Help me design a garden along my fence?

7 years ago

last modified: 7 years ago

I'm not really particular in plants. The only thing I can't do is anything too invasive. I'm not a huge fan of roses, mostly because of the thorns. im in western New York, which is listed as zone 6, but most nurseries around here say we're really a zone 5. I don't really want any trees. The area is about 25-30ft long I have to work with.. Thanks in advance.

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NHBabs z4b-5a NH

7 years ago

last modified: 7 years ago

I'll jump in along with Ken's ideas with general advice to start with.

- Dig Safe - call your local folks as Ken advised so you don't end up damaging buried utilities (and yourself). They will send someone out and mark any that are in the area.

- Get a soil test done. In most states Cooperative Extension will do this. Having the soil pH and texture will tell you what will be happy with your soil, and it will give you info on any nutrients that are lacking.

- Plan on creating a bed, so remove grass and dig in compost over the entire bed area. (Tillers can be rented, but I like hand digging.) Grass will be a nightmare to trim around shrubs and will compete with the other plants, and amending only the planting holes can lead to problems with water movement in the soil (especially in clay). Your town may have compost made from yard waste available for pickup, or you can get compost delivered by the truck load from a yard supply depot. It's far cheaper in quantity than by the bag. Get a good wheel barrow or garden cart to transport it. Having good soil to start with will get the plants off to a good start.

- I generally do the planning and prep of a large bed like yours over the course of the spring and summer, and then plant in early fall and the following spring. When the bed is prepped, I cover it with corrugated cardboard and then mulch to keep weeds from sprouting, and then pull aside the mulch and cut an X in the cardboard when I am ready to plant.

- Use buried edging along the back and side fences to keep the neighbor's grass out and either a buried edging or a V shaped dug edging along the front to keep your grass out.

Here's a bed in the process of enlarging to give you a feel for my process. Grass mostly removed at far end, and composted manure, cardboard and mulch added at the near end, with edging going in. A border of flat patio block was added just inside the edging to give the mower wheels a place to run.

- I would suggest that the bed be a minimum of 6' deep plantable space with 2' empty at the back for access to fix the fence or trim bushes or weed along the back if needed and to keep moisture away from the fence. I'd be even more likely to make it 8'-10' of plantable space since I like having layers of plants with taller ones in back and shorter flowering plants in front, and many shrubs will end up 4'-8' wide.

- Since you have winters, plan for all 4 seasons. Have plants that flower in the spring and summer, some that have great fall color, and some that look good in winter with berries or colored bark or an interesting shape or are evergreen. Think about if you want to attract birds (food or shelter) and if you want some hardscape (bench or birdbath or trellis with a vine) that will add all season interest. Consider having a small tree or two to help vary the height and structure. There are trees such as some of the smaller conifers or something like one of the dwarf crabapples that wouldn't be tree size, but would be tree structure and would break up the series of bush-shaped silhouettes.

- Plant for the size the plants will be, not what they are. This is difficult, since things will look impossibly far apart, but do it anyway.

This bed was newly planted starting the previous fall, with nothing larger than 3 1/2' tall, and mostly much smaller. In June 2010, incredibly sparse. Flowering plants at the front, shrubs and small trees farther back.

Same bed 3 years later with only a few plants added. Mostly it's just growth.

And almost exactly 5 years after planting, it has filled in enough that even in winter it still looks fairly dense and is blocking sight lines to the work area beyond. While my spot is larger than yours (60'x15') the same general ideas will work.

You have all summer to plan and prepare. When you have your soil test back, specific plants can be recommended. (For instance, I have well-drained acid soil, but someone with alkaline clay will have a totally different plant palette.) As you do the prep work, visit local nurseries and other plant sources often (every couple of weeks) to see what plants look like at different times of the year. Take photos and label them - where you saw them and the name, and then go home and research for size and seasons of interest. Look at plantings at arboretums or demo gardens or in yards that you like to develop a sense of what appeals to you.

I will recommend two specific plants that aren't fussy about soil, but have long seasons of interest. Look at variegated red-twigged dogwoods which have summer and winter interest, and Hydrangea paniculata, which for me has flowers for 3-4 months, likes full sun, and is hardy to zone 3. There is a huge one on the left in the last photo above, but they range in size from 3'x3' to 15' depending on the cultivar. Also, if you like roses but not the thorns, look at climbing rose Zephirine Drouhin; almost thornless, repeat bloom, nice scent, and hardy enough for me to grow successfully.

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Comments (40)

purslanegarden
7 years ago
What direction does that fence face (e/w or n/s)? How will the area get watered?

I also see a little bit of slope going down possibly towards the fence, too.

Do you want plants that die back in the fall or something that will stay up year-round to be the decoration along the fence?
Shannon Carey thanked purslanegarden
floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
7 years ago
Hi again Shannon. I'm pleased you came over and asked here. People will need to know where you are located to help you choose plants. And knowing which way the fence faces and how much sun it gets will be helpful too. Good luck with the project.
Shannon Carey thanked floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
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jnavarro31
7 years ago
How much sun does the area get? Is that amount equal across the whole run of fence, or does one section get more than the other? What time of day does it get sun? What kind of soil do you have (sandy, loamy, clay?)

What style of garden do you like? Do you want something more formal? Do you like the cottage garden style?

Do you have a color scheme in mind for flowering plants? What about foliage? Do you want some shrubs, or just herbaceous perennials? Do you plant on putting in annuals each year?

How much time do you have for maintenance? Some plants require more attention than others.

These are the questions you need to answer first before you can begin planning your garden. As for plants, you'll have tons of options once you figure out the rest. Right plant for the right space, and all that.
Shannon Carey thanked jnavarro31
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
Oh boy, you can see how new I am to gardening. I believe the fence faces south? I'm terrible with directions, I just know the sun rises on the right side of the fence and sets on the left side. That particular area gets full sun basically all year round, so I would definitely need full sun plants/shrubs.

There is a small area where it slopes, maybe about three feet from the fence to the yard.

I have some time for maintenance, so that's not an issue. watering shouldn't be an issue either, as I am pretty good about making sure my gardens and baskets are watered.

Im not sure what kind of soil I have, to be absolutely honest with you. I don't even know how to tell. I know I have lots of big fat earth worms. And I used soil from the other side of that area (the side of the shed) when I made my garden around my deck and those flowers have done so well, the daylilies I planted last year are so large I could probably divide them by next spring. So I'm not much help in that area, sorry.

honestly, I am open to perennials, shrubs and annuals. that could be another reason why it's difficult for me to get ideas on where to start.
ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
7 years ago
is the bed already there??? ... if not.. the first step is how wide ...

you note length.. but not width ...

then you would have to understand how to make a bed ...

and then worry about the plants ...

do you think you can get that done within a month ... if not .. it will be too late to plant many things.. with the heat of summer starting ...

after you prep the bed ... you go buy whatever strikes your fancy ... and plant ... if at some time in the future... you dont like it.. get rid of it ... dont get caught in planning out a static garden ...they are ever changing ...

then get it all mulched ...

you have far to go.. before you worry about plants .. in my estimate ...

make sure there arent any buried utilities back there BEFORE you dig .... call miss dig.. .. if you dont know ...

ken
emmarene9
7 years ago
Can deer get into your yard?
Kaillean (zone 8, Vancouver)
7 years ago
Your bed is beautiful Babs! Wish I had more room for some conifers.
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
NHBabs, so what you both are telling me is theres slim to no chance I'll be able to plant this summer? Will I be able to even plant annuals or the dozen or so perennials I already have in a different spot that I want to move? is there an easier way to remove the grass? In the other beds I've made, I didn't remove the grass. I just planted the things I wanted, then I laid the newspaper (I laid strips of black plastic contractor bags along the edge of the fence and along the foundation of the house so weeds couldn't creep back up) and mulched heavily. Granted, the gardens are only three years old so who knows what the future holds. And around the deck, my dad and I just used soil from the other side of the fence. We just put it on top of the grass. Then I planted and mulched. The following year, I preened and then mulched. Same with last year. I'm sure we did everything all wrong because im very new to gardening. I'm just very impatient. I'm ok with it looking sparse the first year, I usually just plant annuals to fill in the areas I feel need it.

Emmarene - no deer in my yard. I live on a very busy street.
NHBabs z4b-5a NH
7 years ago
You certainly can plant this summer, but that'a a big space to prep. If you work faster than I do you could plant at the beginning of the summer but it will take more work to keep it watered. (I have a few years on you and have slowed down a bit following a knee injury, so you probably work a lot faster than I, and I work on my own without a second person.) I am basically lazy so I mostly fall plant so I don't have to water much since many of my beds aren't within easy reach of a hose. Or you can prep part of the bed and plant, and then finish as you have time. Totally up to you and how your time and energy works.

If what you are doing works just fine; keep doing it. I find that if not previously removed, my grass comes up through my compost, cardboard/newspaper, and mulch, perhaps because I have field grass in most places rather than lawn grass. But if your method has worked for three years, you should be fine.

Faster ways to remove grass - a power sod stripper (then compost the sod and reuse later) or Glyphosate (AKA generic Roundup) if you want to go that route.
Shannon Carey thanked NHBabs z4b-5a NH
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
NHBabs, the garden you showed me is gorgeous and I'd like my gardens to look nice too :). I usually do all the gardens on my own, but I'm not handy in building things and whatnot so my dad helped with my deck and the garden around the deck. It was a project he had wanted to do for the last ten years, but I only moved in three years ago and was interested in having a deck. (My sister lived here before me and did absolutely nothing with the yard - the one and only garden in the backyard was so overgrown with weeds and only weeds, it took me three days to clear. I still have trouble with creeping Charlie in that garden). My dad isn't really keen on the garden along the fence due to the fact he will have to change up where he puts the grass clippings when he mows the lawn (he won't let me mow the lawn!) and he does not do well with change at all. all the other landscaping I have done around the house, he has been very pleased as he gets compliments on how nice the place looks now. Lol. So I'm thinking if I can get it done quickly, plant some fast growing annuals along with the perennials I already have and he sees how lovely it will look when it's all completed, he'll change his tune.

If I do the roundup - do I have to remove the dead grass or do I just till in the compost and any amendment (or added soil) I might need? Sorry I am asking so many questions.
marquest
7 years ago
I am a lazy gardener and I have 4 acres. I do lasagna method. I lay newspaper down and because i have so may leaves I dump all the leaves on top of the the newspaper and then soil on top and plant away.

Since your dad wants a place to dump the grass clipping save a corner for the grass clipping they are great for the garden to enrich the soil.

Since you need it to be quick and compliment ready this year I would start with some pretty bushes and annuals.

Shrubs with pretty foliage

Dappled willow -blue-green leaves are liberally dappled in pink and white,

'Emerald 'n Gold' wintercreeper - green leaves are decorated with a broad yellow edge that takes on a pink or burgundy tinge in winter.

Weigela - Any Weigela - They have purple leave with pink flowers, vargiated green/white with fragrant pink flowers, There are some really pretty colors. You can hit any Home Depot and Lowes and pick these up pretty cheap now.

That area could hold a couple of bushes and fill it in to make the area look more mature than just one year.

You could do this in a weekend.
Shannon Carey thanked marquest
floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
7 years ago
Your Dad could still put the grass clippings in the same place. They make a great mulch. But either you or he would need to spread them around rather than just piling them up. Alternatively they can be put on a compost heap which will help your new garden. Or maybe you have a mulching mower?

I'm really please that so you are so enthusiastic and getting so much help over here after your original post on Landscape Design. Good luck with it all.
Shannon Carey thanked floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
marquest
7 years ago
Have you tried a goggle search to get some ideas of a layout?

https://images.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=garden+along+fence&fr2=piv-web&hspart=att&hsimp=yhs-att_001
Shannon Carey thanked marquest
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
Marquest, you made my morning by saying I could get this done in a weekend. :) those shrubs you mentioned are a few of my favorite, too. I actually have two emerald n gold plants in my front yard that have taken a beating between the voles two years in a row and now the damn baby bunny. They're just now sprouting leaves again so maybe I will move them to the back. I'm so so excited!

floral_uk - my dad actually spreads them out along the entire fence line as he mows. I have been noticing though, the last two times he's mowed he put the clippings in the other side of the yard along the fence.

I do do have one more question (probably won't be the last). One thing I am so confused about, is planting time. Right now, a lot of the nurseries are selling their spring blooming perennials for half price. If I were to pick a few of those up, can I plant them now or do I have to wait until fall? Same with spring bulbs, they're basically giving them away. But I haven't bought any because I don't know if it would be safe to plant them now.

im so excited! thank you thank you thank you!!!
floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
7 years ago
You can plant container grown plants at any time of year providing you can water them sufficiently. You can also plant spring bulbs if they are still in leaf. Just tip them out of the pot and plant the whole clump. If they are completely dry you can keep them until fall. So get out there and snap up some bargains! Just one small tip. Over that length of bed it would look better to repeat some plants than have a long series of different plants. Keep us updated with pictures, please.
Shannon Carey thanked floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
NHBabs z4b-5a NH
7 years ago
Yes, you can till right after using glyphosate, but you can also do as Marquest suggested and cut grass super short, put down your newspapers/cardboard, a good layer of soil and compost and just plant. Then newspaper and mulch on top. This would be relatively faster than turning it all in, and the worms will turn stuff in over time. However, there is no way I could move that much soil and compost in a weekend, though I perhaps could have in my younger years. The garden in the first photo above which is probably about as long as yours but deeper, took me about a month to do, but I know I can't work all day by now without being in a fair amount of pain afterwards, so I take things at a rate I find comfortable. If you can do it, go for it! Just don't scrimp on the the bed depth.

Floral's advice to repeat certain key plants is excellent to give the bed a feeling of cohesiveness. Your comment about sale plants is a good one. As you are looking for the passed-by spring bloomers, look at other plants now as well. Shrubs often go on sale in the fall, and if you have an idea of what is available, you can snap them up when they do go on sale. You may also find some spring blooming shrubs on sale now.

I often will plan with general shapes, colors, sizes and bloom times. For the bed above, I didn't pick out specific varieties ahead of time, but went around to local nurseries that I had scoped out earlier in the season during fall sales knowing that I wanted my backbone repeated shrubs to be largely evergreens: rhodies, medium conifers in more than one color, etc. and chose several of each variety that was available and that met my needs to keep expenses down. I didn't do formal plans, but knew the ballpark size of the mature shrubs and the bed size, and once I bought the plants, I plopped the pots down in the bed and moved them around until I liked the layout, and then got out the shovel. Several of my deciduous and flowering shrubs repeat as well, so there are similar pops of color down the bed in any particular season. The perennials, clematis, and bulbs are for me just the final accessories to the shrubs, but I am planning with low maintenance gardening in mind, and you may want more perennials and only a few shrubs.
Shannon Carey thanked NHBabs z4b-5a NH
marquest
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
Shannon yes you can plant the bulbs now, I dig my bulbs up about this time to move them after the leaves die back and I know where they are. This is a great time to pick up the sales.

I know it can be done in a weekend. I would do the grass cover Saturday. Work on that all day. Then do the planting on Sunday. When you get the bushes in and the annuals around them top it off with several bags of mulch and you will be done. Just look for bushes and plants that have leaf color so when your annuals are not in bloom you will have color.
Shannon Carey thanked marquest
posierosie_zone7a
7 years ago
First of all, I just want to say how amazing the commenters are! Gardeners are the best!

After learning that I can just put down cardboard and mulch then plant next growing season, it has been my method of choice! You can amend this practice by adding soil on top for immediate planting as suggested above. I just do this in Fall and plant in Spring.

Here is my "extension" being built Fall 2015
Lazy gardener that I am, I put a few rocks and enough mulch / fall leaves to cover the cardboard and called it a day.

Yours is longer than mine (my addition is maybe 15 ft?) and mine took a few hours. It also took 5 bags of mulch and it is on thinly over some leaves. It also took every box in my house.

Today, there is little paper left and I need to replenish the mulch. Mulching every Spring and putting shredded leaves every Fall will slowly improve the soil quality.
Shannon Carey thanked posierosie_zone7a
marquest
7 years ago
posierosie, that is going to be great. When I first found out about lasagna beds I have not turned the soil again. It is so good for me because I usually have 20 bags of leaves because I have so many trees on my property. Between the leaves, couple bags of manure and some cheap bags of top soil and I am good to plant immediately.
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
Sooo, just an update because you've all been so helpful and wonderful. We've been in a bit of a drought here (which is unusual) and had more than a week of brutally hot weather. That being said, it's taken me longer than I wanted to get the bed started. Also, the bed is 57 feet long. I didn't measure (I should've but didn't) and was counting the fence posts which I thought were only 5ft apart, but they are 8ft apart. Soooo, my dad came over, measured, tried to discourage me because of how much work it will be blahblahblah. Anyway, little by little very early in the morning I would get up and go out and lift the sod. ( I didn't remove it, I just flipped it over. I hope that's an acceptable way of doing it. ) I had to get out early before the heat and before the bees and yellow jackets came out (deathly allergic). Finally, yesterday I had my soil delivered. They won't deliver if there's rain in the forecast l guess.

So here's what I have so far:

I scored these three for $13.
These are hardy hibiscus trees. I got the both of them for $20. I don't know what color the blooms will be, but I have a red one in my front yard as well as a hardy hibiscus bush/shrub that's pinkish red. And another one by my deck, same pinkish red.

Is this daylily ready to be divided yet? I ask because this is its second year here and when I got it, it was just three leaves and a flower. It reblooms, I have four of them in my backyard, all huge like this. But I don't want to divide them if they're still "too young".

I have ton of annuals and about a dozen or so perennials I have to move. All are pretty much summer bloomers, with the exception of St. John's wort, sundrops and something else I can't remember the name.

As far as "the bones" of my garden, I have the azaleas only so far I really really really want a dwarf globe blue spruce or two. I just love them. I really like the forever gold arborvitae, I have two of them in the same garden as the blacklace and they look amazing next to it.

I also have a question about blacklace elderberry. I purchased a young plant last year and it looked like it was getting ready to die by like August. I planted it last May so I didn't prune it at all this spring as I wasn't sure how it has over wintered. Well now it's gigantic and taking over that garden (which isn't a huge deal, I can move stuff around now that I have another place to put stuff ) but when might be a good time to try to tame it a little? The flowers are just starting to open today.

Any other suggestions, tips, advice, please. All are welcome. Thanks so much for all your help and reading such a long post.
marquest
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
You are doing a great job. It is going to look MAREVELOUS!!!!!

The first year I had the same experience with Black Lace i thought it was dead. I was told it is like a weed and you can wack the heck out of it and it will keep on ticking. The third year after it bloomed (because I wanted the blooms). I cut it almost to the ground. I took some clippings and put them in the shade in a corner of the yard and they rooted. This year 2 yrs later it is out of control again. I am going to move it this fall.

Since you did not remove the sod I would put the newspaper over it before you put your soil on top. It will help keep the weeds out to start. That sod will grow up in the garden and you will be pulling grass forever. The newspaper will at least smother the sod.
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
Well I messed that up. The soil was delivered Monday at 430 and I moved all 4 yards of it that night. I cut the grass down to the dirt and it's been lifted and flipped for about a week. We haven't had any substantial rain fall since I can't even remember when. We're 4 inches short in rainfall already. Do you think if I put newspapers down before I mulch that will help? the layer of soil is at least 4 inches deep - the area where it slopes it's thicker to level it all off.
NHBabs z4b-5a NH
7 years ago
Sounds like you are well on your way to a lovely garden! Yes, put down several layers of newspapers before the mulch since it will help keep weed seeds from sprouting as well as discouraging any grass that might want to sprout.
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
Can I use cardboard instead of newspaper? I don't think I'll be able to get my hands on enough newspaper. And is it safe to plant what I have now and put the newspaper or cardboard around those plants and then mulch? Or will that smother the plants too? I'm sorry if I sound stupid. This is my first time making a garden this large from scratch. I can't thank you guys enough for the help!!
NHBabs z4b-5a NH
7 years ago
DH always says (quoting his mom I think) that the only stupid question is the one not asked . . .

Cardboard is fine instead of newspaper or a mix is fine also. Often you can pick up boxes at the grocery story or liquor store. Go ahead and plant what you have now, just keeping in mind how they will work around other plants you are considering. You can either plant and then cardboard/newspaper and mulch or you can do the cardboard/newspaper and mulch and then cut through in a big X it to plant. Depends on your preference and what you think will be easier. Often I will use newspaper right around plants since it's easier to fold and fit, and I'll use cardboard in between plants and in the areas I will plant later since it will have softened some by then. It won't make much difference as long as you have something under the mulch to add to the light-blocking effect of the mulch and prevent weeds/grass from growing up. Also, don't put mulch right against stems - give a couple of inches to allow air against stems and plan to weed as needed immediately around the plant.
Shannon Carey thanked NHBabs z4b-5a NH
floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
7 years ago
I love the way you're running with this idea, Shannon, having started with an innocent question about a couple of raised beds over on Landscape. Little did you know what we'd inveigle you into;-) I am sure it's going to be fantastic.
Shannon Carey thanked floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
marquest
7 years ago
I agree with Babs cardboard or paper. It will just be easier for you later to block the weeds and grass growing back as soon as your garden is complete.
Shannon Carey thanked marquest
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
So, mostly everything I have has been planted. I put newspapers around the planted plants and in the areas where there isn't anything yet. I have mulched and been watering diligently. I think I may have lost my coneflowers in the process, they're having a tough time with the transplant. It makes me sad because they were the Cheyenne spirit and hot coral coneflowers! My white blazing stars are slowly very slowly starting to stand up, but the foliage is still pretty droopy. I made sure to transplant them on the cool, overcast day (it was only like 50 something out) but I will just wait and see. I also read to remove the "flower" so it can focus on putting roots down, so I did that. Worst case scenario, I will just buy more.
Regarding the shrubs and trees. Am I better off buying a small red twig dogwood (or two since I found some for 7.98) or should I spend the extra $20 for a large one? I read that sometimes you're better off buying young shrubs and trees as they transplant and grow better and faster. I've only planted two trees and one shrub since being here,all were young plants. The black lace went crazy this year, but the forever gold arborvitae is a slow grower or maybe they aren't happy where they are.
Anyway, should I go with young shrubs and conifers?
Thanks again!
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
Oh, and I've found hakuro nishiki dappled willow for 4.98 but I didn't buy them as I'm not familiar with them - I hate weeping willows and if they have are anything like them I don't want them.
floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
7 years ago
Nothing like Weeping Willow. You're perfectly safe. At that price you could get several and use them as repeated elements to add cohesion.
Shannon Carey thanked floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
NHBabs z4b-5a NH
7 years ago
The red-twigged dogwoods can go in small. They grow fairly fast, and will adjust well. Just keep an eye on water with all the plants.

Look at images of Hakuro Nishiki on the web They are large shrubs and do well with pruning to encourage new growth that has the variegated foliage. I agree that you can use them for a repeat element as they are quite distinct.
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marquest
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
I think you will like the dappled willow. It grows like the black lace by the way (billowy) I like the dapple willow colors those white/pink/lime green leaves like a big flower all summer. If they are small and green don't let that fool you. They get their colors the next year after they are planted and you can cut it to the size you want. The other colorful bush I like is my purple smoke bush. There are some that have more vibrant purple all summer and red in the Fall. Look for Royal Purple Smoke Tree.
Shannon Carey thanked marquest
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
Now I am torn. I really wanted the red twig for the winter interest but I do like the colors in the dappled willow. My one and only concern is the water for the willow. I don't usually buy plants that need a ton of water after established.

I don't think getting both is an option because they would clash, most likely. I also can't find dwarf globe blue spruce anywhere.

If I do get the dappled willows, they are small and look unruly in their pots, can I trim them up a bit now or should I wait until next year? Everything I could find about them online was pertaining to established plants.
NHBabs z4b-5a NH
7 years ago
Is there a label on the kind of red-twigged dogwood you found? If it's variegated, that might be a bit too much variegation to have both kinds. If the dogwood isn't variegated, then use them both. Be sure to check the size so you know how much room to give it since different red-twigged dogwoods get to different sizes.

I can't help with the water needs of the willow, but I don't prune any new shrubs since new plants will need the leaves for energy to grow. You can shape them in future years.
Shannon Carey thanked NHBabs z4b-5a NH
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
I found three different ones. The ivory halo seems to be the most popular. I forgot the names of the other two, but one was dwarf like the ivory halo and the other wasn't. From what I can remember, they were all variegated except one of them looked really unhealthy and leggy - some leaves were variegated and some weren't and that one was from a local nursery and was the most expensive. Very disappointing. The other dwarf one I found said it only gets 4 ft tall and 4 ft wide.

We finally got a little bit of real rain last night and my transplants are starting to look better. It's amazing what rain can do for plants vs hose water.

NHBabs, do you have any suggestions of evergreens that are blue-ish or silver in color? Preferably something that won't be gigantic. I love the dwarf globe blue spruce but they are next to impossible to find here. The one I did find was grafted and it looked horrible. It was like this little tiny six inch ball on a 4 ft trunk. I don't mind the grafted ones, if they are somewhat proportional.
marquest
7 years ago
Your bed is so long. I think if you put the dappled willow on either end it would not be too much. I have the Ivory Halo it stays very short. I do have deer problem they think it is candy after they eat my hostas they go for desert.

The willow does not need any more water than the rest of my bushes. We have had severe drought some summers and I have never watered the bushes. I have more trouble with perennials dying from the drought than any bushes once they are established.

I know you wanted blue but have you considered a Holly. The dark green is almost a dark blue and you have the red berries in he winter which would accent your your Ivory Halo red stems.
Shannon Carey thanked marquest
Shannon Carey
Original Author
7 years ago
I have considered holly. I found sky pencil holly which I liked just for the shape. My parents have several holly bushes and I was going to try my hand at propagating some by taking cuttings. I've never done it before.
Marquest, do you keep your dappled willow in shrub form or tree form? I saw two dappled willows today on my walk with my pups. They had one in tree form (which I am assuming was grafted) and the shrub form. They are just beautiful. I think I'm gonna go get them tomorrow.
marquest
7 years ago
I have my dapples in shrub form. I keep them at about 4'.- 5 ft. If you wanted tree form I would think all you had to do is cut the lower limbs and let it grow at the top.

I saw a Holly at my local nursery that was variegated white/light green/peach. I am considering it. I have a big deer problem and it is one thing they would not eat to the ground in the winter. My local nursery sell large plants and they want 48.00 for so I have been slow to buy it until they offer a coupon.
Shannon Carey thanked marquest
NHBabs z4b-5a NH
7 years ago
If you want both the variegated dogwood and the willow, you don't have to put both in that bed; you could put one set in another part of the yard. The variegation makes the plants stand out from quite a distance, and IMO it may overwhelm the bed to have both. I like to use variegation to spice up a garden rather than as the main ingredient. However, it's really up to you to decide what appeals to you - you could do a mockup with proportionately sized images to get a feel. Or you could try similar plants that are a bit more subtle. There are a couple other shrubby dogwoods that are about the same size as Ivory Halo. Cornus sanguinea 'Midwinter Fire' has leaves that are green but turn a glowing gold in the fall, and the winter stems are gold at the bottom but get redder toward the top. Not too attention-getting in the summer, but really glorious in fall and winter. There is also one with red winter twigs and green and gold variegation called Hedgerow Gold, but you might have to order that since I've only seen that at mail order nurseries. As far as I can tell, all of them, including Ivory Halo, can get to 6', so give them that much room. Nursery tags frequently give shrub sizes at 5 years, so they may get a bit larger. I usually look them up at the Missouri Botanical Gardens website which IME has accurate size info.

I like Marquest's suggestion of holly as a green for winter. Be sure to get one male that is compatible with your females in order to get berries. It doesn't have to be in the same bed, just blooming at the same time as the girls and within bee-flying distance. Sky pencil won't have showy berries, just the green narrow shape.

For blue shrub-sized evergreens in the east I found only limited choices that are likely to stay healthy. You could look at eastern junipers of various kinds (but don't get any of the J. scopulorum such as 'Wichita blue' which is a western species that likes dry air and gets diseased in the humid eastern half of the country.) I've seen far too many sickly looking dwarf Alberta spruces to want one in my yard, though there are some that are bluish. You might be able to grow blue atlas cedar - I find the weeping ones to be lovely, though expensive, but it's too cold here for them to survive. If you can find one of the dwarf forms of blue spruce, it may work well. I ended up with 'Fat Albert' which will eventually become tree sized and need to be cut down, but I live in a rural area without a huge amount of nursery choice. You may find something that works better for your area, or you might be able to get osomething ordered for next season if you talk to good nurseries near you. You could also ask on the conifers forum for suggestions since there are some real conifer experts there. I know there are some really interesting white firs (Abies concolor) but I don't know if any stay small, and some forms of Korean fir (Abies koreana) hold their needles so that the silvery underside shows, but I'm not familiar enough with them to know if smaller selections are readily available.
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