Did you know Miele makes a line of detergents? Miele Color care for colors is very good and Miele whites are great..but they do have

scent..I'm not sure if they make a unscented. Persils Euro line is also very good but again scented. You can get both these brands from your Miele dealer and not have to pay shipping.

The Eco detergents IMO are only good for freshening up not actually cleaning the clothes. Tide Free and clear powder and pods are very good as is ALL Stainlifter with Oxi Pods.

Congrats on your new Miele.

Thanks for your responses! It's my 3rd Miele appliance in the house and am really stoked to use it. Rococogurl and http://olgaslaundry.com were motivation enough to get the W3038 and then to top it off this forum loves them too!

I read somewhere that people use Oxyclean for greasy towels etc along with the detergent. Is that true? Or is Miele UltraWhite good enough?

-Assad

@assad - Here's something to get you started if you don't have it already. It's a link to the Miele washer cheat sheet. That will provide some basics as it has a learning curve.

I like Oxyclean and have found it to do most of what I need most of the time. It should NOT be combined with detergent. I use it for soaking and in the prewash.

It does NOT go in the detergent (largest) slot. It goes in the first slot in the right which is the prewash slot. It will create sudsing so I'd use it sparingly until you see how it reacts with a hot wash with the water you have.

If you are doing a prewash and using the oxyclean, you will want to use a cycle that has the prewash which Miele calls "Heavy Soil." (which they don't tell you straight out). Also you might want a hot wash for a large load of greasy towels or at least very warm. I would use the MasterCare/ExtraWhite cycle. For a small load of towels I would use Custom + Heavy Soil which has more aggressive agitation and a lower water level than Extra White.

I know there's a detergent fiesta that goes on all the time here. I have an aversion to most of the fragrances.

Re detergents. I have a complicated laundry routine with specialized products. I'm still working on paring those down to what I like best. You can take mamapinky's advice and go with Persil 2 in 1 ProClean liquid and get great results for most things. I agree with Larsi on the Miele Ultra white for a powder. I like Henkel's Delicates and Sport Wash (liquids) for delicates and work out wear respectively. For non enzyme loads I like lavender Vaska tablets which I can easily break.

Mitch very generously sent me some tabs to try. Of those, the Tide Boost with Bleach tablet was one I liked though I think the pods and tabs are most effective in top loaders.

I've been very happy with my machine as it lets me get great results. Hope yours will as well!

Thanks for all the advice.

I think I got all the detergents ordered except the colored ones. I am confused as there is a lot of chatter that Persil 2 in 1 ProClean liquid has an awful smell - and we don't like things that smell awful :) no matter how clean they are.

So still scratching my head on the colored detergent after researching more for a couple hours (my wife thinks I am nuts).

Go to Wal Mart or a grocery store and get a whiff of the 2 in 1 Persil, then you will know. Cheer powder is good for colors and lightly scented.

Hey Sparky823. That seems the most logical, but I really really really dislike Walmart. Not stepped into one in 8+ years and hope to keep that streak going :)

YoU can find Cheer at other stores...make sure its powdered

+1 for Cheer powder. It's my current favorite for colors as it has no brighteners and has a lovely smell. Purchased from Target.

You can find Persil at other stores besides WM. If I had nothing to use but Persil or Sun I would pick Sun. Lol I just hate that Persil smell but you may love it...Just using cheap Sun for an example.

Assad...as you stated on your first post here you don't like clothes to have a scent, that being the case I would stay away from the Persil expecially the liquids as they will leave a scent. Cheer will also most likely leave some scent and although some of us like the old fashioned scent of Cheer you said you prefer no scent...I did recommend some scented ones along with unscented above but if you really want no scent I'd recommend Tide Free Powder and Tide Free Pods. You could also get some Sodium percarbonate for whites as its unscented. I can't remember if you said whether you use a fabric softener or not?

Also I'm going to add..Oxiclean is used because there is oxygen bleach in it, but there is no bleach activator in this stuff which means it will need hot water to activate it... I wouldn't use it in a prewash as prewash should always be cool or lukewarm in which case the oxygen bleach wouldn't even activate and a prewash is to short for it to be beneficial.. I know some people use oxiclean in a cool prewash and have good luck but its not from the bleach, most likely its from the surfactants. Tide with Bleach powder has oxygen bleach in it and a bleach activator so it could be used in less than hot water but it does have a scent. My recommendation is use the oxygen bleach in the main wash with hot water.

Beg to differ on OxyClean. Oxy works well with a FL profile wash. Of course, it may be completely different with a top loader.

I use it in cold, lukewarm and sometimes dissolve it in hot and haven't found any difference practically speaking. It says on the container not to add it together with detergent. It goes into the prewash which is about 20 minutes. It remains there when the heater kicks in. I have photos of the stain removal with this method. It removed dried on espresso coffee. Ink today even with Spray & Wash pretreat didn't come out. We are ink-stained wretches.

Most of these detergents smell awful to me in the bottle except for some of the Henkels liquids. I had to put the pods I got into a sealed container the smell was so strong even in plastic bags.

RoC...what is a profile wash lol I

I add my oxygen bleach with detergent in the dispenser. I don't use oxyclean. I use biokleen oxygen bleach which is Sodium Carbonate, Sodium Sulfate, Hydrogen Peroxide, Sodium Gluconate, Citrus Grandis (Grapefruit) Seed Extract, Glycerin, Sodium Chloride. OxiClean contains surfactants and other additives. Oxygen bleach won't do much of anything in cold water. I'd guess it's the other ingredients that are doing something for you in cold water.

Pinky - I had to ask that question myself originally. All this started for me over that and a few other things. Profile wash is a FL thing with Miele anyway. It's a cycle that does a 20-25 minute cold prewash, followed by a longer wash at the set temperature, followed by 3 rinses. The length of the whole cycle depends on the settings. It allows for a 2-stage detergent treatment if you like. First one can be added to the prewash; second one to the main wash as the water heats.

Wished you lived nearer so you could play with my machine. I know you would grow to like her for some things at least.

Just looked at Oxy Clean jar and you guys are right. So what I've been doing appears to be wrong but, diabolically, it has worked really well for me LOL. I must be a genius.

Roc, does your girl drain and spin after prewash and fill back up for main wash?

No spin between prewash and wash. It adds more water for the wash cycle for sure but I would need to check if it drains some before heater kicks in on the refill at the set wash temp. I don't think so.

That's why I'm careful of how much and what product is added to the prewash. Profile washes can be like an agitated soak + wash or a double wash with different (or the same) temperatures. It also allows a double dose of product. That's the point of the European front loader. Very efficient/ effective. Also why pods are not the best option for this machine though they are great for TLs.

So than a cold prewash..than heater kicks on and heats to hot target temp..is that correct?

Assad, we also don't like anything scented at all, and we have a Miele W4840, similar to your W3038 but larger.

First off, we use the Extended option on 99% of our washes. The manual says Extended is "For laundry with normal to heavy soiling or stains." It adds around 1/2 hour for most programs, and that's time spent tumbling with detergent i.e. doing the actual cleaning. Since we don't use scented products, I can smell the difference between laundry washed with and without Extended.

My wife has one laundry routine for her clothes, I have another routine for my clothes and the rest of the household laundry.

She pretreats stains with Shout, and washes with Biokleen Laundry Powder Free & Clear.

I use either the Biokleen, or Seventh Generation Powder Free and Clear (don't know if this is the same Seventh Generation you use and don't like. It has enzymes, unlike the Biokleen), along with STPP (phosphate) on all loads. If I want extra whitening or bleaching, I use sodium percarbonate. I don't pretreat.

Tide Free & Gentle powder only comes in a non-HE version.

Re the prewash discussion, I set the "Allergy" option in my W4840's service menu a while back, and since then I believe the machine always drains the prewash water and refills. Doing otherwise is IMO a misstep on Miele's part. One function of a prewash is to remove heavy soil (that's the name of the button, in fact) before starting the main wash. It has to drain to remove the heavy soil.

I didn't know Tide Free powder didn't come in HE that's just a poor choice by P&G what do they think..people with scent issues or allergies don't use HE machines..Geesh.

I have Biokleen powder and mine has enzymes. .maybe it comes with or without..I really like Biokleen but doubt I would if there were no enzymes. .mine us Biokleen premium plus with oxygen bleach and enzymes if that makes a difference.

Biokleen Premium has enzymes, the others do not. On my Asko every wash is a profe wash as it only fills with cold and heats the water from there. So, a 205 wash is always longer than 105. I thought the Miele units were the same?

Roc..you may be adding oxi to a cold prewash..but than it adds more water..and heats the water so in fact your oxi is being activated after the water heats up...it may have started in cold but it didn't die, nor was it drained out and if some of the water drained enough remains to do the job...but I agree you are a genius. .I could never operate a Miele like you do.

You cannot discuss Oxiclean without saying which Oxiclean product you are using. There are several of them, some are pre-treat products, others are in-wash boosters. The active ingredient in powdered oxygen bleach is usually sodium percarbonate. If your goal is whitening, sodium percarbonate is most effective at higher temperatures and over a longer period of time. Using percarbonate in the pre-wash will not yield the best results because, very often, the pre-wash temperature is not as high as the main wash temperature. The pre-wash period is also limited to about 10 minutes in a Miele. Short time combined with cold to lukewarm water are not good conditions under which percarbonate can work its magic. It's best to put it in the main wash with your detergent if your goal is whitening. If you find that it's sudsing too much, that's because you may using an Oxiclean version that has a bunch of other stuff in it. Active bleaching ingredient is about 40% by weight in Oxiclean used for bleaching. It's better to use 100% pure sodium percarbonate, you won't have sudsing problems and you will be using 100% pure active ingredient versus paying for Oxiclean which is less than half active ingredient combined with detergents, surfactants, and fillers.

I don't believe any of the consumer Mieles for sale in the USA perform a "profile wash" except for the pro series Little Giants.

Sshrivastava, this subject of oxiclean vs pure sodium percarbonate has been discussed before, in fact when I stated exactly what you did I got under someone's skin. LOL...your right oxiclean is more fillers than actual product where the more pure sodium percarbonate is 99% oxygen bleach. Makes sense to buy the more pure form as opposed to something more than half washing soda. There's no bleach activator in the pure form so it requires hot water to activate but there's no bleach activator in oxiclean either. And the more pure form is more cost effective IMO.

I use OxiClean stain remover which is sodium percarbonate and sodium carbonate.

The heavy soil/prewash in my Miele is 30 minutes.

My understanding of a profile wash is the three stages including the heater which my machine goes through.

Roc, the last time I checked Oxicleans stain remover was just about 50% sodium carbonate. If it works for you and you don't use it with a powder detergent already containing a fair amount of Sodium Carbonate than who am I to complain..LOL... if I use it with a powder detergent even with a full fill rinse my clothes are just to loaded with the carbonate, that stuff can be a real pain in the *** to rinse out. Plus I like the fact the pure sodium percarbonate causes no suds and has no scent. Roc, please don't think I'm downing you..I'm not at all, just for me the stuff isn't good...but you know..I believe you know what your doing and I know your textiles are lovely and sweetly clean...you wouldn't accept anything less than perfect.

Pnky, the things with the Oxi in combo with the powder is a lot of sudsing. I hear what you are saying. Carbonate is probably why. Straight percarbonate may make more sense. I never looked into it as I dont use it all that much and the oxi comes in small containers. Thing with the Miele is that with the wash style I was explaining things come out very clean with much less product.

I ruined a lot of good towels with aggressive washing so I'm trying to be more careful, use more gentle products and less heat. I have pet sox and nighties that are getting crazy expensive to replace. Ditto on the sheets. So I'm trying to make everything live longer IYKWIM.

I understand..but you can buy 1 pound containers of Sodium percarbonate for under 10 $....I wouldn't recommend oxiclean on your fine delicates....everything is getting so expensive, and textiles today are just not worth the cost. Things used to last Roc, even the elastic in unmentionables lasted, not any longer. Everything is made to break or fall apart my mom had hankies I found after she passed, still in a cute little fancy box 3 for 1.00 Woolworths, made better than a 12 $ hankie now days . A few weeks ago i ran to the Bon Ton i had a 50.00 off coupon for a quilt...well needless to say I didn't buy one, the things looked nice from a distance but on close inspection the edging needed all redone...than I looked at some sweaters 70% off sale..the price on one I liked was still 49$ and the seams up the side were crooked may as well buy one at Kmart if I want that. This is why I hate shopping and a big reason I will buy bed sheets from the 70's and go above and beyond cleaning them. My money is hard earned and I'm not throwing it away on cheaply made disposable junk. LOL.

http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0LEVjggLZNWt98A2tlEDN04;_ylu=X3oDMTBzajE3bzE3BHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMTAEY29sbwNiZjEEdnRpZAM-/RV=2/RE=1452514721/RO=10/RU=http%3a%2f%2fwww.armandhammer.com%2fPDF%2fIngredients%2fOxiCleanLaundryStainRemover.pdf/RK=0/RS=N93el.eMrlg35Jhgc_EgI_g84zU-

Oxiclean is not just the 2 ingredients. The excess sudsing is due to the excess detergent.

Nothing to add as far as help here but just saying "Hi" from Golden CO!

Hello Donna..your up late or is it early LOL

I like the Miele UltraColor and the scent is milder than most. The eco detergents are hit and miss and rarely leave any scent. I'm pleased with Ecover liquid and zero powder, BioKleen premium plus, and the liquid 7th generation power plus (or something like that). Others are good for day to day light soil, except the 7th generation concentrated power..It doesn't do anything for me

I completely agree about textiles. I'm sure you know that they put elasticizers in everything now, even things marked 100% cotton. They can put up to 5% of something else and still mark it 100% whatever I was told. Those are used, I believe, to keep the shape because the weaving is being done in the cheapest way and they are packing the warp threads to get more volume so it's not even and doesn't hold up.

The new towels I got are absolute junk. They come with pulls and defective sewing. I've had to exchange half of them. My USA made Fieldcrest towels from the 80s are soft and wonderful though so worn if I use them I will have to make them into cutters.

I need to start going to house sales on the weekends this summer to see what I can pick up. People shy away from buying sheets and towels in house sales but with the FL I can renovate as you do.

I use Oxi for stain removal mainly. The small container is about $7. When this one is used up I'll try the sodium percarbonate. You can tell me where to get it.

Yep. After yet another disappointing batch of WS kitchen towels, I think I'll have to follow your advice and buy vintage.

@rococogurl - what model Miele do you have? If it's a 120v machine, it most likely does not perform a true profile wash. A profile wash starts with cold water which is gradually heated during the wash cycle to your selected temperature. A good profile wash program also holds the temperature at the right level for a set amount of time to allow the enzymes in the detergent to work properly. That's how my Asko worked. All 120v Miele machines fill with water already at the set temperature, they do not start out with a lower temperature. Adding a pre-wash might simulate a profile wash if the pre-wash is cold or lukewarm, but it's not a true profile wash as experienced by owners of 240v machines.

My 120v Miele W4842 does not have a profile wash option, but it cleans just as well as my 240v Asko ever did. I believe sodium percarbonate breaks down into sodium carbonate (washing soda) and hydrogen peroxide in the wash. Since a portion of 100% sodium percarbonate breaks down into washing soda, it doesn't make sense to add more washing soda to the formula like the Oxiclean people do. But hey, if it works then that's all that matters in my book! :)

Pure sodium percarbonate does indeed break down into washing soda, but much much less than oxiclean with its 50% added. Oxiclean isn't always problematic...problems though can result if its used with a powder detergent already containing a fair amount of washing soda...than there's the factor that if I'm buying oxiclean than its for the sodium percarbonate yet I'm paying for a lot of carbonate..no thanks. But yes sodium percarbonate will break down to carbonate but much less.

@sshriva - Like you I had a 240 v Asko. Had it for 8 years before I got the 3035 Miele. The Asko had issues with certain programs that never worked. Suburbanmd thinks its a software problem. I never had the ability to do delicates or wools. It worked fine on the regular washes and it was, indeed, cold water fill only with the heater bringing water up to temp for every cycle. I did find the water level too low on the Asko for certain things.

I was skeptical of the 120 v Miele machine with the cold and hot water fill. Two of us spent considerable time checking whether the various cycles were up to temp as we did the cheat sheet. Tina checked water temps with an infrared gun. She timed the prewashes which are 30 minutes for most cycles and 18 minutes for Delicates.

But the 3000 series has a profile wash on some settings. I believe the difference is that the heater kicks in for hot and sanitize cycles only.

I know that the water gets heated from cold to temperature on the longer cycles because the heater broke on my previous machine and the water just remained cold throughout. For me that's a profile wash. Yesterday, I did a hot wash without the prewash and that, too began cold and then got hot.

Miele has worked it out. The machine does a great job. The only machine I could imagine liking better would be the Little Giant with the much more powerful heater though I doubt I'd like the electric bill. However, for my purposes the 3035 does everything I need.

Mama and others who notice the change in fabrics, you absolutely must read "Over-dressed: The Shockingly High Cost of Cheap Fashion," by E. Cline.

Also, Mama, my Mother's old handkerchiefs are one of my dearest possessions and I will be 75 in March, so you can imagine how old THEY are and in what great shape.

Pat, your mothers hankerchiefs I'm sure are very lovely. I have a few of my mothers and grandmothers, I remember when I was about 4 going to church with grandma, after we arrived and sat down grandma would always press one of her sunday best hankies into my hand, she must have waited until we arrived so I wouldn't get it dirty or wrinkled and for some reason they always matched my dress lol. I remember her Sunday best were always very fine and delicate, often with lace and hand embroidered flowers and always, always smelling like grandma and ironed into nice neat triangles...good memories. And I also cherish my hankies from mom and grandma.

Pat can I read this E. Cline on line?

It's a book pinky. Here's a link to the NPR Review.

Some of us who know the difference in textiles are doing the very same thing Cline does with clothes, i.e. go vintage.

pinky I'm curious about how you source those 70s sheets. Thrifting?

Roc..I will dig them out some boring day and take some pics. I've found some thrifting yes...and tons from my elderly aunts.. my mom also had some. Flea markets are usually loaded with them.

Another vote for Cheer "he" powder and liquid

BEa thank you for the book recommendation and thank you Roc for the books link...this sounds like a great late night read

Old 60's 70's sheets arnt hard to find Roc..if you know anyone older they probably have a cubbord full. They tend to be very cheap at thrift stores but very pricey at estate sales.

Also polka dots and stripes were a very common pattern than...my mom had a georgeous set white with pale pink and green roses that I adore. And as smooth as a new born babies bum lol. Back than sheets felt so much better smooth and crisp...now days the most we can hope for is soft lol.

I used a lot of these old sheets, which I have an abundance of twin sized on the boys beds but after the tip about Targets sheets, I've been using them. I like a nice sheet but usually a really nice sheet set is way out of my pocket book. I had been hunting for nice sheets for the boys when the Target sheets were recommended...they are nice and have a great price tag. Roc..have you checked them out yet? I want to mention though the Target sheets with a print wash nicer than the solid.

FWIW, while on the topic of sheets, I avoid wrinkle free or resistant sheets like the plague. The chemicals used to make them such, from what Ive heard and read don't wash out easily. I don't mind wrinkled sheets but I do mind having my face in the chemical all night. Now shirts a okay sort of but not as everyday attire.

beagle, I agree about wrinkle resistant sheets. Can you imagine the chemicals used to keep them that way? I am really fond of Target's Threshold cotton percale sheets. And I'm sure their non-percale cotton sheets are great also but I love the percale crispness. I think I just noticed a sale on them -- should get over there but they're not a necessity, just a want.

Also, Mama, you should be able to get that Cline book at the library. I'm lucky to be able to order my library books on line and then pick them up when ready. I promised myself no new books -- I've been taking my old books to our library for their re-sale. Decluttering this house is going to last until my dying breath, I think. Not really great when you are stuck with a retired husband who is a neat freak and you are not.

@pinky - Lots of older folks in my area. During the summer there are tons of house sales every weekend. I haven't gone looking for sheets since I have a lot of sets because we had 2 places for a while. Thing with thrifting around here is that the employees pull the good stuff and save it for pickers who come up from the city.Also, I've had so much to do there hasn't been the time I'd like to just drive around on weekend mornings. But I bet house sales will be a good source -- thanks for mentioning.

With this warm weather the season may start early.

Haven't tried the Target sheets but everyone seems to like them. I try to stay out of Target. Haven't been there for months. I get out of control in there LOL. We have dental work to pay for this year.

Roc, I'm in a small country town and the old sheets sell at thrift stores mainly to the underprivlaged...most people around here would walk past the sheets thinking..I don't want someone else's stinky bedding LOL.

Ebay often has a ton of old sheets, but they might be pricey. Personally I don't mind paying for good quality American made sheets even if I have to subject them to torture to get them clean. I recently felt a set of sheets at Bon Ton and looked at the edging..shoot they wanted 140 $ and that was on sale, I wouldn't have paid 10 $ the edging looked like something I would do nowadays with my crooked fingers, LOL and they had a underlying roughness...I pay 30 $ for the twin size at Target without a sale and their much better made than Bon Tons over priced, rough bedding.

Roc, I love Target but I'm glad its an hour drive from me or I'd be there often when I can't afford to. I was there yesterday and finially got the Mrs Meyers Lemon Verbena FS..haven't used it yet so no review yet lol. I do plan to order more Vaska lavender laundry detergent tabs as I did end up enjoying them on towels.