Amanda,

I like to slump while seated so it may be easier for me if it's standard chair height. Although, it's not a must-have at this point.

As for pantry, yes, I don't have any other pantry. I would love to put a row of 15" depth pantry cabinets but I am worried about the lack of path way behind the island seating.

I like Rebunky's plan! :)

But, if you like the galley look more...maybe something like this?

Only 13 more versions and we'll make it all the way through the alphabet, guco. =)

Here's my lay-out tweak to your plan.

I'm spec'ing 30" counters (pull IKEA cabs out from the wall for this, check hacks for how to install, it's been done before) so that your standard depth fridge appears built-in. You'll appreciate the additional room you'll have in front of appliances kept on the counter, plus the additional depth for prepping.

Add a shelf behind the Bluestar like the one GWer Histokitch added behind her range (30" deep counters).

I added a 15" w, 24" d pantry cab between fridge and wall to allow fridge doors to open fully to access fridge drawers. Keep often used food items here (oils, vinegars, etc).

With due respect to Huango's suggestion, I kept the aisle at 46" so that you can open perimeter drawers when the DW door is open and so that you still have a decent aisle between fridge doors and island counter.

I echo funky's suggestion to line up the exterior doors with the DR doors and my plan reflects that move.

I added 2 windows of similar size between doors and range wall. You can make these the same height as the windows on each side of the range or do a tall window next to the doors and the other at the same height as the windows on each side of the range.

I think a 2" spacer will give you sufficient clearance between drawers and window trim but double check that you'll have enough clearance and adjust as needed.

I swapped out the end cabinet for another seat at the island.

I spec 5 pantry cabs and centered on the island; their total length will be slightly longer than the island. Your plan has too wide an aisle between pantry cabs and island for convenient landing zone (48" maximum recommended).

A 47" aisle between seating and pantry cabs is more than the minimum aisle recommended for seating clearance (44") but you can increase this to 48", if you wish, by reducing the range aisle to 45". My aisle between DW and island is 45" and it's enough room to have DW door open at the same time as island drawers. That's with 1 1/2" counter overhang; cab bases are 48" apart.

I also think you should leave the island seating at counter height. There are ways to make it comfortable for slouching. Don't do stools, for one thing. Select comfortable counter height chairs with padded seats (deeper is better) and backs (taller is better).

Traditional Kitchen · More Info

WESTFIELD · More Info

Add a foot rest.

Georgian Style | Minneapolis · More Info

Georgian Style | Minneapolis · More Info

Detached House Reigate · More Info

If you still want to do table height seating, then increase the overhang to at least 18" so that you have room for a plate, laptop, and enough room for legs below counter. 18" seating overhang is NKBA's minimum recommended for table height seating.

Highgate Kitchen · More Info

You're nearly there, guco! I'm delighted that you're going to end up with a kitchen very close to your inspiration pic.

Rebunky, any way to get the sink closer to the dining room? one of my goals are to get the sink, DW, MW, and fridge closer to the front of the kitchen for the quick meals. I do like how open your plan feels. Also, I don't have any pantry space else where so I feel like I need the wall of pantry cabinets. Maybe not?

Lavender_Lass, in your version, the pantry cabinets don't look so bad right? the trouble is that I am trying to get the fridge to the front of the kitchen so we can take two step into the kitchen, grab the ice cream, and go sit in the family room. Totally first world problem, but we don't want to trek all the way to the back of the kitchen for the fridge.

Lisa_a, you come to my rescue again! Thank you. Question, the aisle between fridge and island would be 35" right? I believe you had mentioned before that standard depth fridge with handles stick out 35-36". Wouldn't that be too tight?

Also, any way to off set the range from sink a bit more?

You totally misread the floorplan I created for you. The full-size fridge goes a few inches from the corner to the right of the stove. I then placed a small under-counter beverage fridge a couple of feet inside the French Doors which are counter-depth and will not have any negative impact on your aisle. I thought a small beverage fridge would solve the grab a drink on the way out the back door issue you mentioned for your reason for having the fridge on the opposite side of the room of your work zones.

funkycamper, I totally did!!! sorry. Your idea is very similar to Lisa_a's. my concern is the aisle space between the fridge and island. With a standard size fridge, won't that block most of the aisle?

Guco, the aisle between fridge door and island is 43", just as I noted on the plan.

As I explained above, the counters are 30" deep, which is the depth of a standard depth fridge box (yours may vary slightly but this is generally true). A door's depth is usually 3" or so beyond that, that's why I noted that the aisle between fridge door and island is only 3" narrower than between perimeter counter and island.

I didn't include fridge handles since I don't believe the fridge handles won't be directly across from the island counter but yes, they generally add around 2" to the total depth of a fridge.

Also, any way to off set the range from sink a bit more?

Yep! Rolling out Plan N....You have a 36" drawer base to the left of range and 2 sets of 36" drawer bases between range and fridge.

I left the DW across from the range in case your plan is to store dishes, silverware, etc, in the island cab closest to the fridge. I also increased that cab's width from 24" to 30". IMO, you can easily get away with 42 1/2" aisles at the left and right ends of the island since there aren't any doors, drawers or cab doors opening into these aisles. A 30" wide drawer is a good width for storing dishware.

117" is a long island but should be doable out of one slab, whether you choose granite or quartz (latter are 120" long). Both of the granite slabs we purchased for our kitchen were over 120" but we did see slabs that were less than that so if you want granite counters, choose carefully to avoid a seam in your island.

Where do you intend to store you glassware? In a drawer base as well?

Double check your storage needs: you can always add more pantry cabs to the bottom wall. You can vary their look by mixing up the styles, getting some with solid doors and a few with glass doors in the top sections. In fact, I encourage you to do this to break up the long expanse of solid cab doors on that wall.

Hahaha! Plan N! Lisa your such a trooper.

I think Lisa makes an excellent point about mixing up the pantry cabs with some solid and some glass. Maybe even having a 15" shallow counter top with just base cabs either in the middle of the tall pantries or better yet on each of the ends by the French doors. It could serve as a landing for whatever stuff you want. I think that will look fine and give you plenty storage. I am sure what looked bad when I drew it up is that I had added all the same size panties and all solid going across the entire wall.

Rebunky-'Same size panties and all solid'....lol. That cracked me up. Okay, that is all. Back to awesome layouts.

Ha! Oh I'm totally leaving that typo! That's my best one to date. :-D

I rather enjoyed the belly laugh after a long day. :p

I'm not sure I want to know what will be stored in those tall panties! lol!

See how a nice mix really breaks up that long wall of panties?

Oh I apologize guco, I will totally delete this, but just had to give Autumn some more belly laughs!

Edit: Well, I am still cracking up! What was even funnier was that all I did was Google search "wall of panties" and that picture came up! I am glad everyone got a good laugh, including you Guco! I deleted the picture though, because I didn't want to continue to sidetrack Guco's thread.

That's hilarious, rebunky!

is that a wall of panties as art? HAHAHA!

Now that is a solution to a plain wall, lol. Sorry Guco. You are going to have a nice kitchen panties solid or transparent or no.

I think I am done! I may even have some room for some panties :) I took Lisa_a's plan N and shifted the sink and DW towards the front of the kitchen. In turn, that allowed me to shift the range towards the front as well.

As for the space between the space in between the range and fridge, I hope to put some open shelves up. I may match the open shelves on the other side of the fridge. Glasses can go either side of the fridge on the open shelves like this.

https://www.houzz.com/photos/transitional-kitchen-transitional-kitchen-austin-phvw-vp~19575392

I think perpendicular windows would look good at the top corner like in the picture in the link.

https://www.houzz.com/photos/modern-kitchen-modern-kitchen-kansas-city-phvw-vp~697662

I may just install a couple pantry cabinets and then see what I really need as I go along. What does everyone think? Am I done?

Looking close! Couple things I would change....

Flip dw with micro drawer.

Do a 15" wide x 24" deep pantry to right of fridge. That tiny counter with open shelf above looks odd to me.

oh wait I just remembered, are those counters pulled out to 30"?

Other then that I like it!

rebunky, yes, the counters pulled out to 30". So I figured I might do a open shelf or glass cabinet.

I can't remember which side the DW is supposed to be on, left or right of sink?

Embedding the photos you linked to in this thread (easy to do, copy the photo's url, click on "Houzz Photo" button below the text box, paste the link into the "Houzz URL" box and click "Insert")

Transitional Kitchen · More Info

Modern Kitchen · More Info

Now that I can see what you're talking about, I can comment without flipping to a different tab.

I like your idea about the window wrapping around the corner. I think the open shelves would look nice but not in the way you're drawn them. I'd either do equal lengths on each side of the range hood or one set to the left of the fridge, ending short of the hood more than you show on your plan. I'm not huge on symmetry but I think there needs to be a better balance of blank space.

I second Rebunky's suggestion to do a 15" d, 24" w deep pantry cab instead of a 15" cab and counter with open shelves above. 15" is pretty danged narrow, not really useful. I think it will be a bit of a dark hole.

Is there a reason why you're not going with 36" cabs? Wider drawers always provide more useful storage because you're not losing space to cab and drawer sides. You can always add after market organizers to them. There are a lot of them on the market (including from IKEA). Read these threads for sources and advice,

What cabinet drawer organizers do you love, could do without?
Your favorite (cheapish) source for drawer organizers and liners?
Drawer organizers?

I can't remember which side the DW is supposed to be on, left or right of sink?

DW goes on the side of the sink that makes the most sense, lay-out wise.

Another option for the skinny section to the right of the fridge is to do a slightly shallower cab that sits on the base cab, kind of like a hutch and store glasses in it.

Lisa_a, good idea on shallower cabs that sit on the base cabinet! or maybe just bookshelves like this.

https://www.houzz.com/photos/potters-kitchen-eclectic-kitchen-boston-phvw-vp~10397655

I think Plan O is it! As for the dishwasher vs MW, I think I'll decide when I can see the space live.

Thank you everyone!!! I am done as far as layout. Now comes the fun part of deciding on colors and style :)

Lisa_a, sorry, just seeing your other message now. Yes, I plan on only doing open shelves on the left side of the fridge. How much space would you leave between the range and the open shelves? or how much blank wall do you think there needs to be for symmetry?

36" cabinet where? I don't think I can do 36" any where and achieve symmetry of cabinets right?

I like this plan except for the DW placement. Please flip DW and micro. The red square is the DW door open. Nobody will be able to cook or prep while someone is loading/unloading the DW.

36" cabinet where? I don't think I can do 36" any where and achieve symmetry of cabinets right?

Look at my Plan N. It has a 36" cab to the left of the range and 2 36" cabs to the right. All drawer fronts will be the same width and, more importantly, it will have better function.

I don't see symmetry when I look at your plan above, sorry.

How about this (can't believe we're up to Plan P!):

The green rectangle is for the open shelves. I moved them in from the hood so that there's about the same amount of wall between shelves and hood as there will be between hood and window (you need space for the panty wall art, lol. Wait, what happened to rebunky's photo of the panty wall art?)

Good point, funky. However, guco's preferences are for MW, dish storage and sink to be close to the fridge (they regularly eat prepared meals). That's why I put the DW where I did.

Guco, I forgot an important thing I meant to tell you! Ask your contractor about ordering an 'exterior' French door, even though that one door between kitchen and dining will be interior. The exterior doors are designed to seal nice and tight, yet they still look the same as an interior door.

I think plan P with a few tweaks to the open shelves will be awesome!

Oh and I still would flip dw and micro. Miss Funkycamper is the Queen Bee of the Dw placement. Sorry Lisa, but on this, I must side with the Queen! :-)

No worries, rebunky. I'm not crazy about the DW location either but I'm designing it to fit guco's needs and preferences, not mine. Or (gasp, say it isn't true) the Queen Bee of DW placement, lol.

Long reign, funky, QBDWP!

Can I ask where the trash is?

What about putting the microwave to the left of the refrigerator and the dw on the right of the sink? It would mess with the 36" drawers Lisa has in her latest plan but would help functionally since it would get the dw out of cooking, prep zone. (That's assuming you're doing mw in base cabinets, drawer mw, etc. since you had it in the island.)

rebunky, funkycamper, Lisa_A, I am going to IKEA to look at the 36 vs. 30" drawer IRL. I'll be back.

autumn.4, I had planned on putting the trash underneath the sink.

nancyjwb, I think I need to look at the drawers IRL to see whether I really need 36".

guco, you should also be comparing the storage capacity of the 15" and 18" cabs to the 36". I'm not as concerned about you going from a 36" to a 30" but I think that dropping down from the storage of a 36" cab to an 18" cab and most especially, a 15" cab will be limiting.

My narrowest drawer is just under 21". That works fine for prep utensils, measuring cups, mixing bowls, dish towels, etc but that width is limiting when it comes to storing larger items, such as colanders, pots and pans, dishware, casserole dishes, etc. I'm very glad I have a set of 33" and 36" wide drawers. They offer a lot more flexibility of how I store large items in the drawers.

Look at your list of what you need to store, what location is best for their storage and the amount of space you need for these items. That is the best way to determine drawer size.

I grouped items together, laid them out in blue taped rectangles of my drawer widths on my counter to figure out what I could store and how I would organize them to help me determine that the drawer sizes I had planned for would be fine. When building our home 21+ yrs ago, I learned the hard way that I couldn't just say "oh, that cab/drawer size will work" only to find out that it wouldn't. My kitchen isn't any larger than it was but because I planned my storage so well, I was able to eliminate upper cabs on my cook top wall and still have room to spare in my drawers (hahaha, that ties back to the wall of panties!).

Blue tape marks interior space of 21", 33" and 36" drawers.

End result (double drawer in 33" cab):

top:

bottom:

As you can see, if I'd gone with a narrower cab - an inch or two narrower would have made a big difference - I would have had to find space elsewhere for the rest of my casserole dishes, which means that it would be even harder for DH to remember what goes where (he's the Chief DW Unloader).

I think you're focusing too much on looks and symmetry (still don't quite understand how you feel your latest plan gives you that) and not enough on function. Maybe you won't mind traipsing across your kitchen to the pantry cabs to get regularly used kitchen tools but that's not an efficient design. Given your large kitchen, it seems a shame to not make the most of the space.

Where do you plan to store your baking pans, cutting boards, etc? In a cab above the fridge? I can't remember if we talked about this.

Excellent visual, Lisa. I like the way you did that. FWIW, most of my drawers are 21" wide. The only wider ones I have are one stack of 24". This works just fine for me. I did something similar but not as smartly as I just grouped and measured. I wish I would have thought of your grid idea. It just goes to show that we all like things a bit different and the more we plan for how we use a kitchen in the most efficient and functional way possible, that fits our own style, the better. Planning makes perfect, right?

And the Bossy Queen Bee of DW's says that the DW should be moved to the other side of that sink. I think the inability to cook and wash-up at the same time trumps walking a few extra feet from the fridge. Of course, I suppose it's a wee bit possible that there are some rare situations where I could be wrong. :) And thanks for the nice moniker. I tend to think of myself as the DW Beeotch.

What made you decide against the kitchen table space? Too complicated? I think the island divides your space up so much...have you considered another layout?

I still like Rebunky's L-shape plan. It's a nice layout and not so 'linear' for lack of a better word. Not so lined up....and a little more cozy.

Lisa_a, I prefer the 24" cabinets. 36 is too much for me. After seeing it IRL at IKEA, I realize that I like the 24" and it will be plenty. My current cabinet sizes are mostly 20". I have one large one at 32". I am modifying the layout now.

My baking pans cutting boards are storage in a 15" vertically right now. I think they will end up going in the cab above fridge or in the microwave cabinet.

Oh, and when I think of symmetry, I mean the cabinets or spacing on either side of the range. I have a strong preference for the range/sink/fridge to be close together so that's why I didn't like your plan P. That'd push the range 72" down from the fridge. That's too much IMO.

"Room to spare in my drawers" hahahaha Lisa! You and funky just gave me my first good laugh of the day.

Well, I do love my big 36" drawers!

I do like Nancy's idea of the micro drawer moved next to the fridge. Let me see if I can play with some sizes later.

Guco, I like symmetry too and I think you can get it AND keep a few of those bigger sized drawers.

eta: Oh see we were cross posting guco. We can work with the 24" if your like that size best.

I would also like to play with the open shelves idea and the windows a little more. What was your plan for those window on back wall to the right of the French door. Would they go down lower to match with the French door or just regular height?

Here is plan "Q"

Lavender_Lass and Rebunky, the L shape did't work for me because the sink was so far away! I don't want to deal with a second sink too. My in-laws have a second sink and they never ever use it.

Funkycamper, I gave in to peer pressure ;) the DW is across from the fridge in Plan Q.

Rebunky, yes! I moved the MW to next to the fridge. I think that could be a great coffee center there. Glasses/mugs on the open shelf, coffee maker on the counter. or heat up your hot coco in the MW below.

As for windows in the back wall, I'd like to do a window corner like this. This is why I only want open shelf on the left side of the fridge.

Modern Kitchen · More Info

Me likey plan Q! I like the Windows all the same size at 36". Like the dw move and the micro move. I don't know....I think this might be THE ONE!

Rebunky, please don't give me false hope ;)

Plan Q looks good to me!

Good job sticking with this to a successful conclusion, guco! You're going to have a wonderful kitchen.

I hope you post a reveal when you're done (please, please, please).

Thank the Thanksgiving Turkey and everyone (esp. Lisa_A, rebunky, funkycamper, and whoever I have missed). I am done!!!!!

A note about the tall pantry cabinets, is this not a good look? I would alternate the glossy white with the frosted glass. I am leaning this way because they look like built-ins.

Modern Entry Foyer · More Info

I think it's a clean look, which sounds like what you're going for. Not gym locker at all. But part of that is the hardware. Not sure how closely you can mimic that but even so, it's a good look. I like the idea of alternating glossy cabs with frosted glass, too.

Wahoo, guco, you've got a lay-out!!

It will look great guco. I am so happy for you. Fist pumps and woohoo's!!!

The Queen Beeotch loves the Q plan. DW is placed right, love the windows, love the sight lines you'll have from dining room to backyard through the two sets of French Doors that are perfectly lined up and give you a great walking path behind the island seating, love that you have a functional layout, and I love the inspiration pic for the pantry wall. By Jove, I think you've got it. Oh, you must bless us with a reveal thread when it's done. I think this is going to be a fantastic kitchen!

Thank you thank you. Now can anyone help me find a contractor? :) LA area, I am open to all, especially if they pass the stringent GW test.

I promise I'll be back to do the reveal after you all help me with small details of what flooring, countertops, hardware, etc,