SubZero Depth: we have purchased a 36" Built-in, over-under refrigerator-freezer, panel ready.

Dimensions for Flush Inset. What is that?

Thank you, for the link and images, mamma goose. So, it would probably look okay to have 48" x 36" of butcher block and 30" of whatever (non-butcher block.) It's not my preference, but I do think it would give us peace of mind on several fronts.

24" is opening cut out. Door sticks out past that and so does handle. Flush inset is flush against countertop so door doesn't stick out. But it still requires the same depth. The opening is just deeper. Overall depth of fridge is 26 3/16 not including the handle.

So, if we want this flush with the countertop we need to have our carpenters recess it into the wall a bit? I was expecting the handles to extend the same as the cabinets.

Yes or build out the rest of the cabinets out. I don't know how much the handles stick out. That's one thing I forgot to check in the showroom and I didn't see it in any of the guides.

If you have space to recess it, that's the route I would take. Is that an exterior wall though?

cpartist

"What is the width of the aisle from prep sink to cooktop?"

Originally it was 48". I believe that he's whittled that down to 41 1/4". I think this is in part due to him aligning the two islands on the backsides rather than the fronts. I was only allotting 36" behind the stools on the island. I believe we can gain 2.25" if we align the way I had intended. I also think he's taken away some depth for handles and such that I may have underestimated. We may need to inset the refrigerator to get the true built-in depth. I don't know if this is cost-prohibitive, but it seems to be done quite often from the impression I've gotten on the message board. We may not be able to get to a true 48", but I'd like to try.

smm5525, the garage is on the other side.

It was suggested to us that we use the same line of handles/pulls that we'll be using in the rest of the kitchen rather than purchase the SubZero handles.

If you recess the fridge can you open the doors all the way?

Then inset into garage for sure! Keep in mind when you are finalizing aisles that you'll have the 36" door swinging into the aisle where the person at the prep sink is.

chicagoans, I believe we could because the hinge side is open without cabinetry on that side.

Subzero allows for flush install. I believe it's 110 degree opening with a 90 degree stop option (at least for the FD I'm getting). Double check for your model.

Cheryl why not do 36" French door?

smm5525

Then inset into garage for sure! Keep in mind when you are finalizing aisles that you'll have the 36" door swinging into the aisle where the person at the prep sink is.

Ah, yes. We may wipe someone out with a door from time to time.

smm5525

Cheryl why not do 36" French door?

As we were contemplating our options in the store it occurred to us that buying the floor model and getting 20% off was very attractive.

This is how it looks with standard install (not flush). Note paneled door sticks out.

That makes sense! Just think through how it's going to function with someone retrieving things from fridge while another is prepping or cooking when you are finalizing aisles and layout.

Well, poopy-doop. LOL. I will cross my fingers that recessing it will be an option the BF will approve. :)

I think we'll be fine, as anyone at the sink can sidestep for a second to allow the door to pass. Most of our time will be in the prep zone to the right, I expect.

Good to find out now than after. We had someone post here after install how bad she thought the panel stuck out. She thought it would be flush. Hers was a diff brand.

im not paneling mine so I don't care if it sticks out. If paneled I would want flush

Make sure you check with the contractor (I can't recall if this is going to be DIY), about recessing the fridge, since frames for door openings have doubled 2x4s (king and jack studs), and the second header for the fridge would need a third 2x4 (jack stud), you might have to adjust the fridge over by a couple of inches.

Also, light switches (especially from an exterior entry) are usually placed just inside the door--where will you have the light switches, since the fridge is snugged up to the door trim on one side, and the broom closet is on the other? I remember you've posted your plans before, but I'm sure I missed that detail. Have you considered a stub wall to hold the light switches? And if you put a stub wall and switches on that side, you'd want to flip the door swing. If it's already covered, carry on. ;)

I believe that he's whittled that down to 41 1/4". I think this is in part due to him aligning the two islands on the backsides rather than the fronts. I was only allotting 36" behind the stools on the island. I believe we can gain 2.25" if we align the way I had intended. I also think he's taken away some depth for handles and such that I may have underestimated. We may need to inset the refrigerator to get the true built-in depth. I don't know if this is cost-prohibitive, but it seems to be done quite often from the impression I've gotten on the message board. We may not be able to get to a true 48", but I'd like to try.

Can you steal some room from the pantries by making them a bit smaller and not as deep? I really would try for a minimum of 45" if you can.

mama goose_gw zn6OH, thank you for bringing up the framing of the garage door. The refrigerator was intended to be over a few inches with the broom closet on that side, but the KD switched it to the opposite side. I had already noted that he seemed to have omitted the lightswitch that I had on my original plan. That will be included in our list of items that I'll be emailing him today.

cpartist, yes, I am totally willing to drop the depth of the pantries. I believe people have posted that even 5" pantries are useful. They are currently at 10", what would people advise between 5" and 10"? If they were 8" we would hit the 45". Sufficient?

Also, regarding the pantries, I was thinking of 60" high, leaving 3' above them for a TV or monitor, perhaps, but they could run to the ceiling (8'). What do you all think?

The seating for the island faces the wrong direction to enjoy the screen. Unless your favorite thing to do is cook along with TV chefs (YouTube videos, etc.), I'd skip the TV in favor of more storage, especially if you decrease the depth of the pantries. What's the upward limit of comfortable storage for you? 72"? You could have the pantries stop at that point and display a collection of pottery or other artwork above.

I use the end of my island for baking prep--it faces my open china hutch in the DR, and I never get tired of the view.

The TV would be for me while I stand at the prep island. The kids dominate the other TVs in the house, so sometimes it would be nice to dictate what's on. We are planning for the tops of the upper wall cabs to have glass for displaying pretties. Maybe we should continue with that on the pantry wall, too, considering how few uppers we have.

Question regarding the "hutch": how many drawers? I told the cabinet maker three, because I was thinking it would mirror the height that the appliance garage in the other wall cabinet on the same wall, but I'm unsure. Typically, I see pictures of one and two drawers. I think it's more aesthetically pleasing when the doors start closer to the countertop.

Thoughts? Mirror the height of the other upper or let it do its own thing? I'd want a minimum of two drawers, because I want silverware in the lower one and a charging station in the upper. The question is two or three drawers?

How deep are they? I would do two more on the shallow side. Three might be too tall to function depending on how tall ya'll are. Gotta be able to see inside.

Hmm, I don't know how deep to specify. The cabinet is 15" front to back. You bring up a good point about being able to see down into the drawer. I'm 5' 4", but some of the kids are shorter (for now). Two drawers makes sense to me. I'm thinking 6", but I'd like input, because I really don't know if this is standard.

My designer put two. I don't know how deep they are, we haven't gotten that far. Here's the first draft she came up with. They don't exactly line up with the other side but it's close. She did say one would be for stuff like placemats so they are pretty shallow.

If you click the image it's not as blurry

Cheryl, why not use edge grain instead? Then you can have your entire island in BB.

How high will the stacks of dishes you take out of the cabinets be? You'll want the drawers at least that height, so that you can close the doors above the stacks of dishes, without moving everything immediately. You'd normally be lifting everything in an upper down 18" inches to the counter anyway, so 18" should be fine. Is the appliance garage taller than that?

My tallest drawer stack is 54" (top edge) from the floor, and at 5'7" I have no trouble seeing the items inside.

smm5525, thanks for the drawing. Looks nice! I considered housing our placemats and napkins in one of the drawers, but we have a sideboard in the dining room where we keep them and it's really convenient.

ascorsonelli, we can't cut directly on edge grain like we can with end grain. I am hoping to get away from pulling out cutting boards all the time.

Cheryl have u considered prep sink with ledge to hold cutting board? Like the Kohler stages or Kohler Prolific?

Re: drawers, what would u put in them? That should dictate size but I wouldn't worry about lining up to appliance garage

Can u post the elevations for the sink wall from original plan.

Lily'smom, I'm not sure I could get a larger sink past the BF. As it is, he dislikes the idea of giving up prep space for a second sink. The interior dimensions of the sink I have scoped out is ~ 15" x 15". I'm hoping it's adequate.

Blanco 440079 Performa Silgranit II Single Bowl Sink, Anthracite

smm5525

Cheryl have u considered prep sink with ledge to hold cutting board? Like the Kohler stages or Kohler Prolific?

I did consider that sink. I fell into deep lust after gazing upon its beauty too long. But they're so big and it would fit better on the sink wall. But that sink serves a different purpose. It doesn't make much sense to put a Cadillac of a prep sink in a clean-up zone no matter how much I'd like to pet it.

Re: drawers, what would u put in them? That should dictate size but I wouldn't worry about lining up to appliance garage

Can u post the elevations for the sink wall from original plan.

I don't have an elevation drawing.

The top drawer would be a charging station. The bottom drawer would hold silverware, steak knives, serving utensils, straws, and wine bottle opener.

The window will from the countertop to ceiling and ~90" wide. The appliance garage will need to be tall enough to house my KA mixer.

mama goose_gw zn6OH

How high will the stacks of dishes you take out of the cabinets be? You'll want the drawers at least that height, so that you can close the doors above the stacks of dishes, without moving everything immediately. You'd normally be lifting everything in an upper down 18" inches to the counter anyway, so 18" should be fine. Is the appliance garage taller than that?

My tallest drawer stack is 54" (top edge) from the floor, and at 5'7" I have no trouble seeing the items inside.

The uppers will hold glasses and serving dishes. Our plates and bowls will be in the base cabinet below.

The appliance garage will not be higher than 18". I should measure my KA to see how tall it is. That's the biggest item going into the AG.

54", huh? Okay, that's good to know. I'm 3 inches shorter than you are, so I can use this as a reference.

I'd like some input on the command center I dreamed up. Should I create a new thread?

I would do two shallow drawers for those items. Then you get more practical shelf space (that you can reach) for dishes, cups, etc. Or whatever u plan on putting in those doors with shelves. Here's a visual. This pic pretty much lines up with appliance garage though

Franklin Ave. · More Info

I've seen that picture, love it. I did a search for KA mixers on Amazon and I believe that style I have is 14" tall. This would make both cabinets pretty symmetrical. Woot! I like the idea of the upper cab doors and shelves being a little lower than standard.

This is a pic of breezygirl's kitchen, from a few years ago. I love her hutch cabinet, which has only one drawer, so I don't think there are any hard and fast rules--just whatever will work for you.

Thanks, mama goose_gw zn6OH. I think two drawers is what will work best for our needs, and I think it'll look great.

The KD's plan is very dysfunctional. I would not trust much that he says. But you seem to know what you're doing. Good luck!

Thanks, emilyam819. if it seems like I know what I'm doing it's due to all the stuff I've learned here. My first plan was to have a rangetop in an island, but then I found this message board. :)

We met with our guy, Brian, from the kitchen ideas center again last week. We made a lot of decisions and we're pretty excited. Perimeter cabinets will be Plato and the two islands will be Woodland (?). We decided to go with mid-level cabinetry for the islands, because we're painting them and it's one way to cut costs. The walnut cabinet uppers will have walnut interiors as well. The lower cabinet interiors will be natural maple.

Thanks to the advice on here, I decided to go with two 6" drawers in the "hutch" and the appliance garage will be 16" high.

After seeing a 3D model, there is one area of our plan that is getting an overhaul, and that's the 84"W x 60"H x 10"D pantry. It looked like a row of lockers. Ugh. I hadn't taken it to the ceiling, because I wanted to put a TV above it. I've since given that idea up and I'm excited about the ideas Brian presented.

Basically, a shallow hutch (10" - 13" deep, maybe less) with 18"W floor to ceiling pantry cabinets bookending a center display area - either glass doored cabinets or open shelves, with countertop dividing top and bottom.

The pictures below are similar to the idea.

As soon as we started discussing possibilities I remembered this post by illinigirl: what height pull for these extra tall uppers in bar area? I loved her design drawings for her bar area. At the end of the thread she has a picture of the partially completed bar behind an island, I believe. I especially like that the plans call for 'wood shelves with glass inserts' for the center display area.

I'm not 100% sure how this will evolve, but it's possible we'd use the center shelves for alcohol. Or maybe just a display area for pretty things. The side cabinets would definitely need to hold pantry staples.

We also met with a general contractor and that went quite well. We have another meeting with him tomorrow. Our project would be about 12 weeks out, and he estimates it'll take 12 weeks to complete. He will be presenting us with a full plan tomorrow, I believe. He is also taking on relocating the washer/dryer and making sure we have a somewhat workable temporary kitchen.

Here's a way to break it up with tv. You can also break up the tall doors and put glass on the upper portion. Not sure if you have the depth for the base counter.

smm5525, that is an idea I hadn't thought of, thanks for sharing. :)

We are doing ours similar without the tv because I also didn't want a big wall of locker type cabinetry especially after trying to eliminate all uppers