I squeezed some Geneva crab last month and was pleased with the flavor. Geneva is a very big, say two inches, crab that is dark red and has red tinged flesh. It is mentioned as a good cider apple by the Vintage Virginia folks, and while it might not be a good single variety cider for some folks taste, it would be a good addition to a blend. I have two gallons in the freezer and plan to add it to the Gala cider I'll be squeezing this week. Gala is rather bland to my taste, so I am hoping the Geneva and perhaps some Whitney crab cider added to the blend will kick it up. BTW, where would it be good to post questions about press designs? I just put together a rack-and-cloth press using a Harbor Freight hydraulic press, and even before using it I have been thinking about making a stailess steel cylinder to use with it, and if perforated stainless steel could be used without press cloth. Chuck

Since you are aiming for a sparkling cider, and you still have Live yeast and sugar left in the cider -- it will keep fermenting.... and it will keep generating PRESSURE! DO NOT BOTTLE INTO ANY JARS THAT AREN'T MADE TO HOLD PRESSURE! THEY WILL EXPLODE! This is especially true if you try to pasteurize it.... Mason Jars are a No-No.. Wine bottles are a No-No... Miscellaneous glass bottles are a No-No... None of these are made to hold the sort of pressure the yeast will generate and they will explode... and they will shower you with sharp glass! You need to use either Beer bottles or Champagne bottles if you want to bottle a "Sparkling" beverage for long term storage.... Plastic soda bottles work quite well for short term storage. On the alcohol question - you got alcohol the 1st time it fermented.... Most fruit stand cider will ferment out to about 6% alcohol without any help from you... If it goes right, it won't have a sharp alcohol flavor.... but it's in there... Unfortunately, as you get closer and closer to the alcohol tolerance of your yeast by adding more and more sugar - it will start to generate weird, off flavors that taste like paint thinner, nail polish remover, and rocket fuel.... These are called "Fusel alcohols" because they generally taste "Hot".... Once you start generating this stuff -- there is nothing you can do but to let it age for a long time to mellow out. My advice - stop while you are ahead. Don't add any more sugar. If you want it a bit sweet - put it in the fridge to slow down fermentation and then siphon off the clear liquid off the muck in the bottom. Then, put it back in the fridge till you drink it. Don't be greedy here... Yeast doesn't taste particularly good.... Most sweet ciders and especially those fermented on their wild yeasts are best when they are young... Drink and enjoy. Thanks

Scott, some of the things you say confuse me. If you are tasting your apples, what are you looking for? Here's what I look for: A bittersweet will be totally bitter and totally sweet, without any acidity whatsoever. A bittersharp will be totally bitter and acidic, but the sugar content can be all over the map here. So it's more like a culinary or dessert apple with lots of bitterness that you can't taste until the bitter compounds hit the back of your mouth and throat. I think pure bitters are essentially non-existent. A sweet will be essentially sugar, without any acidity, e.g. essentially tannin free. Eating one is a rather odd experience, it's like eating an acidless lime or acidless orange, like sugar water. A sharp is your average culinary and dessert apple. Even Golden delicious falls into the sharp category. The whole point of these categorizations is so that I can combine the proper ratios of sweet to sharp, to bitter. (the latter usually about 10%) So regarding bittersweets, it means you don't want any "sharp" component to it. If you taste a good bittersweet, it will taste bitter and sweet, with no acidity. I have not heard of apples loosing their bitterness as a result of high heat, but I suppose that's possible. I would expect that they will just have a higher sugar content, that's all, and you will therefore need to reduce the amount of pure sweets you add to your cider batches. So now that we have the technical details out of the way, I highly recommend "Amere de Berthecourt", it's a bittersweet apple, incredibly prolific and vigorous fantastic bittersweet in the purest sense - e.g. there isn't a trace of sharpness in it. I grow it here in California and it's got plenty of bitter tannins in it. You bite into it, and you think at first it's totally bland, until the bitter tannins hit the back of your mouth, at which point it's very difficult to actually swallow. This is the effect that you want. This apple originates from Maine-et-Loire, France and it is available in the US. The french selections are infinitely superior to the British apples, mainly because they have been selected for their precociousness. Kingston Black is pretty much a wild apple, it's not worthy as a cider apple because it is such a shy bearer. If you were making cider commercially, you'd go broke if you tried to grow kingston black. A few notes on heat: heat doesn't necessarily increase the sugar contents in apples - usually the onset of Winter cold does a much better job at drawing the sugars into the apples. So if you're trying to increase the bitterness content to add the "body" to the cider, then heat is in your favor because it will keep the sugars from building too high, that is, as long as the variety in question isn't heat sensitive - e.g. it doesn't go mealy from hot weather. The trouble with some British apples is that they do go mealy from heat exposure. Amere de B. is an early apple, so it will ripen when it's still warm out, and therefore not draw the sugars as much. And it appears to be very heat resistant, e.g. it doesn't go mealy. Now here's an interesting note on tannins: my understanding of tannins is that tannins contribute all sorts of flavors, not just bitters. So you can have a high level of tannins yet have no bitterness at all. What is strange is that the technical classifications according to Barker's Classification of Cider Apples (LARS 1903) is as follows: Sharp Acid More than 0.45% Tannin less than 0.2% Bittersharp Acid more than 0.45% Tannin more than 0.2% Bittersweet Acid less than 0.45% Tannin more than 0.2% Sweet Acid less than 0.45% Tannin less than Yet you take an apple like "Amere de Berthecourt" which is clearly a bittersweet, you have BRIX 15.0 Acid 0.23% PH 4.08 Tannin 0.169% Average weight per apple: 82g So it's low on acidity, yet the tannin levels are still below 0.2%. According to the classification, it would be a sweet, but it's actually a bittersweet, I've tasted it, it's definitely very bitter. Then take Taylor's sweet, it has a malic acid content of 0.18% but the tannins are close to Amere de B at 0.14%. What I am trying to say with this is that the bitterness is not necessarily correlated to the tannin contents, and that bitterness is likely to not be affected by heat, it's only the amount of sugar and malic acid that changes as a function of heat, thus making it seem that an apple might have more or less tannins. I've attached a link for Cider apple compositional data. But I don't think the data is all that helpful in determining which one has the highest bitterness tannins, because the measurement is for tannins as a whole, not just those tannins that contribute to bitterness. Here is a link that might be useful: Cider Apple Compositional Data

I'm guessing that you are missing the point of contamination. From the time the apples are picked, sorted, stored, transported in crates, rehandled and pulp comes into contact with many surfaces prior to finally pressing there are many harmful organisms. I've tested my own cider and was amazed at the total bacteria count; fortunately non harmful. If you would have no bacteria the cider would likely not turn hard for weeks. The problem in your suggested open environment is the greater liklihood of coliform, Listeria or hepatitis organisms getting into the cider. I attended the PA State Farm Show for a few days this past weekend and the majority of stands selling cider had it in capped pint and quart containers. Many buyers simply poped the caps and drank from the containers as they walked. Even in a multi-acre inside facility not one of the cider vendors was pressing onsite. Food safety is just too big of an issue. If you want to bring your press to show-and-tell without operating that may help with your sales. You will still need to sanitize after everyone touches, climbs on and sets their bags and purses on.