Butterflymomok and misssherry, I am happy to see that you all know the value of Larry's expertise, but I am definitely not surprised. I just stumbled into the forum as a newbie, and it will take a while to examine and read through old threads. I will try to catch up and contribute as I may to the discussions. Fortunately, my specialization is different than Larry's in that I work with noctuid moths primarily. I do a great deal of rearing and life history work. I stress the importance of valuing biodiversity because so much remains to be discovered, even right here in the US. The group referred to in my previous post has yielded 11 new species and one new genus and species in California alone. And we are talking about colorful day-flying moths that have simply been overlooked. I first found one new species in the MEDIAN STRIP of I-5! I was in a net swinging frenzy until the Highway Patrol intervened. There are wonderful things to be discovered everywhere: here at home as well as in far flung jungles. As, it turns out, Larry and I passed like ships in the night in one of those far away jungles over a decade ago. I didn't know that, of course, when I joined in the forum, but I couldn't shake the notion that I should know who Larry was. I was trying to place who he might be and used the the language of Papua New Guinea, tok pisin, to test the hypothesis and to offer my bona fides to Larry. The Larry I was thinking of would be one of the few people on earth to understand the references I wrote in that language. I am so happy to have rediscovered him! Misssherry, if you look at our tok pisin entries you will see the word "wantok", which means "friend". Tok pisin is a true pidgin language. "Wantok" (friend) comes from "one talk", meaning sharing one form of talk or thought, a bond. On this forum, we are all talking of the same thing; we share a bond and a love for our natural world. We, therefore exhibit "one talk". We are, therefore, all wantoks. Terry PS to Larry: Mi save tru yu wan bel...

Yes Mazer, thank you for posting this. I would like to think I know more than a little bit about this subject, and for me, it's very well put. But for someone with a 4 month old pee and poop factory, not to mention chewing, running all over the house, cooking, kids, running around, etc. etc. it is probably going to be to much to take in. All the person with the peeing, pooping puppy wants is to fix things and have a pleasant experience with their dog. The very bottom line I see in this, is: Relationship with your dog = success. If you don't have a positive relationship AND assert your authority, you have problems in all potty areas. I can't tell you how many people I have encountered who: #1. Don't research the subject before they get started and just dont know what they are getting themselves in to. #2. Think they know how to deal with it, but just don't. #3. Proceed to quickly, expecting way to much from their dog to fast, thereby confusing the dog and making things worse. #4. Are not successful, get frustrated, don't know what to do, and the dog winds up back at a pound or worse. #5. Fail to realize from the very beginning, that the training and work that goes into it, is temporary. All of these are very important things to consider, unfortunately, lots of people don't. Making the potty correction properly also helps with other negative behaviors, instills confidence in the dog (and human) and should eventually lead to the dogs unsupervised freedom, assuming chewing and teething are under control. Potty issues can be difficult to correct. Enter a medical issue such as a UTI, and if it's not recognized, the experience can be absolute hell. Ask me, I should know and I had all of the experience, and a wonderful vet completely on top of the situation. *I spent 6 months getting the job done. (long story, dog was 4 months and traumatized before I came along). The key is to be able to target what is not going well, including medical issues, backing up and starting over, and proceed, making corrections along the way, in a way that is not to much for the dog or human doing the training. Then, building on success. SG

So what if you go through the list, and are still having problems? Because our 3 year old cat was so playful, and we thought it would be nice for him to have a buddy, we adopted a 2 year old neutered, declawed male cat from an animal shelter. After their initial adjustment, they seemed to get along well. The new cat was never very affectionate with us (our first cat is), but I don't think that's all that unusual. All was well for a few months, then the new cat started pooping outside the litterbox. My vet said he had colitis, and gave him some prescription food to try, which worked well - I kept him on the prescription food, and he always pooped in the litterbox from then on. A few months later, though, he started occasionally peeing on our beds. Thinking it was another medical issue, I took him to the vet a couple more times. He didn't find any medical issues - said it was most likely behaviorial, and gave us some Feliaway and advice similar to the above article. We had two litterboxes, and both were in the laundry room (upstairs). I could imagine that the location and/or noise might be an issue, or maybe privacy (our bedrooms are all upstairs), so I bought two additional litterboxes - one for the main floor (covered), and one for the basement (uncovered). I scooped all litterboxes daily, changed litter, tried different brands, etc. He continued to pee on the beds, and then later started peeing on our leather furniture, and carpet. I ended up returning him to the animal shelter, but have always felt terrible about it. I know that being a good pet owner means that you are willing to spent a certain amount of time and money when necessary, but after paying for several trips to the vet, Feliaway, replacing mattress pads, carpet pad, sections of subfloor, pillows, and buying gallons and gallons of Nature's Miracle and Urine-Off, I just reached my limit. Thank goodness for our first cat, or my confidence as a cat owner would be completely gone. Still, I don't think I will ever get another cat - I feel horrible that our second cat's behavioral issues were just beyond my capacity. Every time I see an article like this, I read it and think, did I do all I could? One of the most frustrating experiences I have had.

What's "FWB" - "Free Wheeling Broads" "/Boys"? I also find it distressing to hear a stream of what we considered foul language coming out of the mouths of many young people ... as part of their routine ... and I must confess that it troubles me more when it comes out of the females' mouths. I learned at home (from Dad - Mom was sick from when I was about 6, and Grandma was old and "sexless" ... and Dad talked around the subject, mainly) and I accepted ... that, as someone here said, "It takes two to tango", that pregnancies don't happen all by themselves (at least, they didn't in those days) ... and even now, teens don't get pregnant all alone (not being interested in the "in vitro" game). I learned that, while guys were inclined to try to get all that they could ... that if one was responsible for pregnancy, that he bore equal responsibility with the girl. Probably/usually more. That there was the risk of some rather nasty diseases, as well. We used to say that a pregnancy, if the girl chose to keep the child, which was unusual in earlier generations, it would pretty well ruin whatever hopes she might have had for a career ... but such wasn't so for the guys ... who seldom felt a responsibility to provide for the child. I remember Dad saying that, in discussion with a female friend when he was young, she'd said that the girls had to not only deny the persistent guy ... they had to deny their own feelings,as well. Not very fair, that. Shouldn't responsibility be shared? Possibly, after the child was born, when it was a week old, she should have taken it to the guy's house, saying that it was his turn to look after it for a week. I remember my wife telling how disappointed? disgusted? her Mom, who'd initiated divorce and was nearing retirement was that a substantial number of the men that she'd dated aimed at going to bed, if not on a first date, often shortly afterward. Maybe it's related to the length of time that movies show a scene on the screen ... if more than a few seconds for each, many modern folks feel that it's too slow ... and boring. When they get old ... and life slows down some ... do you think that modern people'll find life so unutterably boring ... ... that suicide may seem an interesting alternative? Good wishes for keeping your life in focus ... and perspective ... treating yourself and others with respect .. and encouraging the kids to follow similar patterns ... when you have the opportunity. ole joyful P.S. Many seem to feel that people, like machines, exist to serve them, if they can make it happen, and that while they are doing such explotation and after, they owe little more duty of fair treatment to the person than to the machine. Which we've pretty well seen exemplified in the way in which corporations treat their staff ... and suppliers ... and, often, clients - though if they treat them too badly, they may lose their opportunity to serve that client in future. o j