* This update is being brought to you entirely to give all those considering the purchase of a Blue Star Range something even more to consider. My original postings found on another thread warning about BS customer service are long & arduous; as has been the continuing saga of my "banging oven"; and this post, shall be. Having complained for over a year & a half from the very beginning of purchase, and their original service dept. man, Pete, long gone, I had to brow beat the current Blue Star service dept. into sending me a new oven bottom; as by this time it was out of warranty. Then subsequently, I had to demand an oven heating element, once I noticed the melted bracket on the oven back as I went to replace the bottom; and the twisted, melted off rivets on the old bottom. In fairness to Blue Star, they did finally go along with it. After all that, I had the unpleasant discovery that the oven still banged like a gunshot every time I used it. The only possible unchanged piece of hardware in this sequence of events was the oven back (with the melted bracket welded on it). Again I began the process of calling/emailing Blue Star service; but to no avail. They simply would not respond. Finally, I went the route of contacting Trevor at Eurostoves, whom I had purchased from originally, to see if he had any ideas about what could be done. I emailed him photos of the melted oven bracket & back. He contacted Blue Star and they answered him. They like, and respond to Trevor, as he is one of their top sales reps (and in my opinion, a very worthy individual to deal with, if you're seeking major appliances). Trevor forwarded the photos of my oven to Blue Star (I will try to post them for reference). Blue Star's answer to Trevor was that this was fine, it would not be a problem even if the bracket was removed altogether. The banging was normal. So I decided to despair. Then suddenly I remembered having purchased this range by a platinum credit card which carries an extended warranty through the credit card services that doubles whatever the original warranty was. As it was a 1 year original warranty, I was still a few months away from the end of the 2 year mark, so I immediately contacted my credit card and started a claim. Even though, by rights, Blue Star should've stepped up; it obviously being a defective group of hardware from the get go, I was relieved that it would get fixed, in any case. Finally, this is where it starts to get interesting. The credit card services require an estimate of the repair. No problem. The Appliance Barn in Kalona, IA has, since my purchase, begun to carry and service Blue Star's ranges. The service man, Ray, came out and verified that this was obviously a melted oven back and bracket. Now they would simply contact Blue Star to ascertain that the oven back could be replaced, and what the cost of the replacement part would be. Then Appliance Barn would simply send in the estimate to my credit card service and that would be that. Well. It just wasn't going to be that simple. I called Appliance Barn 2 weeks after their service call to ask how it was going. Turns out, it wasn't. Initially, Blue Star had simply ignored the request from the Appliance Barn for verification of replacement viability and price, altogether. Appliance Barn did not know what to do about this; they had never been faced with this type of behavior from a vendor. Finally, Blue Star's answer was (their actual email response): "The first issue with the banging sound coming from the oven is caused by the oven bottom expanding during the heating process. Sometimes this can be reduced by replacing the oven bottom, but we may not be able to eliminate this sound in all units. Secondly, I forwarded the oven cavity photos (that they had already seen from Trevor and the Appliance Barn had resent) to our chief engineer for review. His determination was that the rear bracket was hit by some force causing it to bend and "spidering" the enamel coating. The unit does not produce enough heat to melt the metal causing it to bend down. (yes it can, and it did; as attested to by the melted, twisted rivets & old oven bottom still in my possession) This part is held on by basic aluminum rivets. The original rivets would just need to be drilled out and replacements put back in its place. The unit will function normally without the back bracket if needed. Due to the unit being out of warranty and the damage not appearing to be the fault of BlueStar I am limited in what support I can give to remedy this situation." The interesting bit here being that they were not being asked to do anything (like be responsible), but only answer whether the oven back/cavity could be replaced and give a price for it. I determined that I had to tell the credit card services that I still couldn't give them an estimate and to see if they might be able to sort it out with Blue Star. Blue Star would not respond to the credit card agent's attempts to contact. The agent finally called me back saying they were at a stand still (again) because they could not get an estimate. I flashed on the idea of Trevor (whom Blue Star always responds to) and told the agent to contact him. She did and Trevor conferenced her with Matt Shutte, service dept. head at Blue Star, right then. She called me back to say that they had finally gotten the information from Blue Star that they needed: the range was repairable; but only by Blue Star, themselves. It would need to be shipped (at my expense) to their facility (all 500 pounds of it) and the cost of the repair would be $3000.00. That's right, both she and Trevor heard this clearly; and oddly, simultaneously, John Ditzio (also Blue Star tech) had contacted the Appliance Barn with the exact same information. Well. She went on to say that now, at least they could move forward, as there was no way they would be having me send it in for repair when a new one costs the same (once shipping is considered). That she would just have to have the replacement "authorized" by upper management because the ticket price was so high (they can only go up to $2500 without seeking authorization), but she was certain it would be cleared in a few days. That was over 2 weeks ago. As of yesterday, the "upper management" wants another opinion. Of what, exactly, it's unclear. There is no one else out here that could give an intelligent opinion as to repairing, as this range is virtually unknown out here in the mid-west of nowhere (and I don't mean Chicago-5 hours away). As far as "Is it melted and banging?" that is certainly observable by anyone. It would appear that Visa is feeling the pinch of the market downturn, as well and doesn't necessarily believe me or the Appliance Barn service man to be able to see/hear those things clearly...and for some reason, they are locked in somewhere in Montana where they cannot (will not) receive email, wherein I could send them the oven cavity photos. I will print & send by snailmail. Suffice to say, make sure when you purchase a 500 pounder like this, that you are in a longitude/latitude that allows a comparatively simple return in case after you've paid to have it installed you find it has "issues" or performs less than hoped for.

Yep, have to take into consideration the size of the pans, 2 large (12"+) pans and they'll need to be offset, can't be side to side or front to back inline. One of the reasons I like the 22k's so much are that the flame pattern is larger in diameter and covers the bottom of a pan better, any pan. I have them adjusted so that they'll all simmer quite well, the reason the 8k gets used so little is that it's pattern is quite small and I don't use REALLY small pans that often. My DW likes it better as she has her 'egg' pan which is about 6" across and she tends to get things a bit hot on the other burners. She too actually reads directions and figures the dials are accurate, so has some issue w/the big burners unless she really intends to burn something (hard sear). I tend to look at the dials as a guide and 'read' the flame, I know how hot I want something so make the flame wherever I need it regardless of what the dial says. After a while you should know how far to turn the dial to get what you need without looking. I did have a learning curve, I've been using mine about 18 months (36" RNB) and have a better handle on it now. As far as the dials getting warm, I've never had that issue. Now the space in front of the griddle when it's on a higher setting gets freakin' hot! I'm surprised no one has ever mentioned that, you only need to put your hand there once and you'll remember not to do it again :)

Lehman's in Ohio carries a lot of different appliances etc. for off grid living. Most of the Amish do not have electricity. They are wonderful to work with and have a high level of customer service. I would e-mail or talk with them. I'm betting they can set you in the right direction. They have a grreat website. If you have your heart set on a Bluestar there should be a dealer somewhere that would be interested enough to help. I understand about the watt concern...we've set ourselves up for partial off grid living and hope to be totally free of it at some point in the near future. We'll stay hooked into the grid for back up though. During a long power outage from a hurricaine we lived with a small generator. It becomes a balancing act where we shut something off (like the fans or lights) while we took a shower because of the electrical load when the well pump kicked on. I'm assuming once the burners of a Bluestar are lit you can keep running them without electricity. My GE Profile burners can be lit with a match, so while I couldn't bake I could still make a lot of delicious meals without the oven. I truly hope the Bluestar burners can be manually lit with a match during power outages because we get a lot of them.

Propane is heavier than air -- natural gas is lighter than air. In order for the propane burner to light with an electric igniter, the propane must be pushed up to the spark by the pressure of gas behind it in the venturi tube (since it doesn't rise naturally in air). If the tip of the igniter wire is not at the very lowest opening in the burner, the propane spills out of any lower holes before it gets to the igniter. The Bluestar igniter electrode tips have historically been optimized for natural gas in that they sit at the level of about the third hole up in the column of holes in front of the igniter. For natural gas, this insures that the burner is filled with enough gas before ignition occurs. For propane, this results in delayed or, potentially, faulty ignition if the burner is not exactly level. I came up with a simple and reversible modification for Bluestar propane burners that works really well. After the mod, the burners in my RCS range light reliably within four clicks on cold startup and one click if the burner is already filled with gas. The modification: Replace the screw that mounts the igniter to the underside of the burner with a 6-32 3/8" long stainless steel pan head machine screw (the original one is the same but only 1/4" long). Put a 1/8" thick spacer between the bottom of the burner and the igniter mounting flange in order to lower the igniter by 1/8". I used a #8 stainless steel nut but you could also use stainless steel washers to add up to 1/8". When tightening the screw, make sure that the tip of the electrode wire is directly in front of the lowest burner hole. I think that the currently shipping ranges now have igniters that have longer electrode wires that can potentially be bent downward to the lowest hole using a couple of needle nose pliers (to prevent breaking the ceramic insulator). This might also work to solve the propane ignition problem (I have a one year old RCS with the shorter electrode wires).