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veer_gw

4th July

veer
17 years ago

Is wishing my US RP friends a 'Happy Independence Day' rather like Guy Fawkes wanting everyone to enjoy 'Bonfire Night'?

Is an effigy of a Redcoat/George III (or maybe some other King George) to be found hanging from a lamp-post on every street corner?

Share with all us non-Americans how you spend the 4th and what it means to you.

Comments (46)

  • ccrdmrbks
    17 years ago

    Not a sign of George-in this area-the main re-enactment, actually, is from the Civil War-the battle of Gettysburg, which took place for three days, including the 4th, in 1863. This year, however, due to the flooding, it has been postponed. It is raining again as I type!
    Other than that, it is a day particularly patriotic without being war-focused or glum. Parades featuring not only Veterans, but scouts, the fire company, the Elks and the Moose Lodges, the high school marching band, the mayor and spouse, the Dairy Princess and other local worthies are common. The town where my DD is teaching this summer paints the Main Street traffic line over into a red,white and blue stripe for miles. There are picnics, patriotic music concerts, baseball and softball tournaments, and of course fireworks. We do a family gathering, sharing out the food responsibilities, then watch the fireworks-many towns have them, starting on June 30 and going until next weekend-you can see fireworks every night for a week if you are willing to drive around. I'm content with the ones that are sent up from the park behind our house-no parking troubles, a comfy chair on the deck, the kitchen nearby for refills and my own loo. We usually invite friends and family over for that evening if it doesn't fall on the 4th anyway.
    Of course, this year, we'll spend part of the afternoon watching World Cup-but as it doesn't bode well weatherwise, that's okay.

  • martin_z
    17 years ago

    Working for an American Bank, I've often felt that I ought to have 4th July off. Still trying to persuade HR that this is a good idea....

    The Global head of our team (a Brit) sent round this email today.

    To all our US colleagues - Happy 4th of July.

    Meanwhile, British subjects will spend the day lamenting the loss of the empire and the decline of our colonial power.

    Made me smile...!

  • ccrdmrbks
    17 years ago

    Martin-I hope they at least send round the ubiquitious red, white and blue popsicles (I think they're called iced lollies in your part of town ;-)and give you each a sparkler to wave. Can't have the 4th without a red, white and blue tongue and slightly singed fingers! Ask any American child!

  • sheriz6
    17 years ago

    It is kind of funny when you think about it, the holiday is a celebration of America's independence, but given our close relationship with England, the aspect of 'throwing off the chains of colonialism' really isn't part of the party. Sorry, Vee, no effigy of King George or Redcoats here. It's more about eating and fireworks.

    We have a neighborhood kid's parade with decorated bicycles, scooters, wagons and even appropriately dressed-up pets (my personal favorite was the bunny rabbit dressed in a cotton-ball beard and construction paper top hat to represent President Lincoln). Prizes are given, the fire department comes and lets the kids climb all over the truck, and one year when it was horribly hot they even opened the fire hydrant for a little while to cool everybody off. Then it's off to a family BBQ and possibly fireworks.

    The weather report doesn't look promising today, but I'm hoping the thunderstorms hold off long enough to get the burgers on the grill and let the kids get in the pool for a while.

    Happy 4th!

  • cindydavid4
    17 years ago

    What cc and sheri said. Its a patriotic holiday, but its tons of fun. Most people seem to use it as a celebration of summer. And because its on a Tuesday, that celebration has been going on since Friday night....

    I don't hear people say Happy Independence Day. Rather they'll say Happy 4th!

    Personally I tend to stay away from the fireworks, just coz, well, its outside. And even after sundown, its still over 100 degrees (aka 42 degrees). So usually my family just gets together for a bbq at one of our houses, then later I'll watch the fireworks on tv (the ones from DC are particularly excellent)

  • ginny12
    17 years ago

    The Fourth of July is a favorite among American holidays. It signifies high summer--swimming, barbecues, relaxing, fireworks and fun. I think we in the thirteen original colonies may have a bit more historical awareness than in some places. There are so many reminders all around us. I lived in California during the Bicentennial and it was a non-event--so surprising as it was a very big deal back home on the East Coast.

    In New England, the traditional Fourth of July meal is salmon and peas. The wild salmon were running at that time--now they are all farm-raised but never mind. And peas were and are just ready for picking. And strawberry/rhubarb something for dessert. I try to serve that meal around this time but on the Fourth itself, it's hamburgers and hot dogs on the grill. Sometimes we go to the town fireworks, fun but a parking nightmare, but we always watch the Boston Pops on TV and thrill to the 1812 Overture, the cannons and fireworks, and the very happy and huge crowd. One of Boston's great traditions.

    Every year, the paper publishes the Declaration of Independence on the editorial page. I read it through. It is still a very, very impressive document and worth thinking about, this day and every day.

  • smallcoffee
    17 years ago

    My son played the snare drum in the high school band in the parade this A.M. We go out to dinner. (lazy) then probably to see fireworks at dusk if it stays clear.

  • carolyn_ky
    17 years ago

    We stay home and watch the neighbor boys shoot off fireworks in our cul de sac. My husband faithfully does "spark watch" in case a stray hits our roof; but, of course, it never has. We are having a thunderstorm right now (4:45 pm EDT), so tonight may be quiet.

    We watched a video of Saving Private Ryan this afternoon. We had been meaning to rent SPR and The Longest Day since our visit to Normandy but hadn't got to it until today, and then the shop didn't have TLD.

    We just finished an early supper of BLTs made with our first ripe tomatoes, Silver Queen corn on the cob, and Georgia watermelon. Last Sunday's paper had an article saying that GA watermelons are the best ever this year because of the hot, dry weather they have had; and I have to say this one was about the best I've ever eaten.

    On another forum I did a test of sample questions that are asked on the naturalization test. I scored 95 and would be ashamed to tell you the one I missed.

    Happy Fourth, everyone, and that includes you Brits with whom we are completely reconciled. Tea, anyone?

  • captainbackfire
    17 years ago

    I had 24 members of my family to my house today for a cookout. All have gone home now. We ate burgers, brats, and hotdogs along with a ton of side dishes. We also made homemade ice cream. That is a big tradition in my family.

    It wasn't cookout weather, though. We've had off-and-on rain all day.

    There have been fireworks displays in all the neighboring towns since Friday night. There are 2 towns within easy driving distance of me that are having them tonight, but with the rain, I think we'll just stay home.

  • ccrdmrbks
    17 years ago

    Just home from the family "do"-as we're all sports fans, we waited to eat until the World Cup game was over ;-(, then had our burgers and dogs and potato salad and watermelon-then settled down in front of the TV to watch the hotdog eating contest from Coney Island-no volleyball-too wet and another storm is coming soon.
    We were all glad we'd eaten before we watched the hot dog eating contest-the winner ate 53 3/4 in 12 minutes. shudder.

  • cindydavid4
    17 years ago

    carolyn, do you have a link to that quiz? I'd love to try it.

    Every 4th the paper runs a story about the number of immigrants who become naturalized citizens that day. Its very cool - many wait for that date to be sworn in. I remember years ago an English friend became a citizen that night, and a bunch of us went up to the mountains to celebrate. We could see the fireworks from all over town. Very cool.

    Its funny - I consider myself patriotic, but I usually balk at some of the flag waving and nationistic attitudes that go on in our country. But for some reason this doesn't bother me on the 4th - partly because it is fun, and partly because well there is reason to celebrate.

    Ginny, when I was in Jr Hi we had to memorize the Declaration, as well as the Gettysburg Address and the preamble to the Constitution. They always have a way of moving me when I read or hear them again. Pure poetry.

  • dorieann
    17 years ago

    Happy Independence Day, everyone! I spent the morning catching up on some errands and shopping. Had planned to come home to spend the rest of the day relaxing, doing some reading, laundry, cooking dinner. Instead I came home to no electricity until about 9:00 this evening. Since there was nothing else to do, I put some new batteries in my flashlight and used it to finish one of my books. Oh, and about 4 hours into the blackout I was forced to finish off some rainbow sherbet that was melting in my freezer. Ah well, still better than going to work!

    Martin, your email message gave me a chuckle.

  • cindydavid4
    17 years ago

    Oh, I was reminded of my fav dessert on the 4th when I was a kid. My dad always made 'watermelon' icecream. You take a plastic bowl (not metal) and cover the bottom and sides with two inches of pistachio icecream. Then you mix chocolate chips into strawberry sherbet and pour the mixture in untill the bowl is full. Freeze. When you are ready, cut it into slices. Voila - instant watermelon, and considering I was the only one in my family who didn't like the taste of real watermelon, that suited me just fine!

    Ok, its still daylight here, and for the last two hours the neighbors have been shooting off crackers. You can't see anything, and it scares the neighbor dogs. Silly.

  • veer
    Original Author
    17 years ago

    Great to read about the different ways you all spent The Day.
    Of course in the UK, we have become so unpatriotic ( a trend that seemed to have started in the '60's) that almost nothing is made of our heritage/history. Schools teach little history beyond WWII . .. and even then many youngsters think that 'Churchill' is a bull-dog (from a TV insurance ad).
    Cindy it was probably no bad thing that you had to learn the Declaration of Independence by heart; as a piece of literature it can't be beaten . . . Think of what a modern Bill/Statute/Act of Parliament sounds like today with the dreadful 'politico-speak' that goes on?
    I count myself lucky to have US forebears (my maternal Grandfather was from VA) two brothers who fought on opposite sides during the Rev War, a very distant Quaker family-member who was brought to the US by Willian Penn, sent to university and became the Sec. to the State of PA. This would never have happened to a poor boy in England. And while on the Dec. of Ind. I can count Patrick Henry as an ancestor on the sinister ie female side (which counts for nothing in the UK) I just thought I'd show off as everyone in England would say "Patrick who?"

  • woodnymph2_gw
    17 years ago

    As I am near Colonial Williamsburg and Yorktown, there are lots of parades in colonial dress, fifes and drums corps, flag-waving, and the inevitable fireworks everywhere. It seems to carry on the patriotic spirit, as we are so close to where Cornwallis was actually defeated. Also, this is a military area, with lots of bases. I don't think folk here are so much focused upon our past, as upon the present war.

    Apart from going to parades and seeing fireworks and putting out the American flag on the front porch, most families here are either at the beach, around the pool, or trying to invent a new barbeque recipe. I did see a lot of cyclists, however, on our roads....

  • veronicae
    17 years ago

    Carolyn - can you share a link with the naturalization test?

    Lazy day here, yesterday...but we had already done fireworks Friday with middle son in his home town and they were incredibly glorious...hadn't seen such good displays in years. Sunday we went to our daughter's for a small family barbecue.
    We have barbecued and had salads etc every night since Sat...yesterday was a day to clean to prepare for a wedding...and to watch "1776" - a long time family tradition.

  • cindydavid4
    17 years ago

    > Oh, and about 4 hours into the blackout I was forced to finish off some rainbow sherbet that was melting in my freeze

    Oh, isn't that too bad. The sacrifices we make (if it were me tho I'd been wishing it was Haagen Daz!)

    We spent the evening playing backgammon, and alternating between watching Capitol Fourth and the World Cup. Appropriate, I think.

  • carolyn_ky
    17 years ago

    Here is the site for the naturalization test sample.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13442226/


  • ginny12
    17 years ago

    Vee--What great American ancestors you had! As I'm sure you know, Winston Churchill's mother was American. US-UK--a great combination.

  • cindydavid4
    17 years ago

    Thanks Carolyn. I scored 85%. The two questions I missed were silly - #14 about who selects the SCOTUS justices was tricky, and #19 about what form is used to apply for citizenship was in the category of 'why is this important for a new citizen to know?'. I did btw find the 100 INS questions that these are taken from. Some good civic questions there.

  • martin_z
    17 years ago

    Well, I got 70% on the "who wants to be an American" test, which I reckon is not bad for a Brit. Some of the questions are daft - why do you need to know which particular amendment does what?

  • ginny12
    17 years ago

    Martin, In many cases I guess the number of the amendment is not that important except as their addition to the Constitution demonstrates the evolution of our ideas about government. It is very hard for an amendment to be passed by Congress and then ratified by enough states to become law--and it should be hard.

    That said, the first ten amendments are called the Bill of Rights and their quick addition to the Constitution is very significant. So the number of each of these does matter. Then, if memory serves, the 13th, 14th, and 15th amendments came quickly after the Civil War, ended slavery and guaranteed on paper if not in practice certain imporant rights to American MEN of every race. Those were amendments whose numbers we memorized in school.

    The 18th was memorable because it put Prohibition into practice--then the 21st was Repeal. A lot of people remember those two numbers. There are even bars with those names.

    And the 19th, one of my personal favorites, gave women the right to vote--ratified in 1920.

    Those are some of the the amendments remembered by number and justifiably so.

  • Chris_in_the_Valley
    17 years ago

    Way cool, VeeR.

    So, Martin, why do you think you did so well? Like Cindy, I picked the wrong form for becoming a citizen, but I'm okay with that.

  • veer
    Original Author
    17 years ago

    Went to Carolyn's site and couldn't get onto the question part, just into the 'first page'. Realised that msn is a close cousin of aol and tried it on IE instead of Firefox, but still with no luck. On technical incompetence I can't see me being let into the US at all!
    Ginny, thanks for the explanation on the amendments to the Constitution; most informative.

  • martin_z
    17 years ago

    Why did I do so well? Not sure that I did - it's a bit like a trivia quiz - things I was once told have stuck. So I knew there were 13 stripes and what they represented - I was able to deduce which set were the 13 original states also (not New Zealand(!), not Washigton DC, not Kentucky, hence it must be the other set!)

    I knew that the Declaration of Independence was 1776, so I sort of worked out that the Constitution was 1787.

    But I didn't know the first ten amendments were the Bill of Rights, didn't know what the introduction was called, and couldn't identify the three rights or freedoms guaranteed by the Bill of Rights. (I went for life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Ah, well.)

    But I got the right form. That seemed obvious. Which form do you use to apply to become a naturalized citizen? "Application for Naturalization" - what else?

    And though I know about "Give me liberty or give me death", I've never heard of Patrick Henry.

  • anyanka
    17 years ago

    Well, I managed a cool 60%, but at least 20% of that 60% (you do the maths!) was pure guesswork.

  • dynomutt
    17 years ago

    Hmmmmm........ I missed one question -- the one regarding the amendment that guarantees voting rights. I got confused since I said it was the 19th amendment. After all, if an amendment doesn't guarantee voting rights for EVERYONE, then does that guarantee voting rights for ANYONE?

    Not bad since I'm from Canada! (Although, some people would argue that we're part of the US anyway!)

    I think I got most of them the same way martin did -- by figuring out the questions and by remembering stuff that I've read. Then again, I've always been a bit of a US History buff so that might have helped me.

    By the way, I think the whole "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" is from the Declaration of Independence.

  • Chris_in_the_Valley
    17 years ago

    You are right there, Dyno, it is from the Declaration.

    Hey, it could have been a petition as easily as it could have been an application!

  • martin_z
    17 years ago

    Well, maybe. But I'm a great believer in logic - if you're applying to become a naturalized citizen, it seems to be pretty clear that you use an application for naturalization.

  • carolyn_ky
    17 years ago

    Also, on the other forum thread, someone had found the complete test and said that the grammar, spelling, and punctuation were terrible. Pity the poor new citizens! (Or maybe they will be more competent than our present crop.)

  • lemonhead101
    17 years ago

    I became naturalized in 1996 (but still both a UK and an American citizen) and they didn't ask me any of those questions.... I studied like crazy from a book you can buy but don't remember taking a test with questions like this.

    It's all forgotten now, but for quite a while there, I could stump my friends with lots of esoteric trivia about the US history....

    It's nerve-wracking going through the process though. I always felt as though I would do one wrong thing and then would get deported.... Yikes. It's good to have a US passport to get back into the country. (Still have a Brit passport though to get in the shorter lines on the British side. :-) )

  • veer
    Original Author
    17 years ago

    I just found the site below on becoming a British citizen (a recent concept) and must admit, although I could probably answer most of the questions there are one or two I would have trouble with . . .unless they are put in the form of 'tick the box' in which case I hope logic would come to my aid.
    Craftily the Govt makes you buy a handbook containing the relevant information.
    Assuming, however far-fetched, that RP friends wanted to settle in this sceptr'd isle how would they do?

    Here is a link that might be useful: British Citizenship

  • veer
    Original Author
    17 years ago

    If the site below is the same as the one Carolyn put up through the msn thing I apologise (I couldn't get into it) but I know I would not be able to answer all or probably even 3/4 of these questions.
    I must look more closely at the 'Stars and Stripes'

    Here is a link that might be useful: Test Questions for Would-be US Citizens

  • cindydavid4
    17 years ago

    Wow. They ask those of each applicant? No wonder it takes a long time to become a citizen - it would take forever to get through them all! Interesting questions tho - certainly better and more functional than knowing with amendment is for what (just knowing what rights we have should be enough), the number of stripes on the flag, and the name of the naturalization form.

  • carolyn_ky
    17 years ago

    Vee, your U.S. reference looks like a full set of questions from which the sample was taken, but in the sample you were given multiple choice answers which makes it a lot easier.

    I would have to study that little book before I could become a British citizen. Now, if they asked some questions about English cozy mysteries . . .

  • woodnymph2_gw
    17 years ago

    Vee, what are Georgie and Scouse dialects and where are they spoken? Just curious.

  • veer
    Original Author
    17 years ago

    Mary, Geordie is the accent/dialect of the Tyneside region of N E England and can be difficult to understand. Scouse is from the City of Liverpool, something of a nasal whine as though they have sinus problems. Quite different from a Lancashire accent, the county of which L'pool is part.

    Carolyn, I think a sub-section of questions for you re. becoming a British citizen might be on the theme of "Choccy bars I have eaten". And please go easy on the Cadbury's as they have had a 'product recall' because of something nasty that has been found lurking in one of their production lines.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Cadbury's choc

  • carolyn_ky
    17 years ago

    Didn't someone here say that Cadbury's problem stemmed from some one-off thing and then the government stepped in? I'll volunteer to taste test for them.

  • veer
    Original Author
    17 years ago

    Carolyn I don't think it was at an RP site, maybe on one of those Choccy-eaters Anonymous self-help places? :-)

    Here is a link that might be useful: Terrible Chocolate Quotes

  • twobigdogs
    17 years ago

    FINALLY chiming in on this thread.

    The 4th of July is one of my favorite holidays - despite the fact that I usually spend it with my mother-in-law. We usually watch fireworks from a boat in the Chesapeake Bay while eating steamed blue crabs and shrimp with corn on the cob. We can see fireworks from many different towns from the water - Baltimore, Rock Hall, Annapolis, and on and on. After the grand finale, I always sing The Star Spangled Banner under my breath and promise myself yet again that NEXT year, I'll sing out loud and see how many people on the hundreds of other boats anchored nearby join in to sing with me.

    On the family heritage side, I have ancestors that have fought in every war our country has been in since coming to this land in the early 1730's. In the UK, that it not long ago, but here in the US, it's about as far back as possible. DH's family was on the Mayflower, which is 1620.

    Wonderful stories and comments everyone. I've enjoyed every single one. Thanks for sharing.

    PAM

  • carolyn_ky
    17 years ago

    Vee, the chocolate site is wonderful. Thanks for sharing. It must have been the Fodors Travel Forum that I got the Cadbury info from. Travel folks like chocolate, too. Periodically, someone asks what country has the best chocolates; and the posters are rabid in their answers.

  • venusia_
    17 years ago

    Kind of distantly related, but I'm thinking of applying for Italian citizenship. My husband was born in Italy and has retained citizenship, and apparently in Italy and other European countries, for example, they have what is called jus sanguini, where if you are blood related or have a spouse you can become a citizen. However, if you are born there to a non-citizen it is quite hard to get citizenship. I'm wondering if there are any benefits beyong bypassing the rather long foreigner lines at the airport.

  • cindydavid4
    17 years ago

    If any of you happen to be in Quebec City, you absolutely must go to the Chocolate Factory! A few blocks outside the wall, well worth walking to, even in the rain (which is what we did). They give samples, show you how its made, and have a shop where you can buy all sorts of delectable chocolate treats. And even tho it was cold and wet outside, I had to sample their icecream. Oh My.

    Re Cadbury - I was really disappointed that Canada had the same type of Cadbury that we have - the milk choc kind. I was so hoping for the Brit version - plain chocolate.

    Not sure who has the best chocolate. Ive taste bad and good everywhere. Tho I must admit, if someone in Belguim wanted to send me a few truffles, I wouldn't complain.

  • anyanka
    17 years ago

    Vee, thanks for the link to the UK test. I think the questions in there are good in so far as studying for them would give immigrants a realistic picture of British realities - on the other hand, the majority of Brits would be stumped if tested on political organisation, Quangos, the way the law is administered etc.

    Many of the questions also practically scream for a sarcastic or at least satirical answer! I'm grateful that my EU passport protects me from such testing... especially as I wouldn't pass a test for either of my 'home' countries.

  • woodnymph2_gw
    17 years ago

    I really felt ignorant reading the UK test. What is a "Quango", by the way?

    For best chocolate, my vote would be for French truffles!

  • veer
    Original Author
    17 years ago

    Mary, brace yourself: a Quango is a Quasi-Autonomous Non-Governmental Organisation or, to put it another way. They are powerful committees that advise the Govt and are meant to follow the 7 principles of public life:
    selflessness, leadership, objectivity, integrity, accountability, openness and honesty.
    Excuse me while I choke.
    There are about 1000 in the UK for eg 'The Council for Science and Technology' 'The Medical Research Council' 'The Committee on Standards in Public Life'.
    The members are often more powerful than Members of Parliament and although not paid salaries still do very well with 'expenses'.

    You must have more than your fair-share in the US?

    Here is a link that might be useful: A Not Happy with Scottish Quangos Site.