That was fun. The food sounds great. Though it does not appear to be digesting properly, : ) .....for anyone

I love his writing!

Here's my favorite line (a bit crude): "...At least not with a decent Western toilet within butt-clenched running distance".

OK, for those of you that have been to China (and I mean beyond those glossy Western hotels and coach trips to the Great Wall), his descriptions of the foods, sights and smells rings true.

At least the food is good now.

I spent two months in China in 1977. It was dismal. Everyone wearing the same clothes, every building gray, the only place to buy decent stuff was in the special stores reserved for foreigners and VIPs (where the merchandise was on the level of a dollar store in the last days of liquidation), and the very best banquets to be had at the nicest hotels were utterly mediocre (like stale Panda Express food, maybe not even). I would ride my skateboard down the streets and people would stare in amazement, as if seeing a Martian.

Interesting that he spent three months in China on a food trip, but half of his writing is about that little kid peeing!

All the food and traveling programs and documentaries about China I have seen, none seemed to be like what he experienced.

Not the many trips I have been to China either.

dcarch

It may be that he's too tired and overwhelmed to really speak about the food, and will do so when he's home and had a chance to rest and think.

John Liu, I've heard similar stories about the food, even up to ten years ago, including from a 6'2" Finn whose fair looks (white blond curly hair and pinky white skin) belied his quite passable command of Mandarin. He really stuck out. :) When I lived abroad however, when I first got there, people looked at me and assumed I was a tourist. When the Winter was over and the tourists started coming back, everyone assumed I was a local. Same clothes. It doesn't take a skateboard or outlandish looks to be recognized as a foreigner. There's also the way one stands, facial expression, etc. My burning question is whether your skateboard infected them with California dudeness? Did you leave it there? Did they proliferate?

My brother visits a client's factories in China regularly (his client since 2002). He's also half-Chinese so they sorta/kinda accept him. He's been to some of the same places KAL was in and said the blog's descriptions sounded accurate to him.

Most of the factories are located in company towns. He - my brother, not KAL - has some great stories. One was about the factory vending machines. Every possible color and flavor that Frito-Lay can dream up, no matter how weird, is offered. There are rows and rows of vending machines, each offering different choices. The older Chinese spurn them; the younger Chinese workers spend all their money on branded Western fast food and Starbucks coffees. A slice of Domino's pizza is $10 and a Starbucks coffee is $15!

"-----My brother visits a client's factories in
China regularly (his client since 2002). He's also half-Chinese so they
sorta/kinda accept him. He's been to some of the same places KAL was in and
said the blog's descriptions sounded accurate to him."

So I was on a business trip to Vancouver. As
I was going to a meeting I went through an area in downtown (?) where people were sleeping on the
sidewalks, peeing on the street corner doing drugs in public. There were many
“medical” cannabis stores with “doctor” in the store ready to prescribe
“treatments”. All the stores in many blocks had heavy duty gates and steel
fences protection, alarms, etc.

Should I conclude that is a picture which represents
Canada as a whole?

I am not questioning Mr. Lopez’s accuracy in
his visual experiences. I am just not sure of the picture he is trying to
paint, the picture of China as a culture today.

Speaking of China’s factory towns, I had a
conversation with a Chinese fellow who happened to sat next to me on the train.
He was from a steel manufacturer, the largest in the world. He came to the USA
to organize a global luxury foods exposition to be held in Sanghai. The steel
company is also in food business. They have 2000 supermarkets. I also had met
another fellow, who was in the US to negotiate to buy up the entire country’s
supply of wagku beef. China of course is the world’s largest importer of high
luxury automobiles.

So he concludes that all Chinese are loud,
pushy, impolite. Well, speaking of Lopez, how does Mr. Lopez feel about Mr.
Trump’s portraiture of all Mexicans/Hispanics?

dcarch

Since Lopez is mixed race, I doubt he considers himself Hispanic. I realize you don't like him - you've criticized him before in other threads - but I don't recall that he advises people that ALL Chinese are so overtly aggressive. They certainly can be, in specific situations. So can Americans, or Germans, or anyone else.

Making racial assumptions is a landmine. I've had so many people say they loved traveling in Japan, it's so clean, people are so polite, etc. etc. I guess they never stood in a crowd of mostly women, waiting for an elevator, and been shoved roughly aside by a Japanese exec who automatically assumed that since he was male, HE had the right to enter the elevator first! So he made sure he did - and if that meant using his elbows on a group of women, so be it.

Trump is unafraid to say what all the other Republican challengers are already thinking. I'll give him that, at least.

"---but I don't recall that he advises people that ALL Chinese are so overtly aggressive. ---"

His words: " ----- China's a very pushy culture, ------- If you've been to a Chinatown in a major city, you know that. You can expect to be bumped into, pushed aside, crowded from behind, held up from in front, and generally ignored. In China, the concept of personal space exists sort of like string theory: they've heard of it, but nobody seems to really understand, much less believe in it.

It's even worse once they get behind the wheel. All normal rules of lane shifting, signaling, and general good road etiquette go out the window.-----"

and they are loud and they pee in public ----------

I wonder what are his views on Jews, Irish, blacks -------.

dcarch

Well, um, except for the peeing in public, that paragraph could describe the people in other cultures among whom I've lived. In one place, for instance, the concept of lining up to get on a bus is not even known enough to be considered foreign. They push and shove to get on a nearly empty bus as if it's the last helicopter out. OTOH, they'll never let an old person, or visibly pregnant woman be pushed, or have to stand, or have to push to the back of the bus. They're always given the easiest, frontmost seats. In more orderly cultures I've visited, they might load on better, but they also don't notice and consider their fellow passengers who exist outside their personal space.

Manners are different everywhere. Culture is different. One man's pushy is another man's connectedness.

"----Manners are different everywhere. Culture is different. One man's pushy is another man's connectedness."

So very true. I saw a program about a country, I don't remember the name of the country, where unlike here in USA, it is not polite to make eye contact or strike a conversation with a stranger in public, however, it is very acceptable to ask a perfect stranger to dance the tango with you. Tango dancing is very popular there.

dcarch

"---I realize you don't like him - you've criticized him before in other threads -----"

Yes I
did pick on him a few times. I picked on him because he had made a few fundamental science errors, which to me was
unacceptable for an MIT science graduate and for someone who claims to be an
expert in science.

I now can understand better. From this China series, I just
found out he was not a science major, instead he got an architect’s training from MIT.

Other
than the fact that I don’t think he has the personality to build a career as an
architect, I am curious as to why he really decided to throw away 5 years of
very expensive MIT education to work in a kitchen.

I do recognize
and give him due respect that he has done a lot of good work in the food area, and I have learned a few things from him.

dcarch

I don't know about KLA, but after that hefty education, architects have a longer "residency" than most doctors, and if they don't find the right fit, they basically have to just put in their time and churn for their masters, then start all over again once they're licensed to try to find their own niche.

Considering the depths that architecture sunk to in the Brutalist movement, even being a politician would be an improvement, LOL. Why is it a surprise he changed careers? He likes to eat and likes to write. Seems a natural fit to me. I will never get over that photo of his old NYC apartment kitchen draped with chocolate chip cookies everywhere, when he went through pounds and pounds of flour trying out different recipes!

It reminded me of when I used to make big boxes of assorted cookies as Xmas presents back when I had more time than money. After a while you get so sick of the smell of sugar, you just can't stand it any longer, LOL. There would be all these holiday desserts at parties and I'd almost start gagging.

“----Why is it a surprise he changed careers? He likes to eat
and likes to write. Seems a natural fit to me. -------“

Because he didn’t suddenly discover he likes to eat after
he spent the time and money to get through 5 years at MIT.

He probably realized he did not have design ability. Look
at all the food pictures he has posted.

dcarch

Those might just be brutalist aesthetic pictures. :)

(Not bothering to compose a picture for a blog may show a certain disdain for details but does not actually imply lack of design ability.)

Really, though, a lot of people get an education on a professional track and at a turning point give it up for something less rat race and more artistic. It happens all the time.

"-------Really, though, a lot of people get an education on a professional track and at a turning point give it up for something less rat race and more artistic. It happens all the time.-----"

Yes, Pepsi hired an architect (forgot the name) to lead the company. He later was hired by Apple Computer. Sure, architects can going into different fields. If you can't take the heat, stay in the kitchen. :-).

And Ronald Reagan changed his profession.

---------------------

I actual like the guy a lot.

I am curious how he is plotting his food/cooking path in a very crowded digital world.

Her can't beat America's Test Kitchen,

His is nowhere near the true scientific and stunningly artistic Nathan Myhrvold.

dcarch

Modernist Cuisine is an acquired taste and not for the masses. A lot of people detest America's Test Kitchen, and don't care for (i.e., disagree with) their results. I know a lot of people love it too, but it's not the be all end all, just the first. There are others as well.

What Kenji Lopez-Alt has is what any blogger has--himself. He's wonderfully amusing, and he shows the bumps and pratfalls along the way. He also presents an attitude of here's what I've done, now you try, rather than This Is Divine Truth. He respects his audience and includes them, and his voice is more enthusiastic grad student than anointed authority.

The Darwinian notion of competition and survival of the fittest is actually ill stated. It's survival of the adequate. A lot of professional bloggers aren't trying to be a $10M network news anchor (which job we've been learning comes with its own lack of rigor). They're aiming for, and either achieving or dropping out, a decent living doing something they enjoy.

I'd say KAL is writing for an entirely different audience than Myhrvold. The majority of foodies, even in the SF Bay Area, could care less if they personally ever sous vided anything but do turn to Yelp and Chowhound on a regular basis. Yes, indeed, you too can scalp your reservation to State Bird Provisions or Rich Table - in fact, there's an app for that!

We spend thousands of dollars dining out every year and maybe $600 of that annual amt ever goes to Modernist dishes.

KAL is a blogger. I can say honestly that compared to his Bay Area peers he knows immensely more about food than most Millennials. I've met a number of the local bloggers and although they're delightful people, most of 'em couldn't describe the difference between a kumquat and a Hungarian sweet pepper. They've never even looked inside a Julia Childs' cookbook, and have absolutely no idea where sweetbreads come from or even what they are.

This is one of the reasons I keep my own review blogsite private, by invitation only. I go into very detailed descriptions and even the history of a dish or cuisine, and they're very long reads. My reviews are also on occasion extremely unflattering to a lot of restaurateurs and chefs [smile], so I'd rather err on the side of discretion.

As a blogger, Kenji is one of the better ones. I agree his photos may not be great - certainly not compared to yours, dcarch - but they're a whole lot clearer than 98% of the photos people post on Yelp (which drives me crazy; nobody needs to see 16 photos of the same d****d dish!).

And I have to agree with pillog: I've never liked America's Test Kitchen recipes. They talk a good game, but I have never liked the results I've gotten...oh, except for once. The Chocolate Bourbon Cake is terrific! But don't make it with really great bourbon; even 2 Tblsp can be overpowering (better to drink the Pappy, than bake with it, I learned).

He's posted part V. He's quite laudatory of the food in Chengdu. It sounds delicious. I haven't had the pleasure of visiting, but I hope to some day, just to try the Mapo Doufu at Grandma Chen's.

Anyone who's been in a tourist laden "monkey forest" could have predicted their travails.

And funnier than ever: Part 6: This is Not the Cruise You're Looking For (!)

Kenji's anecdotes about spitting remind me of walking through SF's Chinatown one day doing some grocery shopping, and seeing a Chinese guy produce a honking big snot discharge into his hand and with a practiced flick of wrist, landed it neatly in the gutter of Grant Ave. Let me tell you, he was actually graceful in the wrist movement, disgusting as it was to both watch and walk past. Clearly a lot of experience with his nasal activities.

Singapore, btw, is one of the few Asian countries that has gotten serious about public spitting (partially as a response to the SARS epidemic). They instituted a major increase in the fines for spitting in the late 1980's, increasing first fine offenses from $100 to $1,000.

Anyway, back to Kenji and his adventures: I also thought it was funny how locals kept trying to speak Mandarin to him. I've had that same experience on the other side, so to speak - I'm 100% Japanese but I look Chinese. I was once at a Japanese restaurant with my family, and it took me a while to figure out that all the staff was carefully explaining the food specifically to me because they thought I was the foreigner in the group. LOL!

http://www.seriouseats.com/2015/07/kenji-asia-travel-diary-china-thailand-malaysia-part-6.html

Oh, I know what you mean! My looks could pass for vaguely Germanic (background is mixed Jewish, mostly European), and when I was visiting a Mexican friend in Austria people kept speaking German to me and I was all wide eyed and blank-stare-ish. I knew how to say "apple juice", "forty" and the basic "good day" and "thank-you" that everyone knows. Then my short, olive complected, dark haired, dark eyed friend explain in her Austrian German with a Franco-Mexican accent that I didn't understand them. :) Weirded everyone out. :) OTOH, after I'd lived in Mexico for just a few weeks a bunch of middle aged Americans were surprised that I understood them and could speak English so well to them. :D

Thanks for the link!

Oh that last post upped the gross out quotient.

The cruise reminded me of years ago, me and future DH went on a cruise in Egypt -- except by chance, we booked on a river cruise with 98% French tourists. When we entered the dining hall, the maitre 'd just pointed at an empty table with the one other non-French person, an Indian-American lady. (I actually do speak French, but we complied -- every night). Our food and toilets were much better than his Chinese experience -- taking the "locals" route isn't always the adventure you imagine.

I stumbled on this interview with KLA. It explains a lot that we were speculating about.
http://behindthepass.com/2014/01/31/some-serious-eats-interviewing-the-author-of-the-food-lab-j-kenji-lpez-alt/