Neither A nor B gives you good workflow or traffic flow for the inconvenience and expense of a remodel.

I'm assuming that the family room is currently a small gabled roof running left to right between the main house and garage? If so, it really would not be a big deal to create a new footing even with the front of the garage and change the front side to a different pitch coming up from the new foundation to the existing peak. Maybe 3K if you DIYed as much of the labor as you could. And you could do most of it. Digging a small footing by hand is just grunt work, not rocket science. You can create the new exterior wall and new roof decking while the old is still in place and then tie it in at the peak and never have to worry about having to deal with the interim leak phase. Then just remove the old roof from the interior. And moving a door is not at all a big deal. It's also very DIYable. My neighbor is doing much the same, and while it is taking a while because it is all DIY, it's not at all expensive!

So, does 5K worth of structural work keep you from having a MUCH better traffic flow? Go Ikea and put the money in that!

Where is your family room going to be?

I'll be frank, I'm not crazy about either one of them but Plan B seems a little better to me. But I still wouldn't cut a family room in half to create a drop zone and a mudroom. It just seems like such a waste of space, especially when you are converting the living room into a dining room. Is the "keeping room" big enough for your family to kick back & watch TV, play games, have a few friends over? The family room space you have now looks like a good space for that. I hear you on the "4 doors" problem, but plan B moves one of those doors which gives you 2 long walls for furniture & TV. I also think your current family room, with the cathedral ceilings, seems like a very large & welcoming space to walk in to from the porch or garage. I'd hate to see you lose that.

Which entrance do you use more often? If it's the one from the garage then you have 18' along that back wall of the family room (if I counted the little squares correctly) and I'm sure there's a way to create a drop zone & coat storage area that won't eliminate the function of a family room.

I actually like Plan A, quite a bit! The only thing I would change is no window, to the right of the range...and maybe three windows, instead of four (or one large with smaller on each side) with the sink centered, under the windows. You want to see the view, not the trim, between the windows :)

Plan B seems so tight...that's what I didn't like. It felt like the fireplace is almost in a hallway and the island is so small. In Plan A, the island seating is much more spacious and not crammed up, against the fireplace.

As for the seating, both A and B have the big sofa and chair, seemingly too close to the doorway. What about a couple of big, comfy chairs, with better views of the TV and fireplace? Or, a sofa with a chaise on the end, so you're not sitting sideways, in front of the TV?

Plan C is too much space, with the chairs still too close to the doorway...and what's going on behind the sofa...the mud room storage? I definitely like Plan A, with a slightly different seating arrangement. I think you've got a winner :)

First of all if you're going to be living there for 15 years or more, what the neighborhood or resale 'dictates' doesn't matter. You have a family to raise and things to do in this house, and if you're going to spend any money at all it should be in making it work the best you can for what you do in it.

I agree that the zones don't flow very well in any of the plans... But I'd rather walk a bit, and shift things (where what is stored) as there is more time spent in the kitchen than be cramped in. At least A gives the people room to flow a bit. C really doesn't make any more sense (maybe less) in functional layout's sense for the extra expense.

However, I am concerned that you're losing a family room and your living room, and will end up with only the keeping room as seating/family activity space.

I'd put LOTS of serious thought into what LiveWireOak had to say. You've tried and tried with the space you have and haven't gotten very far. Sometimes things that seem big, like adding on, are less costly and problematic than you'd think. And, for hubby, square footage does add value.

I think you have to look at the proportions of the living spaces. You have a ton of space devoted to a kitchen and very little living space. It doesn't make sense to me and, if you're concerned about resale, it might not make sense to other buyers. A bad layout can kill the opportunity for a quick sale. Here are my thoughts:

Plan A: The dining room seems huge relative to the keeping room and I think you lost the family room all together. Do you really envision using the space in that way? Can you and your family sit comfortably in the space that is not designated to cooking and eating? I prefer a formal dining room, but in this case I don't see how it makes sense.

Plan B: I already commented on this one, but I'll say again there's very little living space and the layout of the kitchen does not make sense to me.

Plan C: While I think it's interesting, you still have little to no living space on the first floor. Especially when you have designated a dining room that can fit 8 - 10 people. Where are they going to sit PRIOR to dinner?

If you are really set on opening up the spaces in any of these plans, I think you need to loose the office and turn it into living space as well. How that lays out, I'm not sure. But think about all the rooms as they relate to one another.

I feel your pain. The only way for us to create a 3rd bedroom/2nd bathroom is to move the kitchen. Probably one of the most expensive ways to do the remodel, but it was the only way it made sense. I've waited seven years and had many plans in my head prior to moving forward. We took our final plan to an architect and he couldn't think of a better way to lay it out.

My personal feeling is that you should either do it right, or don't do it at all. I had to install an HVAC system and did that first. Then we did the bathroom within it's existing footprint a few years later. Now we're ready to do the big job.

Too bad you can't relocate the bath...or can you? That would solve a whole bunch of issues.

The ideas your are presenting are ideas that would would make me want to remodel. I calculated about an 18' trek between the frig and stove!!! I have a 9' and hate it.

IMO it looks like you are ruining the house, not only for resale but for yourselves too. Where do you expect to "live".

I'm sorry for not providing constructive ideas like some are able to but I've gotten extraordinary help regarding my layout on this site! We've been able to to get EVERYTHING we wanted in our kitchen from the help. Be open and even if it takes a while like it did for me, let the help sink in.

You've obviously started thinking outside the box and that's good. My question for you is what is the 76" item next to the hutch? Can it be removed?

One of the "sticking points" that I see that is hampering your efforts to find a functional layout is the fireplace. It's not in a usable or attractive spot at all. Think about removing it completely. You can always do a prefab fireplace in your family room area at another time. They are on craigslist all the time. I just bought a great one for less than $200.

I struggled with an awkwardly placed fireplace for 15 years before taking it out and only wish I hadn't considered it such a "sacred cow" for so long. The house would have lived MUCH better without it.

If you removed the fireplace, you could easily keep the dining room the dining room and just expand the kitchen into the breakfast area. You could easily create a very functional galley kitchen and leave the problem of the many entranced family room to a later project and add the fireplace to it then. Moving around doors in there and adding a fireplace is a very doable DIY project that won't cost much.

Given the trouble you're having and the different, good advice you're getting, perhaps you might spend a little of that remodel money to hire an architect?

Sometimes we just can't do it "just fine" on our own? Your drawings are clear and great, but an architect can take you even further outside your box.

I'm not an architect, builder, contractor, or designer of any sort. I'm someone who knows how hard it is to envision something that actually turns out like the vision.
Sometimes we just need a little outside help. And in your case, someone who might act as a mediator.

Give up the 15 year resale thing, too. DH is dinky on the SF thing, too.

Christine

I like B the best but only if you shrink the mudroom a bunch and take down the wall between the kitchen and family room. I'd rather see the bar moved to the back wall or have it as floating cabs over the dividing space. If you lose the wall, you can move the peninsula a few inches down to give you more floor space near the stove.

Unless you have a huge family with a ton of dirty dishes, I'd lose the second dw and move the oven to that spot or get a full stove instead of a cooktop. I'd rather extend the countertop the full way and not waste the end base cabinet for storage. That would save some money and make your dh happy. If the oven moves to where the dw on the left is, it would give you more counter space for baking and cooling. If you do have such a big family, I think most of the plans give them too little hanging out space. While you may be reacting to having a small kitchen, these plans overreact based on overall layout.

I agree that a discussion about the fireplace is in order. You may be able to keep it, but you also may want to lessen the surround, at least. If the best answer is to lose it, then take it out. I would not let a fireplace dictate too much of day to day living.
Plan C is all kitchen and little living. It is way out of balance.

Sorry, but I didn't look that carefully, at your current plan. Your ONLY living space is going to be the keeping room? How often do you need a dining room table that big?

If it were me, I'd go with something like Plan B, but make the current family room, into the dining room. Having all those doors wouldn't be a big deal, since your table and chairs are in the middle of the room, anyway.

A more expensive option would be to move the kitchen, into the family room area (and probably have to move the door to the garage down a bit) and then make the current kitchen, your dining room. Either way, you'd have views of the back and easy access to the kitchen. The keeping room could stay 'as is' and the living room would still be a much better place for the sofa/chairs and TV.

The advantage to moving the kitchen would be light on both sides, close to the garage and better view of that fireplace. But, I'm sure it would be much more expensive and there's less wall space, for appliances. If you're going to take the load bearing wall out...I'd put the dining room in that location.

If you put the TV back in the living room, maybe you could put a smaller mudroom/cubbie area, to the left of the fireplace? Just enough room for some coat hooks, a bench and a place underneath for boots? At least you'd be warm from the fire...and it's handy to the front door, too.

This may be all wrong for you, but it's just another idea. Before you decide to eliminate almost all your main floor living space, I'd definitely visit an architect. You have a lot of potential with this space (there's plenty of room) you just need to decide how best to use it :)

Wow: thank you so very much for all your inputs. I find it amazing to have people who are willing to share so much passion on my project. It is this forum that I have learned so much that I can push beyond the cookie-cutter layouts that are being plopped into every new home in the development.

Before I address them, I was thinking about a few of the parties I had in my home. How did the traffic flow?

- Bookclub with 14 ladies: Since I had laid out most of the food/wine on the 7ft3inches diningroom table, and some on the peninsula, everyone stayed in the cramped little area around the peninsula and kinda around the DR table for over 4 hours. (Currently there is an Advantium sitting on top of a secretary desk facing the fireplace right next to the familyroom doorway, so I mean it when I say cramped). But no one bothered to go into the large livingroom, even after I had suggested it several times.

- Rotating monthly dinner with 10 adults and 10 children: DR table was extended to 12ft long w/ 16chairs around it. Before dinner, the kids hung out in the familyroom, and the adults hung out in the small space between the peninsula and one end of the DR table. We fed the kids first (10 at the table w/ a few adults near the kids to help cut food, etc). After the kids were done, we shoved them to the familyroom to let them play/watch a movie, while we ate. Kids came back in for dessert, back to familyroom, and adults had dessert/port. No one went to my large 23ftx12ft livingroom. A few kids walked by to get to my kids' rooms.

- Large bday FOAM party for son with ~35kids and ~35 adults in the backyard: Food and drinks were set up outside on the deck tables, wine/cosmos were set up in DR on hutch; dessert was on the DR table (along w/ the 90 homemade chocolate cupcakes I spent all night making/stuffing/frosting). There were 3 long tables on the grass with chairs for eating. After kids got rinsed off of the foam (outside or inside in my 1st floor full bath), they played in the familyroom, while adults enjoyed more drinks around DR table. Once again, no one went to my comfy livingroom in all 10-11hours of the party.

It is not that my livingroom is like a museum (like my aunt's livingroom when I grew up where everything was white, and goodness if we moved a pillow or something). Even now, day to day, the livingroom rarely gets used. Kids watch a little TV there before bedtime, then DH watches TV after kids go to bed.

Even at my girlfriends' large homes (5000+Sqft), when we go there for parties, people tend to hang out around the island, stopping by the diningroom table to fix a plate of food/snacks, and then back to mingling around the area between the kitchen island and the familyroom.

On the flip side, we were just at my gf's Holiday party. Similar to my house, she has a standard L-shaped kitchen with a small center island with 3 small stools. At the open end of the L along the window-wall, she has a loveseat (like a tiny little keeping area). Connecting to the kitchen is a standard DR and across the foyer is a good size livingroom. After we entered from the front door, passing the LR to get to the kitchen, I never entered the LR again. Our group of 12 friends hung out in that little keeping area (almost breaking the loveseat when 6 of us piled on to take a picture) the entire night, while the kids were in the basement familyroom. We did venture into the DR to plate some food, but we then took our plates back to the kitchen island and loveseat area.

2 reasons why I want to flip the DR and livingroom:
1. My table extends to 12feet long. If I put in an island or peninsula in the kitchen, the table will not fit in the current DR anymore.
2. With the examples above, people love hanging around the kitchen. So now, with DR and LR flipped, people can sit on comfy sofa before dinner, or just going into (new) DR just to grab food and back into the kitchen area (near nice fireplace).

So with all the suggestions and ideas, I pushed the layout again to layout ?#63.

I have been fighting this kitchen layout the entire time because knowing my friends, they will not stay behind the line of the LITTLE peninsula overhang, but will invade MY space. People will eventually be standing in the empty area between the windows/cooktop/fireplace, which definitely cuts through my prep/cook area (since I will need to get to the trash and sink, and the far distance fridge).

But it seems that it is the best layout that compromises:
- I still get my BELOVED mudroom area (top priority)
- More storage (than putting the cooktop along the window wall)
- Least structural cost changes (only moving door opening in load-bearing wall, moving porch door closer to garage, closing up kitchen French door to become window), same plumbing
- Still a decent size familyroom and desk/mail area (where drinks can go for parties)
- With this layout, we are going to test flipping the DR and LR. There is nothing permanent so for resale (way down the road) or some other reason, we can flip it back. The kids/teenagers can hang out in the familyroom, while the adults will be in the Keeping Room (or flipped LR or previous DR - yes, this can be confusing)

Yes, GWKitchen is really good with marriage counseling. DH and I had a good discussion last night and I thanked him for his strong suggestion of limiting the budget (halting scope creep of the while-we-are-at-it), because while I think it is great that there are people out there who will open up walls and build new foundation and add all sorts of GLA, etc, size-wise our house is a good size for our family (tough to remember sometimes when friends� houses are 2+ times our home) AND we have other things to spend our money on, such as amazing vacations to China/Vietnam/Cambodia for 3 weeks, etc.

Whole 1st floor

The little peninsula with a 12inch overhang (for the 2 stools for quick snack) has a 12inch overhang that folds down, so for the infrequent times the DR table is extended to 12 ft, it can still fit in the DR (tightly).

After turning the kitchen French doors into windows,
a. I may splurge on putting in a new header (impacts the little roof overhang over the deck) so I can have 3 big windows, or
b. should I just keep to the 1 window over sink and 2 where Fdoors were (feels lopsided/not symmetrical), or
c. just 1window over sink and 1 matching window where Fdoors were (more symmetrical)?

Since I am not moving plumbing (to save cost), the sink will NOT center to the windows. I am 100% more function over form.
There is some weird concrete foundation issue in the basement below the cooktop area, so adding a prep sink would not be cheap.

No, the cooktop will not be center on the peninsula; I rather have 21inches to the right for spices than 2 tiny 10inches cabinet on each side.

Hmmm, that is a lot of counter space between cooktop and sink, and hardly any between sink and fridge. Have to rethink the not moving plumbing idea.

Familyroom/moved entrance/desk/mail hutch (ripple effect of moving porch door is landscaping in front of porch)

Again, thank you very much!
Would love your feedback on layout #63!

Happy New Year!
Amanda/huango

Again, thank you so very much for ideas and feedback!

Live_wire_oak: Agreed on traffic flow on Plan A: I did not like the idea that people could walk in from patio through my cook area (between cooktop and island) to get to the fridge/bathroom, etc.
We are going to DIY as many parts of the project as possible, but we are way inexperienced when it comes to framing/code. We will probably do the demo, painting, and installing the Ikea cabinets/appliances.

EngineerChic: We use the garage door into the familyroom all the time, and friends/guests come through the porch door (only UPS comes to front door because it has a doorbell). Thank you for the urging to reconsider the familyroom space. I think this new layout#63 is a good solution meeting the multiple needs required of this one room (mudroom area, familyroom, desk/bar/porch entrance).

Lavender_lass: I too love Plan A, but I think layout#63 is a good compromise. Thanks for the idea about sofa with a chaise.

Rhome410: Yes, it is true that we are not planning to sell soon, but we did not plan to move from our previous house after 7years either, so you never know what comes up. I also do not want to be the people with the crazy house that cannot sell (even 15years from now).

I must prep/cook differently from many other people. Aloha2009 brought up how she did not like 9ft between cooktop and fridge, let alone my crazy distance of 18feet. I rarely go straight from the fridge to the cooktop. I would get stuff from fridge and plop them onto the right of the sink (6ft apart), prep it and then cook it on the cooktop. Yes, sometimes I would forget an ingredient, like needing to grab some white wine from fridge to deglaze the sauce, but like you stated, I would rather walk a bit than be cramped in. (Again, being short, I do not want to use too many upper cabinets).

1929Spanish: You should have seen my CRAZY other plan: to build a 3-car garage on the Left side of the house (with a masterbedroom/bath on top), thus turning the Office into a nice large mudroom (and turning the current garage into a large familyroom). I have thought about it all!
But I work from home, so the Office has to stay. It is a really good location, not in the middle of everything, but still is close enough for me to check on things (food cooking/kids, etc).

Remodelfla: Yup, I thought about moving the bathroom to the mudroom area - adding laundry, so dirty muddy kids (from soccer, etc) can just strip right there and stuff go into the laundry, etc). But that is a whole lot of structural changes.

Aloha2009/Livewireoak: please see my comments about fridge/cooktop distance.
The 76inches monster is the center-colonial fireplace that runs from basement through 2nd floor (taking up a good chunk of my son's room). DH is actually on board with removing it, but that would be a huge ripple affect (the flooring joist even change direction because of this fireplace)! It is New England: people would think you are crazy to take out a great fireplace from a colonial!

CEFreemanChristine: We did meet with an architect. He and I must not have been communicating clearly because the 3 plans he did draft up, I had already designed AND crossed off OR they were way too expensive (after a quote from a constractor).
Since there are SO many great minds on GWKitchen, I was hoping for that "little outside help".

Dianalo: 2nd dishwasher is because I need to get rid of my countertop dishrack!!! I rather have less storage than to have to use the darn dishrack again (it is a great Superhuman stainless steel one).

Priorities of renovation:
1. Mudroom
2. Good hood venting (there is NONE right now - crazy previous owners)
3. 2 dishwashers
4. Counter-height windows
5. Radiant floor heating (if money left)

Again, thank you very much!
Would love your feedback on layout #63!

Happy New Year!
Amanda/huango

If you want to get your dishrack off the counter, you could put it in a deep drawer and not lose all that storage. That would save on plumbing and the purchase of another dw. I find that since our reno, our dw unloads so easily and quickly, that nothing is left out much. The few hand dried items dry and get put away right after the clunters are cleaned and the floor is swept.` I used to have a full time dishrack and now we don't, even though it was not really expected to lose it. You could leave the drawer cracked open as things dry if you want and shut it as needed. I tend to let things drip dry for 5 minutes or so and then put them away as they are. Drying with a towel adds germs and is not necessary. You'd also get to use the drawer below and the shallow ones above for storage. If you want to be creative, you could put some sort of mesh front inset or the kind of sheet metal on the front of a radiator cover to let things air out in that drawer all the time.... Old time "drawer" fronts by sinks used to have slits to air out below.
It seems like you are losing the storge in the base cabs in your corners. I'd prefer the cooktop moved to the sink wall and extending the counter to the end with the peninsula opposite the cooktop becoming a bar height rectangular table. The counterspace in the corner is also tough to use and clean. You may not think you will mind the distance from the stove to the fridge, but it might impact resale as much because it looks a little "off" as for the practical reasons. Moving the cooktop would also mean 1 less window and therefore less cost. It would also mean avoiding any narrow cabs in the layout (functionally less optimal) and being able to use larger/fewer cabs, also a money saver.
If you do a pretty tile or feature behind the cooktop, it would look nicer as you approach the kitchen from the front of the house than how your plans only shows the side of the front burners.
I noticed your examples above about entertaining, but I think most people were more warning you about day to day living. Your new plan seems to be better for both. I like how the dining room seems more reachable from the kitchen than by having to go through a tight hallway. When setting up or cleaning up with multiple people, the old plans did not work well. There'd be a lot of dancing out of each other's way or crashing if that does not work out.

Alright, so you're leaving the LR for the TV? Why not put the sofa/chaise into that room? Since you have a wall between the kitchen and little family room (in #63) I don't see the advantage of making that a family area. It's going to be a little closed off space, rather than a part of the kitchen.

Just an idea, but if you're going to leave the LR for TV (which I think is a good idea) why not open up that wall between the kitchen and old family room? Even if it's just a pass through it would bring more light into the space. I'd put the dining room in there and maybe have a couple of chairs and a table, in the 'keeping room'. Maybe something upholstered and comfy, but would still work with a small table...for coffee, tea, snacks, etc.

Instead of the TV by the fireplace, what about putting your desk there, and switching the spaces with the hutch...which would be in the new dining room? You could pull one of the chairs up for the desk, or have a smaller stool/chair that slides under, when it's not in use.

The fireplace is so awkward (but still a fireplace so I'd keep it) but I'd make that area the keeping room and have the dining area with the better view and maybe a pass through, from the kitchen. What if you moved your range back to the window wall and have one large window over the sink...and a small one, on each side of the range. Then you could have a narrow counter, under the kitchen side of the pass through and still have your stools across from the range, as in Plan B.

That would put your prep/snack/guest space back on the peninsula and the range would be closer to the sink and fridge. Also put the range a little further from the stools, when frying. Hope that helps :)

Lavender lass said exactly what I was thinking!

I like the idea of making the family room the DR if you open up the wall with a pass through. It can be done with supports for the load bearing beam. In fact, there are some old posts with beautiful pictures of islands/peninsulas with support beams and built-ins created around them. Then, you can have an overhang into the opening for plating food and easy cleanup which eliminates the concern of having to walk around the hallway into the room. You still have to walk, but not with a plate of food. I can then see the fireplace area as a cozy adult seating area for reading, chatting, relaxing, or even secondary TV watching if you so choose. Too bad about moving the bathroom cause then you could just blowout the office/bathroom and place the kitchen there. THen extend the mudroom to include mudroom/laundry/bathroom. It looks like you're only leaving a tad over 3' for the 2 stools. You really need 4' for 2 stools for it to be comfortable.

The following layout would be based on whether or not the current fireplace could be altered (hollowed out) to provide a "hearth" for a cooktop.

Probably not feasible considering the changes required, but this idea kept prodding me so I figured get it out and see what happens.

Pros:
- mudroom
- long dining area (to accomodate 12' table as needed)
- wall of windows (or doors to back)
- beverage bar in dining room (possibly w/small fridge)
- options for open wall to family room (double doors as shown, 1/2 wall behind sink/peninsula then open walkway to family room)
- baking center between "cooktop hearth" and oven/MW

The big con is the traffic past the cooktop to the fridge, but there is a fairly wide walkway there so maybe not too bad.

I love this idea to utilize the chimney as a cooktop hearth. Cant wait to see if this is possible.

I like plan #63 (and it cracks me up that you're on #63, because it means you are being honest about the number of plans you've had. I just delete the plans we decide won't work so it looks like we've only had 6 ideas on how to reconfigure the upstairs.)

You definitely have a lot of people over, which is smart to plan for in addition to the day to day use of your home. And I understand about how you never plan to move but can't be sure - we've had a similar house buying history.

If you moved the range to the sink wall, can you install a down-draft vent? If yes, and if you do that, I'd try to position it so you have enough room that you can be at the stove while someone else is doing prep work in the nook where the stove used to be. I can see that little area being a great place to set up drinks or keep your friends busy with stuff they can do to help, which means you'd need distance between it and the stove. I think as long as you have 4' between the sink & stove, and 2' between stove & other prep space you'd be okay.

If you put the tupperware where the cooktop is now then your friends can be put on "packing leftovers duty". A drawer above the tupperware drawers can hold the plastic wrap, aluminum foil, parchment, etc. And you'd get full cabinets above that space. But all that assumes you can put in a strong downdraft vent on the sink wall. We had one once with a built-in JennAir cooktop and it was pretty awesome - I used to slice onions near it and never shed one tear :) But I don't know if they work with a gas cooktop (assuming you are using gas?)

I like your priorities - better to see more of the world you live in than "over remodel" your one corner of it. I go to Asia 2-4 times/yr for work and I really wish everyone could visit - it's SO different than the US or Europe.

I love Kode's layout for you! I think the table by the windows makes a lot of sense. I love having our table by our back windows/wall because it makes the dining nicer. I need less of a view while cooking because I am focused on what I am prepping or cooking, but you have 2 windows in the kitchen area anyway. If you do put in a corner cab to the left of the sink, you could have it open on the other side and use a non-corner unit.
This plan gives you a full size living room, dining room, family room and kitchen and you get your beloved mud room. It really is the best of all worlds. The only possible tweak might be swapping the fridge and mw, but I am not sure about it. I'd put the layout into the 3d sketch and see which way looks nicer. It would depend on how wide your fridge will be.

I like Kode's plan too, but I would build the mud room into the garage.

I have to laugh at your plan A or B scenarios and DH disagreements. We had plan A, whole house renovation, plan B, kitchen extension / renovation; plan C, just redo our existing, too small kitchen, and I told my DH, whom I love very much, that plan D is divorce! We just started plan B and all is well.

Huango, just returning to your basic comments, I often see and comment on kitchens that become large out of proportion to the rest of the house. It's a common phenomenon among the TKO'd. Often but not necessarily a mistake, but always something that needs to be done with great insight into the gains and losses and a commitment to living with them for decades if it comes to that. People's lifestyles, needs, and interests change as they do, and their homes still need to work for them.

Regarding: "We are the first house into a LARGE neighborhood of very expensive homes, so we could never renovate beyond our neighborhood value." Dead wrong, and you do need to know that. Has your agent friend explained that yet? Future buyers will compare your entire property to their alternatives. The most glorious kitchen in your state would not significantly increase the value of you property if it was inadequate in other ways compared to alternatives. As an appraiser in Los Angeles, I can't remember all the really, really NICE homes that became--literally--teardowns because their neighborhoods developed with homes different (I don't say necessarily better, though almost always a lot bigger) from what they could offer. That's because, typically, almost all the increased value of a property as a neighborhood skyrockets in value is actually in the land--not the house on it.

In any case, any time you're looking more than a handful of months ahead, you have to assume style changes will turn your glorious new tile, or even today's perfect layout, into a cause for buyer dissatisfaction that would have to be "fixed." This is especially the case in affluent neighborhoods where people have become accustomed to updating their homes the way they used to just update their wardrobes, or trade in the 2-year-old for a newer model car.

I think a kitchen should be in proportion to your life and its use. I'm sure there's a limit, but our kitchen and dining room are the largest rooms in our house, and a large percentage of our main floor. It's definitely where we need the most room, and we live much happier and contentedly with adequate space for the activities we do and the number of people involved.

#63 is the best you've come up with, and you regained some useful rooms. It still gives you the option of using the living room as dining for the longer table, and creating a keeping room off the kitchen, which I think I'd love.

I worry about the distance from sink to stove (lots of dripping washed food), and think it would improve both areas to move the sink to the right if you can. I'm not sure it'd be that costly to move it over one window, maybe swapping it with the dw. There are things to retrieve from the fridge while cooking that don't go to prep at the sink first...like some meats, butter, milk, sauces, etc, but with this one you have a more open pathway so the distance isn't as bad.