I'm no lawn expert. . . but I do love a green lawn. here's what I read, true or not I tend my lawn according to it. . .

I mow every 4 days, I stopped bagging my clippings, instead I let the clippings fall. I did this all season last year. They say you should not mow more than 1/3 of the height. I don't like piles of grass standing in the lawn (dogs track it in the house) but cutting it every 4 days works out, there is no standing grass. This is based on my lawn and the rate it grows, others may have to do it less/more depending on watering, weather, soil etc.

I set a bowl out in the yard to see how long the sprinklers had to run to put 1" of water. Mine takes approx. 30 mins. to put down 1" of water. So once a week I run the sprinklers for 30 mins.

I have good soil, full of worms. I don't have (anymore) a weed problem. I used to use Scotts but after reading on here that it can hurt more than it can help, I stopped using it. It will provide a temporary fix, but they are in the business to sell lawn care products, if they *fix* the problem they won't have a customer base left. From what I've read it will also eventually stress kill your lawn. It kills off the worms and those are the best thing for treating your lawn. I discovered Milorganite, as suggested here. It is organic, non burning, no excessive greening, (it turns the grass green over time, because it is delivering healthy nutrients that take time to take effect) it has iron and. . . worms love it. I didn't find it at any of the big box stores. They do have a search so you can find a retailer near you. It's not much more than Scotts and the results are hands down, far more superior.

If you feed the lawn a good consistent balance the weeds should no longer be a problem. Weeds generally don't fair well in healthy lawns.

Since I made these changes last season my lawn has improved 100%. I applied my first treatment of Milorganite yesterday. Other than mowing that is all I did this spring.

One more thing. . . again, I'm no expert. . . if your grass is more than 20% green you shouldn't dethatch it. It is my understanding that it should be done while the grass is still dormant, very early spring.

I would have to guess as far as the septic. . . I would say the soil isn't deep enough over the pipes. In which the water cannot be retained therefore it is drying out. Just a guess tho.

You came to the right place, you should get some really good advise here, I sure did. . .

good luck

~Debi

If your soil is healthy you will never have to dethatch. I suggest you search this forum for "dethatching" if that is possible. You really should look at the lawn and determine if, in fact, you have thatch, or if it is just someone telling you that. Don't dethatch unless you absolutely have to!

No, I know I have thatch and quite a bit of it. After a couple years of letting the grass get too long before cutting and using a horrible mower would routinely leave huge clumps all over the lawn. If I take a rake and dethatch by hand it takes 7-10 passes to get it all and just ~ 1 square foot area makes a decent sized pile of stuff that I pulled up.

We also routinely have a problem with some sort of ground wasps and I think that the thatch may have something to do with that.

Oh okay I understand. Its just that my understanding is that grass clippings are not considered thatch and do not cause a thatch problem. Maybe it's just a matter of terminology but I think the difference can be important.

I'll go out and take a picture of what is coming up when I rake. It isn't old clippings, but I had thought excess clippings could lead to increased thatch. I would love it if dethatching wasn't needed.

Better to pull a 4" to 6" plug so you can see a cross-section. Thatch is defined as a layer of dead organic matter above the soil that exceeds 1/2" in thickness. It is uncommon for clippings to create thatch, but poor mowing habits can do so when the amount of clippings exceeds the ability of the existing microbiology to decay it in a timely manner. Thatch is harmful when it prevents water and amendments from getting through to the soil/roots. Lack of sufficient water and food causes the turf roots to grow towards the soil surface and/or into the thatch layer. This weakens the turf and increases susceptibility to insects, disease and drought.

Ok, here are some pictures. The first is what was pulled up from about a 1 sqft area with a rake.

That's practically no thatch, so dethatching is not required. Nor would I suggest it in this case. Most of that is the normal sloughing off of old grass leaves, which filter to the bottom and decay into the soil.

Well that is great to hear. That's just that much more money I can put into getting a better spreader and other supplies.

I am going to send a sample off to get tested, but is there anything I can do in the mean time? And should I just not even consider redoing the couple of places that would need to be seeded until fall?

For the sample, I should take numerous samples from all over and mix them together, right? Should I consider getting a separate sample from the septic area tested, or just mix that in with the rest?

By the looks of it, I'd say you are well on your way to a best lawn. The amount of thatch in the pictured pile is what I would expect would be brought up by raking any healthy lawn. I agree with morpheuspa, I don't see any thatch problem in the cross-section picture. Some amount of thatch is actually beneficial as it helps keep moisture trapped in the soil. I'd say it's time for you to move on from your thatch concerns and start fine tuning your soil and maintenance schedule to get to that very best lawn goal.
Very nice lawn btw.

Thank you. Pretty much everyone in this neighborhood has pretty nice lawns so anything less than what I already have really stands out. Of course I still want it better though.

>>I am going to send a sample off to get tested, but is there anything I can do in the mean time? And should I just not even consider redoing the couple of places that would need to be seeded until fall?

Hold off on the reseeding until late summer unless we're talking about an enormous area that you absolutely need to use this year.

>>For the sample, I should take numerous samples from all over and mix them together, right? Should I consider getting a separate sample from the septic area tested, or just mix that in with the rest?

Mix the septic area in with the rest of the samples--unless that particular area features radically different performance than the rest of the lawn. And yep, numerous samples all mixed.

Should I just go with the standard test?

Yep, you don't need any of the more advanced ones unless this one shows certain problems (and it's not likely to do so). I've recommended more advanced testing perhaps once in many years.

Thanks. I'll try to get that out tomorrow.

In the mean time is there anything I can do for the dandelions? They are far worse this year than they ever have been.

Have you gotten a lot of rain this year? Weed seeds need a place to sprout (generally bare soil) and continually moist soil (like you might get from repeated rain storms or from watering 45 minutes 3 nights per week(!)). If Mother Nature is the culprit, there's nothing to do but spray them out or pluck them out with a Weed Hound tool. To keep them out you need to allow the soil surface to dry out for a week or two between watering events. The seeds can't sprout if the soil is dry.

Put some cat food or tuna cans out to measure how long it takes to fill them. That time will be your watering time. It might be less than or more than 45 minutes, but you need to know so you can repeat that watering. Then use that time when you water. When you water deeply the grass roots will go down into the soil to get that moisture even when the surface is dry and hard as a rock. That's how we get away with waiting 1, 2, 3, or 4 weeks between watering. At the hottest part of summer you should not be watering more than once per week. I'm going to post this picture of morph's lawn and let him describe how his neighbors water. The pic was taken in July a few years ago.

You can go organic and dig them out or nuke them by spot spraying with an Ortho product and a tank sprayer. I prefer to nuke them as their tap root is hard to remove. I also like to remove the flower heads. Just because it gives me satisfaction. Probably an unhealthy vice.

I vote for nuking them, good old Weed B Gon will kick their butts without the effort (and annoyance and occasional failure) of digging them out.

In that above picture, can you tell the lawn that is rarely watered? Hint: Trick question.

On the left is a lawn that's watered often and shallow. Across the street, both lawns are never watered and rarely fed. Mine is rarely watered.

I water maximum of once a week, 1" of water at a time. My left-hand neighbor is probably closer to 1/4" of water a week, delivered daily to every third day depending. Across the street is whatever nature supplies, usually 3 to 4" of water per month but it varies very widely year to year.

Mind you, this is taken at one of the two most extreme points of the year (the other is winter, when mine is green and everybody else's is...not green). Spring and fall I'm merely deep, dark green to their pale greens.

My sprinklers haven't been turned on yet this year and I was planning to cut back on the frequency and we really haven't had all that much rain this year.

I have no problem with using chemicals to nuke the things, I just didn't know which to use. I'll pick up some Weed B Gone.

And I think I have seen somewhere that you are in the philly area morpheus? Your lawn stays green all year in this area? Wow!

North of Philly in the Lehigh Valley. So subtract five degrees and add 900 feet of altitude. :-)

The majority of years it stays green (greenish, it's nothing to write home about in January, but still definitely green, if pale). Last year and the year before? Nope. The winters were too harsh and it went into partial dormancy.

Ok, I now have a new goal. I want green grass year round.

Okay here's morph's Kentucky bluegrass lawn in the April of 2011 (but he says he can't get that every winter)

What I find most amusing is, if I recall correctly, few of morpheus' neighbors care enough to actually ask him why his lawn is so nice and how they can do the same.

Michael -- I always say this to "new" people but if you follow the morpheus recommendations after getting your Logan soil test, in relatively short time you'll have the nicest lawn in the town (or 3rd best in the state, next to morpheus and his mom).

Oh, and regarding the thatch, I'm not going to say I told you so... :O)

I think two or three have asked. None have actually done anything about it, it would require effort and some attention.

And yes, that's April 2011 on my lawn, just as the weather started to turn. This year? 50% dormant and snow-mold burned, 50% green but paler than the above.

Next year, if the probable El Nino event gets together, I do expect a green winter. If not, maybe not so much.

This is not magic, as I keep saying to anybody who will listen. This is just tuning the soil (which you don't even have to do all that well, just take care of the worst of it), and feeding correctly. Watering and mowing are also important, but I gotta admit I have a very light hand on the water and even with a robot I tend to mow a little less often than I strictly-speaking should. The grass is resilient enough to withstand some mistakes and laziness.