I am a plopper myself as I have found DE to be well able to support itself...as well as having little aptitude for spiralling or other types of training. Like a lot of multiflora hybrid musk types, it makes a dense shrub with many new canes emerging every year, all ending in a profusion of twiggy branches. It may be possible to beat some civilised manners into this exuberant rose but, as it is so at home in a wild garden, I have tended to leave it alone to do its thing. As for water, this is a dangerous question. Although East Anglia is classed as semi-arid, I imagine it is not a patch on Texas. Also, the ash will be doing its best to suck up any free moisture...but, I have never watered mine so would think that, if it gets established over a season, with a fortnightly deep watering (at least a couple of 2 gallon cans allowed to seep into the soil), it is a tough and capable rose. You might find that it marshalls it's resources during the heat of summer, flowering profusely in spring and autumn but looking a bit sere and dull in July/August.

You have to love the phone company. Here they cut right through a tree, leaving a third of it behind, and you can imagine that look. I was in a strangling mood. Finally paid someone to remove the rest.

Sorry, I don't know the answer to your question. I wonder whether the tree will survive its cavalier treatment or will die and ultimately collapse.

Oh, I would be surprised if the ash dies - in fact, if you regard it's haircut as pollarding, you may well prolong its life. Ash (fraxinus) has been pollarded and coppiced in woodland management since time immemorial - watch for many water shoots sprouting from the cut trunk. Some people are not keen on this look but I do have a soft spot for a well-pollarded urban tree - the huge plane trees which line many of Cambridge's streets are pollarded - a very sculptural look in winter and by mid summer, the new green has grown together to make a neat lollipop head - well-suited to narrow but busy roads.

I have Darlow's on a west-facing hillside in really bad soil (actually sub-soil) but I do irrigate, so can't comment on that (it gets watered very modestly via a drip hose once a week during summer and we don't get ANY summer rain, so it's sort of the equivalent of a little rain once a week). Mine does not show any inclination for climbing at all, going on 5 years now, but he is living in a tough neighborhood. It's just a big handsome mound of a bush (mockingbird eats those beautiful red heps all winter long), still rather upright. Interesting that some of the comments on HMF have it behaving more like a ground cover.

Campanula, plopping definitely suits my gardening style--I'm all about the path of least resistance. And I'm intrigued about pollarding--do I just whack off the remaining chunk of its canopy? Now, would be best, I presume, while it's still dormant-ish?

My sympathies, Ingrid. The ash they can have, but they also cut a giant chunk out of the middle of our ~60 year old pecan. That hurt. Have a little respect for age, you barbarians!

DE seems to be an enigmatic rose in more ways than one, Catspa. RVR says they have two specimens--one growing as a shrub, one as a climber--and you've heard of it behaving as a ground cover. I wonder if all this variability is due to different climates/microclimates/soils?

I'm increasingly unsure that he's going to do what I want him to do (clamber up an ugly, maimed eyesore and change it into a giant bloom blob), but what the heck. The only way to find out for sure is to try it.

Thanks, all, for sharing your experience!

My Darlows Enigma, who is about seven years old, grows as a fairly mannerly mound with no climbing ambitions - yet. He is, however, very drought tolerant. He is planted in full Texas sun, and we got no rain from February to October in 2011, but he survived with no watering at all.

Wow, porkpal, that is good to know. I suspected he was tough!

That's terrific news about his drought tolerance, porkpal--thanks for sharing.

You don't want to be grappling with this one much as the prickles are like fish hooks.

[Note that "Darlow's Enigma" is a study name coined by Darlow (after I showed him it wasn't the R. moschata 'Plena' he had been selling it as because he forgot the name he got it under), should therefore be presented in double quotes until we all find out what its true name is someday.]

I concur with Porkpal - mine is planted along a fenceline - it gets hot blasting afternoon Texas sun and does just fine. It is established, but I watered well at first - and do water those fenceline roses fairly well. I don't see this rose trying to climb - it stays shrublike with little pruning. Judith

Same here about Darlow's Enigma not climbing, so I doubt he'd hide the eyesore at the top of this tree. You could plant Darlow in front of the tree and some other climber to disguise the top, but DE is thorny enough you really don't want to work at the base of it to get at a climbing rose. Mine grows in a dry part-shade patch under some limbed up pine trees and gets absolutely zero care in our dry climate. It thrives under tough conditions, but it doesn't sound like it'll meet what you want from this tree fiasco. There are indeed climbers in your zone that will eat a tree or any other structure (Mermaid comes to mind as the most notorious house-eater), but I don't know if that's the effect you're going for, and Mermaid is pretty thorny too I believe. Heck, it might even discourage the phone company from getting near next time!

Cynthia

Being in central Texas, check out Antique Rose Emporium for a good climber. Not an antique, but I think one of the Climbing Edens would look great on that. Or you could plant yourself a David Austin variety on there that would quickly swallow it.

Lady Banksia does wonders in that part of the world, but you may want something that blooms more then just 6 weeks in the spring.

I am in zone 6a, my Darlow's Enigma is about 8-9 years old, I keep it at 12-13' tall, have to cut it back all summer, don't really water it (facing north). We have plenty snow in the winter and rain in the summer. It's a blooming machine with light fragrant. :-)

Hmm... King Cobb & alameda, that is discouraging, especially since you're both zone-adjacent to me, so to speak. On the other hand, summerseve's specimen sounds more promising. I wish I understood why people have such varied experiences with this plant.

I'm not even sure why I have my heart set on this rose, but I do. It's not my usual style at all, but for some reason I've been dreaming of piles of frothy white simplicity.

I've also wanted Veilchenblau for years, and I'm interested in Marechal Neil and Climbing Maman Cochet... but I don't yearn for any of them like I do for DE.

I think, for my peace of mind, I'd better go ahead and make the experiment, despite knowing that it's probably doomed and foolish. I'll just have to be prepared to dig it up in a couple of year and replace it with something sensible. If nothing else, at least this thread has confirmed that he is drought tolerant. So there's that.

Thanks again for everyone's input.

I almost hope no one finds out the real name because I just love the name 'Darlow's Enigma'.

Wait a minute, Campanula. "Although East Anglia is classed as semi-arid..." Semi-arid? The fen country? Gee whiz, my very surname is derived from the necessary dikes my ancestors were involved with in East Anglia! What happened to all the water?

DE is relatively compact for me so I don't think it would train well, but would envelop the trunk to some degree. It is also quite thorny, so that you might not want to interact with it often.

Though I honestly would not expect a true zone 5 rose from that breeding, or something that is quite tolerant of alkaline soil. But these minor details don't seem to bother other people.

Btw, nipstress, I've decided to follow your suggestion: DE in front of the tree, a climber behind. So far I've got the flanking roses in place (Chireno on the left and a pink shrub seedling of Dortmund on the right), and I hoping to add the other 2 this fall--or I may do the climber in the fall so it has a head start and DE in the spring.

Fantastic, Plectrudis! It sounds lovely and I think you'll have the best of both worlds. Just remember that DE is pretty sneaky with lots of little thorns ALL up and down the branches, so you may want to leave yourself an "access spot" perhaps to the side so you can get in to prune the climber, and train the main canes sideways. Even in my zone, DE gets formidable enough I wouldn't want to wade through him on a routine basis.
Of course we'll want pictures when it's all settled!

Cynthia

mine is a climber, shade and drought tolerant and has some wicked wicked thorns. I leave it alone!