For a Zone 6 pergola, Crimson Sky or Illusion red climbers?

8 years ago

last modified: 8 years ago

My husband built a wooden pergola for grapes in our urban Rhode Island back yard -- it's pretty sunny, open to the south and west, trees on the east -- and we'd like to have the west-facing front-corner "poles" host climbing red roses. No spray so we'd like a pair that are disease-resistant, red, fragrant and fast-growing (we're old!). I'm down to Crimson Sky or Illusion. Humidity here drove us from Don Juan. Your thoughts?

I only see Crimson Sky from Monrovia, #5 staked for $69 -- how big would that be?

And Illusion, from Rogue Valley, "3"x3"x6" Band" for $19.95. This sounds like a little plant.

But we're new to this, and would be most grateful for the advice of actual rose gardeners rather than Googlers like us. (We have a few roses around but they've had to fend for themselves, largely, while we worked. Retired now, we're willing to spend some time with these new ones.) Recommendations, sources -- I'm all ears.

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nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska

8 years ago

I'd definitely agree, go with Illusion among those two choices, particularly in zone 6. I haven't been able to get Crimson Sky to overwinter in zone 5 and even if it survives in zone 6 it's not likely to be a climber. Also, $59 is an insanely expensive price to pay for a rose - we could do better than that. For instance, Regan's sells Crimson Sky for under $20, though they're done with bareroot sales for this year.

An alternative to Illusion that blooms a lot more often for me is Quadra, and it would be rock solid hardy for you and pretty trouble free. Both Quadra and Illusion are available from Hortico for $17.99 plus shipping, and those are bareroot grafted roses that give the rose a little head start toward settling in to be a climber. Roses Unlimited also carries Illusion, and a gallon sized plant is a bit bigger than a band-sized plant, though both will grow fine. Those would be own-root plants, where there isn't a graft and the same rose would regrow if you have to cut it back to the ground (shouldn't be necessary with both of these latter two roses).

Here is Illusion on one side of my front yard in a good year - the trouble is it only does this about 3 times a year at best so there are times it's just green.

A more reliable bloomer most of the season for me is Quadra, which is at the other end of my house in similar conditions. Quadra will have some rest periods, but it looks like this off and on all summer.

Both of these roses are healthy and hardy, though any rose takes some pruning out of dead wood periodically. Both are also toward the crimson side of red rather than "fire engine red", which applies to a whole lot of red roses frankly. Do remember that any climber takes about 3-4 years to fully settle in, so don't expect either one to look like this in its first couple of years. You want a climber to put on growth and build cane structure in the first few years, and blooms are secondary considerations at first.

Also be sure to use something to tie the canes to a climbing structure (they don't hang on themselves like clematis does) and do your best to train as many of the biggest canes to bend sideways or horizontally, so that the blooming canes or "laterals" stretch upward from those initial sideways canes. Otherwise you can get blooms just at the tips of those main canes and not all along the way. You can see a cane bending sideways for Quadra in the photo above toward the right side of the arch, and that cane itself isn't blooming until the laterals that branch off it are growing.

Hope this helps!

Cynthia

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Comments (7)

Patty W. zone 5a Illinois
8 years ago
Between those two roses Illusion would be healthier. It is a beautiful rose and said to be an excellent rose in your area.
diane_nj 6b/7a
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
But, where are you seeing the Crimson Sky online for that price and size? Monrovia is wholesaler. Unless you have a good garden center nearby, roses typically don't come to us fully grown. Climbers, in particular, can take 3 - 5 years to reach maturity,
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lennon2
Original Author
8 years ago
Great information, Cynthia. Thanks so much to you and all.

Opposing this, about 50 feet west, is a neighbor's boring wood fence. I'd like to cover that with red, more lateral roses. (Still no spray, disease-resistant etc., fragrance is less important, but the spreading sideways quality, to cover the fence, is important.) The fence gets less direct sun, mostly in the morning, but it's a very bright spot, long vacant and growing only butterwort. Nothing has thrived there. Last year I grew nasturtiums in window boxes up against the fence, which sort of worked with daily watering, but I'd like to establish red roses there. What would you recommend that would be up to that?

diane_nj, https://www.roguevalleyroses.com/rose/illusion
Cindi_KS
8 years ago
I guess location makes a huge difference. Are we talking about the same Crimson Sky, Meilland 2007 rose?

Here in Kansas, Crimson Sky is an awesome rose! The first year I grew it, it was 8' tall! It was the last rose still blooming last November. Our local nurseries are all carrying it. The blossoms were absolutely huge. Mine grows straight up, not sideways.

For a red lateral rose, I would plant Dublin Bay. It is super hardy, disease resistant, and the most pure shade of red. It really looks great with a deep purple clematis growing through it.
lennon2 thanked Cindi_KS
romogen
8 years ago
I second Cynthia's recommendations for the pergola, either "Illusion" or "Quadra". For the neighbor's fence you should seriously consider either "Linda Campbell" or "Sympathie".
nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska
8 years ago
Cindi, I envy you your Crimson Sky! I haven't totally given up on it, but it has failed to overwinter twice from two different companies. What a difference one zone can make! Dublin Bay is also a nice red climber for me, though not nearly as big as the Explorer roses. The red is much more red, though. Linda Campbell is also a nice true red and totally hardy for me, usually cane hardy. Sympathie surprisingly has survived, though is still tiny starting into its third year. Being a climber we'll see if it puts on some growth from here on out.

Other reds that we've mentioned in other threads lately would be good on the neighbor's fence for bushy red roses: Kashmir, Kardinal Kolorscape or Milano Kolorscape are all a good 4 feet or more and pretty much bloom in true red season round. LavaGlut is a good red but shorter, about 3'. AC Navy Lady is about 2' high and 8' wide for me, and it could be used as a short climber in my experience, also that lovely dark burgundy red. All of those are pretty disease and trouble free for me and easily hardy in zone 5.

Cynthia

For a Zone 6 pergola, Crimson Sky or Illusion red climbers?

nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska

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Patty W. zone 5a Illinois

diane_nj 6b/7a

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Comments (7)

Patty W. zone 5a Illinois

diane_nj 6b/7a

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