages of this bread is around $20; I don't know why it is so expensive now.)

https://www.amazon.com/Mestemacher-Bread-Three-Grain-17-6-Ounce/dp/B00471YHU2/ref=sr_1_7_s_it?s=grocery&ie=UTF8&qid=1483874052&sr=1-7&keywords=mestemacher%2Bbread&th=1
l pinkmountain
9 years ago
BHA and BHT. Look 'em up.
laceyvail 6A, WV
9 years ago
pinkmountain, if your comment referred to mine, there's no BHA or BHT in the Mestemacher bread. Nothing but what I listed. And BTW, I know what they are.
Louise Ibbotson, Technician
9 years ago
Now that we are empty nester, we seem to have the opposite problem. Unless I keep it in the fridge or freezer it goes mouldy before we can use it. I really don't like it from the fridge as it dries out.
nancyofnc
9 years ago
Re the Mestemacher bread, my DH said with all the thick grains and seeds in it that it would taste like tree bark, not like bread that he recognizes as homemade white bread or squishy Wonder. Could not imagine using it to make bread pudding or grilled cheese, let alone a BLT.

Personally, I would like it for something good to eat like as a canape, but not for a sandwich. And, it probably lasts a year because no one would eat it except on occasion.

My homemade gluten free bread lasts a max of 3 days then absorbs all the wild yeasts, bacteria, and molds naturally occurring in the air. Even refrigerated it only keeps for a couple days more. It's the reason I only make a small loaf and put the GF mixture in the refrigerator for the next batch next week.

As for preservatives, I expect to live to 150 because of all those I've eaten in the last 70 years.
l pinkmountain
9 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
So there was no mention of what the preservative was? Interesting. I know I ate something today and I could taste the BHT in it. I wonder if they have to list it by name or if they can get away with just listing "preservatives."

Edited to add that I love that whole meal type of European bread (Mestemacher and other such types). I always keep whole grain type things in the fridge, because whole grains can go rancid and they still look fine, but will taste awful and will not be particularly good for you (free radicals, although you probably get exposed to worse stuff just using your smart phone, I dunno). I had to throw out my steel cut oats last week for just that reason.
sleevendog (5a NY 6aNYC NL CA)
9 years ago
The Mestemacher does not use preservatives. They use a second version of heat once packaged probably like a pasteurization. Extends the shelf life but not for an eternity. Some people just keep it frozen. Or freeze once open. Doesn't need to be as it is a shelf bread.

Almost all bread is best kept frozen. (i said almost). The fridge is not a great place to store bread. Mestemacher is an exception. I like it. The best sandwich use is a 1/2 slice under the broiler, then a bit of tuna salad or ham slice, a slice of gruyere, enough to melt off the top a bit falling on the parchment. For that 'cheese skirt' we call it. The crispy fried cheese 'skirt'.

I make my own version now so have not purchased in years.
plllog
9 years ago
Labelling laws are confusing. Small amounts (specifically defined by law) can be mashed together in a single category, like "spices", and even smaller amounts don't have to be listed at all. I was reading something that I didn't fully internalize about making preservative agents out of flours, so that might be something the M. do.

My daily bread is home milled whole grain with lots of other unmilled grains and seeds in it. It makes excellent sandwiches, toast and is good in bread pudding, though best when mixed with other, less dense breads. It is not, however, white or squishy. :)
lindac92
9 years ago
For years and years I have eaten a bread similar to the German whole grain bread lacyveil describes. I remember it being in my house as a child...like 70 years ago.
No, there are no preservatives, yes it does keep for a long time and yes it is delicious, with butter or cream cheese or Liederkrantz (do they still make that?) with mustard and sausages and also with peanut butter.
As for not having to list small amounts of certain things on the label...that's pretty much not so. I remember about 20 years ago....maybe longer....when the state inspectors required a certain cheese maker to list on the label a bleaching agent....eventhough the amount was so minute that listing it wasn't previously required and the usual means of testing couldn't detect it's presence and even though it was only added some of the time when the cows were on green pasture and gave a slightly green tint to the milk.
And BHT and BHA MUST be listed!
party_music50
9 years ago
Annie, I can't believe those hot dog buns haven't molded since October!

My BF thought it would be amusing to see how long a packaged Twinkie would last... he bought it ... decades ago?!... and it still looks like it just came out of the vending machine. LOL!!!

I'm lucky because we do have really good bakeries around here! Wonderful bread and they don't use any preservatives or additives. Unluckily, BF can't eat wheat anymore. :(
laceyvail 6A, WV
9 years ago
Thank you, Lindac and Sleevendog. I too love the Mestemacher bread, otherwise, why buy it!? (That it's healthy is the bonus.) I also believe it says directly on the packages, No Preservatives. (Too lazy to run downstairs and check). I've always loved dense, heavy dark breads, and like Lindac, (I'm just short of 72) grew up on them. Once I open a package, I put it in a plastic bag and keep it in the fridge. Easily lasts a couple of weeks (I've never had it around for longer than that) and it's as good the last day as the day I opened it.

I'm thrilled to have found it.
plllog
9 years ago
I didn't mean I thought there were chemical preservatives in the bread, just that I'd read you can make some out of flour. But now I can't find the reference. I did look up trace ingredients--FDA says they can be there but have to be listed if they're functional. :)

additives to bread ,,,,?

fawnridge (Ricky)

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